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InvisibleChronic7
Registered: 05/08/04
Posts: 13,679
Progress
    #20915545 - 12/02/14 03:16 AM (9 years, 5 months ago)

My calendar at work gives me a quote everyday, today is 'Restless and discontent are the first necessities of progress', do you think this is true?

I don't really agree with it, i believe progress (evolution) is part of the natural flow of creation and when it flows unimpeded it's at its most efficient, seeing things as lacking or being restless in the way you carry yourself can be perceptual blockages or distractions that hold back progress rather than assist it, at a certain point even the idea of progress itself can be a hinderance to progress

Sure if i'm hungry i have to see my belly as lacking food, maybe feel restless and then i go find food, but stuff like that (food & shelter) is more about maintenance rather than progress as i'm seeing it

What do you think?


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OfflineSpacerific
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Registered: 10/13/12
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Re: Progress [Re: Chronic7]
    #20915573 - 12/02/14 03:35 AM (9 years, 5 months ago)

I think whoever wrote that quote was a complete moron, or at the very least a superficial noob that didn't "get" life at all.

IMO all "progress" that comes from that type of attitude, from irritation, restlessness, basically lack of appreciation for what already is, that kind of progress ends up in cut down forests, polluted air and water, generally being inconsiderate. Because it's rushed, it fails to see the larger picture.

Real progress comes from a sense of peace, of potential, of seeing something good and having a nice idea of how to make it simpler, easier, nicer to live around. Real progress comes from longer term consideration, not short term restlessness. One can live their whole life designing awesome stuff, generating a bunch of progress, and not get at all into feelings of restlessness and discontent. In fact if one gets into those I'd say they're involved in bad design, having bitten off more than they can comfortably chew :biggrin:


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Blessed are your eyes because they see, and your ears because they hear.



For truly, I say to you, many prophets and righteous people longed to see what you see, and did not see it,
and to hear what you hear, and did not hear it.
- Matthew 13:16

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InvisibleLakefingers
Registered: 08/26/05
Posts: 6,440
Re: Progress *DELETED* [Re: Spacerific]
    #20915658 - 12/02/14 04:58 AM (9 years, 5 months ago)

Post deleted by Lakefingers

Reason for deletion: No reason.

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Invisibleredgreenvines
irregular verb
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Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 38,499
Re: Progress [Re: Chronic7] * 1
    #20915666 - 12/02/14 05:07 AM (9 years, 5 months ago)

ha,
I could not deny the interpretation, and i find it funny that any would deny it except that we are conditioned to think of "progress" as one of the secular/sacred virtues; and the quote seems to reduce it to a more lowly function.

IMO the observation is an honest one.

but note too that unsatisfactoriness is pervasive, so progress should also be a pervasive tendency of our lives.

alternatively there should be some shame for languishing in muck.


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:confused: _ :brainfart:🧠  _ :finger:

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InvisibleLunarEclipse
Enlil's Official Story
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Registered: 10/31/04
Posts: 21,407
Loc: Building 7
Re: Progress [Re: Lakefingers] * 1
    #20915667 - 12/02/14 05:09 AM (9 years, 5 months ago)

Economic "growth" and "progress" largely means just that, more and more in this case basically debt.  So the PTB create demand via the restlessness of desire to own or consume something useless made in China and sold at Wal-Mart.

On a personal level, i.e. those wishing to achieve "the american dream", it seems that progress would mean roughly the same.  More and more debt from studying some obscure subject and ending up with $40k or more in student debt to pay off in addition to your mortgage and car payment with your job at Wal-Mart since you should have majored in something less obscure.


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Anxiety is what you make it.

Edited by LunarEclipse (12/02/14 05:11 AM)

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InvisibleLakefingers
Registered: 08/26/05
Posts: 6,440
Re: Progress *DELETED* [Re: LunarEclipse]
    #20915683 - 12/02/14 05:34 AM (9 years, 5 months ago)

Post deleted by Lakefingers

Reason for deletion: "

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InvisibleLunarEclipse
Enlil's Official Story
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Registered: 10/31/04
Posts: 21,407
Loc: Building 7
Re: Progress [Re: Lakefingers]
    #20915692 - 12/02/14 05:47 AM (9 years, 5 months ago)

The recipe for the debt formula and making debt slaves isn't new.  The difference today is the Leverage.  It's become a monster, the 800 lb. gorilla but he's not in the room for us to see.  The debt of course has grown incredibly, but bets on the debt are many multiples of the actual debt.

I think China is going to fall first in terms of insolvency.  They have an economy "growing" out of touch with the world's reality other than a bunch of slave labor with people in debt.  Hmm...


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Anxiety is what you make it.

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OfflineSpacerific
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Registered: 10/13/12
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Re: Progress [Re: LunarEclipse]
    #20915957 - 12/02/14 08:05 AM (9 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:


I have found that some progress comes from restlessness and discontent. Some comes from sustained concentration while some comes from accident or chance too.



I agree with this. But see the quote implies that ALL progress comes from the first sources, as in, restlessness and discontent are the first necessities fpr it.

This implication, that ALL progress comes via that way, is the retarded part of the quote, the glitch in the author's attitude. Plenty of progress comes from good vibes, sheer drive and challenge to innovate, no negative crap involved.


--------------------
Blessed are your eyes because they see, and your ears because they hear.



For truly, I say to you, many prophets and righteous people longed to see what you see, and did not see it,
and to hear what you hear, and did not hear it.
- Matthew 13:16

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InvisibleCosmicJokeM
happy mutant
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Registered: 04/05/00
Posts: 10,848
Loc: Portland, OR
Re: Progress [Re: Chronic7] * 1
    #20916054 - 12/02/14 08:51 AM (9 years, 5 months ago)

I agree with the statement.  I think most of the visionary scientists and artists agree that their dissatisfaction is driving them towards something deeper and better, it keeps them making art and solving problems.  Impermanence, frustration, and death are at the core of our psyches.  I think the most boring people on the planet hide behind flowery clap-trap to explain it all away with karma, reincarnation, heaven etc.


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Everything is better than it was the last time.  I'm good.

If we could look into each others hearts, and understand the unique challenges each of us faces, I think we would treat each other much more gently, with more love, patience, tolerance, and care.

It takes a lot of courage to go out there and radiate your essence.

I know you scared, you should ask us if we scared too.  If you was there, and we just knew you cared too.

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InvisibleCosmicJokeM
happy mutant
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Registered: 04/05/00
Posts: 10,848
Loc: Portland, OR
Re: Progress [Re: Chronic7] * 1
    #20916177 - 12/02/14 09:29 AM (9 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

The Chronic said:

Sure if i'm hungry i have to see my belly as lacking food, maybe feel restless and then i go find food, but stuff like that (food & shelter) is more about maintenance rather than progress as i'm seeing it






I think it actually makes a good bit of sense to think about every major and minor convenience, medical and technological, as discoveries that were designed to help us improve nesting, digesting, and congesting.  Same oral and territorial anxieties are the fuel and engine of society and culture as we know it.


--------------------
Everything is better than it was the last time.  I'm good.

If we could look into each others hearts, and understand the unique challenges each of us faces, I think we would treat each other much more gently, with more love, patience, tolerance, and care.

It takes a lot of courage to go out there and radiate your essence.

I know you scared, you should ask us if we scared too.  If you was there, and we just knew you cared too.

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OfflinejackSpearows
ShaRooooms !!!
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Registered: 01/17/12
Posts: 198
Last seen: 7 years, 7 months
Re: Progress [Re: CosmicJoke]
    #20918422 - 12/02/14 05:18 PM (9 years, 5 months ago)

I think its best to synthesize restlessness and discontent with the process of evolution and progress. Those things are a part of the process.  ime anyway.  Not an aim by any means tho.

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InvisibleWhite Beard

Registered: 08/13/11
Posts: 6,325
Re: Progress [Re: Chronic7]
    #20918471 - 12/02/14 05:30 PM (9 years, 5 months ago)

motivational slogans/mission statements from work are so dumb. they're always so cliche and I bet it takes a group of 10-12 upper level executives on an all-inclusive team building weekend in Switzerland to come up with something like "innovation is finding answers to questions no one has asked" (a slogan from my place of employment). :rolleyes:

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Offlineakira_akuma
Φύσις κρύπτεσθαι ὕψιστος φιλεῖ

Registered: 08/28/09
Posts: 82,455
Loc: Onypeirophóros
Last seen: 4 years, 4 months
Re: Progress [Re: White Beard]
    #20918602 - 12/02/14 05:56 PM (9 years, 5 months ago)

the foundation of progress:--

1: Hunting/Gathering
2: Food
3: Relationships
4: Sex
5: Innovation/Invention
6: Art (Trades, Philosophy/Science, Politics, Economy ect)

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InvisibleLakefingers
Registered: 08/26/05
Posts: 6,440
Re: Progress *DELETED* [Re: LunarEclipse]
    #20921230 - 12/03/14 04:39 AM (9 years, 5 months ago)

Post deleted by Lakefingers

Reason for deletion: "

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InvisibleLunarEclipse
Enlil's Official Story
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Registered: 10/31/04
Posts: 21,407
Loc: Building 7
Re: Progress [Re: Lakefingers] * 1
    #20921289 - 12/03/14 05:15 AM (9 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Lakefingers said:
OP, excuse us for this tangent...

Quote:

LunarEclipse said:
The recipe for the debt formula and making debt slaves isn't new.  The difference today is the Leverage.  It's become a monster, the 800 lb. gorilla but he's not in the room for us to see.  The debt of course has grown incredibly, but bets on the debt are many multiples of the actual debt.

I think China is going to fall first in terms of insolvency.  They have an economy "growing" out of touch with the world's reality other than a bunch of slave labor with people in debt.  Hmm...




Yep, it's old. When Europeans first went to "explore" the New World, there was an underlying thought that they'd find cultures with no debt, but what they find were forms of debt they'd never before encountered. I think though that things are getting worse in this respect for our civilization and quickly. If China falls everyone's in for a :crankshitshower:.




The situation in China is so tied into the rest of the financial world, that I agree when it "falls" the shit will fly everywhere.  "Fortunately" the drug money keeps feeding "the system", but look at what just happened to petrodollar recycling.  It went away, and is now negative. 

The end of the petrodollar may represent progress to some countries, but "we" the US isn't going down without a fight.  After all, fight is what we do best.  So the price of oil goes down as the USD goes up, for now.

In China, as with Goldman Sachs, there are "shadow" markets.  The shadow debt market in China in particular is a huge bubble, just waiting to explode.


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Anxiety is what you make it.

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InvisibleChronic7
Registered: 05/08/04
Posts: 13,679
Re: Progress [Re: LunarEclipse]
    #20922300 - 12/03/14 11:52 AM (9 years, 5 months ago)

Thanks for the replies everyone, lots of views that are all valid :thumbup:


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Offlineviktor
psychotechnician
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Registered: 11/03/10
Posts: 4,293
Loc: New Zealand Flag
Last seen: 2 years, 1 month
Re: Progress [Re: Chronic7]
    #20925693 - 12/03/14 11:48 PM (9 years, 5 months ago)

I'd take that quote as an admonition against complacency and laziness. I think that this was the intent of it, even if the wording could be interpreted several ways.


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"They consider me insane but I know that I am a hero living under the eyes of the gods."

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