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chucklehead
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Wild Dagga - Lion's Tail - Leonotis leonurus 2
#21194262 - 01/28/15 10:02 PM (9 years, 3 months ago) |
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I have been smoking weed for decades now and lately I smoke every night. Actually I vape mostly. I smoke a bowl here and there and a joint only very rarely. Oh and on special occasions I will dab.
I like my vape so much I started getting curious about what else I could vape. Per my usual I started surfing the web for answers. It turns out you can vape loads of stuff but not much of it sounds particularly fun in the 'getting you high' department. There are piles of conflicting reports and vendor hype statements. I have even wondered how many reports were contrivances by vendors looking to swindle you with snake oil. I had tried a few things in many years ago but never found them to work. Still I was hopeful.
One thing that stood out in the world of legal highs was Lion's Ear. Most vendors refer to it as wild dagga. The Latin name is in the title. I recommend checking it out on wiki. I had purchased some years ago with a lot of other bunk. I tried smoking bowls of it but it never worked and it tasted completely awful and burned harshly.
Well my recent web mining turned up the fact bowls don't work well with it but joints and bongs do. I reasoned that must mean the active chemical is vaping just behind the cherry and the combustion part is destroying the actives. It is a guess but it sounded good in my head.
Since the stuff is dirt cheap I decided to try and vape it. I bought a second vapir2 vaporizer for the purpose of vaping things other than weed btw that is my favorite vape I own. Never owned a volcano but I digress. I ordered some lions tail petals only (most potent part of the plant) I orders some other stuff but I will get into that later.
My research indicated the vape temp for dagga is 300F-350F. So I set the vape to 325F and off I went. Oops I almost missed this detail. I took a T break for 10 days in preparation for this test. I read that regular smokers are disappointed and often feel nothing.
I have to tell you I was jonesing hard today. If this didn't work I was going to enjoy the best of my bud and go full retard.
Well as you may have guessed it did work. So how was it?
Pretty much like weed with several noteworthy exceptions.
There is no analgesic effect that I could tell. I have a recent injury and the pain never let up an ounce. The effects are short lived.
I took a good ten hits and the effects mostly wore off after an hour and fifteen minutes with a sort of lingering after buzz that feels like I had two beers.
The vapor itself is literally sweet on the tongue and feels only like air in the lungs but I do have throat irritation which feels a bit scratchy. I woke up the next day with a runny nose and a little cough but it only lasted for 20 minutes.
Initially I wondered if I was getting anything other than water vapor but the buzz kicked in gradually over 5 minutes.
The buzz is like a sativa high.
I noticed no time distortion and while there was a good body buzz too it wasn't very Stoney. Basically your mind doesn't slow down much if at all.
I read it has sedative properties but I would suggest that part is very mild.
It has no hallucinogenic properties that I noticed. If I smoke enough weed I get a mandala I don't see that happening here.
Now for more pros. I told you I was jonesing. Well not anymore. My jones was gone and stayed gone.
Also no cotton mouth munchies red eyes nor paranoia.
Also no smell from vaping it at all. I mean none.
And it is legal to buy and own and grow. I gather you aren't allowed to legally smoke it but I doubt you would find yourself in much trouble over it but I am no lawyer. Also it isn't going to be trouble on a drug test.
My over all impression was I like vaping dagga and even recommend it. Weed is better in many respects but this has advantages.
I would say the short duration has an up side. Maybe you don't want to be high for hours. You could vape this on a lunch hour (smell free) to relax and be back to normal in time for work again with no one the wiser.
The legal status is obviously great if you live in a state where smoking weed is not legal. You can grow as much as you are able and the plant is even attractive. You can order dried petals on the internet to your door. No dealer to deal with. No shady neighborhoods to visit.
So you may be wondering what else I ordered. Hops for one because of the flavor. It shares terpenes with weed so I figured mixing might be pleasant and give me even more of a sense of smoking weed.
Also I ordered some blue lotus stamens to add to the mix for the mood enhancement. I bet through the vape it works even better than the tea.
Finally I ordered some seeds. There appear to be two common varieties of dagga, lions tail and lions ear, the latter is often referred to as klip dagga and is rumored to be slightly stronger but is twice as expensive. I find it to be a less attractive plant but it has some noted advantages in terms of cultivation so I will try to grow both.
I will report back on the mixing in of lotus and hops. I am a little concerned about not having enough dagga in the vape if I mix this stuff in but it is going in the food processor first to see if that helps compact it the blend. The first go with dagga I didn't bother even to grind it. So it'll probably be fine.
Oh I also got some lions ear to try but haven't yet. I read it tastes different but in a bad way. It smells the same to me in the bag. We shall see.
I give lions ear a 7.5 out of 10 because even though the high is more like 6/10 the other pros have to be factored in. I encourage you to do some research on your own because this is just my personal experience and there is a lot of interesting info out there about this plant and I am by no means an expert after trying it once.
C.H.
Edited by chucklehead (01/29/15 06:10 AM)
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mandrin13
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Re: Wild Dagga - Lion's Tail - Leonotis leonurus [Re: chucklehead]
#21194331 - 01/28/15 10:21 PM (9 years, 3 months ago) |
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Nice, I have some seeds to grow so figure I will try this in a few months.
-------------------- Even Jesus got stoned.
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newageshaman
Amateur Ethnobotanist



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Re: Wild Dagga - Lion's Tail - Leonotis leonurus [Re: mandrin13]
#21194378 - 01/28/15 10:36 PM (9 years, 3 months ago) |
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I haven't read the OP cause it is a wall of text, paragraph that shit. My experience with wild dagga has been positive, the closest natural drug i have found similar to cannabis that is still legal. It is still no where near cannabis's level for stoning someone even with high strength extracts, It is however a lot more effective then other legal alternatives such as damiana, wild lettuce ect.
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chucklehead
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Re: Wild Dagga - Lion's Tail - Leonotis leonurus [Re: newageshaman]
#21195192 - 01/29/15 06:38 AM (9 years, 3 months ago) |
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There you go. It was a ramble but I wanted to get it all down while it was fresh in my head. Hopefully it's easier to read now.
Another note. I saw a post from a guy who grows the stuff himself suggesting that some of wild variation in experience such as taste and effect may be the result of various growing methods and conditions as well as the repute of the vendor. More or less the quality is a matter of finding a good vender that isn't selling you something crumby that is either old or poorly dried or grown in sub optimal conditions etc.
I must have just been lucky with the one I found this time. I'll use them again for certain.
If Lion's Ear (Klip Dagga) really is stronger cool but in retrospect this was very good and I'm very satisfied with it.
I've tried a bunch of other legal highs and I don't find them to be effective or if they are they are unpleasant and often have side effects that I hate.
Salvia - YUCK. That works but I don't consider that fun. I'd rather suck on a Whip Cream can and kill my brain than do that again.
Kava Kava - Also sucks for me. It works but I'd just rather have the booze. I don't need the belly ache and weird burny numb tongue and throat. Oh and it gave me a weird rash on my arms. No thanks.
Lotus never worked for me before. I only tried smoking petals before I hear the stamen is where it is at. I am hopeful. There seems to be a good body of experiences out there suggesting it does work. I say it's worth another shot.
Damiana - nothing.
Wormwood - nothing.
So with all of that negative experience I'm delighted and encouraged by the fact Lion's Tail is so effective and only costs me $18 for an ounce including the shipping. One 'bowl' in my vape is all I needed. Really I could have done with less but was shooting for a good effect to get to know this plant. So even with daily use, or nightly in my case, this will last a good long while. Hell it's cheaper than beer if you don't count the cost of the vape.
Speaking of Vapes, I'm thinking about ordering an Arizer Extreme Q. The reviews on it look good and the bowl looks big which is what I'm after. I also enjoy the whip style vapes now and then. I have never tried the balloon style but if it's noisy I don't suspect I'd use it. I hope it's easy to clean out since it has a bigger bowl. Cleanup is the only annoy part of a vapir2. It'll have to wait a few pay days before it is in the budget but I think having a bigger bowl might allow for less processing of the input and still have a good high experience even with the dilution. It's just speculation for now. I'll let you know if I end up getting one.
C.H.
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hayabuser

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Re: Wild Dagga - Lion's Tail - Leonotis leonurus [Re: chucklehead]
#21195239 - 01/29/15 07:01 AM (9 years, 3 months ago) |
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I started making a mix of 50 Dagga, 20 Lotus and 30 Weed 2 years ago, this saved me tons of money. Another plus is most people get scared away from that mixture and dont try to score some weed from me. Those few who tried it mentioned its amazingly good against their earlier expectations^^
Edit: I think they have a very synergistic effect and are a whole lot better than weed alone.
-------------------- Everything I post is (science)fiction.
Edited by hayabuser (01/29/15 07:03 AM)
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chucklehead
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Re: Wild Dagga - Lion's Tail - Leonotis leonurus [Re: hayabuser]
#21195458 - 01/29/15 08:45 AM (9 years, 3 months ago) |
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hayabuser that sounds pretty great. I have read about mixing in some weed and the experience is even better. Do you preprocesses that? I'm guessing that is by mass not volume. Do you weight it out and dump it in a grinder or something or you just eyeball it each time? It seems like it would be easier to make a week worth and grind a batch. I wouldn't imagine doing big batches would be wise as it will dry out and such and probably get less potent due to exposed surface area.
What is your process? I'd love to know.
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LogicaL Chaos
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Re: Wild Dagga - Lion's Tail - Leonotis leonurus [Re: hayabuser]
#21195741 - 01/29/15 10:00 AM (9 years, 3 months ago) |
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This sounds pretty awesome.
I like the combo of weed with Lions tail. I wanna try that now!
thanks for the topic OP. 
Ive smoked some legal herb blends before, and it sounds kinda like how u describe. It was mild but pleasant and was similar to weed itself, but more clear headed.
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hayabuser

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Re: Wild Dagga - Lion's Tail - Leonotis leonurus [Re: chucklehead]
#21195771 - 01/29/15 10:09 AM (9 years, 3 months ago) |
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I weight them our so I get percentages of each herb right, grind all up and throw it in a bag ^^ But even after 4-5 weeks the stuff still hits me pretty hard so I guess theres no major decrease in potency.
-------------------- Everything I post is (science)fiction.
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chucklehead
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Lion's Ear -Klip Dagga [Re: hayabuser]
#21204904 - 01/30/15 10:56 PM (9 years, 3 months ago) |
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Came on fast. To be fair I added some lotus stamens which are putting off more potency. This is a more Stoney experience . I notice I am thirsty after vaping it. Typing is challenging. Visual distortion and vague time concentration issues, motor skills are slow but thoughts are clear. The come up is really fast and I would say the ceiling is higher on the high than lion's tail. Ie lions ear is quicker and higher but shorter duration. I took less this time in anticipation of the stronger potency. The lotus is noticeable and adds neatly into the experience. I personally feel it is a light Stoney feeling with a tiny tiny mood lift. Oh and some drowsiness.
I have to say this is fun for sure. I just wish it killed pain.
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hayabuser

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did you smoke lotus only?
-------------------- Everything I post is (science)fiction.
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Oeric McKenna
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Re: Lion's Ear -Klip Dagga [Re: hayabuser]
#21204963 - 01/30/15 11:23 PM (9 years, 3 months ago) |
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Yeah I grew a bunch but didn't catch much from it...
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chucklehead
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Re: Lion's Ear -Klip Dagga [Re: hayabuser]
#21204971 - 01/30/15 11:25 PM (9 years, 3 months ago) |
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Yeah yesterday I packed a very full vape and worked it for 30 minutes.
Today I mixed them and I am going to round off the night with more more immediately followed herb.
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chucklehead
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Oeric did you smoke it or vape it? Plant or just petals? I read the petals are where you get the most actives. I have only tried the petals. Regarding smoking vs vaping I recommend vaping. It works it tastes good it is healthier and it lasts longer which stretches your buck a good bit.
Speaking of that. As a filler for weed or as a mixer with weed I am not sold. I will have to try again with better weed. It felt a little weird to me and I sort of felt liked the lions tail changed or maybe killed some of the weed effects. The weed wasn't fresh and I had them in series rather than parallel. So I will experiment on. Next time with fresh MJ literally mixed with the Lions Tail and lotus. But I need to do some other experiments first.
I want to add in hops for a taste change to mimic weed. Also I have some saint johns wort to vape alone and then in the lions tail and lotus mix. Then I will combine them all if they all play well to make a 'wish it was weed' blend. I have long wished to develop a good substitute in the case that one day I can't get weed or as a substitute in case I need off the weed for a new job or any other reason. Last night I was thinking that if the blend works I can travel with it. This week I am going to order some lavender, rosemary, and spearmint to also mix in for different flavor experiences. Regarding traveling with it initially I had joints of it in mind but now I think instead I should find a nice portable dry herb vape. I am thinking a cloud pen 2.0 with the dry herb atomizer. I will also experiment with joints but I predict they will be too harsh for my taste.
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chucklehead
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Lion's Tail vs Lion's Ear thoughts.
Ear had a more rapid onset with a bit of a rush on the come up. The high was slightly more high but I used about half what I did with Tail. This could also account for the rapid come down again but there is still a lingering buzz afterward just like Tail. I also noticed no throat or lung irritation as with tail. That could be anything, pesticide for all I know. Though that seems unlikely.
I still have a lot of both but since it is so cheep I may get more from another vendor to see how different that might be.
Also I am going to attempt to cultivate both. If that works I will know they are both pesticide free.
--- more later.
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chucklehead
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Lion's Tail with lotus and Hops.
I like it but it tastes a bit different than I expected but it is close. I think I will have to find a cultivar of hops that is higher in lemonine. Though the Lion's Tail imparts a sweetness that throws it. Off in a way that makes an orange cream sickle effect. It is delightful but not where I was aiming.
The hops has adds a visual vapor that you can actually feel in your lungs etc which mimics vaping weed more closely than the lion's tai alone.
I ground the lion's tail in a food processor. The finer grind works for getting more material in the vape to keep the experience while adding flavor too.
Potency note. Switching back to Tail from Ear the potency difference is more noticeable.
Edited by chucklehead (01/31/15 10:49 AM)
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chucklehead
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A variety of hops called Columbus hops is said to smell just like weed. After having smoked that Zeus bowl a second time the hops take on a different flavor. I don't recommend it. Not horrible just less appetizing. I am going try adding some other flavoring so as soon as they arrive.
Before that I tried hayabuser's recipe. All I can guess is that you get better weed than I do. That mix needed more weed for me but it certainly is nice. I made a decent batch and I will use as is for now but I think I want maybe 2 more parts weed.
I noted a couple of more things after several days of repeated use. There is an increase in thirst and greater frequency of urination as a result. Also I think sleep patters are altered. I wake several times a night but immediately fall back to sleep. Repeated daytime use results in a build up of drowsiness. This I suspect is from the lotus in the mix.
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SynKyd
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Blue lotus extract is where it's at. I soak some ground up bud in it and dry it like a changa mix. Some it with your lady, the first 20 min or so are incredible..........massages and sex are intensified, and the connection is indescribable.
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chucklehead
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Re: Lion's Ear -Klip Dagga [Re: SynKyd]
#21218253 - 02/02/15 08:36 PM (9 years, 3 months ago) |
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I have read lotus has a reverse tolerance. so I have been vaping it daily but I was thinking I would make some tea every night to add to the mix to see if the effects were more pronounce. I don't think I have observed tactile enhancement yet but I do believe there is some mood elevation and a greater sense of relaxed comfort and a general reduction in anxiety. The last bit is actually the most valuable to me. I will have to read up on how to do an extraction from lotus. I am familiar with several methods for weed, and a couple for shrooms, and a few for poppies. I would love to dial in my extraction for lotus and for lions ear/tail and just pop them like vitamins and keep them coming all night.
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newageshaman
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never tried blue lotus, hoping to try some dried passiflora vine as i have one growing at the moment. Supposedly it is a weak maoi and thusly would produce a somewhat dreamy high, how much would be needed i wouldn't know but if plain dried vine doesn't work i will do a bit of an extract and see what happens.
Wild lettuce is a sedative also, said to be a non-addictive opiate substitute but i doubt that the two drugs are very similar at all. Wild lettuce smoked or made into tea will put me to sleep in about an hour, doesn't really produce a high more just a laziness. Similar somewhat to cannabis minus any euphoria, worth a shot if you need a natural sleep aid.
Wormwood an other thujone containing species give a nice mellow cannabis like buzz, i prefer a shot of absinthe to smoking the herb though as the smoke is really harsh. The intoxication from absinthe is very different from other spirit's I have tried, less of a wanting to drink drink drink till you're floored yet adds a to ones creativity with words and drawings.
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chucklehead
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Thanks for the tip on the wild lettuce. That's just the thing this mix needs is a little drowsy bit to round it out. I have noticed I tend to stay up later when I vape the Lion's Tail. It doesn't really keep you up but I think I'm just having fun and don't want the fun to stop. I can't do the wormwood. It makes me kind of ill feeling.
A funny thing happened last night. I had both vapes ready one for weed and one for Lion's Tail+Lotus. Well I vaped that for a while and watched a few TV shows and afterward I wasn't really interested in the weed. I was more interested in some more lion's tail. Perhaps it was just the mood I was in but I'm really quite getting to like the Lion's Tail that's for sure.
Does anyone out there have Lion's Tail tea or Blue Lotus Tea recipes they use regularly? I find videos of people trying things but you don't always get good recipes where people have really dialed it in.
Also I wonder if there are any concerns about liver or kidney damage from long term use of the teas. There are probably no actual scientific studies of such things as I imagine world wide use is so low.
I saw one thing were a lady puts an ounce of lotus in 1.5L of wine and lets it sit for 3 weeks. Eh... okay but how much wine do I have to drink? I don't really want to drink daily and certainly not in high volume. I'm not anti-alcohol I just don't drink often because it messes with my sleep and it seems to drag down my immune system.
I use these plants to enhance my life by reducing my anxiety and raising my mood and to kill pain. Those things in turn help me sleep and rest well. That has the effect of improving my health. I suppose you could say it's self medication. Though I also enjoy the recreational side.
~Short rant. I realize I'm preaching to the choir but I tire of the medical argument about weed. I get that it has medical benefits and certainly I am for pushing the Pro Legal MJ agenda but I think we should do it in a forthright manner. If we want the public's trust we should be telling the truth to them. I don't understand why people are shamed or ashamed for enjoying something recreationally when they use it responsibly. We shouldn't have to make excuses. I like chocolate so I sometimes eat chocolate. I like beer and wine so I occasionally have a glass. I wish people would stop spinning it as a moral issue. This I say with the prudent stipulation of classy responsible use (no different than normal social rules around drinking - show respect for the health happiness and safety and well being of others). ~End Rant
BTW thanks all of you for joining in this thread. I'm excitedly enjoying these new found treats and enjoying the discussion.
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