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Offlinestara
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bulk substrate and potency
    #2095906 - 11/12/03 07:36 AM (13 years, 25 days ago)

I use rye to spawn poo +straw + verm. and is the potency of this bulk substrate dependent on how much grain I use for spawning ?Thanks.


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Offlineenimatpyrt
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Re: bulk substrate and potency [Re: stara]
    #2095919 - 11/12/03 07:43 AM (13 years, 25 days ago)

The theory goes that mycelia grown on straw/poo is produces more fruits. I guess it only matters to an extent. How much of each did you use? a 1:5 or 1:10 ratio is allright . Lower ratio = faster colonization


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The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few, or the one.


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Offlinestara
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Re: bulk substrate and potency [Re: enimatpyrt]
    #2095927 - 11/12/03 07:55 AM (13 years, 25 days ago)

I use 1:5 but I'm curious if I use 1:10 would then the potency decrease or is it independent from grain amount?


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OfflineEspresso
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Re: bulk substrate and potency [Re: stara]
    #2097026 - 11/12/03 02:09 PM (13 years, 25 days ago)

I don't believe the potency will be dependant on how much spawn you use because you will still end up with the same amount of mycelium for fruiting. Not totally sure though.


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Offlineenimatpyrt
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Re: bulk substrate and potency [Re: Espresso]
    #2097343 - 11/12/03 03:19 PM (13 years, 24 days ago)

Since no conclusive tests have been run to demonstrate potency change I'll tell you what the "theory" is and give my answer based on that.

P. Cubensis mushrooms grown on bulk substrates(such as dung/straw as in your case) are exposed to a higher level of nutrients than off of a BRF cake. This produces larger fruitbodies.  Some theorize that it also makes for more potent (Gram per gram ) fruitbodies.  If this theory is correct and bulk substrates do produce more potent shrooms, you would ideally want as much bulk substrate and as little spawn as possible. When using a BRF cake, or grains, it's best to use a 1:6 ratio, in my opinion, so that the fast colonization can eliminate the possibility of contams.  If you break your cake up really good inside a plastic bag, mix it with the straw/dung at approx a 1:6 ratio, then stir and work the spawn with your hands, you should disperse the mycelia enough for full colonization in about five days.

Now, as for ratios.  If you use a 1:6 ratio, your mycelia will be feeding mainly off of the straw/poo.  That's fine.  Possibly a 1:1 ratio might reduce potency, but I am not sure of that really even. 1:6 is fine
Good luck, welcome to bulk! :smile:


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The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few, or the one.


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OfflineMycoCat
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Re: bulk substrate and potency [Re: enimatpyrt]
    #2097353 - 11/12/03 03:21 PM (13 years, 24 days ago)

Wow enimatpyrt, thanks for that Matrix spoiler! Considering I haven't seen Revolutions yet...


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No question is so difficult to answer as that to which the answer is obvious.

Meow.


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Offlineenimatpyrt
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Re: bulk substrate and potency [Re: MycoCat]
    #2097362 - 11/12/03 03:22 PM (13 years, 24 days ago)

:-)


It's basically the 2 lines in my signature with a few hours of boring kung-fu fighting.


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The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few, or the one.


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OfflineRoseM
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Re: bulk substrate and potency [Re: enimatpyrt]
    #2097368 - 11/12/03 03:23 PM (13 years, 24 days ago)

Not cool dude.


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Fiddlesticks.



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OfflineMycoCat
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Re: bulk substrate and potency [Re: enimatpyrt]
    #2097384 - 11/12/03 03:25 PM (13 years, 24 days ago)

Since I've talked to so many people who said Revolutions sucked, I'm going to go in with very low expectations. So if it's better then I guess I'll be pleasantly surprised.

So I guess technically I could thank you.


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No question is so difficult to answer as that to which the answer is obvious.

Meow.


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Offlinediacamomo
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Re: bulk substrate and potency [Re: Rose]
    #2097385 - 11/12/03 03:25 PM (13 years, 24 days ago)

not at all !  :nonono:


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InvisibleATWAR
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Re: bulk substrate and potency [Re: diacamomo]
    #2097530 - 11/12/03 03:57 PM (13 years, 24 days ago)

More spawn = more nutrients. The best form of supplementation. Although I really wouldnt consider a BRF cake a supplement, I am talking grains...


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To give is to live...



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Offlinediacamomo
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Re: bulk substrate and potency [Re: ATWAR]
    #2097564 - 11/12/03 04:03 PM (13 years, 24 days ago)

what happen if u spawn with a little piece of myc. into ur poo???
of course the mushies will make u trip !!!

so i don't think that the amount of grain colon. that u gonna use make a BIG difference in the final result !


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OfflineEkstaza
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Re: bulk substrate and potency [Re: enimatpyrt]
    #2097598 - 11/12/03 04:11 PM (13 years, 24 days ago)

Quote:

enimatpyrt said:
:-)


It's basically the 2 lines in my signature with a few hours of boring kung-fu fighting.




That has to be the most extreme understatement ever made in the history of mankind.

The Matrix Revolution kicked cinematic ass.


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YOUR EXPERIENCE WITH ANY GIVEN DRUG ISN'T THE DEFINITIVE MEASURE OF THE DRUGS EFFECTS.


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InvisibleATWAR
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Re: bulk substrate and potency [Re: diacamomo]
    #2097627 - 11/12/03 04:16 PM (13 years, 24 days ago)

A totally pointless point. You could also say the reverse:

What would happen if you didn't spawn bulk at all, you just fruited cased grain or BRF. Of course the mushies will make you trip.

Although you will see a big difference. The amount of mushrooms produced is directly proportionate to the amount of nutrients and water available.

Edit: In keeping with my original more spawn = more nutrients (which was "borrowed" from Stamets I must add), of course you are going to reach a maximum point with each type of supplement. You simply cannot add more nutrients than the supplement provides.


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To give is to live...



Edited by ATWAR (11/12/03 04:22 PM)


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Offlinediacamomo
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Re: bulk substrate and potency [Re: ATWAR]
    #2097671 - 11/12/03 04:25 PM (13 years, 24 days ago)

>Although you will see a big difference. The amount of mushrooms produced is directly proportionate to the amount of nutrients and water available.

i think the most important it's the water cause the mushies r 90%
water !

nutrients= grains ,rice flour ...

but we r talking about POTENCY NOT amount produced !!!


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InvisibleATWAR
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Re: bulk substrate and potency [Re: diacamomo]
    #2097793 - 11/12/03 05:11 PM (13 years, 24 days ago)

I refuse to enter the potency issue... It is an ongoing debate that will never end. However I felt it necessary to include my thoughts on supplementation because high tryptamine supplements (spawn) can be used to increase potency. Water is up to you and is very easy to provide, it is not the focus of this discussion. In the end I stand by this:

If you have more nutrients you will end up with better results. Simply put, the more nutrients, then the more essential chemicals available to produce both mushrooms and Psilocybin (and Psilocin). Better results as in both yield and alkaloid content. You will see a big difference between a cased BRF cake and a manure/straw mix. You will also see better results from a heavily supplemented bulk substrate compared to that substrate alone, without the additional nutrients provided by the supplements.


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To give is to live...



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Offlinediacamomo
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Re: bulk substrate and potency [Re: ATWAR]
    #2097811 - 11/12/03 05:19 PM (13 years, 24 days ago)

i'm agree with u about nutrients,water,tryptamines....etc

BUT what about the potency of ur product ?????

i'm disagree about more grain = more potency !

(colon. grain)


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Anonymous

Re: bulk substrate and potency [Re: stara]
    #2097902 - 11/12/03 05:56 PM (13 years, 24 days ago)

and is the potency of this bulk substrate dependent on how much grain I use for spawning ?

i believe that's got something to do with it. that's not proven however. what is proven is that extra grain in the substrate means faster colonization and a good deal of nutrient supplementation. i think it's generally wise to use as much spawn as is practical... to a point that is... i probably wouldn't go any higher than 1:5.


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Offlinestara
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Re: bulk substrate and potency [Re: ]
    #2099982 - 11/13/03 03:40 AM (13 years, 24 days ago)

Thanks for all feedbacks and I've got a second question:Does the potency change if I use millet instead of rye as spawn?I use rye because I think it's more visionary but probably not right,is it?


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