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Offlineultimacanam
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rye berry poor fruiting / mold help
    #21307285 - 02/21/15 08:57 AM (9 years, 10 months ago)

I had good luck with the pf tec method so I though I would try rye berries, but I am very frustrated. If someone could look over my process and give me some advice/pointers that would be great.[list]


rise the berries well
soak 24 hours in water with a TBS of gypsum
boil 15 minutes
drain and dry berries
put in mason jars, holes in the lid tyvek filter
pressure cook 90 min
Next day do a grain to grain transfer infrom on my home made Flow Hood
Put jars in a dark room with the temp set to 86
Shake jars every few days to keep the grains loose
After about 10 days they are pretty collenated


Transfer grain to tin foil tray, covered in tin foil with a few air holes.


Let them sit in the dark @ 86 until fully collinated. Usually 1-2 weeks

Not fully collinated here, but I didn't have anything else to take a picture of


Add thin casing layer (details below)

cover and put back them back in the dark @ 86 until mycelia starts to poke through


Uncover and move to fruiting chamber



Temp in the room is about 72, humidity in the camber is 90%, indirect sun ligth. The mycelia grows a little bit more then stops
After about 2 weeks nothing is happening other than most are starting to get green mold.



It is hard to see in the picture but it is starting to mold up.


I have done alot of reading and though I was doing everything correctly.Please help.


Casing layer
10 parts peat moss
1 part gypsum
1/4 part hydrated lime
10 part vermiculite
put in jars cook at 140-160 for 1 hour

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OfflinetaGyo
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Re: rye berry poor fruiting / mold help [Re: ultimacanam]
    #21307330 - 02/21/15 09:11 AM (9 years, 10 months ago)

86 is way too high bro.

Colonize at 75-78. Afte 81f you favor contams over mycelium growth.

It should be getting direct sunlight.

Mold before the first flush means you had bad spawn or didn't prep your substrate right. I'm guessing it was bad spawn because it didn't recover very nicely in that tote. Also why wouldn't you add bulk substrate instead of just casing grains? Bulk substrate would have allowed you to split your grains better into more trays and it holds water better then grains.

The amount of available water is directly correlated to fruit size.


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Offlineultimacanam
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Re: rye berry poor fruiting / mold help [Re: taGyo]
    #21307348 - 02/21/15 09:18 AM (9 years, 10 months ago)

Is moving them to the fruiting room when they first poke through correct? I have also seen people say to wait until they are fully collinated again?

Not sure what bulk substrate is? Can you explain that?

The mold is growing in the casing, the cake underneath looks good. I think I am preping correctly.

Edited by ultimacanam (02/21/15 09:19 AM)

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OfflinePsilicon
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Re: rye berry poor fruiting / mold help [Re: taGyo]
    #21307350 - 02/21/15 09:19 AM (9 years, 10 months ago)

:whathesaid:  It was probably the spawn.  The first thing I'd look into is your flowhood.  Have you tested it with a petri dish and smoke?


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OfflinetaGyo
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Re: rye berry poor fruiting / mold help [Re: Psilicon]
    #21307365 - 02/21/15 09:23 AM (9 years, 10 months ago)

What did you case with?

When I case I fruit immediately. Within the next seven days the myc will reach up and knot. It's worth noting I've only cased with CVG, not sure about peat and Jiffy. Some wait till 30%.

Bottom line is they both work.

The mold is growing where your mushrooms should have, meaning its somewhere in your grains.


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Offlineultimacanam
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Re: rye berry poor fruiting / mold help [Re: taGyo]
    #21307383 - 02/21/15 09:26 AM (9 years, 10 months ago)

My casing is
Casing layer
10 parts peat moss
1 part gypsum
1/4 part hydrated lime
10 part vermiculite
put in jars cook at 140-160 for 1 hour


Once cased do I recover and put them back in the warm room or leave uncovere in the fruiting chamber?

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Re: rye berry poor fruiting / mold help [Re: ultimacanam]
    #21307413 - 02/21/15 09:31 AM (9 years, 10 months ago)

Drop your temps in your warm room to 75 all around. They will do much better.

I would case and let it colonize to 20-30% with peat and then fruit.

Do an hour and thirty minutes next time. In this hobby always air on the side of caution.


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Offlineultimacanam
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Re: rye berry poor fruiting / mold help [Re: Psilicon]
    #21307430 - 02/21/15 09:38 AM (9 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

van der griegen said:
:whathesaid:  It was probably the spawn.  The first thing I'd look into is your flowhood.  Have you tested it with a petri dish and smoke?




I have done alot of strain isolation in the flowhood with petri dishes and havn't had any mold issues.

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OfflinetaGyo
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Re: rye berry poor fruiting / mold help [Re: ultimacanam]
    #21307437 - 02/21/15 09:39 AM (9 years, 10 months ago)

It was most likely your spawn. Those jars don't look the greatest. I've had jars look exactly like that and they gave me my first mold:

Trichoderma:



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OfflinePsilicon
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Re: rye berry poor fruiting / mold help [Re: ultimacanam]
    #21307466 - 02/21/15 09:47 AM (9 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

ultimacanam said:
I have done alot of strain isolation in the flowhood with petri dishes and havn't had any mold issues.





That, sir, is a sweet-looking flowhood.  I take it from your answer that in addition to isolation you've done the smoke and petri tests?

I think that you should pitch your grain master and anything in that lineage of G2Gs you have left. If you're skeptical, do a shake test.

If you show us your agar master maybe there'll be something that leaps out at us.


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Oat Prep Tek
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Offlineultimacanam
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Re: rye berry poor fruiting / mold help [Re: Psilicon]
    #21307508 - 02/21/15 09:59 AM (9 years, 10 months ago)

I'll have to look up what the smoke and petri test is. I have not done that. I was using a glove box before and was getting alot of mold in the jars, I build the flow hood and the jars are doing better but the fruiting sucks. I can't win.

Do I need to soak the grains longer, maybe 2 days, before pressure cooking.

Here is on dish that was in the fridge for a while. I stopped transfering dishes for now because nothing was fruiting for me.

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OfflinePsilicon
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Re: rye berry poor fruiting / mold help [Re: ultimacanam]
    #21307526 - 02/21/15 10:03 AM (9 years, 10 months ago)

Those look pretty moldy to me, man.  I think we've found the culprit.


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Offlineultimacanam
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Re: rye berry poor fruiting / mold help [Re: Psilicon]
    #21307551 - 02/21/15 10:08 AM (9 years, 10 months ago)

THe blueish tint only showed up after being in the fridge. I though it was ok. Is that mold? Or is the more fuzzy part the mold?

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OfflinePsilicon
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Re: rye berry poor fruiting / mold help [Re: ultimacanam]
    #21307560 - 02/21/15 10:10 AM (9 years, 10 months ago)

It looks like mold to me.  Do you think you can get another shot with more light?


--------------------
Agar - what, why and how?  Everything a beginner needs to know.
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Re: rye berry poor fruiting / mold help [Re: Psilicon]
    #21307564 - 02/21/15 10:11 AM (9 years, 10 months ago)

Mold man.

None of that looks like myc unless it's extremely cloudy in there.


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Offlineultimacanam
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Re: rye berry poor fruiting / mold help [Re: taGyo]
    #21307647 - 02/21/15 10:28 AM (9 years, 10 months ago)

Better picture. So the fuzzy white is mold?



here is the missing pieces growing in a little jar

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OfflinePsilicon
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Re: rye berry poor fruiting / mold help [Re: ultimacanam]
    #21307661 - 02/21/15 10:30 AM (9 years, 10 months ago)

Yeah, I'd say that THAT fuzzy white is mold.  Not all fuzzy white, but that one in specific.  And what you have in the jar there is healthy cube mycelium, so it looks like you have a ridealong contam.


--------------------
Agar - what, why and how?  Everything a beginner needs to know.
Oat Prep Tek
Bored?  Please take one of my experiments off my hands.

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OfflinetaGyo
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Re: rye berry poor fruiting / mold help [Re: Psilicon]
    #21307664 - 02/21/15 10:32 AM (9 years, 10 months ago)

:thumbup:,

I'd just case that and fruit it from the top and start something else. I had a Golden Teacher clone and it had this crazy fluffy white thing on top of it. I thought it was just myc. Fruited and got contamed before first flush.


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OfflinePsilicon
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Re: rye berry poor fruiting / mold help [Re: taGyo]
    #21307672 - 02/21/15 10:33 AM (9 years, 10 months ago)

Compare to Frank Horrigan's hidden contam.



Front and center is an obvious one, but check out the back left section.  Look similar to you?


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Re: rye berry poor fruiting / mold help [Re: taGyo]
    #21307685 - 02/21/15 10:35 AM (9 years, 10 months ago)

I think you have a few things causing issues.

Quote:

ultimacanam said:





I see cloudiness all around the myc in that agar and that's a bad sign. That darkness could be bruising if it's blue.

Like mentioned, drop your temperature for colonizing. I keep my room between 65-75F and try to stay around 70F.

Don't shake your jars every few days. Instead shake right after G2G or agar is added, then at about 30% colonized. Maybe once more at about 80-90% if you have a slower growing culture.

If your substrate seems to look good and the contamination is starting on your casing, then it's your casing prep. Which pasteurization tek are you following? How are you monitoring the casing temperature while pasteurizing?

That "flowhood" may be your problem too. A SAB works really well. There's more to a flowhood than a strong blower blowing through a filter. There are some airflow dynamics at play too.

Which substrate tek are you following?


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