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InvisibleSkorpivoMusterion
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Bi-Polar...are YOU Bi-Polar?
    #2069560 - 11/04/03 07:29 AM (13 years, 1 month ago)

Sometimes I think its all just a fuckin big SCAM. The psychology of the human mind is very complex with countless intricacies...that it is easily able to get "tangled" up into its own web of fallacies, beliefs, psyches, mindsets, etc etc. Basically, what I'm saying is, one could easilly simply be depressed for a very SPECIFIC reason, such as an event that was never resolved in the past, or something in their physical world that is continously perpetuating their unhappiness, and depressive sadness....and not even be AWARE Of it! But...no, they just KNOW that they are unhappy, but they don't know WHY. Sometimes the answers are even RIGHT IN FRONT OF THEM!! Sometimes it's because they dont get enough excercise and don't drink plenty of water, or have a miserable sex life, etc etc. But, like I mentioned above about the intricate and complex mind, they are too often easilly misled and believing that something out of their reach is wrong with them...so they go to the doctors, and then the doctors, of COURSE They don't know anything about their lives enough to say "Hmmm..well, gee, maybe its THIS or THAT, I dont think you're Bi-Polar." SO, needless to say, they're gonna just shuttup and prescribe you some damn zoloft and some damn prozac and be on their merry way, and let you turn into an emotion-less, pill-popping zombie. Cuz that just their way of saying "We give up, we don't know, but here, take this, at least you wont feel sad no more, OH and you wont be feeling super happy either too tho, or any other real human emotion." Benjamin Franklin said it best: "A good doctor knows the worthlessness of the vast majority of medicines."
So, until someone can TRULY say, that they have achieved EVERYTHING they want in life, until they can TRULY say that they HAVE everything that they REALLY WANT in life, until they can say that they are completely content with their family and friends, until they can say that they are FINALLY satisfied with themselves, and thier lives, until they can say that they are TAKING GOOD CARE of their body and mind, until they can say that they are HAPPY with their jobs and careers.......AND STILL, feel like they're bi-polar....STILL feel unhappy, for some "unknown reason"...only THEN, will I truly, and fully believe in Bi-Polarism.
Don't get misdiagnosed....too many people already do, and because of that...these are what their doctors look like:


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Coffee should be black as hell, strong as death, and sweet as love.


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OfflineSeussA
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Re: Bi-Polar...are YOU Bi-Polar? [Re: SkorpivoMusterion]
    #2069588 - 11/04/03 08:27 AM (13 years, 1 month ago)

When I was in school, one of the classes I took was abnormal psychology. The prof was very good and had a private practice on the side... he taught for the fun of teaching. The one thing that he kept stressing was the idea that most mental problems are physical. We would look at a case, and all the symptoms that went with it, and then try to figure out what was wrong. In 9 out of 10 cases we looked at, there was a physical medical issue that was resulting in a mental problem. One person had a tick (parasite) that was causing some kind of mental distress. Another one was starting to get diabetes, etc.

The moral of the story is that it is easy to prescribe a pill to fix a symptom. It is much more difficult to figure out what the problem is and to fix that instead.


--------------------
Just another spore in the wind.


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OfflineKremlin
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Re: Bi-Polar...are YOU Bi-Polar? [Re: Seuss]
    #2070327 - 11/04/03 06:44 PM (13 years, 1 month ago)

I feel what you are saying about psychology possibly being a scam, but i know for myself (being diagnosed as cyclothymic and a psychology major, neuroscience minor) that my moods, if left unmedicated/regulated, swing in irregular patterns that are not connected to life events that i am conscious of.

Sure, sometimes there are very obvious reasons, and id believe that in order to avoid working on the intricacies, people would rather choose to deny them and take meds to solve the problem.

I trust the man who diagnosed me, i have seen him almost my entire life, and we both feel (he never diagnoses without asking me) that my swings, milder than most mind you, have some form of extra-motivation behind them....biological mainly.

I've never been one to hop into meds for relief, i hate having to take them, it's a pain in my ass, so i feel that. BUT, i have felt my life without the help of them, and id rather have the annoyance.

I used to sit there and say that psychologists just throw a label on anything different to fortify their positions and keep social control...but i dont believe that anymore. Seeing what i have seen of some patients firsthand, there is no denying that something was wrong with those people, something that was definately too far from the norm to be safe without medications and therapy.

My main issue is that we live in a pill-popping society that likes to solve problems fast by using medications. I dont agree with this, medications help manage the problems, but i take plenty of time to introspect and to watch & judge my actions with the guidance of people and myself.

I dont feel that my life is going in any negative directions, on the contrary everything is going right...i'm getting the education i want, with plans and a possible future in a graduate program that i want. SO, i wont jock up my negative affect to being related to life-angst...ive passed that teen angst a few years ago, good riddance to it!

--Kremlin


--------------------
"Human suffering has been caused because all too many of us cannot grasp that words are only tools for our use, and that the mere presence of a word in the dictionary does not mean it necessarily refers to something definitive in the real world"
--Richard Dawkins, "The Selfish Gene"

"It is the mind which creates the world about us, and even though we stand side by side in the same meadow, my eyes will never see what is beheld by yours."
-George Gissing

"Without a firm idea of himself and the purpose of his life, man cannot live, and would sooner destroy himself than remain on earth, even if he was surrounded by bread."
--Fyodor Dostoevsky


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OfflineNiamhNyx
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Re: Bi-Polar...are YOU Bi-Polar? [Re: Kremlin]
    #2070638 - 11/04/03 08:17 PM (13 years, 1 month ago)

If bipolar is a scam than stuff like Oppositional Defiance Disorder most definitly are. The symptoms include having a problem with authority, breaking rules, disrespecting authority figures...

I'm pretty sure I've got that one, me and just about every other person who's ever had a thought of thier own.


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OfflineGrandpa
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Re: Bi-Polar...are YOU Bi-Polar? [Re: NiamhNyx]
    #2070874 - 11/04/03 09:17 PM (13 years, 1 month ago)

bipolar?

Nope, just crazy.


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I don't intend for this to take on a political tone. I'm just here for the drugs.
--Nancy Reagan, former First Lady


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Offlineiamhimheisme
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Re: Bi-Polar...are YOU Bi-Polar? [Re: Grandpa]
    #2071162 - 11/04/03 10:24 PM (13 years, 1 month ago)

the trouble is that there are new 'disorders' created out of things like having a problem with authority. the shit some people come up with is ridiculous. and since when are you truly depressed if you've felt unhappy for two weeks? two weeks is nothing, and even at a reasonable cut of date, it doesnt imply a chemical imbalance. im not really in state good for thinking, but this shit pisses me off so i felt i had to respond


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Offlineentiformatie
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Re: Bi-Polar...are YOU Bi-Polar? [Re: NiamhNyx]
    #2071488 - 11/04/03 11:50 PM (13 years, 1 month ago)

lmfao! yer fuckin shitting me right?! oppositional defiance disorder?! "Quick, give this kid some thorazine! He knows more than his teacher and isn't afraid of him!"

i never believed in add or adhd either... or mebbe they exist... but misdiagnosis is definitely a fuckin problem

Quote:

NiamhNyx said:
If bipolar is a scam than stuff like Oppositional Defiance Disorder most definitly are. The symptoms include having a problem with authority, breaking rules, disrespecting authority figures...

I'm pretty sure I've got that one, me and just about every other person who's ever had a thought of thier own.




--------------------
/opinion
.sean


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InvisibleSkorpivoMusterion
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Re: Bi-Polar...are YOU Bi-Polar? [Re: entiformatie]
    #2071564 - 11/05/03 12:13 AM (13 years, 1 month ago)

Oh, and about that...ADHD, ADD, etc...here's a very good quote from RadioActiveSlug, on the subject of it:

Quote:

RadioActiveSlug said:

Its a bunch BS, its a made up thing.
It has to do with your brain developing. Since kids are brought up on TV, video games, and computers their brains develop differently than those who weren't. They have shorter attention spans. People with ADD apparently can process lots of data much quicker than those without, but take data in at a slower rate.

Its only called a disorder because those who made up the name, didn't have it, but what it really is, is just humans forming a symbiosis with their digital enviorment.

Is really sad, they have all kinds of drugs to make the brain NOT work the way it was developed to so that kids can continue to be uniformly educated like in the past. These drugs (ritalin, adderall(sp?), etc have terrible side effects (i should know)




Agreed.




--------------------
Coffee should be black as hell, strong as death, and sweet as love.


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OfflineNiamhNyx
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Re: Bi-Polar...are YOU Bi-Polar? [Re: SkorpivoMusterion]
    #2071727 - 11/05/03 01:18 AM (13 years, 1 month ago)

Most of the "disorders" are simply ways to trivialize the thoughts and motivations of people that don't fit the mold. If someone has a disfunctional brain how can thier ideas be of any value?

All of these personality disorders are products of the ill environment we've created for ourselves. They are of our own making, and some of them are quite possibly a necessary and essentially positive reaction to a culture that has become unliveable.

I'd like to go see a psychologist and see what labels I'd be given. I'd wear them with a sense of sarcastic pride.

Here's a link to my favourite joke http://www.4troubledteens.com/odd.html

and here are the symptoms!

Is your teen:
Hostile
Negative
Defiant
Oppositional
Pessimistic
Aggressive
Argumentative
Angry
Resentful
Low frustration level
Accusatory
Unreasonable
Blaming
Spiteful
Vindictive
Bad temper
Foul-mouthed

What teen isn't, at least for a period of time... I'm pretty sure we all go through it.


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Invisibleadrug

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Re: Bi-Polar...are YOU Bi-Polar? [Re: NiamhNyx]
    #2071746 - 11/05/03 01:27 AM (13 years, 1 month ago)

A friend's younger brother, 11 years old, was just placed on 40 mg of amphetamine salt a day for treatment of add. He dumped that shit down the toilet.


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Offlinemonoamine
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Re: Bi-Polar...are YOU Bi-Polar? [Re: NiamhNyx]
    #2071774 - 11/05/03 01:35 AM (13 years, 1 month ago)

I got labled with schizotypal personality disorder because I made the mistake of discussing psychedelic use and eastern religious thought with my shrink. Me thinks if I was a good little christian and discussed going to church and eating the body of christ,I would have been labled "religious" instead.


--------------------
People think that if you just say the word "hallucinations" it explains everything you want it to explain and eventually whatever it is you can't explain will just go away.It's just a word,it doesn't explain anything...
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Offlinemonoamine
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Re: Bi-Polar...are YOU Bi-Polar? [Re: SkorpivoMusterion]
    #2071794 - 11/05/03 01:41 AM (13 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

It has to do with your brain developing. Since kids are brought up on TV, video games, and computers their brains develop differently than those who weren't. They have shorter attention spans. People with ADD apparently can process lots of data much quicker than those without, but take data in at a slower rate.




That's a good explanation. There is such an information overload,our brains can't handle it,and thus it's impossible to have good attention spans all the time.

My whole take on psychiatry is that chemical imbalances really do exist,there are just way too many moronic doctors that see everything as pathology. And in it's current technological state,doctors have no way of accurately diagnosing these imbalances.

I've read most of the DSM-IV (psychiatrist's bible),and I'm reasonable sure that everyone I've ever met probably has a "disorder" if you take it literally (which many doctors do).


--------------------
People think that if you just say the word "hallucinations" it explains everything you want it to explain and eventually whatever it is you can't explain will just go away.It's just a word,it doesn't explain anything...
Douglas Adams


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Offlinemonoamine
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Re: Bi-Polar...are YOU Bi-Polar? [Re: adrug]
    #2071805 - 11/05/03 01:45 AM (13 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

A friend's younger brother, 11 years old, was just placed on 40 mg of amphetamine salt a day for treatment of add




That seems like a very large dose for someone that I'm assuming has a relatively small body weight.


--------------------
People think that if you just say the word "hallucinations" it explains everything you want it to explain and eventually whatever it is you can't explain will just go away.It's just a word,it doesn't explain anything...
Douglas Adams


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OfflineDavid_Scape
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Re: Bi-Polar...are YOU Bi-Polar? [Re: NiamhNyx]
    #2071846 - 11/05/03 02:07 AM (13 years, 1 month ago)

"All of these personality disorders are products of the ill environment we've created for ourselves. They are of our own making, and some of them are quite possibly a necessary and essentially positive reaction to a culture that has become unliveable."

This idea must have some merit. Ignoring the possibility of genetic predispostions to certain mental problems, you still get a direct reflection of a persons predicament in his personality and brain. I wouldnt blame society specifically, but more The Human Predicament and Human Nature (if possible to *blame* them). Society is our enviroment now, and if your not busy working and living in it, then you should be busy changing it. I for one, strongly believe that the major problems of society(and people) today are the ideas people have about themselves and human nature in general. While you can think of psychology or psychiatric drugs as ways 'the man' tries to constrict your behavior to conform to society, IT cannot do that if you dont have personal goals IN society. And everybody here probably has goals with society. Also... it'd be rather foolish to try to generalize a large group of people to such a conspiracy, because like any group of people, every individual will have their own opinions, beliefs and intentions.


--------------------
focusing
Flow
The Enneagram


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OfflineDavid_Scape
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Re: Bi-Polar...are YOU Bi-Polar? [Re: SkorpivoMusterion]
    #2071926 - 11/05/03 02:34 AM (13 years, 1 month ago)

to the radioactive slug quote.
Perhaps fast paced stimulus has something to do with ADD, i wouldnt know, im not a neuroscientist. However, he talks as if whatever develops naturally in the brain is A-okay, this is misleading. Veitnam war vets with PTSD developed it 'naturally', and i'd hardly call that fun or good. While this example sounds more serious, it still applies.

And stimulants (adderal at least i can personally vouch for), do not have horrible side effects at prescribed dosages. It can induce psychosis in some people, but so can mushrooms and ciggerettes.


--------------------
focusing
Flow
The Enneagram


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Offlinemonoamine
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Re: Bi-Polar...are YOU Bi-Polar? [Re: David_Scape]
    #2071959 - 11/05/03 02:49 AM (13 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

And stimulants (adderal at least i can personally vouch for), do not have horrible side effects at prescribed dosages.




Everybody is different. Some people can develop paranoid psychosis from just medical doses,and it's not extremely rare either.

There's nothing wrong with making people feel better through psychiatric drugs,but the wrong ones can seriously fuck you up. And it's when doctors see you for 15 minute med checks,they can miss things and interpret outward behavior as postive when the person is a wreck inside (think of Thorazine calming down schizophrenics).

Quote:

Perhaps fast paced stimulus has something to do with ADD, i wouldnt know, im not a neuroscientist. However, he talks as if whatever develops naturally in the brain is A-okay, this is misleading. Veitnam war vets with PTSD developed it 'naturally', and i'd hardly call that fun or good. While this example sounds more serious, it still applies.




I think ADD can possibly be a positive adaptation though (it can certainly be negative too),like people with PTST developing amnesia of certain events.


--------------------
People think that if you just say the word "hallucinations" it explains everything you want it to explain and eventually whatever it is you can't explain will just go away.It's just a word,it doesn't explain anything...
Douglas Adams


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OfflineKremlin
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Re: Bi-Polar...are YOU Bi-Polar? [Re: monoamine]
    #2075099 - 11/05/03 11:27 PM (13 years, 1 month ago)

in response to the DSM-IV comment, most doctors who are knowledgeable know that it is out of date in todays world, and use it as a reference with flexible guidelines.

I wont disagree that alot of the symptoms are a result of our society, but saying that doesnt accomplish anything..we still have the problem, and if it works for people, then more power to it.

You cant hold the entire practice at fault for the doctors who are incompetant..blame the institutions that gave them their credentials.
everyone has had bad experiences with shrinks, ive had plenty of them, but i wont say that the entire institution is bullshit just because of that, ive had too many positive encounters with it to write it off so quickly.
In any practice or job you will always have your hypocrites who have the titles but dont care, singling out one and saying its bull because of that is in itself, bull.
The fact that you, monoamine, were diagnosed with schitzotypal personality disorder for having a conversation is ludicrous, and the doctor who did that should be slapped around...but when you view the people who are correctly diagnosed by quality doctors who have a good sense of when to flex the rules, you see why they are labeled that way.

just my opinion at least.
--Kremlin


--------------------
"Human suffering has been caused because all too many of us cannot grasp that words are only tools for our use, and that the mere presence of a word in the dictionary does not mean it necessarily refers to something definitive in the real world"
--Richard Dawkins, "The Selfish Gene"

"It is the mind which creates the world about us, and even though we stand side by side in the same meadow, my eyes will never see what is beheld by yours."
-George Gissing

"Without a firm idea of himself and the purpose of his life, man cannot live, and would sooner destroy himself than remain on earth, even if he was surrounded by bread."
--Fyodor Dostoevsky


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