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OfflineZahid
Stranger
Registered: 01/21/02
Posts: 4,779
Last seen: 19 years, 5 months
Jessica Lynch Criticizes U.S. Accounts of Her Ordeal
    #2079260 - 11/07/03 12:16 AM (20 years, 4 months ago)

Jessica Lynch Criticizes U.S. Accounts of Her Ordeal
By DAVID D. KIRKPATRICK

Published: November 7, 2003

In her first public statements since her rescue in Iraq, Jessica Lynch criticized the military for exaggerating accounts of her rescue and re-casting her ordeal as a patriotic fable.

Asked by the ABC News anchor Diane Sawyer if the military's portrayal of the rescue bothered her, Ms. Lynch said: "Yeah, it does. It does that they used me as a way to symbolize all this stuff. Yeah, it's wrong," according to a partial transcript of the interview to be broadcast on Tuesday.
Advertisement

After months of retreating from the news media, Ms. Lynch will be a ubiquitous presence next week. In addition to her appearance on ABC, she will be on the cover of Time magazine, and NBC will broadcast a movie based on an Iraqi's account of her ordeal. On Tuesday, the book publisher Knopf will release an account of her experience, "I Am a Soldier, Too," written with her cooperation by a former reporter for The New York Times, Rick Bragg.

The book and the movie are unrelated and tell different versions of Ms. Lynch's story, but the publisher has timed the book to capitalize on publicity from the television movie.

The book has already added another, lurid indignity to the public accounts of her capture. It reports that Ms. Lynch's military doctors found injuries consistent with sexual assault and unlikely to have resulted from the Humvee crash that caused her other wounds, suggesting that she was raped after her capture. Ms. Lynch, who was unconscious immediately after the crash, does not remember any such assault, according to people who have talked to her and read the book. Those details of the book's contents were reported yesterday in The New York Daily News.

In the book and in the interviews, Ms. Lynch says others' accounts of her heroism often left her feeling hurt and ashamed because of what she says was overstatement.

At first, a military spokesman in Iraq told journalists that American soldiers had exchanged fire with Iraqis during the rescue, without adding that resistance was minimal. Then the military released a dramatic, green-tinted, night-vision video of the mission. Soon news organizations were repeating reports, attributed to anonymous American officials, that Ms. Lynch had heroically resisted her capture, emptying her weapon at her attackers.

But subsequent investigations determined that Ms. Lynch was injured by the crash of her vehicle, her weapon jammed before she could fire, the Iraqi doctors treated her kindly, and the hospital was already in friendly hands when her rescuers arrived.

Asked how she felt about the reports of her heroism, Ms. Lynch told Ms. Sawyer, "It hurt in a way that people would make up stories that they had no truth about. Only I would have been able to know that, because the other four people on my vehicle aren't here to tell the story. So I would have been the only one able to say, yeah, I went down shooting. But I didn't."

And asked about reports that the military exaggerated the danger of the rescue mission, Ms. Lynch said, "Yeah, I don't think it happened quite like that," although she added that in that context anybody would have approached the hospital well-armed. She continued: "I don't know why they filmed it, or why they say the things they, you know, all I know was that I was in that hospital hurting. I needed help."

Lt. Col. Rivers Johnson, a spokesman for the Department of Defense, declined to comment on Ms. Lynch's views. But he said, "Essentially, the mission to rescue Jessica Lynch demonstrated America's resolve to account for all of its missing service members." He added that the rescue had been conducted under the appropriate procedures for a fluid situation like the war in Iraq. "You always plan for the worst."

Ms. Lynch also disputed statements by Mohammed Odeh al-Rehaief, the Iraqi lawyer, that he saw her captors slap her.

"From the time I woke up in that hospital, no one beat me, no one slapped me, no one, nothing," Ms. Lynch told Diane Sawyer, adding, "I'm so thankful for those people, because that's why I'm alive today."

Jeff Coplon, who helped Mr. Rehaief write his book, "Because Each Life is Precious," said it was possible that both he and Ms. Lynch were telling the truth in their divergent accounts.

"One of the questions that could arise in the wake of this kind of trauma is that someone could believe they remember everything and their memory could still be incomplete," Mr. Coplon said.

Link


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InvisibleXochitl
synchronicitycircuit
Registered: 07/15/03
Posts: 1,241
Loc: the brainforest
Re: Jessica Lynch Criticizes U.S. Accounts of Her Ordeal [Re: Zahid]
    #2080379 - 11/07/03 08:53 AM (20 years, 4 months ago)

speaking of which, anyone notice the hypocrisy of the conservatives when it comes to the new NBC TV show Saving Jessica Lynch? In regards to the Reagan docu-drama, they cried historical inaccuracy (which may be true) and demanded censorship. But when it comes to Saving Jessica Lynch and the false portrayal of events that will be included in this TV show, they havent said a word.



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As we know, there are known knowns. There are things we know we know. We also know there are known unknowns. That is to say we know there are some things we do not know. But there are also unknown unknowns, the ones we don't know we don't know.

-Donald Rumsfeld 2/2/02 Pentagon

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Invisibleafoaf
CEO DBK?
 User Gallery

Registered: 11/08/02
Posts: 32,665
Loc: Ripple's Heart
Re: Jessica Lynch Criticizes U.S. Accounts of Her Ordeal [Re: Xochitl]
    #2080393 - 11/07/03 08:58 AM (20 years, 4 months ago)

shameless, it's all horribly shameless.

I still don't understand why everyone
tries looking at reagan through such rose
colored glasses.


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All I know is The Growery is a place where losers who get banned here go.

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Invisiblez@z.com
Libertarian
Registered: 10/13/02
Posts: 2,876
Loc: ATL
Re: Jessica Lynch Criticizes U.S. Accounts of Her Ordeal [Re: Xochitl]
    #2080671 - 11/07/03 10:51 AM (20 years, 4 months ago)

I always suspected that Jessica Lynch's story was blown way out of proportion. No real suprise there.

In regards to the Reagan docu-drama, they cried historical inaccuracy (which may be true) and demanded censorship.

No one demanded censorship. They simply said we don't like what you are doing and we will stop supporting your business if you air that. Its not censorship. No one forced CBS to take it off the air. They simply did what all businesses do and catered to their customers.


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"Of all tyrannies, a tyranny exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It may be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end, for they do so with the approval of their own conscience." - C.S. Lewis

"I would rather be exposed to the inconveniencies attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." - Thomas Jefferson

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InvisibleXochitl
synchronicitycircuit
Registered: 07/15/03
Posts: 1,241
Loc: the brainforest
Re: Jessica Lynch Criticizes U.S. Accounts of Her Ordeal [Re: z@z.com]
    #2080716 - 11/07/03 11:09 AM (20 years, 4 months ago)

Again, if conservatives are so concerned with the historical accuracy of the major television dramas, then why havent there been any calls for "boycotts" (or whatever nice term you chose) of NBC's sponors for the promotion and production of the Saving Jessica Lynch story? This new docu-drama is bound to be as inaccurate and spiced up as CBS's depiction of the Reagans.

The reasons for the called "boycott" of CBS included:

1) historical inaccuracy
2) insensitivity towards the ill Reagan

Now, how is this different than Saving Jessica Lynch? The story that NBC will portray is highly inaccurate (towing the politicized propaganda originally put forth by the Pentagon/State Department), and Lynch herself is still alive and dealing with her supposed rape.

Why the double standard? Why the hypocrisy?


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As we know, there are known knowns. There are things we know we know. We also know there are known unknowns. That is to say we know there are some things we do not know. But there are also unknown unknowns, the ones we don't know we don't know.

-Donald Rumsfeld 2/2/02 Pentagon

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Anonymous

Re: Jessica Lynch Criticizes U.S. Accounts of Her Ordeal [Re: Xochitl]
    #2080723 - 11/07/03 11:11 AM (20 years, 4 months ago)

if conservatives are so concerned with the historical accuracy of the major television dramas, then why havent there been any calls for "boycotts" (or whatever nice term you chose) of NBC's sponors for the promotion and production of the Saving Jessica Lynch story?

i know i won't be watching it. good luck convincing mainstream america and the show's sponsors.

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Invisiblez@z.com
Libertarian
Registered: 10/13/02
Posts: 2,876
Loc: ATL
Re: Jessica Lynch Criticizes U.S. Accounts of Her Ordeal [Re: Xochitl]
    #2080728 - 11/07/03 11:13 AM (20 years, 4 months ago)

They are calling for boycotts against that Reagan show because it portrays one of their heros in a bad and perhaps innaccurate light. I doubt it has much to do with historical inaccuracy


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"Of all tyrannies, a tyranny exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It may be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end, for they do so with the approval of their own conscience." - C.S. Lewis

"I would rather be exposed to the inconveniencies attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." - Thomas Jefferson

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InvisiblePsiloKitten
Ganja Goddess

Registered: 02/12/99
Posts: 1,617
Re: Jessica Lynch Criticizes U.S. Accounts of Her Ordeal [Re: afoaf]
    #2081058 - 11/07/03 01:06 PM (20 years, 4 months ago)

I was watching some cable in the classroom thing about regan. It was frightening. That man is a fundamentalist christian like none other. He was racist and paranoid. He had no business being in office. Mentally, psychologically.

Just like, when you are Head of the CIA, you dont get to be president. I think that is a gross conflict of interests. A tangent.. because Im tremendously high and I think when you are high, you shouldnt get too politcal.

The line between blatent censorship and vague PC is getting dimmer and dimmer.


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OfflineDoctorJ
Male

Registered: 06/30/03
Posts: 8,846
Loc: space
Last seen: 1 year, 4 months
Re: Jessica Lynch Criticizes U.S. Accounts of Her Ordeal [Re: PsiloKitten]
    #2081156 - 11/07/03 01:35 PM (20 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

if conservatives are so concerned with the historical accuracy of the major television dramas, then why havent there been any calls for "boycotts" (or whatever nice term you chose) of NBC's sponors for the promotion and production of the Saving Jessica Lynch story?




Because they aren't concerned with historical accuracy, they are concerned with staying in power. And they are willing to use coercion to do it. Another sign that profit worship doesn't always lead to the moral right.

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Offlinemonoamine
umask 077(nonefor you)

Registered: 09/06/02
Posts: 3,095
Loc: Jacksonville,FL
Last seen: 18 years, 6 months
Re: Jessica Lynch Criticizes U.S. Accounts of Her Ordeal [Re: DoctorJ]
    #2081234 - 11/07/03 02:06 PM (20 years, 4 months ago)

It's too bad the Reagan can't even remember how much of a piece of shit he is.


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People think that if you just say the word "hallucinations" it explains everything you want it to explain and eventually whatever it is you can't explain will just go away.It's just a word,it doesn't explain anything...
Douglas Adams

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Invisiblesilversoul7
Chill the FuckOut!
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Registered: 10/10/02
Posts: 27,301
Loc: mndfreeze's puppet army
Re: Jessica Lynch Criticizes U.S. Accounts of Her Ordeal [Re: PsiloKitten]
    #2081454 - 11/07/03 03:34 PM (20 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

PsiloKitten said:
I was watching some cable in the classroom thing about regan. It was frightening. That man is a fundamentalist christian like none other. He was racist and paranoid. He had no business being in office. Mentally, psychologically.



From what I've heard, he wasn't all that religious himself, but he pandered to those people. Racist? Maybe a little bit. Paranoid? Not as much as Nixon, but ya, I suppose he was a little bit.

Quote:

Just like, when you are Head of the CIA, you dont get to be president. I think that is a gross conflict of interests. A tangent.. because Im tremendously high and I think when you are high, you shouldnt get too politcal.



I don't think Reagan was ever in the CIA. You're probably thinking of Bush, Sr.


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"It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong."--Voltaire

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OfflinePhluck
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Re: Jessica Lynch Criticizes U.S. Accounts of Her Ordeal [Re: silversoul7]
    #2081505 - 11/07/03 03:59 PM (20 years, 4 months ago)



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"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us

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Invisibleafoaf
CEO DBK?
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Registered: 11/08/02
Posts: 32,665
Loc: Ripple's Heart
Re: Jessica Lynch Criticizes U.S. Accounts of Her Ordeal [Re: monoamine]
    #2081795 - 11/07/03 05:38 PM (20 years, 4 months ago)

comedy.

he doesn't, but I'm sure Nancy does...


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All I know is The Growery is a place where losers who get banned here go.

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Invisibleadrug

Registered: 02/04/03
Posts: 15,800
Re: Jessica Lynch Criticizes U.S. Accounts of Her Ordeal [Re: silversoul7]
    #2081921 - 11/07/03 06:26 PM (20 years, 4 months ago)

If I'm not mistaken, Reagan occassionally got policy advice from his wife's astrologer.

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OfflineZahid
Stranger
Registered: 01/21/02
Posts: 4,779
Last seen: 19 years, 5 months
Re: Jessica Lynch Criticizes U.S. Accounts of Her Ordeal [Re: z@z.com]
    #2081939 - 11/07/03 06:32 PM (20 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

z@z.com said:

No one demanded censorship. They simply said we don't like what you are doing and we will stop supporting your business if you air that. Its not censorship. No one forced CBS to take it off the air. They simply did what all businesses do and catered to their customers.




Extortion is force with semantics.



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Invisiblesilversoul7
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Registered: 10/10/02
Posts: 27,301
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Re: Jessica Lynch Criticizes U.S. Accounts of Her Ordeal [Re: adrug]
    #2081940 - 11/07/03 06:32 PM (20 years, 4 months ago)

Correct. Also, during press conferences, he would only call on reporters who were wearing red. Eventually everyone in the room started wearing red.


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"It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong."--Voltaire

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InvisibleEvolving
Resident Cynic

Registered: 10/01/02
Posts: 5,385
Loc: Apt #6, The Village
Re: Jessica Lynch Criticizes U.S. Accounts of Her Ordeal [Re: Zahid]
    #2082560 - 11/07/03 10:17 PM (20 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Zahid said:
Extortion is force with semantics.



Please explain.

How come if some from a leftist political persuasion organize a boycott or related public action, they are exercising their rights, but when some from the right do the same thing it is censorship?

Can you say hypocrisy?


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To call humans 'rational beings' does injustice to the term, 'rational.'  Humans are capable of rational thought, but it is not their essence.  Humans are animals, beasts with complex brains.  Humans, more often than not, utilize their cerebrum to rationalize what their primal instincts, their preconceived notions, and their emotional desires have presented as goals - humans are rationalizing beings.

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Invisiblesilversoul7
Chill the FuckOut!
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Registered: 10/10/02
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Re: Jessica Lynch Criticizes U.S. Accounts of Her Ordeal [Re: Evolving]
    #2082613 - 11/07/03 10:42 PM (20 years, 4 months ago)

Whenever you ASSUME, you make an ASS out of U and ME.


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"It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong."--Voltaire

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InvisibleEvolving
Resident Cynic

Registered: 10/01/02
Posts: 5,385
Loc: Apt #6, The Village
Re: Jessica Lynch Criticizes U.S. Accounts of Her Ordeal [Re: silversoul7]
    #2082617 - 11/07/03 10:45 PM (20 years, 4 months ago)

What exactly is your point? (I don't want to assume anything)


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To call humans 'rational beings' does injustice to the term, 'rational.'  Humans are capable of rational thought, but it is not their essence.  Humans are animals, beasts with complex brains.  Humans, more often than not, utilize their cerebrum to rationalize what their primal instincts, their preconceived notions, and their emotional desires have presented as goals - humans are rationalizing beings.

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Invisiblesilversoul7
Chill the FuckOut!
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Registered: 10/10/02
Posts: 27,301
Loc: mndfreeze's puppet army
Re: Jessica Lynch Criticizes U.S. Accounts of Her Ordeal [Re: Evolving]
    #2082649 - 11/07/03 11:03 PM (20 years, 4 months ago)

You assume that he subscribes to such a double-standard when you have no proof that he does.


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"It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong."--Voltaire

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InvisibleEvolving
Resident Cynic

Registered: 10/01/02
Posts: 5,385
Loc: Apt #6, The Village
Re: Jessica Lynch Criticizes U.S. Accounts of Her Ordeal [Re: silversoul7]
    #2082691 - 11/07/03 11:15 PM (20 years, 4 months ago)

Sometimes people's words give us clues that prompt us to question their reasoning. I did request an explanation and used the word 'some.' You could have assumed my questions were intended to prompt everyone to think, then your assumption would have been correct.


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To call humans 'rational beings' does injustice to the term, 'rational.'  Humans are capable of rational thought, but it is not their essence.  Humans are animals, beasts with complex brains.  Humans, more often than not, utilize their cerebrum to rationalize what their primal instincts, their preconceived notions, and their emotional desires have presented as goals - humans are rationalizing beings.

Edited by Evolving (11/07/03 11:20 PM)

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InvisiblePsiloKitten
Ganja Goddess

Registered: 02/12/99
Posts: 1,617
Re: Jessica Lynch Criticizes U.S. Accounts of Her Ordeal [Re: silversoul7]
    #2082783 - 11/07/03 11:44 PM (20 years, 4 months ago)

I wasnt speaking about Regan. I said a comment about him and then I made a seperate comment.

I think pretty much everyone here is versed enough to know who I was talking about.

Perhaps it was confusing.


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InvisiblePsiloKitten
Ganja Goddess

Registered: 02/12/99
Posts: 1,617
Re: Jessica Lynch Criticizes U.S. Accounts of Her Ordeal [Re: silversoul7]
    #2082813 - 11/07/03 11:51 PM (20 years, 4 months ago)

Reagan wasnt a religious man?

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/amex/reagan/filmmore/reference/interview/nancyreagan01.html

Nancy Reagan on:
What Religion Meant to her Husband

Well he has a deep belief in God and that everything happens for a reason, which we may not understand at the time it happens but that God has a plan for each of us and you know you begin to think that really someone is looking out for him. In Sacramento, when he was first sworn in it was a gray day and as he stepped up to the podium to give his speech, the clouds parted and the sun shone. When he finished, the clouds went back together. The same thing happened in Washington. And after the shooting, the next morning, there was a rainbow over the White House, so and just the shooting itself, he said to Cardinal Cook, I know that God was sitting on my shoulder.


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InvisiblePsiloKitten
Ganja Goddess

Registered: 02/12/99
Posts: 1,617
Re: Jessica Lynch Criticizes U.S. Accounts of Her Ordeal [Re: PsiloKitten]
    #2082824 - 11/07/03 11:59 PM (20 years, 4 months ago)

In October 1983, Ronald Reagan leaned over to Tom Dine, the Israel lobby leader, and said: "You know, I turn back to your ancient prophets in the Old Testament and I find myself wondering if we're the generation that's going to see that come about. I don't know if you've noticed any of those prophecies recently, but believe me, they certainly describe the times we're going through."

http://www.salon.com/books/it/1999/12/24/templeton/

I like this quote too:
In June 1989, Ronald Reagan said, "Information is the oxygen of the modern age. It seeps through the walls topped by barbed wire, it wafts across the electrified borders. ... The Goliath of totalitarianism will be brought down by the David of the microchip."


OMG I forgot about all this great Reagan stuff. The Reagan Doctrine.. what a gem that was. Here is an article with Issac Asimov's opinion on it.
http://www.positiveatheism.org/hist/asimov.htm

Some time ago, Ronald Reagan pointed out that one couldn't trust the Soviet government because the Soviets didn't believe in God or in an afterlife and therefore had no reason to behave honorably, but would be willing to lie and cheat and do all sorts of wicked things to aid their cause. Naturally, I firmly believe that the president of the United States knows what he is talking about, so I've done my very best to puzzle out the meaning of that statement.

Let me begin by presenting this "Reagan Doctrine" (using the term with all possible respect): "No one who disbelieves in God and in an afterlife can possibly be trusted." If this is true (and it must be if the president says so), then people are just naturally dishonest and crooked and downright rotten. In order to keep them from lying and cheating every time they open their mouths, they must be bribed or scared out of doing so. They have to be told and made to believe that if they tell the truth and do the right thing and behave themselves, they will go to heaven and get to plunk a harp and wear the latest design in halos. They must also be told and made to believe that if they lie and steal and run around with the opposite sex, they are going to hell and will roast over a brimstone fire forever.

...snip

Oh and this speech about Israel and our Judeo Christian national bonds... gotta love it!
http://members.aol.com/VFTINC/history/Reagan.htm

And let me assure you, we will never attempt to impose a solution on Israel, nor will we ever weaken in our opposition to terrorism by the PLO or by anybody else. As I said when I addressed you in 1980, terrorists are not guerillas or commandos or freedom fighters or anything else. They're terrorists, and should be identified as such. We will go on working with all our hearts to help the people of the Middle East achieve a just and lasting settlement--a settlement that agrees, in the words of my statement of September 1982, that Israel "has a right to exist in peace behind secure and defensible borders, and it has a right to expect its neighbors to recognize this."

When I spoke to you 4 years ago, peace was eluding the Middle East. It still does. But now we and the State of Israel have far greater cause for hope.

Today the United States is rebuilding its defenses, and that is restoring confidence in our leadership and making the parties more willing to take risks for peace. Today the United States has re-energized its vast and productive economy, and that will help to make Israel more prosperous. And today the United States has stopped wringing its hands apologetically and once again begun to play its rightful role in the world with faith, confidence, and courage. And that means Israel can depend on us.

We who are friends of Israel may differ over tactics, but our goal remains always unchanged--permanent security for the people of that brave State. In this great enterprise, the United States and Israel stand forever united. And as we approach the Jewish holiday of Rosh Hashanah, let us pray that the new year will be a Shanah Tovah Umetukah--a good and sweet year for both America and Israel.

For make no mistake: In a world where so many are hostile to freedom, where millions live in poverty and oppression, those few nations who share the light of liberty must stand together. If we do not, we take the awful chance that the darkness will overwhelm us one by one. But standing together, we can pierce the darkness and shed our light over all the Earth.

Thank you. God bless you all.

Closing remarks of second inaugural address:
It is the American sound. It is hopeful, big-hearted, idealistic, daring, decent, and fair. That's our heritage; that is our song. We sing it still. For all our problems, our differences, we are together as of old, as we raise our voices to the God who is the Author of this most tender music. And may He continue to hold us close as we fill the world with our sound--sound in unity, affection, and love--one people under God, dedicated to the dream of freedom that He has placed in the human heart, called upon now to pass that dream on to a waiting and hopeful world.

God bless you and may God bless America.


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Edited by PsiloKitten (11/08/03 01:25 AM)

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Offlinemonoamine
umask 077(nonefor you)

Registered: 09/06/02
Posts: 3,095
Loc: Jacksonville,FL
Last seen: 18 years, 6 months
Re: Jessica Lynch Criticizes U.S. Accounts of Her Ordeal [Re: adrug]
    #2082934 - 11/08/03 01:03 AM (20 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

If I'm not mistaken, Reagan occassionally got policy advice from his wife's astrologer.




Carl Sagan used to rip him a new asshole about that all the time.


--------------------
People think that if you just say the word "hallucinations" it explains everything you want it to explain and eventually whatever it is you can't explain will just go away.It's just a word,it doesn't explain anything...
Douglas Adams

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InvisiblePsiloKitten
Ganja Goddess

Registered: 02/12/99
Posts: 1,617
Re: Jessica Lynch Criticizes U.S. Accounts of Her Ordeal [Re: PsiloKitten]
    #2083200 - 11/08/03 05:08 AM (20 years, 4 months ago)

Indeed, it is an incontrovertible fact that all the complex and horrendous questions confronting us at home and worldwide have their answer in that single book.
? Ronald Reagan
The King James Bible, Newsweek, Dec. 27, 1982 p.46

One of Reagan's radio addresses:
What would you say if someone decided Shakespeare's plays, Charles Dicken's novels, or the music of Beethoven could be rewritten & improved?
I'll be right back. . .

Writing in the journal "The Alternative", Richard Hanser, author of The Law & the Prophets and Jesus: What Manner of Man Is This?, has called attention to something that is more than a little mind boggling. It is my understanding that the Bible (both the Old & New Testaments) has been the best selling book in the entire history of printing.

Now another attempt has been made to improve it. I say another because there have been several fairly recent efforts to quote "make the Bible more readable & understandable" unquote. But as Mr. Hanser so eloquently says, "For more than 3 1/2 centuries, its language and its images, have penetrated more deeply into the general culture of the English speaking world, and been more dearly treasured, than anything else ever put on paper." He then quotes the irreverent H. L. Mencken, who spoke of it as purely a literary work and said it was, "probably the most beautiful piece of writing in any language."

They were, of course, speaking of The Authorized Version, the one that came into being when the England of King James was scoured for translators & scholars. It was a time when the English language had reached it's peak of richness & beauty.

Now we are to have The Good News Bible which will be in, "the natural English of everyday adult conversation." I'm sure the scholars and clergymen supervised by the American Bible Society were sincerely imbued with the thought that they were taking religion to the people with their Good News Bible, but I can't help feeling we should instead be taking the people to religion and lifting them with the beauty of language that has outlived the centuries.

Mr. Hanser has quoted from both the St. James Version & the Good News Bible some well known passages for us to compare. A few thousand years ago Job said "How forcible are right words!" [Job 6:25] The new translators have him saying "Honest words are convincing." That's only for openers. There is the passage [Eccl. 1:18], "For in much wisdom is much grief: and he that increaseth knowledge increaseth sorrow". Is it really an improvement to say instead, "The wiser you are, the more worries you have; the more you know the more it hurts."

In the New Testament, in Mathew, we read "The voice of the one crying in the wilderness. Prepare ye the way." [Matthew 3:3] The Good News version translates that, "Someone is shouting in the desert. Get the road ready." It sounds like a straw boss announcing lunch hour is over.

The hauntingly beautiful 23rd Psalm is the same in both versions, for a few words, "The Lord is my shepherd" but instead of continuing "I shall not want" we are supposed to say "I have everything I need."

The Christmas story has undergone some modernizing but one can hardly call it improved. The wondrous words "Fear not: for; behold, I bring you good tidings of great joy" has become, "Don't be afraid! I am here with good news for you."

The sponsors of the Good News version boast that their Bible is as readable as the daily paper ? and so it is. But do readers of the daily news find themselves moved to wonder, "at the gracious words which proceeded out of his mouth"? Mr. Hanser suggests that sadly the "tinkering & general horsing around with the sacred texts will no doubt continue" as pious drudges try to get it right. "It will not dawn on them that it has already been gotten right."

This is Ronald Reagan. Thanks for listening.


? aired September 6, 1977

http://www.av1611.org/kjv/reagan.html


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Invisibleafoaf
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Registered: 11/08/02
Posts: 32,665
Loc: Ripple's Heart
Re: Jessica Lynch Criticizes U.S. Accounts of Her Ordeal [Re: PsiloKitten]
    #2083633 - 11/08/03 10:19 AM (20 years, 4 months ago)

"terrorists are not guerillas or commandos or freedom fighters
or anything else. They're terrorists"

that's a real gem.

reagan should be personally thanked for his wonderful
efforts in the first war on terrorism.

I wonder if it was his inability to address these people
as something more than just 'terrorists' that led to the
repeated targeting of US interests in the middle east
and ultimately the downing of Pan Am 103.

I feel like we're taking the same path today.

instead of addressing their grievances, we vilify, discredit,
malign and misrepresent the enemy.


--------------------
All I know is The Growery is a place where losers who get banned here go.

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InvisiblePsiloKitten
Ganja Goddess

Registered: 02/12/99
Posts: 1,617
Re: Jessica Lynch Criticizes U.S. Accounts of Her Ordeal [Re: afoaf]
    #2083924 - 11/08/03 12:36 PM (20 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

instead of addressing their grievances, we vilify, discredit,
malign and misrepresent the enemy.





But that is the American way.


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OfflineDoctorJ
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Posts: 8,846
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Last seen: 1 year, 4 months
Re: Jessica Lynch Criticizes U.S. Accounts of Her Ordeal [Re: PsiloKitten]
    #2084314 - 11/08/03 02:49 PM (20 years, 4 months ago)

what is the official definition of terrorism?

I remember back in the 90's hearing that the definition of "terrorist" is a group or person who uses fear, violence, and threats to get their way.

If that is true, doesnt that make all governments "terrorist" in a way?

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InvisibleEvolving
Resident Cynic

Registered: 10/01/02
Posts: 5,385
Loc: Apt #6, The Village
Re: Jessica Lynch Criticizes U.S. Accounts of Her Ordeal [Re: DoctorJ]
    #2084342 - 11/08/03 03:01 PM (20 years, 4 months ago)

Yes.


--------------------
To call humans 'rational beings' does injustice to the term, 'rational.'  Humans are capable of rational thought, but it is not their essence.  Humans are animals, beasts with complex brains.  Humans, more often than not, utilize their cerebrum to rationalize what their primal instincts, their preconceived notions, and their emotional desires have presented as goals - humans are rationalizing beings.

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Invisiblecarbonhoots
old hand

Registered: 09/11/01
Posts: 1,351
Loc: BC Canada
Re: Jessica Lynch Criticizes U.S. Accounts of Her Ordeal [Re: DoctorJ]
    #2084439 - 11/08/03 03:40 PM (20 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

I remember back in the 90's hearing that the definition of "terrorist" is a group or person who uses fear, violence, and threats to get their way.






I think more than certain governments are guilty of that. I'm sure every one of us has used that tactic to get their way at some point in their life.

Corporations regularly use that tactic...especially now that democratic law has been trumped with "free trade" agreements.

"unless you submit to worse working conditions, lower environmental protection and lower taxes, we're gonna move all the capital to China,(Thialand, Mexico, the southern USA, etc) then you'll have nothing. So what will it be? Nothing or something (pathetic)
Sound familiar?

Of course it helps to point out that these terrorist corporations are not suffering, no usually they are fabulously rich, they just want to make even more money at the expense of those actually doing the work to produce the wealth.


--------------------
  -I'd rather have a frontal lobotomy than a bottle in front of me

CANADIAN CENTER FOR POLICY ALTERNATIVES

Edited by carbonhoots (11/08/03 03:46 PM)

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InvisibleEvolving
Resident Cynic

Registered: 10/01/02
Posts: 5,385
Loc: Apt #6, The Village
Re: Jessica Lynch Criticizes U.S. Accounts of Her Ordeal [Re: carbonhoots]
    #2084492 - 11/08/03 04:01 PM (20 years, 4 months ago)

Tell us what corporations in the U.S. are using violence and not violating the law.


--------------------
To call humans 'rational beings' does injustice to the term, 'rational.'  Humans are capable of rational thought, but it is not their essence.  Humans are animals, beasts with complex brains.  Humans, more often than not, utilize their cerebrum to rationalize what their primal instincts, their preconceived notions, and their emotional desires have presented as goals - humans are rationalizing beings.

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Invisibleafoaf
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Registered: 11/08/02
Posts: 32,665
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Re: Jessica Lynch Criticizes U.S. Accounts of Her Ordeal [Re: Evolving]
    #2084550 - 11/08/03 04:28 PM (20 years, 4 months ago)

I'm not trying to cover for carbonhoots, but how
could they use violence without violating the law?


--------------------
All I know is The Growery is a place where losers who get banned here go.

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InvisibleEvolving
Resident Cynic

Registered: 10/01/02
Posts: 5,385
Loc: Apt #6, The Village
Re: Jessica Lynch Criticizes U.S. Accounts of Her Ordeal [Re: afoaf]
    #2084727 - 11/08/03 05:43 PM (20 years, 4 months ago)

They can't. For him to equate corporations operating legally with terrorists is sheer idiocy.


--------------------
To call humans 'rational beings' does injustice to the term, 'rational.'  Humans are capable of rational thought, but it is not their essence.  Humans are animals, beasts with complex brains.  Humans, more often than not, utilize their cerebrum to rationalize what their primal instincts, their preconceived notions, and their emotional desires have presented as goals - humans are rationalizing beings.

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InvisiblePsiloKitten
Ganja Goddess

Registered: 02/12/99
Posts: 1,617
Re: Jessica Lynch Criticizes U.S. Accounts of Her Ordeal [Re: Evolving]
    #2084927 - 11/08/03 07:10 PM (20 years, 4 months ago)

Hrmm.

Here is another Jessica Lynch story where she says the pentagon used her.

Im enlightened and NED is a fucking marketing think tank. That's what I have to say.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/Iraq/Story/0,2763,1081207,00.html


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