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Invisiblebigjoshman
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Re: First LSD trip, worried about hppd! [Re: HamiltonJoe]
    #21651941 - 05/08/15 04:45 AM (9 years, 12 days ago)

Alright people crap talking the nbomes again haha. Okay I'll tell you what hppd most commonly truly is. you likely WILL get hppd. With lsd it's waves and stuff on ceilings or floors if you focus in on them this is the same with the nbomes. However lsd makes car lights appear REALLY bright atleast for a couple months I have not noticed this with the nbomes. at least not for as long. A similar thing happens to people who get eye surgery to improve their vision it makes lights brighter and very annoying but like I said it was worse for me with lsd and barely noticeable with nbome but listen to who you want to Listen to.

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InvisibleSirShroomsAlott
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Re: First LSD trip, worried about hppd! [Re: HamiltonJoe]
    #21652083 - 05/08/15 06:38 AM (9 years, 12 days ago)

I agree with just not abusing it, as I said I get it for like a few weeks everytime I trip, but I only take psychs every couple months. I feel like if I didn't let it fully go away before taking more, it would just get worse and last longer.

But I always swear I only get it because I thought about it too much and because it only happens when I think about it and try to see if it's happening. Only once was it happening without me trying, which is what got me so worried about it, but that only lasted 3 days or so or until I stopped smoking weed everyday.

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InvisibleHeisencybin
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Re: First LSD trip, worried about hppd! [Re: SirShroomsAlott]
    #21652090 - 05/08/15 06:40 AM (9 years, 12 days ago)

Just make sure it really is lsd. And try not to think about hppd like others said before me. Seems to be directly related to anxiety or a bad trip. If you're really nervous, start low dosing first. I've done a lot of acid and the other real issues of hppd I've had were from hits that were low purity or not even acid. You'll be good bro

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InvisibleSirShroomsAlott
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Re: First LSD trip, worried about hppd! [Re: bigjoshman]
    #21652233 - 05/08/15 07:39 AM (9 years, 12 days ago)

Quote:

bigjoshman said:
Alright people crap talking the nbomes again haha. Okay I'll tell you what hppd most commonly truly is. you likely WILL get hppd. With lsd it's waves and stuff on ceilings or floors if you focus in on them this is the same with the nbomes. However lsd makes car lights appear REALLY bright atleast for a couple months I have not noticed this with the nbomes. at least not for as long. A similar thing happens to people who get eye surgery to improve their vision it makes lights brighter and very annoying but like I said it was worse for me with lsd and barely noticeable with nbome but listen to who you want to Listen to.




I agree with your point to atleast be wary of hppd, but I don't think you should try to objectively say everyone gets it just because you did, I rarely take acid, a lot of my friends, a minimum of 10-20, take acid ATLEAST once every two weeks, and they've never got a single lasting effect, out of everyone I've ever met who used/uses psychs, I'm the only one who had lasting symptoms, I'm also the only one who studied and researched these drugs before taking them, so I'm the only one who knew there could be lasting visual effects like hppd, which still makes me think that thinking about it too much, can make you pay attention to it, thus bring it out a symptom that wouldn't of been there otherwise.

nbomes aren't all bad either so I agree with you on that, I personally would never take them, but I would advise atleast researching the possible effects .positive and negative before taking any of them but I recommend that with all drugs.

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Invisiblebigjoshman
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Re: First LSD trip, worried about hppd! [Re: SirShroomsAlott]
    #21653422 - 05/08/15 01:52 PM (9 years, 12 days ago)

I didn't tell my girlfriend about hppd and she didn't research anything she also complained about the bright lights so I dint think it's merely a mental thing. But I also wouldn't notice unless I try to make it happen. I personally like hppd... Reminds me of good times plus it makes smoking weed trippier

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Invisiblebigjoshman
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Re: First LSD trip, worried about hppd! [Re: bigjoshman]
    #21653424 - 05/08/15 01:52 PM (9 years, 12 days ago)

Minus the bright lights from lsd that is simply annoying and can't be avoided

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InvisibleGottaloveacid
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Re: First LSD trip, worried about hppd! [Re: PsychedelicSwede]
    #21653661 - 05/08/15 02:50 PM (9 years, 12 days ago)

I wouldn't worry about it unless you are taking over 500ug or are taking it with other strong drugs like mdma or 2cb.

I had 15 LSD trips and a shroom trip before I got HPPD, and it wasn't even that bad until I candyflipped. ~250ug of LSD and 150mg of pure MDMA. Had a VERY intense trip, and it gave me bad hppd. That was over a month ago as well, and I still have strong HPPD.

Not everyone gets it bad, but some do. People may think that HPPD isn't that bad... until you have really bad hppd. It is much stronger than moving walls and faint cevs. There are open eyed visuals ranging from not just intense breathing but surfaces morphing into one thing, oev patterns, and when I toke I get light LSD dose visuals. The headspace is non existent, but the strong visuals are very intrusive. It can also be hard to masturbate or fall asleep because the closed eyed visuals become too distracting (I close my eye when I am wackin' it).

My HPPD is at it's worst whenever I get out of a hot shower while high on weed. The visuals are like CEVs but with your eyes open, making it VERY difficult to see. I get these strong visuals even in direct sunlight...






Just use it no more than a reasonable amount and you should be okay :billymaythumbup:


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OfflineRebelutionsssss
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Re: First LSD trip, worried about hppd! [Re: Gottaloveacid]
    #21653744 - 05/08/15 03:10 PM (9 years, 12 days ago)

Damn dude that sounds like a pain in the ass. I guess you were the one in ten thousand


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Offlinemy3rdeye
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Re: First LSD trip, worried about hppd! [Re: Rebelutionsssss]
    #21655177 - 05/08/15 09:44 PM (9 years, 11 days ago)

http://www.newyorker.com/tech/elements/a-trip-that-doesnt-end

This guy took half a hit of lsd in the 80s and has it for life. This thread is full of bad info. You dont need to abuse it to get hppd. And nbome or lsd makes no difference. About the only good advice is dont think about it. Debate is raging about how many people have hppd but it doesn't matter how rare it is when you get it.

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InvisibleGottaloveacid
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Re: First LSD trip, worried about hppd! [Re: my3rdeye]
    #21655185 - 05/08/15 09:46 PM (9 years, 11 days ago)

Certainly there is a risk every single time you do it, but I think everyone can agree that long term use or frequent abuse can increase the chance you will get it. My cousin did mescaline for his first psychedelic a few months ago and has some HPPD he talks about, but it is nothing serious.


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:mushroom2::mushroom2: The greatest story ever told is the story that never ends!:mushroom2::mushroom2:

wubba lubba dub dubstep :gimmebass:

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OfflineEggtimer
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Re: First LSD trip, worried about hppd! [Re: PsychedelicSwede]
    #21663058 - 05/10/15 09:41 PM (9 years, 9 days ago)

http://www.nature.com/news/no-link-found-between-psychedelics-and-psychosis-1.16968
Quote:

For example, people may develop hallucinogen persisting perception disorder (HPPD), a ‘trip’ that never seems to end, involving incessant distortions in the visual field, shimmering lights and coloured dots. “I’ve seen a number of people with these symptoms following a psychedelic experience, and it can be a very serious condition,” says Grob.

Krebs and Johansen, however, point to studies that have found symptoms of HPPD in people who have never used psychedelics5.

The second of the new two studies, also published in the Journal of Psychopharmacology2, looked at 190,000 NSDUH respondents from 2008 to 2012. It also found that the classic psychedelics were not associated with adverse mental-health outcomes. In addition, it found that people who had used LSD and psilocybin had lower lifetime rates of suicidal thoughts and attempts.

“We are not claiming that no individuals have ever been harmed by psychedelics,” says author Matthew Johnson, an associate professor in the Behavioral Pharmacology Research Unit at Johns Hopkins University in Baltimore, Maryland. “Anecdotes about acid casualties can be very powerful — but these instances are rare,” he says. At the population level, he says, the data suggest that the harms of psychedelics “have been overstated”.




http://brain.oxfordjournals.org/content/137/5/1419
Quote:

Patients with ‘visual snow’ report continuous tiny dots in the entire visual field similar to the noise of an analogue television. As they frequently have migraine as a comorbidity with ophthalmological, neurological and radiological studies being normal, they are offered various diagnoses, including persistent migraine aura, post-hallucinogen flashback, or psychogenic disorder. Our aim was to study patients with ‘visual snow’ to characterize the phenotype. A three-step approach was followed: (i) a chart review of patients referred to us identified 22 patients with ‘visual snow’. Fifteen had additional visual symptoms, and 20 patients had comorbid migraine, five with aura; (ii) to identify systematically additional visual symptoms, an internet survey (n = 275) of self-assessed ‘visual snow’ subjects done by Eye On Vision Foundation was analysed. In two random samples from 235 complete data sets, the same eight additional visual symptoms were present in >33% of patients: palinopsia (trailing and afterimages), entoptic phenomena (floaters, blue field entoptic phenomenon, spontaneous photopsia, self-light of the eye), photophobia, and nyctalopia (impaired night vision); and (iii) a prospective semi-structured telephone interview in a further 142 patients identified 78 (41 female) with confirmed ‘visual snow’ and normal ophthalmological exams. Of these, 72 had at least three of the additional visual symptoms from step (ii). One-quarter of patients had ‘visual snow’ as long as they could remember, whereas for the others the mean age of onset was 21 ± 9 years. Thirty-two patients had constant visual symptoms, whereas the remainder experienced either progressive or stepwise worsening. Headache was the most frequent symptom associated with the beginning or a worsening of the visual disturbance (36%), whereas migraine aura (seven patients) and consumption of illicit drugs (five, no hallucinogens) were rare. Migraine (59%), migraine with aura (27%), anxiety and depression were common comorbidities over time. Eight patients had first degree relatives with visual snow. Clinical investigations were not contributory. Only a few treatment trials have been successful in individual patients. Our data suggest that ‘visual snow’ is a unique visual disturbance clinically distinct from migraine aura that can be disabling for patients. Migraine is a common concomitant although standard migraine treatments are often unhelpful. ‘Visual snow’ should be considered a distinct disorder and systematic studies of its clinical features, biology and treatment responses need to be commenced to begin to understand what has been an almost completely ignored problem.




Quote:

Experience with the consumption of illicit drugs

Cannabis has been tried at least once in 31 patients with visual snow (40%). In addition to the patients, who had a start of the visual snow after using cannabis, one experienced a temporary worsening of the visual snow while smoking. Ecstasy has been tried by eight patients with visual snow (10%). Cocaine produced a temporary worsening of the visual symptoms in one patient. Seven patients (9%) had experience with cocaine. LSD did not induce visual snow or any additional visual symptoms and was tried by three patients (4%). For recreational purposes, amphetamines were taken at least once by four patients (5%). None of our patients has tried hallucinogenic mushrooms.




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OfflineTrypto-Fan
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Re: First LSD trip, worried about hppd! [Re: Eggtimer]
    #21663901 - 05/11/15 02:36 AM (9 years, 9 days ago)

I've had visual snow (and all the other visual snow related things) all my life.
I only recently found out that this was not 'normal' whilst researching HPPD.

I think some people are just much more perceptive to these things, and I'd agree with heisencybin and sirshroomsalot that it's directly related to anxiety and paying too much attention to these things.

You end up in a feedback loop;  noticing a slight change in visual perception-getting anxious-dwelling on said change-noticing it even more-getting more anxious-noticing completely normal things that were unnoticed before and dwelling on them and getting more anxious.

I know this from my own experience with HPPD and anxiety.

These days, i do not worry about HPPD because I've been through that whole turmoil, and i know that as soon as you stop noticing or looking for it, it goes away and doesn't interfere in life, and so now i notice no lasting visual symptoms. :smile:

Edited by Trypto-Fan (05/11/15 02:37 AM)

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OfflinePyrrho
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Re: First LSD trip, worried about hppd! [Re: bigjoshman]
    #21664085 - 05/11/15 05:06 AM (9 years, 9 days ago)

I've taken hundreds of hits and no HPPD :shrug:
Quote:

bigjoshman said:
With lsd it's waves and stuff on ceilings or floors




:whatshesaid:

That is the only HPPD that I've experienced... Really not a big deal. I've taken hundreds of hits over the course of the past 7 years.

There is always a risk of side effects such as HPPD.. but if you are gonna do the drugs regardless, better off not stressing over it.


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~Arthur Schopenhauer



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OfflineShortknight
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Re: First LSD trip, worried about hppd! [Re: Pyrrho]
    #21666769 - 05/11/15 06:56 PM (9 years, 9 days ago)

If you can forget memories at the flick of a switch, you won't have have any hppd. If you have a good memory it will stick with you because you don't want to forget. :peace: Make the best of whatever you're dealt.

Shorty:yinyang:


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InvisibleGottaloveacid
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Re: First LSD trip, worried about hppd! [Re: Trypto-Fan]
    #21667213 - 05/11/15 08:28 PM (9 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

Trypto-Fan said:
I've had visual snow (and all the other visual snow related things) all my life.
I only recently found out that this was not 'normal' whilst researching HPPD.

I think some people are just much more perceptive to these things, and I'd agree with heisencybin and sirshroomsalot that it's directly related to anxiety and paying too much attention to these things.

You end up in a feedback loop;  noticing a slight change in visual perception-getting anxious-dwelling on said change-noticing it even more-getting more anxious-noticing completely normal things that were unnoticed before and dwelling on them and getting more anxious.

I know this from my own experience with HPPD and anxiety.

These days, i do not worry about HPPD because I've been through that whole turmoil, and i know that as soon as you stop noticing or looking for it, it goes away and doesn't interfere in life, and so now i notice no lasting visual symptoms. :smile:




Imo you just haven't had bad enough hppd :shrug: When I first had it (was minor) I just got the occasional moving surface or morphing wall. It was no big deal, actually it was kind of cool. But I am at the point where I get obvious open eye patterns, like really small and infinitlely repetitive, sort of like those Persian rugs covering surfaces. It isn't nearly as vivid as it would be if I was tripping, but it is there. When I smoke weed, it comes out even more.

When you have bad HPPD, it is more than anxiety about a small change in perception. It is a huge change in visual perception that can be distracting and overly intrusive.


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:mushroom2::mushroom2: The greatest story ever told is the story that never ends!:mushroom2::mushroom2:

wubba lubba dub dubstep :gimmebass:

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OfflineTrypto-Fan
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Re: First LSD trip, worried about hppd! [Re: Gottaloveacid]
    #21668390 - 05/12/15 02:22 AM (9 years, 8 days ago)

Quote:

Gottaloveacid said:
Imo you just haven't had bad enough hppd :shrug: When I first had it (was minor) I just got the occasional moving surface or morphing wall. It was no big deal, actually it was kind of cool. But I am at the point where I get obvious open eye patterns, like really small and infinitlely repetitive, sort of like those Persian rugs covering surfaces. It isn't nearly as vivid as it would be if I was tripping, but it is there. When I smoke weed, it comes out even more.

When you have bad HPPD, it is more than anxiety about a small change in perception. It is a huge change in visual perception that can be distracting and overly intrusive.




One of the first times i tried weed, everyones voices and mouth movements went out of sync, like a bad copy of a movie.
This remained (a year or more) and with it came depersonalisation/derealisation, anxiety, panic attacks, and the feeling that i was insane or that I'd fucked my mind up forever.

As soon as i learnt to live with it and managed to ignore it, it went away :smile:

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InvisibleHeisencybin
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Re: First LSD trip, worried about hppd! [Re: Gottaloveacid]
    #21668696 - 05/12/15 06:37 AM (9 years, 8 days ago)

So how long have you had hppd? I have some hppd like the visual snow ish and morphing if I concentrate enough. Mostly it's all ignorable. It's been worst before but if I take a month or two off, I'm back to normal. I've tripped many many times and I'm curious to how yours got that bad.

Did you notice some and keep pushing it? Or did it come about after a particular trip? And is it permanent?  As in, have you taken time off psychs to see if it goes away? Anyways, hope you manage well and it goes away for ya.

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InvisibleSirShroomsAlott
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Re: First LSD trip, worried about hppd! [Re: Heisencybin]
    #21668735 - 05/12/15 06:57 AM (9 years, 8 days ago)

Quote:

Heisencybin said:
So how long have you had hppd? I have some hppd like the visual snow ish and morphing if I concentrate enough. Mostly it's all ignorable. It's been worst before but if I take a month or two off, I'm back to normal. I've tripped many many times and I'm curious to how yours got that bad.

Did you notice some and keep pushing it? Or did it come about after a particular trip? And is it permanent?  As in, have you taken time off psychs to see if it goes away? Anyways, hope you manage well and it goes away for ya.




considering it sounds like heisencybin has the exact same situation I do with psychs and hppd, I'm curious about this as well. I always get it shortly after a trip, weed makes shit worse, but after a month or two I'm 100% back to normal, but I never took more until it fully went away.

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OfflineAchillita
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Re: First LSD trip, worried about hppd! [Re: SirShroomsAlott]
    #21668903 - 05/12/15 08:17 AM (9 years, 8 days ago)

Recewntly I've been noticing that I've got some really really minor HPPD. Really it's just tracers. They're mostly neglible but still occasionally annoying.

Maybe this thread is just giving me HPPD :tinfoil:


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OfflineRebelutionsssss
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Re: First LSD trip, worried about hppd! [Re: Achillita]
    #21668942 - 05/12/15 08:32 AM (9 years, 8 days ago)

:lol: this thread should have never been started, now everyone's going to think they have hppd


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