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OfflineJsneeb
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First grow microgrow, Fruiting advice, Lots of questions.
    #21660863 - 05/10/15 11:24 AM (9 years, 10 days ago)

First off, I'd like to ask.
I see alot of these "my first grow posts" Do these get annoying? I know many would say just to look at the TEK and follow the TEK but its easier for the pro to look at it and give advice in person advice.

Anyway. I posted a week ago saying my jars are colonized and how I should proceed to fruit them.

Most people said I should crumble and mix with bulk substrate.
I intended to do this but cant find Coir anywhere. I'll likely have to order online so it'll be a while till it gets here.

So I procceeded to fruit it PF tek style, invert the cakes and set them in a humidity chamber.

Now, again my cakes are 1/4 pint very small so even though i have a 27 Quart tote here I could fill with perlite and turn into a proper SGFC it doesn't seem worth it. Especially since I was going to make it a mono tub with my next grow.

I birth the cakes and gave them 4 hours of dunk. ( again its a 1/4 pint cake I didn't want to leave it in as long as a full size cake ) I did not roll. I saw conflicting advice about weather to roll on the first flush or not. I will re dunk and roll for subsequent flushes.

Anyway here's what I got.







Its a small Tupperware container with the cakes sitting on two post it notes.
Some clean verm was sprinkled in to keep water from pooling in the container

I always keep the lid on super loose and sometimes add a popsicle stick to keep it propped open.

I mist them 3-5 times a day. I started of lightly but after seeing some of the posts about peoples cakes drying out I upped the misting to heavy mist.

Anyway does anything look wrong about this set up? Since the jars were concave on the outside the cakes now pool a little bit of water on the tops of the cake when I mist. Is this a problem? I could used a cotton swab and dab up excess water. If I wait for it to evaporate of the top of the cake the sides are completely dry.

Is my FAE inadequate? I fan every time I mist and I feel like with such as small container and such small cakes there should be plenty of oxygen in there.


--------------------
Read my trip report :smile:

Titled, Mushrooms, Thirsty Water Bottle, And Boiling Peanut-butter?

http://www.reddit.com/r/shrooms/comments/37z9rp/mushrooms_thirsty_water_bottle_and_boiling/

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OfflineMatt87
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Re: First grow microgrow, Fruiting advice, Lots of questions. [Re: Jsneeb]
    #21660893 - 05/10/15 11:35 AM (9 years, 10 days ago)

Roll your cakes.
Why the post it notes?
Drill the holes for sgfc.
Your cakes have to dry out a bit- don't overmist.


--------------------

Once you understand the way broadly, you see it in all things. -Musashi

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OfflineJsneeb
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Re: First grow microgrow, Fruiting advice, Lots of questions. [Re: Matt87]
    #21660921 - 05/10/15 11:42 AM (9 years, 10 days ago)

Damn, Didn't realize how much those pictures suck. I'll try take some better ones.


--------------------
Read my trip report :smile:

Titled, Mushrooms, Thirsty Water Bottle, And Boiling Peanut-butter?

http://www.reddit.com/r/shrooms/comments/37z9rp/mushrooms_thirsty_water_bottle_and_boiling/

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OfflineJsneeb
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Re: First grow microgrow, Fruiting advice, Lots of questions. [Re: Jsneeb]
    #21662394 - 05/10/15 06:46 PM (9 years, 10 days ago)

Bumping to the top. I know its not a popular topic but I'd appreciate some input for the newbies.


--------------------
Read my trip report :smile:

Titled, Mushrooms, Thirsty Water Bottle, And Boiling Peanut-butter?

http://www.reddit.com/r/shrooms/comments/37z9rp/mushrooms_thirsty_water_bottle_and_boiling/

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OfflineZuto18
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Re: First grow microgrow, Fruiting advice, Lots of questions. [Re: Jsneeb]
    #21662467 - 05/10/15 07:12 PM (9 years, 10 days ago)

If this works for you i might do the same its my first grow too and i was planning on invitro but lately ive been having second thoughts since one of the strains i got is moving along quite rapidly while the other is way slow how long did your jars take to colonize btw im also using 1/4 pint jars


--------------------

Ever make mistakes in life? Lets make them birds, yeah, they are birds now. -Bob Ross

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OfflineMatt87
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Re: First grow microgrow, Fruiting advice, Lots of questions. [Re: Jsneeb]
    #21662506 - 05/10/15 07:24 PM (9 years, 10 days ago)

Quote:

Jsneeb said:
Bumping to the top. I know its not a popular topic but I'd appreciate some input for the newbies.



I gave you input. Use a sgfc.


--------------------

Once you understand the way broadly, you see it in all things. -Musashi

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OfflineAppalachian Brony
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Re: First grow microgrow, Fruiting advice, Lots of questions. [Re: Jsneeb]
    #21662633 - 05/10/15 07:57 PM (9 years, 10 days ago)

Quote:

Jsneeb said:
Bumping to the top. I know its not a popular topic but I'd appreciate some input for the newbies.




don't bump your own thread within 24 hours

Follow a tek, build an sgfc and use it properly.

If you insist on bein different you will get some mushrooms, but not as many as you could. The key thing to remember is that the cakes need light, fresh air exchange, and evaporation from the surface of the substrate
you need to fan this every couple hours
you need a daylight spectrum bulb a few feet away or indirect sunlight
you need only mist when the cakes look dry
Rolling the cakes in verm helps the cakes keep from drying out, but it is not meant to keep the cakes moist. You don't want your cakes to stay moist. You want the moisture evaporating. The evaporation from the surface of the substrate tells the mycelium where to knot. With that cointainer you're using, if you mist heavily three times a day and don't fan hard once an hour you're not allowing evaporation from the surface of the substrate.

If that tupperware deal was my only option I would mist in the morning and fan at least 4 times throughout the day while also leaving the top of the container cracked.


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InvisiblebodhisattaMDiscordReddit
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Re: First grow microgrow, Fruiting advice, Lots of questions. [Re: Appalachian Brony]
    #21662700 - 05/10/15 08:13 PM (9 years, 10 days ago)

put a shopping bag over the top and poke some holes in it, dunk and roll your cakes.

or build a SGFC

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OfflineJsneeb
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Re: First grow microgrow, Fruiting advice, Lots of questions. [Re: Zuto18]
    #21662792 - 05/10/15 08:35 PM (9 years, 10 days ago)

Thank you everyone.

I've been working with limited resources, which is why I ask if my alternative will work.

So You're saying even for 2 cakes I should build a full size SGFC?
I planned on going to mono tubs in the future so I would use it for this and then it would sit or just get thrown out.

Thank you for the hints on the misting. I have been keeping them moist all the time. I didn't know over misting was a problem. I'll tone it down to misting before bed and in the AM.


--------------------
Read my trip report :smile:

Titled, Mushrooms, Thirsty Water Bottle, And Boiling Peanut-butter?

http://www.reddit.com/r/shrooms/comments/37z9rp/mushrooms_thirsty_water_bottle_and_boiling/

Edited by Jsneeb (05/10/15 08:40 PM)

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OfflineJsneeb
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Re: First grow microgrow, Fruiting advice, Lots of questions. [Re: Jsneeb]
    #21662824 - 05/10/15 08:42 PM (9 years, 10 days ago)

Matt, Thank you. I read your response and acknowledged. On a forum hundreds of people visit a day I was expecting a few more opinions. Once 4-5 people have said to stop screwing around and build an SGFC I will do so.

Also sorry for thread bumping before 24 hours. Now aware of the rules. Will no do so again


--------------------
Read my trip report :smile:

Titled, Mushrooms, Thirsty Water Bottle, And Boiling Peanut-butter?

http://www.reddit.com/r/shrooms/comments/37z9rp/mushrooms_thirsty_water_bottle_and_boiling/

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InvisiblebodhisattaMDiscordReddit
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Re: First grow microgrow, Fruiting advice, Lots of questions. [Re: Jsneeb]
    #21662840 - 05/10/15 08:45 PM (9 years, 10 days ago)

https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/19279962

Fruiting Chamber
A SGFC has 1/4" holes spaces 2 inches apart in a grid patten on all six sides. 4-6 inches of moist perlite. No attachments made to it with any extra things like humidifiers. Optimally the SGFC should be in the middle of a room. No fans should be run in the room with the SGFC, but a cracked window is OK. A humidifier in your house can help to raise the ambient RH but don't put it near your SGFC put it in the other corner of the room if you do decide to run a humidifier at all. The SGFC IMO should have at least 6-12 inches of room from any wall on all 6 sides. This includes finding some sort of raisers to elevate the SGFC off of the surface it's on.

Misting and Fanning.
In general you'll mist your cakes until they glisten(yes they can even with the verm on them) and then fan right after the mist. You can mist your cakes directly and you should. Also get some mist on the perlite to keep it hydrated. When you notice the cake is no longer glistening you can mist it again and then fan. This occurs on average of 3-5 times a day. Don't worry about sleeping or being gone 12 hours. Just do it when you're around and don't forget about it is all.

Fanning is not FAE it's only purpose is to relive the high RH air so that the cakes can get a kickstart on evaporation.

FAE
This is a phenomenon (Fresh air exchange) in a properly built SGFC this is constantly happening. The perlite is naturally cooler than the surrounding air this moves molecules closer to each other as the lose kinetic energy. This creates low pressure which pulls air up through the bottom holes. As the air moves through the perlite it picks up humidity and keeps the chamber at or above 90%RH. This occurs naturally without the fanning and is why we like to have no fans in the room and is also why fanning after misting is not a replacement for FAE. FAE is having your PPM of CO2 below ~600-1000

Quote:

pussyfart said:
Fanning is not a replacement for constant FAE.

You would need to fan several times per hour.




Quote:

The physics of the shotgun terrarium are that evaporation causes a temperature drop, thus the air molecules are closer together.  This results in higher pressure within the air spaces around the perlite.

The substrates and/or lights provide slight heating within the body of the terrarium.  This results in relatively lower pressure.  This low pressure area above the perlite(high pressure) results in airflow to balance the pressure.  This in turn leads to more evaporation from the perlite, continuing the process.  This is why a shotgun terrarium handles FAE automatically.

The CO2 does not settle to the bottom.  In addition, the CO2 from mushrooms is mixed thoroughly into the O2, thus it travels out through the holes in the sides and top as part of the natural circulation.  It doesn't enter the denser air within the perlite and spill out the bottom.
RR




Quote:

RogerRabbit said:
Quote:

JayBrasco said:
fewer, you dont want alot of humidity to escape. only enough on the BOTTOM to get rid of CO2




Bad advice.  Fresh air exchange causes a loss of moisture from the cakes or other substrate, and this loss of moisture is the number ONE pinning trigger.  Noobs worry too much about humidity, which is easily corrected with misting.  You MUST mist to make up for the lost moisture.  In the old days, people would toss cakes in a sealed up chamber and hope for a couple of mushrooms before green mold set in.  Today, you can easily get three or four times the harvest the early growers did by using a proper terrarium that provides both fresh air and high humidity.

Furthermore, why you guys think CO2 is heavy like water and will drain out holes in the bottom baffles the mind.  If all the CO2 settled to the bottom, we'd all be dead due to the power plants and cars, cows, etc., that are puking out tons of CO2 by the minute.  The CO2 MIXES with the air and thus must be exchanged WITH the air.  It isn't a sweet little layer on the bottom of your fruiting chambers.

As for only reading 80% humidity in a shotgun terrarium with a humidifier running in the closet, it proves your hygrometer is screwed.  I can put a shotgun terrarium in an open room with the lid totally off and get higher humidity than that.

I seriously doubt anyone has lower humidity than I do.  It's below zero outside and I use a large cast iron wood stove to heat my cabin.  My properly made shotgun terrariums all read 95% or greater.  I keep a cool mist humidifier running near the wood stove, and it's nice and cozy in here, even though there's nearly five feet of snow on the ground outside.
RR




Co2's concentration in "air" is higher at sea level but it's still mixed evenly with the air. Yes gravity does work but it doesn't pull co2 out of the air to make it it's own distinct layer.

even more on the subject

RH
You can't see RH, a SGFC should have no condensation on the walls, Condensation is caused by temperature differentials, if you have condensation you need to fix something. If you want to measure RH the bare minimum in quality for a hygrometer is a analog cigar box one that can be calibrated or a "synthetic hair hygrometer"

Don't get too worried and caught up trying to measure the RH in your SGFC anyway. It's far more important in a green house to measure humidity not so much in your SGFC,

When I put a RH gauge in my SGFC it doesn't read more than 90% all the time, and that's good A-OK just fine, don't worry about it don't measure it, your cakes are going to have a perfect micro-climate if you did the dunk and roll you'll have 99% surface humidity and that's all that matters, FAE is way more important and the RH inside the chamber is just fine for the fruit bodies themselves, if you have low humidity in your home just mist the perlite a bit more often to keep it hydrated it will work just fine and properly if you build it right and follow the damn directions to the T and not try to make your own uneducated guesses as to what improvements you can make. If you must then use the humidifier on the other side of the room or as far away from the SGFC as you can manage.

supplemental info about RH

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Offlinepinto
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Re: First grow microgrow, Fruiting advice, Lots of questions. [Re: Jsneeb]
    #21662880 - 05/10/15 08:54 PM (9 years, 10 days ago)

From the look of it, I don't think you'll have enough head space for the mushrooms to grow. It also looks like more FAE is needed. If you are only doing a few cakes a full SGFC isn't completely necessary. All the Teks are dialed in for that size, so you could make a smaller version and tinker until it works (like I've done before). As long as you don't screw it up real bad you'll get some results.

From my limited personal experience, BRF cakes to coir isn't the greatest. I'm doing WBS from now on.


--------------------
Stupid Sexy Flanders.

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InvisibleTossout
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Re: First grow microgrow, Fruiting advice, Lots of questions. [Re: pinto]
    #21663365 - 05/10/15 11:01 PM (9 years, 9 days ago)

I followed all the Pf tek instructions and just had these pop up! These members are smart, listen to them!





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OfflineMatt87
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Re: First grow microgrow, Fruiting advice, Lots of questions. [Re: Tossout]
    #21663474 - 05/10/15 11:30 PM (9 years, 9 days ago)

Nice tossout!


--------------------

Once you understand the way broadly, you see it in all things. -Musashi

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OfflineJsneeb
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Re: First grow microgrow, Fruiting advice, Lots of questions. [Re: bodhisatta]
    #21666559 - 05/11/15 06:05 PM (9 years, 9 days ago)

Thats exactly what I was looking for.

I definetly fit into the noob who worries about Misting more than FAE. I thought fanning was enough FAE for the small container.

I bought some perlite and will construct a proper SGFC tonight.

Thanks again.


--------------------
Read my trip report :smile:

Titled, Mushrooms, Thirsty Water Bottle, And Boiling Peanut-butter?

http://www.reddit.com/r/shrooms/comments/37z9rp/mushrooms_thirsty_water_bottle_and_boiling/

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Offlinecr1s1s
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Re: First grow microgrow, Fruiting advice, Lots of questions. [Re: Jsneeb]
    #21666695 - 05/11/15 06:37 PM (9 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

Jsneeb said:
I bought some perlite and will construct a proper SGFC tonight.
Thanks again.




Proper is what you should look for. :thumbup:
If you follow these teks exactly everything should be a breeze.
It will take a while your first few times but once you find your groove it's almost second nature so the process takes up much less of your time.

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