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OfflineMixomatosis
great ape

Registered: 10/28/03
Posts: 1,306
Loc: cipherland
Last seen: 3 years, 11 months
You silly afterlife-believing fools...
    #2145946 - 11/30/03 06:05 AM (13 years, 9 days ago)

... is what a jerk might say if we were allowed to attack people on this forum.

Basically, what's with all you people out there (You know who you are) who come out and explain how we will all be reincarnated, or will go to heaven, or we have karma, or anything along those lines. How can you claim to know what happens after death? Who gave you the authority to come out and state how the whole "system" works? Let me guess.. some stupid book you read.

That's right, I invite you to state why you believe whatever afterlife fantasy you believe. It seems strange to me that anyone would claim to have the answer considering how you can't possibly have the answer.


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OfflinePositronius
playboy

Registered: 11/27/03
Posts: 947
Loc: montreal-vancouver-tokyo
Last seen: 12 years, 3 months
Re: You silly afterlife-believing fools... [Re: Mixomatosis]
    #2145954 - 11/30/03 06:15 AM (13 years, 9 days ago)

a solid belief in the afterlife is like a comforting electric blanket. What is comfort? why do us humans strive for mental comfortability, even though it is often analgous with fantastical beliefs?

Belief in an afterlife, belief in a creator god who gave you a purpose (even though it may be as redundant as worshipping the one who created you) are all attempts to return one's mind the comfort state of our fetal incubation.

Not me though, I'm not gonna opt for the warm blanket, because I know I'll pull it over my eyes and miss out on the great picture-show that is life. Having a concrete belief in afterlife hinders one's ability to truly experience true experience?

yes, no? we're in a hedgemaze and we dont know whats in the middle, by making up stories that the middle of the maze will be filled with cushy sofas and big screen TVs, are we not robbing ourselves the direct experience of being lost in a maze?

am I the only one who finds being lost enjoyable?


--------------------
and you know it like a poet, like....babydoll


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Invisiblemedicinebag
Hunting

Registered: 11/15/03
Posts: 344
Loc: The land of The People
Re: You silly afterlife-believing fools... [Re: Positronius]
    #2145969 - 11/30/03 06:25 AM (13 years, 9 days ago)

What does Mixamatosis believe is going to happen to his mind/ego/personality/memories/experiences when breath ceases to flow from his lungs??????


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OfflineDroz
Love of Life
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Registered: 10/16/00
Posts: 2,746
Loc: Floorida
Last seen: 1 year, 3 months
Re: You silly afterlife-believing fools... [Re: medicinebag]
    #2146037 - 11/30/03 07:19 AM (13 years, 9 days ago)

It's fun to believe. Basically I get to mentally masturbate on my own ideas. Sometimes I let my ideas flow other times I keep them inside. I'm not one who is that good at communicating images that i see. I'm in a daze at the moment trying to understand what is going on in my mind. But it's all good in the end we all get to see the reality which one has created in ones own mind to the fullest. If it's not true like many say, then we die. Simple.

Peace,
Droz


--------------------
Evolution of Time.


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InvisibleSkorpivoMusterion
Livin in theTwilight Zone...
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Re: You silly afterlife-believing fools... [Re: Mixomatosis]
    #2146272 - 11/30/03 11:29 AM (13 years, 9 days ago)

lemme ask you: What's YOUR belief? That not a damn thing happens to us when we die? Whatever your belief is....you can't prove that your belief is right more than anybody else's belief is right.

So I could call you a "sillly non-afterlife-believing fool"...that is, if thats what you choose.

It all boils down to what YOU honestly feel to be true. If it gives you comfort knowing that your soul doesn't transcend death, then hey, go for it, who am I to judge you if thats what makes you happy?


As for your invitation to state why I believe in reincarnation....the following says it all right here...
Quote:


Is there actually proof of reincarnation?

I would like to answer this with another question: Is there actually any proof that reincarnation doesn?t exist? This question poses a greater problem for the skeptic than the believer. Proof is intangible. When you research and do your homework on the existence of reincarnation, you?ll find that there?s much more ?proof? for it than against it.
If you establish your case on the laws of probability, then the existence of reincarnation would triumph because more than two-thirds of the world believes in it. If you base your argument on historical documents, then you?ll find that there are many references to reincarnation, particularly in the Bible. If you predicate your findings on logic, then there?s no contest: Reincarnation is more logical than any other opposing viewpoint. If you strictly rely on religion as your basis for a conclusion, then the argument for reincarnation wins again, because it?s either believed whole-heartedly, or at least, tolerated by the vast majority of the world?s populace.
When substantiated by historical documents, the case for the existence of reincarnation has far more followers than opponents. All of the major religious writings mention reincarnation. None of them, including the Bible, ever state that reincarnation, or the belief that it exists, is false. The vast majority of famous authors have written about reincarnation; few have not. The Dead Sea Scrolls, and writings by the Essenes, (an early Gnostic sect), are making modern-day Christianity take notice in reanalyzing their theological teachings. These scribes were reincarnationists. Early writings on reincarnation were composed as far back as 2500 B.C. in China. Other writings, such those in Egypt 3500 B.C., or in China as far back as 4500 B.C., all predate the earliest records of Judaism from which Christianity sprung.
Great philosophers and writers?such as Socrates, Aristotle, Plato, Pythagoras, Lao-tze, Chang-tze, and Plotinus?all believed in reincarnation. Christian theologians?including St. Augustine, St. Clement, Origen, Basilides, Christian apologist Tatian, Valentinus, the manes, St. Jerome, Porphyry, St. Pamphilius, Iamblichus, Athenagoras, and St. Gregory?are just a few of the legions who believed in reincarnation. The Nag-Hammadi scrolls indicate that Jesus was either an Essene, a student of the Essenes, or at least associated very closely with this sect (which was said to have believed in reincarnation) during the ?lost? or ?silent? years of his life between the ages of 12 and 30. All this evidence supports the argument for reincarnation, rather than against it.
If you base your case on logic, the existence of reincarnation prevails. Reincarnation furnishes us with very logical explanations for the inequities of life. Why is one person born poor, and another rich? Why does one person die young as opposed to another who lives a long life? Why is one person crippled, and another whole? I could go on and on. The existence of reincarnation offers a reason for these injustices because it presents the case that there?s more than one life to live.
If God is all-loving and all merciful (the basic teachings of Jesus Christ), then why does evil exist? Negativity can?t survive when you know through God?s loving and merciful nature, He allows you to incarnate more than once to perfect your soul. You can then experience a life in which you?re rich, poor, crippled, whole, young, or old. Logically, reincarnation doesn?t detract from the teachings of Jesus; it augments them. God doesn?t care how long it takes or how many lives you must live to perfect. He only wants you to achieve the ultimate goal?the perfection of your own soul.
If the argument against the existence of reincarnation is based on religion, then the nonbelievers are not well informed. All of the Eastern religions support reincarnation, and Western religions are changing their views rapidly. Nowadays, most Christians either believe in reincarnation or tolerate it because in no way does it detract from their teachings. In fact, it actually broadens them.
If you research the early Christian church, you?ll find that almost all of the references to reincarnation in the Bible were expunged by the fourth century. This was an act of humankind, not God; regardless of this attempt to eradicate reincarnation, almost every Christian Gnostic sect still believed in it. These sects, in turn, were literally ?wiped out? by the early Church. The history of the Christian Church is filled with murder, bloodshed, and torture. (The Holy Inquisition is a prime example.) The early Christians, who believed in reincarnation, were much more loving and understanding than the ?warlike? Church rulers of the Middle Ages.
Despite many of the arguments disputing its existence, reincarnation seems to have the upper hand?truth always surfaces in the end. If skeptics argue with you, ask them to research reincarnation and try to prove it doesn?t exist. They can investigate it endlessly, but they won?t find any true evidence against it. It won?t matter, though, because in their search, they?ll find tomes of overwhelming validation that it is, in fact, truth.







--------------------
Coffee should be black as hell, strong as death, and sweet as love.


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OfflineFrog
Warrior
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Registered: 10/22/03
Posts: 4,284
Loc: The Zero Point Field
Last seen: 3 years, 10 months
Re: You silly afterlife-believing fools... [Re: Mixomatosis]
    #2146280 - 11/30/03 11:35 AM (13 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

Mixomatosis said:
How can you claim to know what happens after death? Who gave you the authority to come out and state how the whole "system" works? Let me guess.. some stupid book you read.

That's right, I invite you to state why you believe whatever afterlife fantasy you believe. It seems strange to me that anyone would claim to have the answer considering how you can't possibly have the answer.




First, I was a Catholic. Then I became a Christian. I did not believe in reincarnation because it was against the teachings of the churches to which I belonged. I went through a huge awakening a year and a half ago. I read lots of books. Then I read Edgar Casey. I am convinced that there is an after-life. I am convinced that there is more to this world and this life than what we see, physically.

Read "The Field", too.


--------------------
The day will come when, after harnessing the ether, the winds, the tides, gravitation, we shall harness for God the energies of love. And, on that day, for the second time in the history of the world, man will have discovered fire.  -Teilard


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Invisiblemuhurgle
Turtles all theway down

Registered: 10/29/03
Posts: 299
Re: You silly afterlife-believing fools... [Re: SkorpivoMusterion]
    #2146304 - 11/30/03 11:57 AM (13 years, 9 days ago)

If you base your case on logic, the existence of reincarnation prevails. Reincarnation furnishes us with very logical explanations for the inequities of life. Why is one person born poor, and another rich? Why does one person die young as opposed to another who lives a long life? Why is one person crippled, and another whole? I could go on and on. The existence of reincarnation offers a reason for these injustices because it presents the case that there?s more than one life to live.

Whoever wrote this, obviously hasn't got even the faintest grasp of logic.

I could give you thousand different theories on what happens to us after we die and nobody could really refute them. Does that mean that they're all right, or all equally plausible? Why have you chosen one particular belief then?

Another nugget from your quote is that since so many people believe it, it must be true. Why do you think people believe this? Because they want it to be true perhaps?

It all boils down to what YOU honestly feel to be true. If it gives you comfort knowing that your soul doesn't transcend death, then hey, go for it

For me, it would be a very great comfort to know that there was something after death. Most people would agree to that. But just becaues you want something to be true doesn't make it so. You should be particularily suspicious of anything you hold as true when that is something you wish very strongly for.


--------------------
"To make this mundane world sublime
Take half a gram of phanerothyme."

Aldous Huxley


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InvisibleAnnapurna1
liberal pussy
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Registered: 05/21/02
Posts: 5,646
Loc: innsmouth..MA
Re: You silly afterlife-believing fools... [Re: Mixomatosis]
    #2146315 - 11/30/03 12:08 PM (13 years, 9 days ago)

There is actually a solid reason to believe in an afterlife: ppl who dont will be very hesitant about launching an armed revolution against a repressive government.

Not surprisingly, the opposite belief has also been used by govts in the past to threaten divine retribution as punishment for disobedience along with execution. But in this case the state is taking two steps, whereas denial of an afterlife requires only one, and as such is more questionable.


--------------------


"anchor blocks counteract the process of pontiprobation..while omalean globes regulize the pressure"...


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Offlineergot
MydriasicVisionary
Registered: 09/25/03
Posts: 685
Last seen: 10 years, 2 months
Re: You silly afterlife-believing fools... [Re: muhurgle]
    #2146320 - 11/30/03 12:13 PM (13 years, 9 days ago)

No evidence of an after-life. Period. Mixomatosis is cool for bringing this topic to a thread. We die, we decompose, we fuel other life through our organic waste. Our existence does not end, but our chance to experience it does. And nothing more could ever prossibly be proven at this stage of humankind.


--------------------
"Remain a learner, never become a knower." - Osho


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Offlinefireworks_godS
Sexy.Butt.McDanger
Male

Registered: 03/12/02
Posts: 24,849
Loc: Pandurn
Last seen: 10 days, 9 hours
Re: You silly afterlife-believing fools... [Re: ergot]
    #2146321 - 11/30/03 12:16 PM (13 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

ergot said:
No evidence of an after-life. Period. Mixomatosis is cool for bringing this topic to a thread. We die, we decompose, we fuel other life through our organic waste. Our existence does not end, but our chance to experience it does. And nothing more could ever prossibly be proven at this stage of humankind.




No one is debating that we physically die and decompose. The question is of a spiritual matter, and there is no way we can even begin to prove any belief as to what happens in any way. It is beyond our level. If we were capable of understanding at this point and time, we already would know.
Peace.


--------------------
:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you

:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:


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Invisibleadrug

Registered: 02/04/03
Posts: 15,800
Re: You silly afterlife-believing fools... [Re: fireworks_god]
    #2146326 - 11/30/03 12:20 PM (13 years, 9 days ago)

We all have to have faith in something...whether it be an afterlife or NO afterlife.


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Offlinefireworks_godS
Sexy.Butt.McDanger
Male

Registered: 03/12/02
Posts: 24,849
Loc: Pandurn
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Re: You silly afterlife-believing fools... [Re: adrug]
    #2146342 - 11/30/03 12:32 PM (13 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

adrug said:
We all have to have faith in something...whether it be an afterlife or NO afterlife. 




Well, myself, I believe in the soul. I believe in reincarnation until we learn enough to wake up and live in our true state. I guess it is sort of hard to decide on something, eh? hehe

But I don't like expect anything to happen, because there just isn't any way of knowing. :grin:
Peace.


--------------------
:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you

:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:


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InvisibleAnnapurna1
liberal pussy
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Registered: 05/21/02
Posts: 5,646
Loc: innsmouth..MA
Re: You silly afterlife-believing fools... [Re: ergot]
    #2146363 - 11/30/03 12:40 PM (13 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

ergot said:
No evidence of an after-life. Period. Mixomatosis is cool for bringing this topic to a thread. We die, we decompose, we fuel other life through our organic waste. Our existence does not end, but our chance to experience it does. And nothing more could ever prossibly be proven at this stage of humankind.




Theres just as much evidence of no after-life.


--------------------


"anchor blocks counteract the process of pontiprobation..while omalean globes regulize the pressure"...


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InvisibleSkorpivoMusterion
Livin in theTwilight Zone...
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Registered: 01/30/03
Posts: 9,944
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Re: You silly afterlife-believing fools... [Re: muhurgle]
    #2146375 - 11/30/03 12:44 PM (13 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

muhurgle said:
But just becaues you want something to be true doesn't make it so.   




Just because you want no-higher-existence after-death to be true, doesnt make it so. :wink: 


--------------------
Coffee should be black as hell, strong as death, and sweet as love.


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Offlineergot
MydriasicVisionary
Registered: 09/25/03
Posts: 685
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Re: You silly afterlife-believing fools... [Re: Annapurna1]
    #2146382 - 11/30/03 12:46 PM (13 years, 9 days ago)

Exactly. But if we were to choose faith wisely, it would be much more intelligent to choose no after-life because there is no evidence, so it implies a lack there of.


--------------------
"Remain a learner, never become a knower." - Osho


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Anonymous

Re: You silly afterlife-believing fools... [Re: Mixomatosis]
    #2146406 - 11/30/03 01:00 PM (13 years, 9 days ago)

the law of conservation of matter and energy state that matter and energy cannot be created nor destroyed.

this would lead me to assume that the contents of the universe are static. and so, what YOU are never dies, it will always exist. it just exists in a different state.

so 'after life' is a misnomer. there is no 'after'. there just.. is!

i THINK that makes sense, anyway.


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InvisibleSkorpivoMusterion
Livin in theTwilight Zone...
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Registered: 01/30/03
Posts: 9,944
Loc: You can't spell fungus wi...
Re: You silly afterlife-believing fools... [Re: ergot]
    #2146413 - 11/30/03 01:02 PM (13 years, 9 days ago)

How is it much more intelligent to choose belief in no-afterlife because there's no evidence for an afterlife? Using that logic, you could equally say that it's much more intelligent to choose belief in an after-life because there's no evidence that there ISN'T.

And the fact is, there's MORE evidence for reincarnation than there is AGAINST it.


--------------------
Coffee should be black as hell, strong as death, and sweet as love.


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Offlineergot
MydriasicVisionary
Registered: 09/25/03
Posts: 685
Last seen: 10 years, 2 months
Re: You silly afterlife-believing fools... [Re: SkorpivoMusterion]
    #2146417 - 11/30/03 01:04 PM (13 years, 9 days ago)

"And the fact is, there's MORE evidence for reincarnation than there is AGAINST it."

Is this a joke?

Okay... do you believe in the Loch Ness? Bigfoot? Be honest with yourself... There is no evidence for these and most people are much more skeptical, but with an after-life people lose all rationale.

Immaculate is right... like I said before "Our existence does not end, but our chance to experience it does." We aren't what we once were, but our pieces are still around... and hopefully being put to good use (perhaps DNA memory like Timothy Leary professed).


--------------------
"Remain a learner, never become a knower." - Osho


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InvisibleAnnapurna1
liberal pussy
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Registered: 05/21/02
Posts: 5,646
Loc: innsmouth..MA
Re: You silly afterlife-believing fools... [Re: ergot]
    #2146420 - 11/30/03 01:07 PM (13 years, 9 days ago)

But since theres equal evidence to the contrary, there is still a 50% percent chance that an afterlife exists. Similarly, there is also no evidence for or against divine retribution, so there is also a 50% probability of that given that an afterlife has occurred. When the probabilities are combined, theres still a 25% chance of going to hell either way. So while the odds may be in your favour, its nothing to bet the ranch on either.


--------------------


"anchor blocks counteract the process of pontiprobation..while omalean globes regulize the pressure"...


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Offlineergot
MydriasicVisionary
Registered: 09/25/03
Posts: 685
Last seen: 10 years, 2 months
Re: You silly afterlife-believing fools... [Re: Annapurna1]
    #2146432 - 11/30/03 01:14 PM (13 years, 9 days ago)

Hey, now there's also a chance I am divine and I will damn you to hell after this world no matter what..... a 50% chance, actually. WORSHIP ME, O STATISTICAL ONE.


--------------------
"Remain a learner, never become a knower." - Osho


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