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Thanatos10
Stranger



Registered: 01/19/15
Posts: 2,770
Loc: South Florida
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Freedom
#21211463 - 02/01/15 03:05 PM (9 years, 3 months ago) |
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The supreme mystery of despotism, its prop and stay, is to keep men in a state of deception, and cloak the fear by which they must be held in check, so that they will fight for their servitude as if for salvation.
The above is a quote from some person, but it got me thinking about freedom. Are we truly free as we are now? Living in this society are we free or simply paying by the rules of the world that we live in? How much control do we have over our lives? Is it an illusion of freedom or limited freedom? Is the alternative any better?
-------------------- As lightless oblivion devours you, drown in the ever-blooming darkness.
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Lakefingers
Registered: 08/26/05
Posts: 6,440
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redgreenvines
irregular verb


Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 38,485
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what happens if people do not feel compelled to do stupid things; that to me is freedom. the rest is an endless game of boundaries and diplomacy
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery



Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
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Quote:
Thanatos10 said: The supreme mystery of despotism, its prop and stay, is to keep men in a state of deception, and cloak the fear by which they must be held in check, so that they will fight for their servitude as if for salvation.
The above is a quote from some person, but it got me thinking about freedom. Are we truly free as we are now? Living in this society are we free or simply paying by the rules of the world that we live in? How much control do we have over our lives? Is it an illusion of freedom or limited freedom? Is the alternative any better?
No we are not free and we likely never have been. But this is a dead horse in this forum. If you want to know how much freedom you actually have just wait. Age will shed light on this issue.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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Rahz
Alive Again



Registered: 11/10/05
Posts: 9,395
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Freedom is a relative thing is it not?
-------------------- rahz comfort pleasure power love truth awareness peace I am I feel I do I love I speak I see I know βScience advances one funeral at a timeβ ~Max Planck
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Raven Gnosis
π°π’π―ππ’π«π±π¦π π¦π‘π


Registered: 02/10/11
Posts: 1,311
Loc: Necoc Yaotl
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Re: Freedom [Re: Rahz] 1
#21214890 - 02/02/15 07:24 AM (9 years, 3 months ago) |
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No, you're confusing freedom with incest.
-------------------- To be human is to be fettered, to endure what one is, in perpetuum, no matter what the debility or perversity.
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CosmicJoke
happy mutant


Registered: 04/05/00
Posts: 10,848
Loc: Portland, OR
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Quote:
Icelander said:
No we are not free and we likely never have been. But this is a dead horse in this forum. If you want to know how much freedom you actually have just wait. Age will shed light on this issue.
Sapolsky argues that a sense of control is beneficial for mild to moderate stressors, because in those circumstances you know how much worse it could have been, and rightly or wrongly, that you had control over improvement. For major disastrous stressors, however, the last thing you want is an inflated sense of control, because that sets you up to think that the disaster is all your fault. In that domain, the most humane thing you can do is foster denial and rationalization than a sense of responsibility.
The idea is one's opinion on how much control we have may simply result from what's in one's best interest for coping with stress. It's an interesting thought.
-------------------- Everything is better than it was the last time. I'm good. If we could look into each others hearts, and understand the unique challenges each of us faces, I think we would treat each other much more gently, with more love, patience, tolerance, and care. It takes a lot of courage to go out there and radiate your essence. I know you scared, you should ask us if we scared too. If you was there, and we just knew you cared too.
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Thanatos10
Stranger



Registered: 01/19/15
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Is that the reason we still keep government around? I've pondered what it would be like if anarchy were to take place. Some people seem utterly convinced that it would be a good idea, but me personally I don't know. Granted the current system is not really that good to be honest, but I'm not sure how well the world might function without it. To me it sounds like a dream that you hope for but in reality would be a disaster. But I guess only time will tell, I can't predict the future.
-------------------- As lightless oblivion devours you, drown in the ever-blooming darkness.
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Lakefingers
Registered: 08/26/05
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redgreenvines
irregular verb


Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 38,485
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truth
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Grapefruit
Freak in the forest


Registered: 05/09/08
Posts: 5,744
Last seen: 3 years, 4 months
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Quote:
Lakefingers said: Whether it would be good having no state is one thing. What that would be like is another. If the state were disbanded now, things would quickly become nasty and brutish. Freedom is a complicated word either way. Are we talking about judicial freedom, existential freedom, intellectual freedom, freedom of will, financial freedom, freedom from natural law, etc.
People prefer to have limited legal freedom rather than to live in constant fear. Enforcement and protection is extended to the state, ensuring those basic legal freedoms for most citizens most of the time. That American land-of-the-free-freedom is an illusion. French Revolution-style freedom is a set of perishable legal privileges called liberty, meaning freedom under certain conditions from certain forces.
A good political system has to acknowledge people's weaknesses and set the proper controls in place that ensure people don't unwittingly support corruption. Right wing libertarians say we can just vote with our wallet and in an ideal world where people didn't just vote for easy and cheap without thinking about what they are really voting for this would be the case. As it is this system will always put power in the hands of whatever private companies are offering the best deal.
-------------------- Little left in the way of energy; or the way of love, yet happy to entertain myself playing mental games with the rest of you freaks until the rivers run backwards. "Chat your fraff Chat your fraff Just chat your fraff Chat your fraff"
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Rebelutionsssss
Mdmazing



Registered: 07/23/14
Posts: 13,137
Loc: San Francisco
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We have little to no control. We live in a fucked up society
-------------------- : To define is to confine.
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Tropism
ChasingTail


Registered: 09/12/09
Posts: 2,039
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I would wager society is inherently fucked up. There is probably one in every million galaxies that does it right.
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