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OfflineBigbadwooof
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Re: Budget Office Again Reduces Its Estimate on Cost of the Affordable Care Act [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #21395757 - 03/12/15 12:45 AM (9 years, 2 months ago)

If you want a single payer system, or anything good really, to come out of government, we have to remove money from politics in the first place. Citizens United has to be reversed, and campaigns have to be publicly financed. There should be strict campaign finance laws in place, because the government has been owned by rent-seeking coporations and billionaires for decades. We got rid of the Monarchy, now lets get rid of the Oligarchy!


--------------------
"It is no measure of good health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society," - Jiddu Krishnamurti
FARTS
"The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command." - George Orwell
Every one of you should see this video.
"Facts are chiels that winna ding, and downa be disputed" - Robert Burns

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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Budget Office Again Reduces Its Estimate on Cost of the Affordable Care Act [Re: Bigbadwooof]
    #21395816 - 03/12/15 01:09 AM (9 years, 2 months ago)

:thumbup:


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.

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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
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Re: Budget Office Again Reduces Its Estimate on Cost of the Affordable Care Act [Re: sweeper54]
    #21396415 - 03/12/15 07:41 AM (9 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

sweeper54 said:
Quote:

luvdemshrooms said:
Considering the Dems passed the ACA without a single Republican vote... they could have just as easily passed single payer if they wished to.





You don't remember much about the process. There were a lot of Dems that were afraid of the single payer system, we called then 'DINOS':picard:.

Add to that, O was caving at the least bit of resistance and gave away the farm without a real fight.




Stupid assumption but I remember the process quite well. The Dems changed the rules, prevented other input and ignored their constituents. Which amazingly enough is the same process they could have used to pass single payer had they wanted to.


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers

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OfflineBigbadwooof
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Re: Budget Office Again Reduces Its Estimate on Cost of the Affordable Care Act [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #21396451 - 03/12/15 07:52 AM (9 years, 2 months ago)

'ignored their constituents'?

Firstly, the entire country wanted health care reform to some degree. Beyond that, the Dem's 'constituents' wanted it more than anyone.


--------------------
"It is no measure of good health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society," - Jiddu Krishnamurti
FARTS
"The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command." - George Orwell
Every one of you should see this video.
"Facts are chiels that winna ding, and downa be disputed" - Robert Burns

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisibleluvdemshrooms
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Re: Budget Office Again Reduces Its Estimate on Cost of the Affordable Care Act [Re: Bigbadwooof]
    #21396472 - 03/12/15 08:01 AM (9 years, 2 months ago)

Alas for your claim, they ignored them then. They ignore them now.


Quote:

We looked at a similar claim in 2011, but it’s time to dive into the polls again.

Since the Affordable Care Act was drafted in 2009, the poll numbers have been more or less consistent across different months and polling organizations: The approval rating has hovered around 40 percent recently, with about 50 percent disapproval and 10 percent no opinion.




http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2013/sep/26/newt-gingrich/obamacare-has-never-been-favored-majority-american/

Quote:

While still shy of a majority, 49 percent support is numerically the highest on record – albeit by a single point – in more than 20 ABC/Post polls since August 2009. The previous high was 48 percent in November 2009. The low was 39 percent in April 2012; the average, 45 percent.




http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politics/2014/03/at-49-percent-support-obamacare-hits-a-high/


Now, here's a sorely needed lesson for you: It doesn't matter whether you are of the same party as your elected representative. You are still his/her constituent.

Quote:

constituent
Tweet
noun con·stit·u·ent \-wənt, -ənt\

: any one of the people who live and vote in an area : a member of a constituency

: one of the parts that form something





http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/constituent

So yes... "The Dems changed the rules, prevented other input and ignored their constituents."


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers

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OfflineBigbadwooof
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Re: Budget Office Again Reduces Its Estimate on Cost of the Affordable Care Act [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #21396556 - 03/12/15 08:26 AM (9 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:


Quote:

constituent
Tweet
noun con·stit·u·ent \-wənt, -ənt\

: any one of the people who live and vote in an area : a member of a constituency

: one of the parts that form something





http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/constituent





You have inadequately interpreted the definition.

Read the second definition: One of the parts that form something. ie.: one of the Democrats that forms the Democratic party.

Aside from that, the entire country wanted healthcare reform desperately, which is why Romney was also advocating Romneycare. Your argument is just a lie.


--------------------
"It is no measure of good health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society," - Jiddu Krishnamurti
FARTS
"The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command." - George Orwell
Every one of you should see this video.
"Facts are chiels that winna ding, and downa be disputed" - Robert Burns

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisibleluvdemshrooms
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Re: Budget Office Again Reduces Its Estimate on Cost of the Affordable Care Act [Re: Bigbadwooof]
    #21396570 - 03/12/15 08:32 AM (9 years, 2 months ago)

You say some incredibly stupid things. Each and every person represented by an elected leader is by definition a constituent. It doesn't matter if you are, or are not, a member of the same party.


Quote:

One of the parts that form something. ie.: one of the Democrats that forms the Democratic party.




:lmafo:

One of the parts that form something includes, sadly for you, everyone represented.

": any one of the people who live and vote in an area : a member of a constituency"

While you can of course ignore parts of a definition you don't care for, the rest of us who can understand the language are free to laugh at you.


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers

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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
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Re: Budget Office Again Reduces Its Estimate on Cost of the Affordable Care Act [Re: Bigbadwooof]
    #21396602 - 03/12/15 08:38 AM (9 years, 2 months ago)

Perhaps a second source will slow down the nonsense you spew (I'm skeptical it would stop it completely). Read it and weep:

Quote:

An electoral district (also known as a constituency, riding, ward, division, electoral area or electorate) is a distinct territorial subdivision for holding a separate election for one or more seats in a legislative body. Generally, only voters who reside within the geographical bounds of an electoral district (constituents) are permitted to vote in an election held there.




Quote:

The term constituency is commonly used to refer to an electoral district; it can also refer to the body of eligible voters within the represented area.




http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electoral_district


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers

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OfflineBigbadwooof
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Re: Budget Office Again Reduces Its Estimate on Cost of the Affordable Care Act [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #21396668 - 03/12/15 08:57 AM (9 years, 2 months ago)

You can play the semantics game all you like. It doesn't deteur from my point in any way, shape, or form. It's purely misdirection, and using such tactics demonstrates a lack of faith in your own supposed convictions.


--------------------
"It is no measure of good health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society," - Jiddu Krishnamurti
FARTS
"The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command." - George Orwell
Every one of you should see this video.
"Facts are chiels that winna ding, and downa be disputed" - Robert Burns

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisibleluvdemshrooms
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Registered: 11/29/01
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Re: Budget Office Again Reduces Its Estimate on Cost of the Affordable Care Act [Re: Bigbadwooof]
    #21396813 - 03/12/15 09:45 AM (9 years, 2 months ago)

Your not understanding the definition of "constituents" demonstrates my lack of faith? :lmafo:

Semantics is a "game"? :lmafo:

Both those claims from you demonstrates nothing but ignorance. My convictions were demonstrated quite clearly by my quotes and links. Your lack of which is clearly noted.


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers

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Offlinesweeper54
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Re: Budget Office Again Reduces Its Estimate on Cost of the Affordable Care Act [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #21396966 - 03/12/15 10:33 AM (9 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

luvdemshrooms said:
Quote:

sweeper54 said:
Quote:

luvdemshrooms said:
Considering the Dems passed the ACA without a single Republican vote... they could have just as easily passed single payer if they wished to.





You don't remember much about the process. There were a lot of Dems that were afraid of the single payer system, we called then 'DINOS':picard:.

Add to that, O was caving at the least bit of resistance and gave away the farm without a real fight.




Stupid assumption but I remember the process quite well. The Dems changed the rules, prevented other input and ignored their constituents. Which amazingly enough is the same process they could have used to pass single payer had they wanted to.



All of that is true but that is not what we were talking about.

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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
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Re: Budget Office Again Reduces Its Estimate on Cost of the Affordable Care Act [Re: sweeper54]
    #21397039 - 03/12/15 10:55 AM (9 years, 2 months ago)

Actually, we've spent the last few posts talking about exactly that.

Funny, it was brought up in the second post of this thread but until your "point" was de-pointed... you were OK with it.


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers

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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Budget Office Again Reduces Its Estimate on Cost of the Affordable Care Act [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #21400095 - 03/12/15 10:06 PM (9 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

luvdemshrooms said:
Quote:

Bigbadwooof said:
'ignored their constituents'?

Firstly, the entire country wanted health care reform to some degree. Beyond that, the Dem's 'constituents' wanted it more than anyone.



Alas for your claim, they ignored them then. They ignore them now.

Quote:

We looked at a similar claim in 2011, but it’s time to dive into the polls again.

Since the Affordable Care Act was drafted in 2009, the poll numbers have been more or less consistent across different months and polling organizations: The approval rating has hovered around 40 percent recently, with about 50 percent disapproval and 10 percent no opinion.






Wooof's claim that the "country wanted health care reform to some degree" is very easy to prove.  The polling also shows that the Dem's constituents wanted it even more.

You changed his argument from wanting health care reform to wanting Obamacare as it was originally passed (though the vast majority of people still like many things about it), then you attacked your own straw man argument.  Very typical for you.


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.

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OfflineBigbadwooof
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Re: Budget Office Again Reduces Its Estimate on Cost of the Affordable Care Act [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #21400802 - 03/13/15 03:59 AM (9 years, 2 months ago)

The Democratic party is (pay attention to the base word here) constituted by democratic party constituents. This meets the criteria of the second definition.

The citizens of a country are the constituents of their government. That is the first definition.

Now, I will explain how a word can be defined in two ways, pay attention:

Saw definition:
verb
1. Simple past tense of see.
2. To cut or divide with a saw.

Now that we're hopefully past the simple minded semantics, the substance remains unchanged.

I would like to point out that the fact that 50% of people disapprove of Obamacare doesn't mean they don't want the healthcare reforms, necessarily. Many people just want more extensive measures.


--------------------
"It is no measure of good health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society," - Jiddu Krishnamurti
FARTS
"The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command." - George Orwell
Every one of you should see this video.
"Facts are chiels that winna ding, and downa be disputed" - Robert Burns

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisibleluvdemshrooms
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Re: Budget Office Again Reduces Its Estimate on Cost of the Affordable Care Act [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #21401084 - 03/13/15 06:47 AM (9 years, 2 months ago)

I'm aware you have trouble understanding direct comments. Seems like a tough way to go through life.


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers

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OfflineBigbadwooof
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Re: Budget Office Again Reduces Its Estimate on Cost of the Affordable Care Act [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #21404083 - 03/13/15 09:22 PM (9 years, 2 months ago)

Mhmm... you're a real piece of work lol


--------------------
"It is no measure of good health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society," - Jiddu Krishnamurti
FARTS
"The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command." - George Orwell
Every one of you should see this video.
"Facts are chiels that winna ding, and downa be disputed" - Robert Burns

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Budget Office Again Reduces Its Estimate on Cost of the Affordable Care Act [Re: Bigbadwooof]
    #21404442 - 03/13/15 11:04 PM (9 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Bigbadwooof said:
Mhmm... you're a real piece of work lol



It's always an ad hominem attack with him.  Not, "here's where you are wrong", just a "you're stupid" type of response, since that's the best he can do.  :shrug:


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.

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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
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 User Gallery

Registered: 11/29/01
Posts: 34,247
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Re: Budget Office Again Reduces Its Estimate on Cost of the Affordable Care Act [Re: Bigbadwooof]
    #21405005 - 03/14/15 06:08 AM (9 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Bigbadwooof said:
Mhmm... you're a real piece of work lol




Yes, I know. It comes from dealing with those who are unreachable through other means. You know, the ones that think what they want trumps what others don't want.


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
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