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OfflineCrobih
rap-cord
Registered: 11/04/98
Posts: 2,015
Loc: cave
Last seen: 4 years, 3 months
The essence of e-democracy
    #2164994 - 12/06/03 09:00 PM (13 years, 6 days ago)

..or, direct demoracy.

What is the essence in your opinion? I need this info to know, from what point I have to start explaining this concept.

Thank you in advance  :sun:


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Anonymous

Re: The essence of e-democracy [Re: Crobih]
    #2165066 - 12/06/03 09:36 PM (13 years, 6 days ago)

direct democracy would be disastrous in any nation, especially
this one.


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OfflinePhred
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Registered: 10/19/00
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Re: The essence of e-democracy [Re: ]
    #2165327 - 12/06/03 11:14 PM (13 years, 6 days ago)

immaculate is right on the money.

Direct democracy (with no constitutional limits) would be nothing more than mob rule. Even with constitutional limits, it would be so cumbersome and unwieldy as to be unworkable.

pinky


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Anonymous

Re: The essence of e-democracy [Re: Phred]
    #2165388 - 12/06/03 11:46 PM (13 years, 6 days ago)

what is any democracy but mob rule controlled according to mob dynamics?


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OfflinePhred
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Re: The essence of e-democracy [Re: ]
    #2165455 - 12/07/03 12:27 AM (13 years, 6 days ago)

This is exactly why I oppose unlimited direct democracy -- Democracy with a Capital "D" as discovered by the Greeks.

The United States is not a democracy. It is a constitutionally limited Republic whose legislators and executive branch are elected through a democratic vote.

Too bad the legislators and the judiciary pay no attention to constitutional limits.

pinky


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OfflineGilgamesh
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Registered: 09/14/00
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Re: The essence of e-democracy [Re: Phred]
    #2165468 - 12/07/03 12:33 AM (13 years, 6 days ago)

The point of any government is simply to allow those possesing power to function effectively. It would be unnatural for those with power to give it up so the powerless can have a say in things. Based on evolutionary precedence, those who are powerless dont deserve a say in things. Therefore systems of government will stay democratic only to the point that their are equaly powerful members in the upper echelon of that society.


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(( (( NEVER EVER SHAKE A BABY )) ))


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Anonymous

Re: The essence of e-democracy [Re: Gilgamesh]
    #2166790 - 12/07/03 05:01 PM (13 years, 5 days ago)

"dont deserve a say in things."
what you're basically saying is that it's a-OK for most of humanity to become slaves to an upper-class, that is utterly BS on the natural level. It's obvious that republics and democracies both have fatal flaws- one becomes mob rule, the other is just plain oligarchy- why should a select group have the power to govern? I don't give a damn what the people in "power" think of retaining the power they have been born with


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OfflineMetaShroom
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Re: The essence of e-democracy [Re: ]
    #2166826 - 12/07/03 05:19 PM (13 years, 5 days ago)

Direct democracy is good for small groups, as is consensus descision making, but the more people there are, the greater is their collective stupidity - at least within a system such as we have have right now.


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JOIN MAPS -> www.MAPS.ORG


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Invisiblez@z.com
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Registered: 10/13/02
Posts: 2,876
Loc: ATL
Re: The essence of e-democracy [Re: Crobih]
    #2167061 - 12/07/03 07:02 PM (13 years, 5 days ago)

Quote:

Crobih said:
What is the essence in your opinion?



Two wolves and a sheep deciding what's for dinner.


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"Of all tyrannies, a tyranny exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It may be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end, for they do so with the approval of their own conscience." - C.S. Lewis

"I would rather be exposed to the inconveniencies attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." - Thomas Jefferson


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OfflineCrobih
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Registered: 11/04/98
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Re: The essence of e-democracy [Re: MetaShroom]
    #2167062 - 12/07/03 07:02 PM (13 years, 5 days ago)

Well. Let me ask you one question. Imagine that you will be responsible for what you say to the public. Cause that is the only way that e-democracy works. By taking your own responsibility for your statements. And in transparent system we can all see what are you talking.

So. Shall you participate in that system if you actually do not have a clue about the topic? Remember. You are being listened. As a part of society. Society can trust you, but society has to punish wrong step. And its leader. To protet itself.

Shall you now participate in public opinion making about the stuff you have no clue. Or, shall you let it to those who are not affraid of consequences, that will come for sure. One more thing. You can not say too big stupidities, cause smart people will fuck you up.

Remember. We do not chat, we do not talk in a regular base. Cause we are responsible. For society and for ourselves. Its not a regular forum, like this one. Not a regular disscusion. Here you have to ask if you do not understand, or let it to those who do understand. You can not bi ignorant fool, cause you do risk.

What shall you do? What shall the average person do in this sort of a system? Where you take yourown consequences for all the public action. Cause, leading society means responsibility. So.


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Invisiblemuhurgle
Turtles all theway down

Registered: 10/29/03
Posts: 299
Re: The essence of e-democracy [Re: Crobih]
    #2167170 - 12/07/03 07:40 PM (13 years, 5 days ago)

Switzerland seem to have something resembling direct democracy. As far as I can tell, it works for them.

The problem with democracy, is that people are (by choice) stupid and apathetic. Maybe direct democracy would give people an incentive to be political and educate themselves on issues. Or maybe not.


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"To make this mundane world sublime
Take half a gram of phanerothyme."

Aldous Huxley


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