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OfflineAmorphouspattern
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Drying frozen thawed san pedro any suggestions?.
    #20991972 - 12/17/14 10:02 PM (9 years, 4 months ago)

Hello I am a long time lurker first time poster anyhow.

(question)[can I use the blender and dry thawed out sanpedro  foam/liquid with no problems to make an extract trying to make foam)

(amount) 12 inch cutting 576 G + 300?G very neglected thin various smaller san pedros I had grown

I had recently got some san pedro a 12 inch cutting and I decided to make a tea so I have cut and frozen and thawed three times
The San pedro but I remembered how awful the taste was from a previous unsuccessful experience and since I have 99% ISO alcohol I am now regretting my decision to make a tea instead of dring and making an extract.

Will there be any problems putting the san pedro in a blender and trying to dry the cactus liquid/foam or should I save the liquid excreted by the cactus from freezing and dry all the pieces?

I My climate is the very humid hot tropics so I am concerned I will just be growing mould trying to dry without a desiccant.(had dried before this way)

would there be any point in trying to extract using ISO alcohol from the boiled down dry tea?

As a side question I am hoping to try cactus before I do a Aya brew for first time.

Should I just make the cacti tea and boil down( I always burn it trying to reduce it)

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Invisiblenewageshaman
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Re: Drying frozen thawed san pedro any suggestions?. [Re: Amorphouspattern]
    #20992461 - 12/18/14 12:16 AM (9 years, 4 months ago)

Your post is pretty all over the place, can you reword your questions In either dot points or numbered, all i really gathered from this post is that you have freezed and thawed a 12 inch cutting.


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OfflineAmorphouspattern
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Re: Drying frozen thawed san pedro any suggestions?. [Re: newageshaman]
    #20992493 - 12/18/14 12:36 AM (9 years, 4 months ago)

(1) is there any point in making an alcohol extract from a tea residue

(2) Is it better to dry my thawed san pedro pieces or use a blender and dry out the liquid/foam(should be quicker yes???

(3) will vinegar I add during the process of making tea boil off thus requiring me to add more after initial addition.
If acidic acid's boiling temp is 18c higher then water it shouldn't boil off yes?

(4)should I worry about boiling destroying the mescaline I realise it shouldn't but a lot of people say just to simmer and im a little unsure.

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Offlinehealing
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Re: Drying frozen thawed san pedro any suggestions?. [Re: Amorphouspattern]
    #20992596 - 12/18/14 01:26 AM (9 years, 4 months ago)

Ir's better to dump your cactus sludge into a large pot with some water and boil the shit out of it. Then strain the sludge and boil it again a few times.


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Invisiblenewageshaman
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Re: Drying frozen thawed san pedro any suggestions?. [Re: Amorphouspattern]
    #20992598 - 12/18/14 01:27 AM (9 years, 4 months ago)

(1) I have never made an alcohol extract of cacti before, though usually this is only done with dried cacti and IMO if you already have it in tea why not boil down to resin? More or less the same end product except with tea you evaporate it slowly with heat

(2)If yo have frozen and thawed you're cacti I would avoid trying to dry it unless you have a shit load of time, I am talking roughly 24+ hours as it will end up as a disgusting sludge and even then... tried doing this once and gave up after 6 hours in a 150degree Celsius oven, made tea instead.

(3)I have never added vinegar when doing up tea, though synapsetrap pointed out to me in another thread that adding a source of citric acid like lemon or lime juice should make a tea more potent. My theory on this is that having the citric acid in the mix will help salt out the mescaline, making you're tea more potent. I'd imagine adding vinegar would work similar, though i don't think you'd have  to keep adding more just make sure you add water as it get's low.

(4)My personal opinion on this is that no it shouldn't degrade it, I base this on the fact that all my tea's i have boiled the hell out of with no noticeable loss of potency. I tend to keep adjusting the temp aswell a fair bit for the first 2 to 3 hour's as not to have the foam overflow on you.

I also have one question, you are working with a 12inch cutting but do you know roughly the diameter of the plant you are using. depending on this you may get a powerful experience or nothing at all, my min diameter i consume now is 5 - 6 inches. I prefer larger diameter cacti as it end's up being less material to work with and when using the smaller cacti you will need upwards of 2foot to even feel threshold effects


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OfflineAmorphouspattern
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Re: Drying frozen thawed san pedro any suggestions?. [Re: newageshaman]
    #20992627 - 12/18/14 01:57 AM (9 years, 4 months ago)

Thanks for the the reply to my questions considering your answers tea will be the way I go.

I have a 12 inch cutting I would say 2.5-3 inch cutting it is 576 grams

I also cut up lots of smaller cacti very small in diameter(some 1 inch most less) but quite long and added to the 12 inch

The weight of these small ones all held together felt like half the weight of the 12 inch although felt near 350g (used to make mince)

I have frozen and thawed 3 times but will repeat this a couple more times do you think this will be worth repeating

I have a small amount of weed/hash/oil I could take to reduce nausea but I was thinking it would be best not to get stoned while tripping on cacti first time after reading some reports also I now never smoke weed and have no tolerance im worried it will fuck me up to much

(used to smoke daily for years)

do you think vinegar will be bad to use if I make a tea regarding the flavour

One time I used a whole bottle of lemon squeeze and it was too acidic when I tried to drink tea.

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Invisiblenewageshaman
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Re: Drying frozen thawed san pedro any suggestions?. [Re: Amorphouspattern]
    #20994964 - 12/18/14 04:13 PM (9 years, 4 months ago)

sorry about the late reply man, other side of the world and all :shrug:

honestly the brew you're doing maybe very weak but who know's I'd suggest boiling for atleast 8 to 10hour's with the cacti in the pot, then straining out the solids and boiling down to a cup no more as it is quite a bitter brew. I don't think the vinegar will make the taste of the brew anymore worse or better so if you think it will help use it, if not just do a standard tea.

Using weed at the peak of the cacti expereince is good, even when it is a weak trip as weed will kick it up a knotch without you even knowing. I'd say start smoking it at about the 3rd or 4th hour, as this is when mescaline tend's to start becoming apparent in  it's effects. I can't even remember the amount of times I have thought I wasn't going to trip on cactus at the 3rd hour then smoking some weed only to realise my vision is absolutely covered in fractals and colours.

the only down side to smoking weed while tripping is that if you're trip isn't overly powerful you will need to continue to smoke to get a good mind fuck and visuals. goodluck and let us know if it works or not


next time though buy


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OfflineAmorphouspattern
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Re: Drying frozen thawed san pedro any suggestions?. [Re: newageshaman]
    #20995856 - 12/18/14 07:20 PM (9 years, 4 months ago)

For the sake of the name of the thread do you think it would be better to dry cactus slices
Or freeze and and blend then try to dry the liquid in a pan?

The latter could increase time of drying but also pose more of a mould/contamination risk?

I hope to have fun thanks for input very helpful
I thought a 12 inch cutting plus around 350g of smaller cuttings would create a good (not to strong)trip because I have read some other people use 6 - 8 inch cuttings.

Do you think adding Epsom salt to the cactus once blended with no water after being defrosted-frozen-defrosted
and then adding 99% ISO would work
as in instead of drying just add Epsom salt to cactus juice(remove water) then add alcohol to make an extraction?????

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Offlinehealing
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Re: Drying frozen thawed san pedro any suggestions?. [Re: Amorphouspattern]
    #20996305 - 12/18/14 08:43 PM (9 years, 4 months ago)

You should not add epsom salts or ISO. You should use water.


--------------------
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Invisiblenewageshaman
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Re: Drying frozen thawed san pedro any suggestions?. [Re: Amorphouspattern]
    #20996624 - 12/18/14 09:50 PM (9 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

healing said:
You should not add epsom salts or ISO. You should use water.



:whatshesaid:

If you want to dry you're cactus next time don't freeze and thaw it, it will make more hassle and work than what it is worth. The freezing and thawing would be good possibly if you were to be extracting the pure mescaline salt's but that is still very different to an ISO extract.

Now how i dry my cactus is by firstly getting rid of all the spines with a set of plier's, san pedro's are the easiest to remove the spine's and bridgessi the hardest. After that you can either peel the thin waxy layer of skin from the bright green outer flesh or do what i do which is cut the cacti into 1 to 2inch stars. After that cut as much of the white flesh away from the green as you can, get a few baking trays and lay some baking paper down and put your green outer flesh strips on.

Now heat an oven to no higher than 150 degree's Celsius and place your baking tray(s) in with the cacti, usually takes around 5 to 7 hour's to have it completely bone dry. check the cactus every hour and a half as some bit's will dry quicker then other's, and once it's all dry powder it with either a mortar and pestle or a coffee grinder. Make sure if you use a coffee grinder that it end's up being one you use exclusively ffor powdering entheogens, nothing worse then a cacti tasting coffee :puke:


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OfflineAmorphouspattern
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Re: Drying frozen thawed san pedro any suggestions?. [Re: newageshaman]
    #20996776 - 12/18/14 10:22 PM (9 years, 4 months ago)

making tea as I speak thanks for the drying tips and warning you guys

what do you think of blending and drying out the liquid mush rather then the stars??

Had the tea boiling for 3 hours now first boil
I will strain and boil the cactus mush 3 more times then reduce.
I added two tea spoons of vinegar to aid it.

Any tips

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Offlinehealing
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Re: Drying frozen thawed san pedro any suggestions?. [Re: Amorphouspattern]
    #20996815 - 12/18/14 10:36 PM (9 years, 4 months ago)

There is no need to dry the mush. The point of drying is so that you can powder it so that you can increase the surface area of the plant material and so expose more actives to the solvent. Making your cactus into mush does the same thing.


--------------------
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Invisiblenewageshaman
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Re: Drying frozen thawed san pedro any suggestions?. [Re: Amorphouspattern]
    #20996883 - 12/18/14 10:59 PM (9 years, 4 months ago)

Waste of time to try and dry the mush, next time if you want to make powder don't freeze and thaw just follow the method I outlined in my previous post. Once you have powder from the method able you can either gel cap it or go onto a mescaline extraction, I have never done ISO extracts on cacti and you asked in another thread if it produces dry crystals and the answer is no. ISO extracts will only make a mescaline and other alkaloidal tar.


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Offlinehealing
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Re: Drying frozen thawed san pedro any suggestions?. [Re: newageshaman]
    #20996948 - 12/18/14 11:24 PM (9 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

newageshaman said:
Waste of time to try and dry the mush, next time if you want to make powder don't freeze and thaw just follow the method I outlined in my previous post. Once you have powder from the method able you can either gel cap it or go onto a mescaline extraction, I have never done ISO extracts on cacti and you asked in another thread if it produces dry crystals and the answer is no. ISO extracts will only make a mescaline and other alkaloidal tar.




Does ISO tar differ from tar made with water?


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OfflineAmorphouspattern
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Re: Drying frozen thawed san pedro any suggestions?. [Re: healing]
    #20997027 - 12/18/14 11:51 PM (9 years, 4 months ago)

I have read it does make more pure tar like not as wet just saying that makes me laugh.

I Hate using the oven hope to find a way to dry in the BBQ without burning.

I I tried to decant the tea I make after leaving in fridge would I lose any actives?

would any of the sludge bottom layer have actives??

I got a turkey baster glass one.

Thanks for answers respect SHaman

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Invisiblenewageshaman
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Re: Drying frozen thawed san pedro any suggestions?. [Re: Amorphouspattern]
    #20997375 - 12/19/14 02:00 AM (9 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

healing said:
Quote:

newageshaman said:
Waste of time to try and dry the mush, next time if you want to make powder don't freeze and thaw just follow the method I outlined in my previous post. Once you have powder from the method able you can either gel cap it or go onto a mescaline extraction, I have never done ISO extracts on cacti and you asked in another thread if it produces dry crystals and the answer is no. ISO extracts will only make a mescaline and other alkaloidal tar.




Does ISO tar differ from tar made with water?



Though I haven't done a cacti ISO extraction I wouldn't think there would be much difference, other then the fact you boil/simmer off the excess water with a tea instead of letting it evaporate like with ISO. Maybe one pull's more actives then another I know from what i have seen, that doing a tea tar aswell as doing a ISO tar can more than half the amount of material you consume for psychedelic effect's.

So that is roughly halving you're dosage of 30grams powder for a moderate trip to about 15grams, for me that translates to 30 00 size capsules instead of 60. Which if you aren't able to preform more refined extraction's is pretty good. Some find taking some many capsules to be very uncomfortable so reducing it in any way you can is a good idea.

Quote:

Amorphouspattern said:
I have read it does make more pure tar like not as wet just saying that makes me laugh.

I Hate using the oven hope to find a way to dry in the BBQ without burning.

I I tried to decant the tea I make after leaving in fridge would I lose any actives?

would any of the sludge bottom layer have actives??

I got a turkey baster glass one.

Thanks for answers respect SHaman



If you want to avoid using an oven to dry and do it more naturally (which I really hope you don't try to do with you're tea) you could start a bit of a bon fire and line the cactus strip around it on some pieces of wood. Would probably take awhile so you would want to be able to kepp the fir burning for a prolonged period of time.

I don't really think decanting will do much just get rid of some excess, but aren't you making tar cause I am pretty sure it will always retain some moisture. This is why I like drying fresh cactus as after it's done you can keep it for prolonged periods without worry of any mold or bacteria forming. But you plan to take your tar pretty much straight away if not in a couple day's I'm assuming other wise you could probably freeze it for awhile aswell

for what you are doing you won't need a turkey baster, when transferring the tar don't use it or you will have a huge mess to clean as it can be extremely sticky. I hear adding a tiny bit of flour can make it a bit more manageable to handle.


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OfflineAmorphouspattern
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Re: Drying frozen thawed san pedro any suggestions?. [Re: newageshaman]
    #20997448 - 12/19/14 02:31 AM (9 years, 4 months ago)

one last question
I have boiled the cactus and strained twice im now on a third boils
Do you think its necessary to boil it this long???(6 hours)

I just read that you get 99% of mescaline in first boil??

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Invisiblenewageshaman
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Re: Drying frozen thawed san pedro any suggestions?. [Re: Amorphouspattern]
    #20997491 - 12/19/14 02:58 AM (9 years, 4 months ago)

never done multiple boil's but in saying that i tend to boil my cactus for atleast 8 to 10 hour's before straining and reducing.


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OfflineBigHeart
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Re: Drying frozen thawed san pedro any suggestions?. [Re: newageshaman]
    #21003455 - 12/20/14 02:37 PM (9 years, 4 months ago)



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