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Offlinejong21
Mycologist/CSMajor

Registered: 05/28/03
Posts: 576
Loc: Berkeley, CA
Last seen: 11 years, 9 months
Random thoughts on creation/our minds
    #2141573 - 11/28/03 03:43 AM (13 years, 17 days ago)

I was talking to a cognitive science major friend of mine, here are some htings we discussed about god and creation I want to know if you have any input.

So...as time goes one we learn more and more about how the human brain works. If you think about it the history of man is just a steady growth of understanding about us and the world we live in.

So there are two possibilities for the future. Either we someday completely figure otu ourselves, how our minds and consciousness are created by the chemical reactions in our brain, or we never figure it out. I personally believe we will never figure it out but it is interesting to look at what it means if we were too...

So at some point in time we understand completely our own minds. What does this imply about us, and god? I'm going to assume for the sake of argument that we were created by some being. Well...who is to say that once we understand completely how the mind works, we can't create new minds? That we could in some way become "creators" or gods ourselves.

Do you think our creator will allow us to understand our minds? If we continue to make progress do you think he will feel threatened? Do you think we have the capability to actually surpass god, to become more powerful than him? Will he wipe us out before that is allowed to happen? What if famines, natural disasters, etc, are god's messages to us, to keep us in check, to remind us who is in charge? What if those instances of mass destruction, and conversely times of great prosperity, are actually messages from god, messages we've never been able to decode correctly?

I know stories in the bible talk about natural disasters and plagues and so forth but those types of things still happen today, why are they not similar?

I know I haven't stayed ont he same point but whatever I'm stoned/tired and just feel like rambling. If anyone has any related thoughts I'd be interested to hear. Ciao all.


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I either talk about my friends in the first or third person, but I never, ever talk about myself on this website. Except that last sentence.


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Offlinepattern
multiplayer

Registered: 07/19/02
Posts: 2,183
Loc: Canada
Last seen: 1 year, 8 months
Re: Random thoughts on creation/our minds [Re: jong21]
    #2141593 - 11/28/03 04:19 AM (13 years, 17 days ago)

Quote:

Do you think we have the capability to actually surpass god, to become more powerful than him? 




What god are you talking about, Yahweh/Allah?

If God is omnipotent then there really isn't anything we can do to become as or more powerful than him, unless He willingly lets us.

On a related story we already are, in a sense, gods of AI.  We created their minds, their worlds, and have complete control over them.  If they came to understand themselves, that wouldn't make them as powerful as us, since their minds are less sophisticated.  God's mind may be so insanely complex that even by understanding our own minds, we only understand a fraction of his.

my two cents
:sun: 


--------------------
man = monkey + mushroom


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InvisibleJellric
altered statesman

Registered: 11/08/98
Posts: 2,261
Loc: non-local
Re: Random thoughts on creation/our minds [Re: jong21]
    #2141746 - 11/28/03 09:47 AM (13 years, 16 days ago)

Do you think our creator will allow us to understand our minds?

Understanding the mind using the mind? That is impossible in the same way that it is impossible for the tongue to taste itself or the eye to directly see itself. Maybe the creator created us to give himself a way of "seeing" himself?

Here's a related snippet taken from the Tao Te Ching in another thread. (Thanks, kaiowas)

We cannot know the Tao itself,
nor see its qualities direct..

Either we someday completely figure otu ourselves, how our minds and consciousness are created by the chemical reactions in our brain, or we never figure it out. I personally believe we will never figure it out..

I agree. Understanding is infinite. Even if you could somehow reach the outer limits of understanding, there would be more and more created to be understood as evolution is unending.

What if famines, natural disasters, etc, are god's messages to us, to keep us in check, to remind us who is in charge?

Natural phenomena like these are part of an impersonal process. The creator created the physical world and lets it run. Much like building a watch, winding it, setting it on the table and letting it run. Men make the mistake of taking natural disasters personally when they merely got in the way of something larger than themselves.



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I AM what Willis was talkin' bout.


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OfflinePanoramix
Getafix
Male

Registered: 11/26/03
Posts: 634
Loc: Everywhere else
Last seen: 4 years, 2 months
Re: Random thoughts on creation/our minds [Re: Jellric]
    #2142002 - 11/28/03 01:07 PM (13 years, 16 days ago)

Yeah, nice quote.  Who says 'God'* is sentient?  Or self-aware?  Or even concious?  What if 'God' were an event that created us and is ongoing?  The only thing I'd consider 'God' is existance itself, as a thought that is constantly experiencing itself.

*Your word, not mine.

Jong 21

Mechanistic gnostic creationism?
Tangy, yet mild.  A bit spicy.
I give it  :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:
May I ask what you're on?


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Don't worry, I'm wrong.


Edited by Panoramix (11/28/03 01:08 PM)


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OfflineDavid_Scape
Anti Genius
Male

Registered: 08/05/02
Posts: 878
Loc: U.S. of muthafuckin A.
Last seen: 7 years, 6 months
Re: Random thoughts on creation/our minds [Re: jong21]
    #2142299 - 11/28/03 04:01 PM (13 years, 16 days ago)

Quote:


jong21 said:
"I was talking to a cognitive science major friend of [snip]"





Get him to become a regular here



--------------------
focusing
Flow
The Enneagram


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OfflineSole_Worthy
Stranger

Registered: 04/20/03
Posts: 463
Loc: over here
Last seen: 9 years, 28 days
Re: Random thoughts on creation/our minds [Re: David_Scape]
    #2142306 - 11/28/03 04:04 PM (13 years, 16 days ago)

be he that powerful?


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get it all together get like birds of a feather


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Offlinejong21
Mycologist/CSMajor

Registered: 05/28/03
Posts: 576
Loc: Berkeley, CA
Last seen: 11 years, 9 months
Re: Random thoughts on creation/our minds [Re: Sole_Worthy]
    #2142440 - 11/28/03 05:19 PM (13 years, 16 days ago)

Pattern...by "god" I mean whoever created the universe. Whether it is the traditional yahweh/allah or someone/thing else, I honestly don't know.

Panoramix...I was just on a little weed, makes me thoughtful about stuff like this. And I like your description...mechanistic gnostic creationism....hehe.

Thanks for the thoughts everyone...hmm...I guess I was just trying to shed some light on the question "where did god come from" in a sense...I'm not sure.

Look at the matrix though, I guess that's exactly what Iwas saying, we create machines, they surpass us. Of course it is a movie. :smile: I'm not well read at all on this stuff, anyone have any recommended readings, not too advanced as I'm only getting into philosophy, but anything that might make me more able to discuss this topic?


--------------------
I either talk about my friends in the first or third person, but I never, ever talk about myself on this website. Except that last sentence.


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