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OfflinePhluck
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The new age movement is the death rattle of spirituality.
    #2109791 - 11/15/03 08:37 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

Faith is dead. Long live thought.


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"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us


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Offlinesirreal
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Re: The new age movement is the death rattle of spirituality. [Re: Phluck]
    #2109800 - 11/15/03 08:43 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Phluck said:
Faith is dead. Long live thought.





That is pretty vague.

"Thought" can include anything that the mind comes up with.


What do you mean by faith is dead,exactly?

I think I know what you mean. Just want to be sure.



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I may not always tell the truth, but atleast I'm honest
-----------

I see what everyone is saying. It is so hard to form an opinion when you see both sides so clearly!


Edited by sirreal (11/15/03 08:44 PM)


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OfflineSole_Worthy
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Re: The new age movement is the death rattle of spirituality. [Re: sirreal]
    #2109805 - 11/15/03 08:45 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

Well faith is alive and kicking in me :P


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OfflinePhluck
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Re: The new age movement is the death rattle of spirituality. [Re: sirreal]
    #2109827 - 11/15/03 08:52 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

Over the past few centuries, science has become a much more powerful force. Religion finally has a very effective alternative. While various religious and spiritual movements still pop up, as the people of the world become more educated as a whole, more and more of them are abandoning faith for reason.

Maybe the death of faith is still fairly far in the future, but it's certainly begun.


--------------------
"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us


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InvisibletrendalM
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Re: The new age movement is the death rattle of spirituality. [Re: Phluck]
    #2109835 - 11/15/03 08:54 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

I don't think that faith is dead, though perhaps its religious versions are thinning out.

Faith is impossible to avoid, unless you are nihilistic...


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Offlinesirreal
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Re: The new age movement is the death rattle of spirituality. [Re: Phluck]
    #2109836 - 11/15/03 08:54 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Phluck said:
Over the past few centuries, science has become a much more powerful force. Religion finally has a very effective alternative. While various religious and spiritual movements still pop up, as the people of the world become more educated as a whole, more and more of them are abandoning faith for reason.

Maybe the death of faith is still fairly far in the future, but it's certainly begun.




I figured that is what you meant.I agree for the most part.

But,As long as there is an "unknown" there will be room for faith.


--------------------
I may not always tell the truth, but atleast I'm honest
-----------

I see what everyone is saying. It is so hard to form an opinion when you see both sides so clearly!


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OfflineSole_Worthy
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Re: The new age movement is the death rattle of spirituality. [Re: Phluck]
    #2109850 - 11/15/03 08:59 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

maybe folks needs educating about the truth then they will abondon science in their droves


--------------------
get it all together get like birds of a feather


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OfflinePhluck
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Re: The new age movement is the death rattle of spirituality. [Re: sirreal]
    #2109852 - 11/15/03 09:00 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

"But,As long as there is an "unknown" there will be room for faith. "

I've got room for a broke down ol' chevy in my basement but I sure as hell ain't getting one.

Faith won't help you come to any worthwhile conclusions about unknowns, science will.


--------------------
"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us


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OfflinePhluck
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Re: The new age movement is the death rattle of spirituality. [Re: Sole_Worthy]
    #2109857 - 11/15/03 09:02 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

"maybe folks needs educating about the truth then they will abondon science in their droves"

Huh?

There is no truth, there is only observation. Science is a whole shitload of observation put together. Faith is fairy tales.


--------------------
"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us


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Offlinesirreal
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Re: The new age movement is the death rattle of spirituality. [Re: Phluck]
    #2109863 - 11/15/03 09:05 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Phluck said:
"But,As long as there is an "unknown" there will be room for faith. "

I've got room for a broke down ol' chevy in my basement but I sure as hell ain't getting one.

Faith won't help you come to any worthwhile conclusions about unknowns, science will.





I don't believe that having faith makes scientific thinking impossible.

Dogmatic faith does. But having faith does not necessarily close ones mind.


--------------------
I may not always tell the truth, but atleast I'm honest
-----------

I see what everyone is saying. It is so hard to form an opinion when you see both sides so clearly!


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OfflineSole_Worthy
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Re: The new age movement is the death rattle of spirituality. [Re: Phluck]
    #2109865 - 11/15/03 09:05 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

"Faith is fairy tales"

hehe stop it Phluck


--------------------
get it all together get like birds of a feather


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OfflineMixomatosis
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Re: The new age movement is the death rattle of spirituality. [Re: Sole_Worthy]
    #2109879 - 11/15/03 09:13 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

faith is awesome. I have faith in myself, Im playing basketball, I go for a 3-pointer fade away, my faith, coupled with my skill produces that nice "swoosh" sound weve all grown to love.


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OfflineSole_Worthy
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Re: The new age movement is the death rattle of spirituality. [Re: Mixomatosis]
    #2109888 - 11/15/03 09:15 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

yes lets combine science and religion


--------------------
get it all together get like birds of a feather


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Offlinejiva
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Re: The new age movement is the death rattle of spirituality. [Re: sirreal]
    #2109896 - 11/15/03 09:19 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

Modern science started booming when we found out that the priests that had dictated our realities were not only falible, but exploiting us.

With out faith in the clergy, we lost faith in the christian meaning of life. So we sent out explorers all over the place to explore the world for ourselves. The information came pouring in, and although none of it really had to do with finding the meaning of life (the reason to look for anything) we were grateful for the break from the microcosm to focus on the macrocosm. So as we learned all this cool stuff that not only improved our lives but gave us small insights into the nature of life (like darwinism). So we waited while others explored, and we waited and waited and started focusing on secular security while the verdict was out on the meaning of life.

Well we're still waiting on that one, but modern science has ended up discovering what many religions around the world taught up to 8000bce. Psychology, Physics, Archeology, Anthropology, Astronomy and Linguistics to name a few all demonstrate various relations and abilities between us and the universe that used to be considered "magic". (is there a difference between magic, spirituality and science? isn't it all part of the same environment that we're trying to describe in different ways?)

Now look at us, we've gotten so hung up on that secular security that we have divided us from our environment and have trashed the fuck out of it. Hopefully our new spirituality (science?) can show us that we are infact a part of our environment and that this environment is much bigger than our country, but up to as big (but not limited to) the entire damn univerise which we are now aware of thanks to our new magic abilities (math and astronomy).

As for new age, they make the same fatal mistake as science. They try to describe old things with new jargon and divide it up into way too many overlapping "compartments".

at least thats my two cents


--------------------
i am another you


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Offlinejiva
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Re: The new age movement is the death rattle of spirituality. [Re: jiva]
    #2109898 - 11/15/03 09:20 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

oh and faith in science is exactly the same as faith in spirituality. of course someone tests science. of course some one tests spirituality. but have you questioned these tests? experience is the only alternative to faith.


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i am another you


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OfflineSole_Worthy
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Re: The new age movement is the death rattle of spirituality. [Re: jiva]
    #2109907 - 11/15/03 09:23 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

yes, and what an expierince you get with faith

I personaly have faith because I have expiernced. Ive expierecned what you can of science, but the taste of a pear sure beats what i get from that figure on the board


--------------------
get it all together get like birds of a feather


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OfflinePedM
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Re: The new age movement is the death rattle of spirituality. [Re: Sole_Worthy]
    #2110041 - 11/15/03 10:16 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

It is erroneous to assume that faith equals naivety.


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OfflineNiamhNyx
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Re: The new age movement is the death rattle of spirituality. [Re: Ped]
    #2110074 - 11/15/03 10:34 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

I've been reading Ken Wilber lately. I think that you may find him interesting. His focus is the integration of Science and Spirituality with terms both will find acceptable. Spirituality will never die, and science will never replace it because they have different purposes. Science is innately valueless, as it should be. Spirituality is what gives value to the experience of living.

Wilber is a great read, he gives complete respect to both religion and science, as they are due. You don't have to choose between them!


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Offlinepattern
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Re: The new age movement is the death rattle of spirituality. [Re: Phluck]
    #2110089 - 11/15/03 10:42 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

Faith is a thought.


--------------------
man = monkey + mushroom


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Invisiblekaiowas
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Re: The new age movement is the death rattle of spirituality. [Re: Phluck]
    #2110112 - 11/15/03 10:49 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

wait until the thought subides and all there is is nothing. silence....when we leave from this plane to experience the other. to know what true silence is. enough of this input, the screen, these tyipng of these keys, I'm going to enjoy the rest of my shroom trip outisde. the moon is out and the clouds swirl around it.


there in the what said who???

get it??


--------------------
Annnnnnd I had a light saber and my friend was there and I said "you look like an indian" and he said "you look like satan" and he found a stick and a rock and he named the rock ooga booga and he named the stick Stick and we both thought that was pretty funny. We got eaten alive by mosquitos but didn't notice til the next day. I stepped on some glass while wading in the swamp and cut my foot open, didn't bother me til the next day either....yeah it was a good time, ended the night by buying some liquor for minors and drinking nips and going to he diner and eating chicken fingers, and then I went home and went to bed.---senior doobie


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