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Psilicon
Really Nice Guy


Registered: 08/26/12
Posts: 7,057
Last seen: 4 years, 1 month
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Re: Ok Violet, you're next [Re: Violet]
#21360479 - 03/04/15 10:33 AM (9 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
Violet said: Yes I have definitely said before that clone isolates I took from bulk grows, which did quite well on bulk grows, were shown to be far less awesome than I thought when used for my cases grain cakes. This is why I think vtek can show a culture's true potential more easily. Fewer cultures may prove to excel in all circumstances when put to a grow condition like these. Using vtek for culture tests puts them to a more grueling comparison. The ones that make it thru the crucible after tests with my teks have proven themselves to be gems worth keeping.
Cultures from bulky grows didn't show to do well with the vtek-style methods, but the cultures I obtain with my culture tech do great with them - and prove to be incredibly badass on bulks as well!
I'd like to see this. You were promising a side-by-side grow for a while.
What do you think are the reasons a culture would do well in bulk but not in V-tek?
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Pastywhyte
Say hello to my little friend



Registered: 09/15/12
Posts: 37,972
Loc: Canada
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Re: Ok Violet, you're next [Re: bodhisatta]
#21360484 - 03/04/15 10:34 AM (9 years, 10 months ago) |
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I think the big advantage to v tek is the undestroyed colony. The big drawback is water supply. For some its easy, for me it wasn't. Pans did good for me with v tek, I would recommend it for anyone wanting a first crack at em. Mudas pans in v tek were fucking awesome. I gonna try my pan cambo clone in v tek here soon.
For the water guzzling cubes muda bottles have been really good to me. They can support a big pinset and still have the upside of extra fruiting energy. In tall pp5 they are really something.
People need to try everything they can and stop taking peoples word for it. Its all opinion at the end of the day anyway. I hope that if I came out with a new method, people would give it a try before forming an opinion.
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bodhisatta 
Smurf real estate agent


Registered: 04/30/13
Posts: 61,916
Loc: Milky way
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Re: Ok Violet, you're next [Re: Violet]
#21360492 - 03/04/15 10:36 AM (9 years, 10 months ago) |
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70g wet about 7g dry first flush. fuck 7-10g first flush isn't out of the ordinary for a test cake doing really well.
try out test cakes in the plastic containers for culture selection some time.
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MBabble
Pumpkinhead



Registered: 01/05/15
Posts: 234
Loc: Hot and humid
Last seen: 5 years, 9 months
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Re: Ok Violet, you're next [Re: Violet]
#21360531 - 03/04/15 10:43 AM (9 years, 10 months ago) |
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I'm only on my first few tubs, but adding urine was a success for me already, I'll be doing some side by side comparisons with small container grows, keep a journal and post findings as I have them.
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Violet



Registered: 12/06/11
Posts: 4,205
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Re: Ok Violet, you're next [Re: Psilicon]
#21360593 - 03/04/15 10:57 AM (9 years, 10 months ago) |
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No 7g first flush isn't totally rare for other cakes. But the flush curve for future flushes, and the total yield, Is. Pf cakes have less of a limitation by water because they need less water total over time to deliver the lesser yield that is capable from the lesser nutrition.
Show me a half-pint cake that gets 10g dry first flush. For that matter, show me one that yields 14 or more total, much less a number of them consistently. Frankly I doubt I'll see 12 common even under great conditions and culture.
Quote:
van der griegen said:
Quote:
Violet said: Yes I have definitely said before that clone isolates I took from bulk grows, which did quite well on bulk grows, were shown to be far less awesome than I thought when used for my cases grain cakes. This is why I think vtek can show a culture's true potential more easily. Fewer cultures may prove to excel in all circumstances when put to a grow condition like these. Using vtek for culture tests puts them to a more grueling comparison. The ones that make it thru the crucible after tests with my teks have proven themselves to be gems worth keeping.
Cultures from bulky grows didn't show to do well with the vtek-style methods, but the cultures I obtain with my culture tech do great with them - and prove to be incredibly badass on bulks as well!
I'd like to see this. You were promising a side-by-side grow for a while.
What do you think are the reasons a culture would do well in bulk but not in V-tek?
I don't remember promising a side-by-side, just a short grow log with grass seed which I did. I did grow both methods side-by-side while I still grew bulks and had my greenhouse up. I am growing cubes less these days and getting into the swing of Shiitake and Kings. I likely won't revisit Cubie outside of a few poms and invitro-vteks for personal sharing supply until Anne FINALLY (read: eventually) *sigh* starts showing poms 2-4.
Honestly I'm not really sure about that. For all my discerning and observational ability, I haven't put my thumb in it for sure, but I do have some thoughs.
One little thought is that culture variety may be more or less picky/needy/finicky about fruiting from a low-/no-nutrient site. Bulk subs surround the nutritious grain with such a condition and may pretty much take that variable out of the equation. I suppose that thought is hand-in-hand with how a culture might handle fruiting from extreme nutrient density, as my experiments have shown somewhat better multi-spore results with grass seed than with brown rice. (Am I right in guessing that your pictured cake is gs?)
My main thought about it is another culture variable that bulk subs mostly remove from perspective - water handling. Briefly worded: "Weaker" cultures in this regard may effectively yield little differently when they have 100% of the fruits' water on-hand from start to finish, but a truly aggressive fruiter may plunge into heavy fruiting regardless and allocate such resources on the fly as they may come.
I'm proposing that the qualities of a culture's prolific disposition may expand beyond what bulk substrates give the opportunity to indicate.
-------------------- Intentionally or not, here in mushcult we are purveyors of love culture and enlightenment movement. Let's try to act like it!
PODS TEK - Growing Invitro with BRF/verm or Grass Seed containers
The simplest, quickest, safest tek! For beginners, culturers, lazy people, stealth lovers, contam haters, and alternative seekers!
• Violet's Teks and Posts •
Edited by Violet (03/04/15 11:33 AM)
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Mushroom_J
Hard to the Coir !



Registered: 02/17/11
Posts: 774
Loc: East
Last seen: 8 years, 10 months
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Re: Ok Violet, you're next [Re: Violet]
#21361075 - 03/04/15 12:45 PM (9 years, 10 months ago) |
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Who needs mono's other than drug dealers or the easily impressed? What reason would I need 2 lbs of fruits for a personal stash? What about people that like to experiment or grow more than once a year? What about people who are doing this for a hobby and like having lots to do?
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spacechildo
proletarians rise up



Registered: 01/24/13
Posts: 19,243
Loc: Babylon
Last seen: 7 years, 4 months
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Re: Ok Violet, you're next [Re: Mushroom_J]
#21361119 - 03/04/15 12:54 PM (9 years, 10 months ago) |
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pf cakes 
No need for a big ass PC if you cant even give away a couple oz of fruits to friends...
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Guardian187
Neophyte


Registered: 11/29/14
Posts: 716
Loc: Center of the Universe
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Re: Ok Violet, you're next [Re: bodhisatta]
#21361175 - 03/04/15 01:06 PM (9 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
bodhisatta said: as for testing cultures quickly. make brf cake mix. put about 1/2 pint into a quart or pint wide mouth sterilize let it cool down inoculate wait a week fruit in-vitro
stays sterile the whole time too. but the turn around is way faster and they pin faster and the yields are the same
 fruited in-vitro
 little 3rd flush ape cubes
From start to finish about two weeks til you can harvest.
This thread got intense...
Bod, how do you get enough FAE to fruit in-vitro with this method? Are you using a SFD and just loosening the lid? Wouldn't you need to case or bottom water?
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urthtown
meat popsicle



Registered: 10/26/13
Posts: 1,039
Loc: Eastern Canadia
Last seen: 3 years, 3 months
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Quote:
spacechildo said: pf cakes 
No need for a big ass PC if you cant even give away a couple oz of fruits to friends...
PF cakes are a PITA doing them the RR video way IMO once you've figured out how to do some different styles of grow. I'd rather do muda bottles or vtek than PF cakes by far.
EDIT: I'd also rather do what Bod just posted than regular PF cakes.
-------------------- Cluster Headache sufferer? Cluster Busting
Veil Tear GIF
Flower Pot Grow GIF
Mini Mono Tub GIFS
"All mushrooms are edible, but some only once."
-- Croatian Proverb
Edited by urthtown (03/04/15 01:12 PM)
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spacechildo
proletarians rise up



Registered: 01/24/13
Posts: 19,243
Loc: Babylon
Last seen: 7 years, 4 months
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if you dont want more than a couple grams why would you invest in a pc and a blender just for vtek/mudabottles?
cakes to coir in a mini/shoe box would suffice then IMO 
it would be like buying a gamer pc just to browse the shroomery..
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urthtown
meat popsicle



Registered: 10/26/13
Posts: 1,039
Loc: Eastern Canadia
Last seen: 3 years, 3 months
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Quote:
spacechildo said: if you dont want more than a couple grams why would you invest in a pc and a blender just for vtek/mudabottles?
cakes to coir in a mini/shoe box would suffice then IMO 
it would be like buying a gamer pc just to browse the shroomery..
I actually do a lot of canning, pressure prepping beans and speed cooking of chickens for my meals
It's either shrooms or bombs, eh? Guess it is rare these days to actually use a PC for what it was intended?
Also if you want to grow any edibles you are kinda out of luck sticking to the old PF tek, I mean it can be done but you are barely ever going to get a whole meal off them. As for actives, I only take like 0.25 grams at a time for my headaches but I still go through them since I take them daily or every couple of days for weeks at a time. Even so, growing a couple of grams doesn't go far when you want to trip with some friends. PF tek wouldn't be worth my time and honestly doesn't scratch the hobby itch very well for me personally. I like tinkering with my agar plates. It relaxes me. Now I clone grocery store shrooms all the time just for shits and giggles but I wouldn't if I didn't have a PC.
It's not just about whether you need to grow a lot of drugs or not, it's about whether you like the hobby enough to go beyond an intro tek like PF tek and geek out a bit for your own pleasure. You can't put a price on the things you enjoy.
-------------------- Cluster Headache sufferer? Cluster Busting
Veil Tear GIF
Flower Pot Grow GIF
Mini Mono Tub GIFS
"All mushrooms are edible, but some only once."
-- Croatian Proverb
Edited by urthtown (03/04/15 01:37 PM)
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bodhisatta 
Smurf real estate agent


Registered: 04/30/13
Posts: 61,916
Loc: Milky way
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Quote:
Guardian187 said:
Quote:
bodhisatta said: as for testing cultures quickly. make brf cake mix. put about 1/2 pint into a quart or pint wide mouth sterilize let it cool down inoculate wait a week fruit in-vitro
stays sterile the whole time too. but the turn around is way faster and they pin faster and the yields are the same
 fruited in-vitro
 little 3rd flush ape cubes
From start to finish about two weeks til you can harvest.
This thread got intense...
Bod, how do you get enough FAE to fruit in-vitro with this method? Are you using a SFD and just loosening the lid? Wouldn't you need to case or bottom water?
surprisingly they fruit eventually with just the SFD lid on after reaching full colonization. after loading the PF mix I usuually sprinkle some straight verm on top. the cake sill colonizies if you throw a wedge in but it helps with getting fruiting from the top. for whatever reason cubes fruit well in-vitro even though it has a surprisingly low FAE
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bodhisatta 
Smurf real estate agent


Registered: 04/30/13
Posts: 61,916
Loc: Milky way
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Quote:
spacechildo said: if you dont want more than a couple grams why would you invest in a pc and a blender just for vtek/mudabottles?
cakes to coir in a mini/shoe box would suffice then IMO 
it would be like buying a gamer pc just to browse the shroomery..
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Mushroom_J
Hard to the Coir !



Registered: 02/17/11
Posts: 774
Loc: East
Last seen: 8 years, 10 months
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Quote:
spacechildo said: if you dont want more than a couple grams why would you invest in a pc and a blender just for vtek/mudabottles?
cakes to coir in a mini/shoe box would suffice then IMO 
it would be like buying a gamer pc just to browse the shroomery..
If you just want to grow to trip cakes would be fine. There's no reason to really even move to other techniques if you only want to trip. For someone who likes mycology, and wants to learn/experiment... you need a PC... agar etc.
You guys seem to forget there's different people and different growers. every method has +/-. They're all worth learning.
If you live on the 4th floor of a 20 floor apartment building... hauling 50 lbs of bird seed, a big bag of verm, shit tons of jars etc... It's kinda suspicious.
a bag of rice and pp5 cups would be more ideal in a circumstance like that. It's fun too and lends to small scale experimenting.
If you need lbs of shrooms... go with monos if you have no interest in mycology and just want to trip... go with cakes if you like to fuck around find a method that allows you to without being knee deep in fruits. I personally like Violets teks. It's a grow system. It allows me to do things the way I want. It's not for everyone. It's more involved which is why I like it.
I started with cakes,then moved to monos... I find it boring. I've had more fun doing agar in my SAB. The fun is just beginning. Since Violet did some nice write ups, I now have some pretty cool methods to fuck around with.
Now that I've seen poms 1.0... Knowing what i can do with it...it'll take my growing to a new level.
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urthtown
meat popsicle



Registered: 10/26/13
Posts: 1,039
Loc: Eastern Canadia
Last seen: 3 years, 3 months
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Re: Ok Violet, you're next [Re: Mushroom_J]
#21361652 - 03/04/15 02:56 PM (9 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
Mushroom_J said: There's different people and different growers. every method has +/-. They're all worth learning.
-------------------- Cluster Headache sufferer? Cluster Busting
Veil Tear GIF
Flower Pot Grow GIF
Mini Mono Tub GIFS
"All mushrooms are edible, but some only once."
-- Croatian Proverb
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Guardian187
Neophyte


Registered: 11/29/14
Posts: 716
Loc: Center of the Universe
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Re: Ok Violet, you're next [Re: Mushroom_J]
#21361657 - 03/04/15 02:58 PM (9 years, 10 months ago) |
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Agar is by far my favorite part 
I prefer mini-monos over doing cakes, but my only experience was using a large SGFC with cakes.
I do have leftover pf tek ingredients, so makes sense for me to do it the way bodhisatta recommends.
It's cool to learn different techniques though, but I'm one of the "loves mycology" folks
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spacechildo
proletarians rise up



Registered: 01/24/13
Posts: 19,243
Loc: Babylon
Last seen: 7 years, 4 months
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Re: Ok Violet, you're next [Re: Mushroom_J]
#21361660 - 03/04/15 02:59 PM (9 years, 10 months ago) |
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I'd love to see some of your pics of these cased grains or even better a pom grow that doesnt just look like a pinning pasty plate!
You'd need use more grains if you dont spawn them to bulk so I dont get your "bag of wbs" comment?
also most people dont have the time to babysit those cased grains which needs watering almost constantly.
but each to his own
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Mushroom_J
Hard to the Coir !



Registered: 02/17/11
Posts: 774
Loc: East
Last seen: 8 years, 10 months
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Quote:
spacechildo said: I'd love to see some of your pics of these cased grains or even better a pom grow that doesnt just look like a pinning pasty plate!
You'd need use more grains if you dont spawn them to bulk so I dont get your "bag of wbs" comment?
also most people dont have the time to babysit those cased grains which needs watering almost constantly.
but each to his own 
When i have pics to share I will.
The wbs comment... no one except bird nerds need wbs on the 4th floor. When your neighbors see you hauling in 50 lb bags of wbs.. but never hear chirping, it's a little suspicious.
It would take all of 2 minutes to water 12 pp5 cups. Plus it's actually something to do... being involved in the grow instead of just... standing there.
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Violet



Registered: 12/06/11
Posts: 4,205
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Quote:
spacechildo said: also most people dont have the time to babysit those cased grains which needs watering almost constantly.
Ignorant idiocy. You officially know nothing about this tek. Known and established.
-------------------- Intentionally or not, here in mushcult we are purveyors of love culture and enlightenment movement. Let's try to act like it!
PODS TEK - Growing Invitro with BRF/verm or Grass Seed containers
The simplest, quickest, safest tek! For beginners, culturers, lazy people, stealth lovers, contam haters, and alternative seekers!
• Violet's Teks and Posts •
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spacechildo
proletarians rise up



Registered: 01/24/13
Posts: 19,243
Loc: Babylon
Last seen: 7 years, 4 months
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Re: Ok Violet, you're next [Re: Violet]
#21361901 - 03/04/15 03:49 PM (9 years, 10 months ago) |
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"this tek" 
its cased grains. grains dont hold much water. grains must therefore be watered several times a day.
You make up BS about "this tek". Known and established.
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