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Ghatti
Totally not a Federal Agent

Registered: 06/23/14
Posts: 1,733
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Stabilizing a mutation
#21695794 - 05/18/15 08:05 PM (8 years, 8 months ago) |
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Also this should probably be put in advanced myc but I will try here first.
I have been able to reproduce and stabilize a genetic mutation through generations (spores to fruit, spores to fruit) over 5 generations so far.
The "strain" is RS and as you can see it does not appear on every single cap but it has yet to fail to show on roughly 35% of fruit bodies.
Aside from the little hat there is little difference. I have an isolate saved from my favorite potency that throws the same little hats.
I believe I sent a print a half year ago to Mr.giraffe and would be interested to see if he was able to reproduce the same mutation but I don't see why not if I'm able to through generations.
I don't believe this mutation to be external from chemical or crazy conditions but it will not be proven until someone can duplicate the results.
It was just selective breeding. Cloning the mutant, isolating strains and fruiting. When a strain threw another mutation it was cloned and printed and fruited from the print and it mutated again and was cloned and printed. The clone was saved and I continued the print fruit cycle.
What can I further do to stabilize my results?
I am trying to post images but it won't let me, you'll have to look at the newest in my gallery.
Edited by Ghatti (05/18/15 08:10 PM)
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2shoes
The anti-agar



Registered: 04/07/11
Posts: 3,124
Loc: Not in a SAB
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Re: Stabilizing a mutation [Re: Ghatti]
#21695808 - 05/18/15 08:08 PM (8 years, 8 months ago) |
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I think its referred to as isolation.
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Pastywhyte
Say hello to my little friend



Registered: 09/15/12
Posts: 37,810
Loc: Canada
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Re: Stabilizing a mutation [Re: Ghatti]
#21695810 - 05/18/15 08:08 PM (8 years, 8 months ago) |
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Ummm pics? However your on the track. After 5 or 6 generations it will be for the most part pretty damn stable so its pretty doubtful you will get anything more after that. If its not stable by that point it won't be.
Here is my attempt at stabilizing mutations. Might give you some ideas.
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/20228521
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Pastywhyte
Say hello to my little friend



Registered: 09/15/12
Posts: 37,810
Loc: Canada
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Re: Stabilizing a mutation [Re: Pastywhyte]
#21695822 - 05/18/15 08:11 PM (8 years, 8 months ago) |
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Also as far as I can tell you don't have a gallery. . .
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Ghatti
Totally not a Federal Agent

Registered: 06/23/14
Posts: 1,733
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Re: Stabilizing a mutation [Re: Pastywhyte]
#21695827 - 05/18/15 08:13 PM (8 years, 8 months ago) |
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For whatever reason it won't let me copy/paste the code. The 3 images newest in my pics are them. Let me give your thread a read
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Ghatti
Totally not a Federal Agent

Registered: 06/23/14
Posts: 1,733
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Re: Stabilizing a mutation [Re: Ghatti]
#21695872 - 05/18/15 08:19 PM (8 years, 8 months ago) |
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WTF, why can't you see my pics? Let me switch to the pc
These are latest generation 5 I believe, honestly I am at 5 or 6.



These pics are from 1st or 2nd generation 10/14



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cronicr



Registered: 08/07/11
Posts: 61,436
Loc: Van Isle
Last seen: 2 years, 8 days
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Re: Stabilizing a mutation [Re: Ghatti]
#21695898 - 05/18/15 08:24 PM (8 years, 8 months ago) |
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are you clicking the share button when you upload?
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  It doesn't matter what i think of you...all that matters is clean spawn I'm tired do me a favor
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Ghatti
Totally not a Federal Agent

Registered: 06/23/14
Posts: 1,733
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Re: Stabilizing a mutation [Re: cronicr]
#21695949 - 05/18/15 08:34 PM (8 years, 8 months ago) |
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I dunno. I'm doing good just to get em here. The post above yours shows them for me
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cronicr



Registered: 08/07/11
Posts: 61,436
Loc: Van Isle
Last seen: 2 years, 8 days
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Re: Stabilizing a mutation [Re: Ghatti]
#21695963 - 05/18/15 08:37 PM (8 years, 8 months ago) |
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i see them i just don't see a gallery for ya
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  It doesn't matter what i think of you...all that matters is clean spawn I'm tired do me a favor
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Ghatti
Totally not a Federal Agent

Registered: 06/23/14
Posts: 1,733
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Re: Stabilizing a mutation [Re: cronicr]
#21698469 - 05/19/15 01:38 PM (8 years, 8 months ago) |
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Am I missing something? I thought this would have been fairly exciting. I mean it's not PE but I have mushrooms with hats now consistently from spore. They seem to be pretty leucistic for RS too. Who can I send a print to to see if they can duplicate or to make sure it's not environmental?
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cronicr



Registered: 08/07/11
Posts: 61,436
Loc: Van Isle
Last seen: 2 years, 8 days
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Re: Stabilizing a mutation [Re: Ghatti]
#21698516 - 05/19/15 01:53 PM (8 years, 8 months ago) |
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it is exciting
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  It doesn't matter what i think of you...all that matters is clean spawn I'm tired do me a favor
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Pastywhyte
Say hello to my little friend



Registered: 09/15/12
Posts: 37,810
Loc: Canada
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Re: Stabilizing a mutation [Re: Ghatti]
#21698537 - 05/19/15 02:00 PM (8 years, 8 months ago) |
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Quote:
Ghatti said: Am I missing something? I thought this would have been fairly exciting. I mean it's not PE but I have mushrooms with hats now consistently from spore. They seem to be pretty leucistic for RS too. Who can I send a print to to see if they can duplicate or to make sure it's not environmental?
The original variety wouldn't happen to have been Colombian rust spore?
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Achillita
Back to the basics



Registered: 05/26/14
Posts: 4,565
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Re: Stabilizing a mutation [Re: Pastywhyte]
#21698596 - 05/19/15 02:20 PM (8 years, 8 months ago) |
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Ghatti
Totally not a Federal Agent

Registered: 06/23/14
Posts: 1,733
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Re: Stabilizing a mutation [Re: Achillita]
#21699377 - 05/19/15 05:48 PM (8 years, 8 months ago) |
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Why yes it is. You have some insight?
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Pastywhyte
Say hello to my little friend



Registered: 09/15/12
Posts: 37,810
Loc: Canada
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Re: Stabilizing a mutation [Re: Ghatti]
#21699509 - 05/19/15 06:25 PM (8 years, 8 months ago) |
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Well my CRS often do the same thing with the little blobby hats. I see it in them a lot. CRS also are usually lighter in color than most of my other cubes, the pins often have a caramel color to the caps not red or brown. By maturity they are often very pale indeed. Given that the main CRS vendor is a mycologist who knows his craft I would imagine he took great care in stabilizing the rust spore mutation. That would likely have spaned several generations.
Hetrozygosity drops off very quickly after the initial wild grow, its less than a single 1% by 7 generations. Of ccourse there is still a huge amount of variation in a single percent but, many potential traits will have been discarded and others strengthened by that point. I'm not really trying to downplay what your doing but it seems likely to me that you're simply slightly reinforcing a tendency that was already strong with the line. While I'm certain that was not the intention for that charecteristic to be common with CRS when it was initially domesticated, often during the course of domestication of a line unlooked for tendencies will be strengthed inadvertantly.
Now given the progress you have made here I am not looking to tell you it was for nothing or that its not significant. But you should know its a pretty common trait with crs, in addition to being a normal expression within the species phenotype as a whole. Something else to consider is that a) to get it too the point where it shows regularly might still take a fair bit more time and b) and given that you're working with a lot less hetrozygosity in doing so you may run the risk of destabilizing the genetics via inbreeding. That would take a large number of grows of course (100's) but typically when we are looking to stabilize traits we do it as quick as possible as to prevent issues years down the road.
CRS with hat
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Ghatti
Totally not a Federal Agent

Registered: 06/23/14
Posts: 1,733
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Re: Stabilizing a mutation [Re: Pastywhyte]
#21699552 - 05/19/15 06:37 PM (8 years, 8 months ago) |
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Well poo lol. I don't see the hats in your pic. I do see slight nipples. Like this in

Remember willsolvems peyote KSS? Well KSS tend to blob anyways but he was able to isolate by culture not spore I believe.
Are you saying my hats are just crs's "blobs" and I have essentially done jack all?
That blows. I have yet to have a complete tub throw the same mutation but I've gotten around 70%
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Ghatti
Totally not a Federal Agent

Registered: 06/23/14
Posts: 1,733
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Re: Stabilizing a mutation [Re: Ghatti]
#21699558 - 05/19/15 06:39 PM (8 years, 8 months ago) |
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Oh nvm I see the one
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blojo02184
Big Red



Registered: 05/15/13
Posts: 3,525
Loc: Maine
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Re: Stabilizing a mutation [Re: Ghatti]
#21699669 - 05/19/15 07:03 PM (8 years, 8 months ago) |
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The peyote strain was a mutation that was induced by uv light. That's as much as I know.
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Ghatti
Totally not a Federal Agent

Registered: 06/23/14
Posts: 1,733
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Re: Stabilizing a mutation [Re: blojo02184]
#21699673 - 05/19/15 07:04 PM (8 years, 8 months ago) |
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I thought it was just a KSS blob that he managed to isolate out. Cool
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blojo02184
Big Red



Registered: 05/15/13
Posts: 3,525
Loc: Maine
Last seen: 10 months, 3 days
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Re: Stabilizing a mutation [Re: Ghatti]
#21701229 - 05/20/15 05:49 AM (8 years, 8 months ago) |
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If you search carefully, you might be able to find his pics around hhere.
I know he was working on diploid(2 complete sets of genetics) and triploid cubes. They looked pretty fucking gnarly.
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