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InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/19/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
More on Sylvia Browne
    #2140021 - 11/27/03 12:26 PM (13 years, 14 days ago)

from: http://www.geocities.com/jsmigelski/randi.html

James "The Amazing" Randi vs. Sylvia Browne, world-renowned "psychic"?

Sylvia Browne is world-renowned as a psychic, medium, and trance channeler.

James "The Amazing" Randi is world-renowned as a skeptic of all paranormal phenomena. Putting a very large amount of money where his very large mouth is, Randi offers a million dollar challenge to anyone who can exhibit paranormal phenomena under test conditions agreed to in advance by both Randi and the claimant.

Over two years ago on Larry King Live, Browne tentatively agreed to take Randi's challenge. In September of 2001, again on Larry King, Browne accepted the specific protocol to be used for the test.

Since then, Browne has been silent on the subject and has not arranged to take the test. Recently, once again on Larry King, Browne was asked by a caller about the test. Browne expressed doubts about the reality of the million dollars and said that she wouldn't take the challenge "if he doesn't have the money."

Randi responded by sending a certified letter to Browne containing "a notarized copy of the account status showing the balance in a special 'James Randi Educational Foundation Prize Account' in excess of one million dollars." Browne refused to accept the letter. It seems that Browne is avoiding that million dollars like the plague.

Or perhaps Browne has some fears that her spiritualistic ability may be as dicey as her psychic powers, given her predictions that the year 2000 would usher in an age of reduced porn on the Internet and a Bill Bradley presidency.

Based on self-announced and unverified powers, psychics can become wealthy celebrities in charge of mini media empires, while the skeptics who ask for a little proof are perceived as curmudgeonly ogres and killjoys. Is Barnum's Law correct, or is there hope that psychics will someday be obliged to put up or shut up?


On another note: want your money back from SB? No way!

from: http://www.bunda.org/archives/000088.html

A few weeks later I requested a refund and was sent a standard Refund Policy letter: "The services provided by Sylvia Browne Corporation are highly speculative in nature and we do not guarantee that the results of our work will be satisfactory to a client."

I did not know that being a con-artist and a fraud was the hallmark of being a spiritual teacher.




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The proof is in the pudding.


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InvisibleSkorpivoMusterion
Livin in theTwilight Zone...
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Re: More on Sylvia Browne [Re: Swami]
    #2140033 - 11/27/03 12:31 PM (13 years, 14 days ago)

She spoke about this the last time she was on Larry King Live, the reason why she wont do it, is because they wont put the money into escrow. And believe me, for THAT much money, I wouldn't do it without having it into escrow either :grin:
But you do must wonder, why wont they put it in escrow? are they too afraid that they'll be proven wrong? Hmm...
(btw I was waiting for a post like this from you :grin:)
 


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Coffee should be black as hell, strong as death, and sweet as love.


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Offlinepattern
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Registered: 07/19/02
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Re: More on Sylvia Browne [Re: Swami]
    #2140365 - 11/27/03 03:45 PM (13 years, 14 days ago)

What I really want to know is why skeptics think they are "Amazing"?

Sure skeptics are clever, even sarcastically correct most of the time, but I demand that Randi prove he is "Amazing"!!  :devil: 


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man = monkey + mushroom


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InvisibleSwami
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Re: More on Sylvia Browne [Re: pattern]
    #2140384 - 11/27/03 03:58 PM (13 years, 14 days ago)

It is called "show business" a hard concept to grasp. Randi was a stage magician for many years. How you extrapolate that to skeptics in general is an "amazing" stretch of "logic".


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InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

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Re: More on Sylvia Browne [Re: SkorpivoMusterion]
    #2140394 - 11/27/03 04:06 PM (13 years, 14 days ago)

transcript from LKL:

King: Randi has offered a million dollars in the past to those who would take his challenge. Would you first -- let's start with Randi -- explain
what the challenge constitutes? You will pay a million dollars if?

Randi: A million dollars in negotiable bonds, Larry, to any person or persons who can provide evidence of any paranormal, occult or supernatural event or ability of any kind under proper observing conditions. It is that simple.

King: OK, and the observing conditions would be?

RANDI: It would depend upon what the claim is. I have got a whole outline right here that will tell Sylvia exactly what the test would be if she agrees to take the test.

King: Sylvia, in the past you have not agreed to this.

Browne: Well, I don't even want his million dollars. I don't want his million dollars. I mean, the reason I came on is because he kept you know, my web site, yeah, yeah, and said I would never come on and face him. But I don't care about his million dollars. I mean, I don't need his million. . . .

King: Are you willing to take his test?

Browne: Yeah, whatever test it is.

After Randi suggested the specific type of psychic ability he would test, Sylvia agreed: All that was needed was for her to contact Randi. But by April 2003, she had made no contact.

Browne: But I don't care about his million dollars.
(Uh-huh. She AGREED to take the test!) This has been covered in numerous Swami posts. She loves to give to charities, but would rather give them a pittance than the $1,000,000. Certainly makes "sense".


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


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Offlinepattern
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Re: More on Sylvia Browne [Re: Swami]
    #2140398 - 11/27/03 04:10 PM (13 years, 14 days ago)

Quote:

Swami said:
It is called "show business" a hard concept to grasp. Randi was a stage magician for many years. How you extrapolate that to skeptics in general is an "amazing" stretch of "logic".




It was a joke, that went right over your head.


--------------------
man = monkey + mushroom


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InvisibleSkorpivoMusterion
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Re: More on Sylvia Browne [Re: Swami]
    #2140400 - 11/27/03 04:13 PM (13 years, 14 days ago)

If you're getting this transcript from the legit source that you would normally get all valid LKL Transcripts from CNN.com, then you should be able to pull out the transcript where Sylvia clearly states after having a caller ask her about the Million-dollar test, that the reason why she wont do it, is because they wont put the money into escrow.

your first link in your first post isnt valid, can you at least provide a valid link to where you're getting this LKL Transcripts?


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Coffee should be black as hell, strong as death, and sweet as love.


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OfflinePhluck
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Re: More on Sylvia Browne [Re: pattern]
    #2140921 - 11/27/03 09:46 PM (13 years, 13 days ago)

"It was a joke, that went right over your head. "

People make such statements in this forum without humorous intent all the time. It's not surprising he didn't see right off the bat that it was a joke.


--------------------
"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us


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Offlinesalviadog
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Registered: 06/06/03
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Re: More on Sylvia Browne [Re: Phluck]
    #2141985 - 11/28/03 12:54 PM (13 years, 13 days ago)

I thought you just mispelled salvia brownie:)


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Happiness is not being smart enough to know what to worry about.


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Anonymous

Re: More on Sylvia Browne [Re: pattern]
    #2142340 - 11/28/03 04:29 PM (13 years, 13 days ago)

Quote:

pattern said:
What I really want to know is why skeptics think they are "Amazing"?

Sure skeptics are clever, even sarcastically correct most of the time, but I demand that Randi prove he is "Amazing"!!  :devil: 




I got it.  And trust me, I laughed my ass off! :lol:


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Anonymous

Re: More on Sylvia Browne [Re: Swami]
    #2142342 - 11/28/03 04:31 PM (13 years, 13 days ago)

I meant to ask you Swamster.

Is this one of those "I found a medium that is a fraud. Ipso facto, they are all frauds" kinda logic?

Just wondering.


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Invisiblechunder
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Registered: 08/11/02
Posts: 965
Loc: The City
Re: More on Sylvia Browne [Re: ]
    #2142377 - 11/28/03 04:53 PM (13 years, 13 days ago)

I think the fact that there is a Sylvia Browne Corporation pretty much says it all about Mrs. Browne's abilities and motives....


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OfflineSole_Worthy
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Re: More on Sylvia Browne [Re: ]
    #2142386 - 11/28/03 04:58 PM (13 years, 13 days ago)

oh dont do that to him Mr M!


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OfflinePhluck
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Re: More on Sylvia Browne [Re: ]
    #2142822 - 11/28/03 07:56 PM (13 years, 12 days ago)

I don't think he ever said that, so no, that probably wouldn't be the logic he's using.

The fact that there are dozens of psychics that claim their abilities are "proven", yet none have agreed to undergo the "Amazing" Randi's challenge might be a little telling.


--------------------
"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us


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InvisibleJellric
altered statesman

Registered: 11/08/98
Posts: 2,261
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Re: More on Sylvia Browne [Re: Phluck]
    #2143273 - 11/28/03 11:58 PM (13 years, 12 days ago)

Wasn't Sylvia Browne a very successful operator of a Nevada whore house back in the sixties?

Swami?


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I AM what Willis was talkin' bout.


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InvisibleSclorch
Clyster

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Registered: 07/13/99
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Re: More on Sylvia Browne [Re: Phluck]
    #2143731 - 11/29/03 04:06 AM (13 years, 12 days ago)

The fact that there are dozens of psychics that claim their abilities are "proven", yet none have agreed to undergo the "Amazing" Randi's challenge might be a little telling.


How dare you question the mighty Mr_Mushrooms?!

He's like a statesmen and all that hoohah... blah blah blah...


--------------------
Note: In desperate need of a cure...


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OfflineToxicManM
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Re: More on Sylvia Browne [Re: SkorpivoMusterion]
    #2144170 - 11/29/03 12:56 PM (13 years, 12 days ago)

Quote:

She spoke about this the last time she was on Larry King Live, the reason why she wont do it, is because they wont put the money into escrow. And believe me, for THAT much money, I wouldn't do it without having it into escrow either




Your statement implies that there is a financial risk for Ms Browne. There is not. She doesn't have to put up a dime to do this.

The claims Randi has made make him subject to severe legal problems if whe were to pass the test and not pay up (let's start with fraud - a felony). Not just civil suits, but criminal as well. If he didn't pay, a call to the New York Attorney General's office would result in a great deal of unpleasantness for Randi. And the money would get paid out.

The money is currently in an interest bearing account. Taking it out of that account would mean the loss of a significant amount of money. He has offered to do exactly that, if the person requesting it will place the amount of interest lost in an escrow account to be paid if they fail the test.

What exactly is it you find objectionable in all that?


--------------------
Happy mushrooming!


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InvisibleSkorpivoMusterion
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Re: More on Sylvia Browne [Re: ToxicMan]
    #2144217 - 11/29/03 01:32 PM (13 years, 12 days ago)

I had no thoughts of any "financial risks" involved when I repeated what she said on LKL. I was merely quoting her as to why she wont do such and such. The bottom line is, they wont put it into escrow. Until they do, then see what happens.

How much money do you speculate would be lost by taking it out of the account? I sincerely doubt it's significant compared to a million dollars.


--------------------
Coffee should be black as hell, strong as death, and sweet as love.


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OfflineToxicManM
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Re: More on Sylvia Browne [Re: SkorpivoMusterion]
    #2145444 - 11/29/03 10:46 PM (13 years, 11 days ago)

I recalled reading about the interest issue at some point. Rather than try to remember all the details, I went back to the source. This is a more recent bit than I had read, so the details are slightly different.

Here is Randi's most recent statement on the matter, a letter he sent to Larry King. (Scroll down the page to the photo of Mr. King).

Basically, it says that they have gotten some sort of special dispensation from Goldman-Sachs which will allow them to put the money into escrow without any loss of income. In the letter, Randi asks Mr. King to act as the escrow agent of the escrow fund, and therefore to be the final judge of the results of the test.

That letter was sent on November 7. I don't see any comments indicating that anything has happened yet. If something happens, I'm sure we'll see something here.


--------------------
Happy mushrooming!


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