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OfflineHerbologist
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buying a telescope
    #20774774 - 10/30/14 09:22 PM (9 years, 3 months ago)

So I have $250-$280 to spend on a telescope and I know that isn't going to buy me an amazing telescope but I have a couple picked out that seem nice and have good reviews. I want to know what you guys think.

Orion 9851 SpaceProbe 130 EQ Reflector Telescope https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0000XMSWK/ref=cm_sw_r_awd_TdOuub1DFGMBW



Or.


Orion 09007 SpaceProbe 130ST Equatorial Reflector Telescope (Black) https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00D05BKOW/ref=cm_sw_r_awd_UlOuub0XT2TP8



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OfflineAll We Perceive
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Re: buying a telescope [Re: Herbologist]
    #20775338 - 10/31/14 12:05 AM (9 years, 3 months ago)

Way overpriced dude.  You can get a much better telescope on craigslist.  For example:

http://denver.craigslist.org/ele/4679537180.html


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InvisibleShockValue
Because, ShockValue.

Registered: 11/18/08
Posts: 5,097
Loc: Tipping at windmills.
Re: buying a telescope [Re: All We Perceive]
    #20775429 - 10/31/14 12:39 AM (9 years, 3 months ago)

Make sure you get a good judge of the mount as well.  My buddy just bought a scope, and while the optics and tube are good, the mount sucks .  It's flimsy and not smooth, so even if he does managed to get it aligned well, you have to be really really careful about moving from target to target or it gets out of whack again.

Reflectors are a great 'bang for the buck' scope though, and if you're on that kind of a budget you're looking int he right place.  If you can stand used, you could do even better.    Just make sure if you buy a used one that you check it carefully, as a banged around scope is worth about $0.00.

Orion, Meade, Celestron all make good scopes in your range.


I'm currently working on the Messier challenge (View all 101 objects).  I'm up to about 10, but the weather turned bad here in WA just as I was getting into it.  I'll either have to wait until a cold clear night, or.. next summer :smile:

I have an old Nextstar 5.    It works pretty well, although there have been lots of improvements in the computerized goto and tracking functionality since then.

Here's a pic with my home-made dew-heater.


--------------------
  • When we built temples to view the stars, we knew about all 2000 of them.


Edited by ShockValue (10/31/14 12:42 AM)


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OfflineHerbologist
Grrratata
I'm a teapot


Registered: 05/09/10
Posts: 7,471
Loc: Casa Bonita Flag
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Re: buying a telescope [Re: ShockValue]
    #20776521 - 10/31/14 10:19 AM (9 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

All We Perceive said:
Way overpriced dude.  You can get a much better telescope on craigslist.  For example:

http://denver.craigslist.org/ele/4679537180.html




I have ZERO experience in telescopes.  Why do you say over priced?  If I were to look on craigslists I wouldn't even know what I'm looking at at the moment or what to search for.

The one in the ad you posted looks good, but see, I dont even know what makes it good haha.  Could you possibly post one from amazon that you think is a good scope for the price?  I dont live in Denver


Quote:

ShockValue said:
Make sure you get a good judge of the mount as well.  My buddy just bought a scope, and while the optics and tube are good, the mount sucks .  It's flimsy and not smooth, so even if he does managed to get it aligned well, you have to be really really careful about moving from target to target or it gets out of whack again.

Reflectors are a great 'bang for the buck' scope though, and if you're on that kind of a budget you're looking int he right place.  If you can stand used, you could do even better.    Just make sure if you buy a used one that you check it carefully, as a banged around scope is worth about $0.00.

Orion, Meade, Celestron all make good scopes in your range.


I'm currently working on the Messier challenge (View all 101 objects).  I'm up to about 10, but the weather turned bad here in WA just as I was getting into it.  I'll either have to wait until a cold clear night, or.. next summer :smile:

I have an old Nextstar 5.    It works pretty well, although there have been lots of improvements in the computerized goto and tracking functionality since then.

Here's a pic with my home-made dew-heater.






Thats a pretty cool looking scope you got there.  i think the mounts in the ones I posted are pretty decent, I think the reviews were good too.  Do you think one of the two telescopes I posted is worth buying at all?  The only brands I know of are Orion and Celestron


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OfflineAllGreyThumbs
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Re: buying a telescope [Re: Herbologist]
    #20776683 - 10/31/14 11:17 AM (9 years, 3 months ago)

I have a 4.5 inch reflector on an EQ mount.  I never use it because it's such a pain in the ass to set up.  I wish I would have bought one on a Dobsonian mount.  With a good laser sight you can still find and follow what you are looking for pretty easily.  And with a Dob you can set up and take down on a whim.  "Ok look, it's clear tonight and I have an hour."  With an EQ it's a bigger deal to set up and align, and also to break down and put away.


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OfflineHerbologist
Grrratata
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Registered: 05/09/10
Posts: 7,471
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Re: buying a telescope [Re: AllGreyThumbs]
    #20776759 - 10/31/14 11:41 AM (9 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

AllGreyThumbs said:
I have a 4.5 inch reflector on an EQ mount.  I never use it because it's such a pain in the ass to set up.  I wish I would have bought one on a Dobsonian mount.  With a good laser sight you can still find and follow what you are looking for pretty easily.  And with a Dob you can set up and take down on a whim.  "Ok look, it's clear tonight and I have an hour."  With an EQ it's a bigger deal to set up and align, and also to break down and put away.





Is the dobsonian mount the ones that are much shorter and smaller?  I'd have to have it sit on something to be at my height, correct?  I am 6ft, so it sounds like I would have to maybe sit down to use one of these?


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OfflineAllGreyThumbs
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Re: buying a telescope [Re: Herbologist]
    #20776878 - 10/31/14 12:12 PM (9 years, 3 months ago)

Yea, the small Dobsonians are more like table top units.  Bigger scopes and mounts are taller and might not be that low when aimed high.  When aimed low you would still end up pretty crouched down.

But just because a small Dobsonian looks like it should sit on a table doesn't mean that you can just set one on any table.  Whatever it rests on has to be very, very stable or your view will end up shaking all over.

It's been a while since I've even thought about this, but if I recall you might be able to get reflectors mounted on a stand with a simpler altitude azimuth movement.  It just moves side to side and up and down.  Like a little refracting telescope.  Point it where you want it kind of deal.  Maybe that's something to consider.

Maybe see if there are some videos online of how to set up an EQ mount.  They are complex things in their own right.  Just think about whether you want to go through all of that every time you want to use it.  And unless you want to spend big bucks for high quality motorized mounts and equipment for photography where you need to track objects I just don't think they are that necessary.

Also realize that a lot of the time it is hard to predict viewing conditions.  Depending on where you live you might rely more on spur of the moment opportunities.

So yea, maybe Dobsonian isn't perfect.  If you plan on working from grass or dirt maybe a reflector with a simpler up/down left/right stand mount is in order.  They are less common with reflectors, but I think you can get that kind of set up.


--------------------
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OfflineHerbologist
Grrratata
I'm a teapot


Registered: 05/09/10
Posts: 7,471
Loc: Casa Bonita Flag
Last seen: 3 years, 2 months
Re: buying a telescope [Re: AllGreyThumbs]
    #20776947 - 10/31/14 12:27 PM (9 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

AllGreyThumbs said:
Yea, the small Dobsonians are more like table top units.  Bigger scopes and mounts are taller and might not be that low when aimed high.  When aimed low you would still end up pretty crouched down.

But just because a small Dobsonian looks like it should sit on a table doesn't mean that you can just set one on any table.  Whatever it rests on has to be very, very stable or your view will end up shaking all over.

It's been a while since I've even thought about this, but if I recall you might be able to get reflectors mounted on a stand with a simpler altitude azimuth movement.  It just moves side to side and up and down.  Like a little refracting telescope.  Point it where you want it kind of deal.  Maybe that's something to consider.

Maybe see if there are some videos online of how to set up an EQ mount.  They are complex things in their own right.  Just think about whether you want to go through all of that every time you want to use it.  And unless you want to spend big bucks for high quality motorized mounts and equipment for photography where you need to track objects I just don't think they are that necessary.

Also realize that a lot of the time it is hard to predict viewing conditions.  Depending on where you live you might rely more on spur of the moment opportunities.

So yea, maybe Dobsonian isn't perfect.  If you plan on working from grass or dirt maybe a reflector with a simpler up/down left/right stand mount is in order.  They are less common with reflectors, but I think you can get that kind of set up.





Do you mind if I get your opinion on some scopes in a private message? I have some picked out and questions, if thats okay. I would be outside on grass/dirt most of the time because of where I live, also, my area is pretty good for viewing, a lot less light pollution so clear skies and good views are pretty common at my house.


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OfflineAllGreyThumbs
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Re: buying a telescope [Re: Herbologist]
    #20777166 - 10/31/14 01:26 PM (9 years, 3 months ago)

I don't mind, but I'm no expert by any means. I bought one smallish scope and a few lenses, and played around with it for a while.  I actually haven't used it in a couple years.  There might be people that are into astronomy as a hobby and know way more than me.

But if you still want to you can ask.  In fact this has gotten me to thinking that I should maybe just buy a new mount since that's my biggest issue.  So perhaps it's time to get refamiliarized with this stuff.

Of course it also almost the weekend and I don't have quite the time at home as I do at work.  Can't just sit around reading about telescopes and posting on the Shroomery you know.  But if you PM, I will look around and get back to you at some point.


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OfflineHerbologist
Grrratata
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Registered: 05/09/10
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Re: buying a telescope [Re: AllGreyThumbs]
    #20777196 - 10/31/14 01:35 PM (9 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

AllGreyThumbs said:
I don't mind, but I'm no expert by any means. I bought one smallish scope and a few lenses, and played around with it for a while.  I actually haven't used it in a couple years.  There might be people that are into astronomy as a hobby and know way more than me.

But if you still want to you can ask.  In fact this has gotten me to thinking that I should maybe just buy a new mount since that's my biggest issue.  So perhaps it's time to get refamiliarized with this stuff.

Of course it also almost the weekend and I don't have quite the time at home as I do at work.  Can't just sit around reading about telescopes and posting on the Shroomery you know.  But if you PM, I will look around and get back to you at some point.





yeah, understandable.  I am not on shroomery when im at home unless Ive posted a thread like this..

Ill shoot you a :pm: and if you can help me, awesome. if not its all good :thumbup:


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OfflineHerbologist
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Re: buying a telescope [Re: Herbologist]
    #20777321 - 10/31/14 02:25 PM (9 years, 3 months ago)



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InvisibleShockValue
Because, ShockValue.

Registered: 11/18/08
Posts: 5,097
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Re: buying a telescope [Re: Herbologist]
    #20777771 - 10/31/14 04:57 PM (9 years, 3 months ago)

I find the "go to" functionality on my scope (and like the Orion listed above) to be nice.  It does add setup time to a viewing session (takes me about 15 minutes to set up my scope now that I've had practice) but it makes moving between objects very very fast.

Some old-schoolers would call it cheating, but as long as I'm seeing cool shit up in the sky, I don't think it matters how you got there.


Plus, you can interface it with your computer if you want and drive it through astronomy programs.    This was really nice for me as my set is so old the database of objects was limited.  The computer control gets around this issue.

However, Alt-Az tracking like this is OK for moon and very bright object photography, but deep space dim objects really need an Equitorial mount.


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InvisibleDieCommie

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Re: buying a telescope [Re: Herbologist]
    #20777942 - 10/31/14 05:48 PM (9 years, 3 months ago)

I like the Equitorial mount best.  It actually tracks the movement of the sky and you can find objects easily using their right ascension and declination because their declination doesn't change as the earth turns.

I don't think the scopes you posted are overpriced.  They are cheap, for sure.  The eyepieces are often a part that is neglected for quality.


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OfflineHerbologist
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Re: buying a telescope [Re: DieCommie]
    #20787760 - 11/03/14 11:44 AM (9 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

ShockValue said:
I find the "go to" functionality on my scope (and like the Orion listed above) to be nice.  It does add setup time to a viewing session (takes me about 15 minutes to set up my scope now that I've had practice) but it makes moving between objects very very fast.

Some old-schoolers would call it cheating, but as long as I'm seeing cool shit up in the sky, I don't think it matters how you got there.


Plus, you can interface it with your computer if you want and drive it through astronomy programs.    This was really nice for me as my set is so old the database of objects was limited.  The computer control gets around this issue.

However, Alt-Az tracking like this is OK for moon and very bright object photography, but deep space dim objects really need an Equitorial mount.




I dont think of it as cheating, Im all for taking advantage of the motorized mount/tracking abilities.  I am going to get one like that.


Quote:

DieCommie said:
I like the Equitorial mount best.  It actually tracks the movement of the sky and you can find objects easily using their right ascension and declination because their declination doesn't change as the earth turns.

I don't think the scopes you posted are overpriced.  They are cheap, for sure.  The eyepieces are often a part that is neglected for quality.





I went ahead and decided to get a mount like that.  I am getting a Celestron Nextar 130SLT, with a 2x Barlow lens and collimator eye piece for $424.  The celestron is the #1 telescope on the top 10 list for beginner scopes, and Amazon has it for $360 instead of $499.

http://telescopes.toptenreviews.com/telescopes-for-beginners-review/celestron-nexstar-130slt-review.html



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OfflineHerbologist
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Re: buying a telescope [Re: Herbologist]
    #20805661 - 11/07/14 12:33 PM (9 years, 3 months ago)

Finally received my Celestron Nexstar 130 SLT on Wednesday.  The first night was all about just setting it up and reading the manual and stuff, I looked at the moon and got a great pic through my cell phone.  I didn't manage to get Sky Align to work, it kept saying Alignment Failed, it was getting cold out so I went inside.

Thursday night, I waited all damn day to take it outside.  Finally took it out at 10pm and the moon was full and bright with clear skies, the full moon really dimmed out a lot of the stars, I could only see main bright stars like Orion, Altair and Capella.

Alignment was a success after my first try with SkyAlign, I had it look at M103, I couldnt see anything.  Not even a spot on the eye piece.  So that was dissapointing.  I then decided to do a "Sky Tour" and chose Andromeda Galaxy.  The telescope began rotating and spun all the away around then starting going upwards.  The telescope went almost completely vertical then FUCKING BAM the dovetail mount failed and the telescope crashed into the cement on my drive way.

I was so fucking pissed, I had just assembled the thing and not done shit and somehow the ONE screw that holds the tube came loose.  Everything was rocked so hard, every screw came loose.  I had to tighten everything and collimate my mirrors all over again.

After all that, I took the telescope back outside and re aligned it ( Match confirmed ), I had it point at a star in the computer, it slewed over and stopped, it wasn't aligned.  So, then I tried the Moon, the telescope slewed towards the moon then stopped like 6 inches short.

What a bummer.  SkyAlign was completely inaccurate.  My finderscope is like 99% aligned, the stock one is cheap and I have it aligned the best it can be.

Anyone else experience SkyAlign being inaccurate?  It was so off the from the Moon and it said I had succesfully aligned the telescope.  Any suggestions?  This was a huge disappointment..  I haven't viewed one Nebula, star cluster, galaxy, nothing.


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InvisibleShockValue
Because, ShockValue.

Registered: 11/18/08
Posts: 5,097
Loc: Tipping at windmills.
Re: buying a telescope [Re: Herbologist]
    #20817144 - 11/10/14 12:00 AM (9 years, 3 months ago)

Does it have a built in GPS on this model?  If not, does it ask for your location, date, time etc?


--------------------
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OfflineHerbologist
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Registered: 05/09/10
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Re: buying a telescope [Re: ShockValue]
    #20818109 - 11/10/14 10:02 AM (9 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

ShockValue said:
Does it have a built in GPS on this model?  If not, does it ask for your location, date, time etc?




It does not, but I can always buy a GPS for this model.

It does however ask for my location, date and time.  Ive entered all that.  I have even put it in my exact coordinates at to where I am.

I managed to get it fairly accurate, I told it to look at Jupiter again and it slewed over and stopped almost right on it, but I still had to adjust because Jupiter was off in the far top left corner of my eye piece.

So it's shown that it can be I guess 90-99% accurate.  Although, not accurate all the time is kind of a waste.

The Nexstar computer and the motorized mount adds a lot of cash to the price.  If I didnt care about the computer/motor I could get a Orion Dobsonian XT8 for the same price:
http://www.optcorp.com/orion-skyquest-xt8-classic-dobsonian-telescope.html?gclid=CjwKEAiA4YGjBRDOxa3XvfTnvSASJACC3bLBSCP9opvQgkEoXOUUZBIdNLdMnnKuIjl-x2Gyz87sdBoCA1bw_wcB



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InvisibleShockValue
Because, ShockValue.

Registered: 11/18/08
Posts: 5,097
Loc: Tipping at windmills.
Re: buying a telescope [Re: Herbologist]
    #20818144 - 11/10/14 10:12 AM (9 years, 3 months ago)

Getting in the eyepiece is about as close as you are going to get with these things.  But after you find what you are looking for, a quick tweak to get it centered is pretty easy.

KEEPING it in the eyepiece once it's in there is the important part.

With that size of a scope, things like Andromeda etc will be a very faint grey smudge.  Maybe with a little more brightness in the center if you're looking on a nice clear dark night.

With my 5", this is what m13 and m81 look like with some stacked longer exposure pictures.    It's much dimmer with just the naked eye though the eyepiece.



--------------------
  • When we built temples to view the stars, we knew about all 2000 of them.


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OfflineHerbologist
Grrratata
I'm a teapot


Registered: 05/09/10
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Last seen: 3 years, 2 months
Re: buying a telescope [Re: ShockValue]
    #20818225 - 11/10/14 10:29 AM (9 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

ShockValue said:
Getting in the eyepiece is about as close as you are going to get with these things.  But after you find what you are looking for, a quick tweak to get it centered is pretty easy.

KEEPING it in the eyepiece once it's in there is the important part.

With that size of a scope, things like Andromeda etc will be a very faint grey smudge.  Maybe with a little more brightness in the center if you're looking on a nice clear dark night.

With my 5", this is what m13 and m81 look like with some stacked longer exposure pictures.    It's much dimmer with just the naked eye though the eyepiece.







With my 5" thats about what I get but less detail, cant even see the cluster or a glow around them.  All the messiers and other clusters just look like 1 bright star without any detail.

Is it really that big of a pain to keep things in the eye piece?  Ive never owned a telescope so having the tracking ability is pretty nice even if I haven't fully experienced it yet.

Does this 8" dobsonian even offer that much more then the 5''?


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