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Noaidi Registered: 10/18/10 Posts: 2,627 Loc: EU Last seen: 7 years, 5 months |
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Hello.
This thread are those who grow columnar cacti or plants what needs much of sun light. And radiation what comes from sun is not only light. Human feel sun light as warmth at skin and eyes see the waves what are light. Heat waves cannot be seen, they can be obviously feel only. They who don't know, it is long time known that heat and light are same thing, they comes as "waves" and color of light is different wave length and so on.. However I want to tell my discovery about windowsill, etiolation and light. As what I have witness, heat waves are not so much talked with etiolation and only topic for that is amount of light, but there can be much more important in heat waves too combined to light what effects the growth thickness of cacti in general. So this is for indoor growers with windowsill and what they commonly encounter is etiolation of columnar cactus plants. This thread is not so important to outdoor growers who use sun what radiates enough heat and light. But some windows(modern day windows) in arctic zones are not so easily penetrating the heat from sun than older windows and this is one factor why cactus can grow very nicely if window is old only 1 or 2 layer window. Before in here north has been used only two glass where is air in the middle so it is very effective way to keep heat indoors at winter and today there are used also 3 layer windows so there is two air pockets what are very effective to separate outdoor and indoor temperatures. I have recently just discovered that light is only one part of etiolation and another factor is temperature. It is a fact that in windowsill can be plenty of light but if temperature is not enough cactus keeps growing etiolated. Light and heat waves are actually quite same but light is visible to human eye. I have picture to show and this is happened by accidentally. Originally San pedro cactus in picture has been a 3- 4inch tip cutting with etiolation. Planted there and etiolation has continued. I know this environment and so on so do not argue with me that cactus started to grow fat after got some heigh, no.. It is stopped etiolation till it started to got accidentally heat by laying on lamp reflector. So this san pedro stopped etiolation in windowsillas picture very well can show. These small fluoro bulbs usually generate the heat above and light below cause they still generate heat but warm air rise up so that's why after growth tip of cactus has grown over the light and started to get heat what comes from 15watt light reflector cause light will generate heat and warm it a bit. Cactus has just simply grown over the light, and started to get fat just right there where these reflectors are "hot" and generate heat. When etiolted cactus started to get same light as before but with that more heat than normally indoors have in arctic zone it has get fat like there is more sun. Also spines started to grow with heat waves. So for me this explain lots what I have been understand wrong before and I think many of you has not been think that sun gives heat and light radiation, also HPS/MH light bulbs gives heat and light radiation similar to sun. What I realized to witness this is that etiolation is not so obvious and simple related to light. Ofc cactus what get sun light inside the house from window it is warm and actually heat waves with light are almost as important to get cactus out from etiolation(or winter grow cause lack of heat with light) When you think to be in warm place where sun feels like it burn your skin, combination of strong sun and heat makes the perfect "waves" for cactus to grow. It needs heat like any other organism and plant to grow and usually that comes with sun light. Windowsill is different and window can block heatwaves and let only light in and only when sun shines straight to window, cactus can grow good by getting these heat waves what comes trough window but they are not so easily comes trough compared to light. I know cause in here outdoors can be at spring time -20C or even -35C and still indoors temperature with modern day windows is +18C from +25C(some people like it cooler) and windows made especially good heat blockers to houses in here arctic zone and are not so cold when touched inside even temperature difference is 40-60C.. And moders arctic build window glasses do not get concentrated water indoors ever difference is so much cause of multi-layering. However, enough of writing and it is time to show photos what has happened. This cactus has been grown there all the time and it is cuttings from me to my friend and this is happened at my friends house and gets my attention after she said that cactus started to get when lamp reflector gives support to etiolated cutting. This is picture from Cactus stopped etiolation and started to grow nice spines and fat AFTER it grows over the light and started to get heat: See the shape of reflector and material is aluminium so it is quite warm: Heat what rise above and are more than room temperature causes cactus grows like it has got more light even light amount is not changed dramatically, even it seems so. That cactus has been on windowsill since small cutting.. The fat growth with nice spines are really seen that is is caused by the heat of light cause I know there is no other factors like more light or so. San pedro cactus has been grown etiolated until it grows over the light and when actually light level goes down and heat up, etiolation stopped radically. Look the picture, etiolation has stopped to grow and cactus starts to get thickes and grow spines like in sun when it started to take support from light reflector. Light bulb has effected actually "opposite" cause under fluoro light etiolation has been continued. There is picture from top of same cactus: So light level has actually decreased and warm heat has increased after cactus started to take support from warm reflector. However as you can see in first picture it is fluoro light what will not generate so much heat but they will generate heat small amounts and it will rise up. Cool air comes down. So even small 15Watt fluoro light generate geat and warm the reflector of it. Only thing what I can think of this accidentally happened stop of etiolation even artificial light has not anymore effect the top of cactus. Only way it helps it it gives warm but not hot air rising from reflector and top of cactus will not get artificial light and actually light level has come down and heat comes up but not so much that it burn the cactus. One thing you guys should know too.. This san pedro will get sun light too trough window combined to artificial light but no matter how much light it has got, after the small light bulb reflector starts to give support and heat etiolation has stopped. This is actually for me very new discovery and no matter how much light cactus can get, if there is not enough heat like sun light have but much more. Etiolation with indoor cacti is not only caused by lack of light I think. Good growth of columnar cactus is somekind of balance with heat and light waves. Basically if temperature is cool and light amount if big, etiolation problems is not solved by increase the light if there is lack of heat waves. This is is still not proof that cactus can grow without light in heat but this proof clearly this: Balance between light and heat levels are important to cactus to grow it properly without etiolation. Warm climate growers with greenhouse or outdoors do not have to actually even know this but healthy growth of cactus(even with columnar trichocereus is combination of sun radiated heat and light. Some cactus in the wild will grow thin at winter and fat at summer and that is cause of winters cool temperature and light what force cactus to grow but it will etiolate not cause of light, cause of temperature and heat waves. So windowsill etiolated cactus can be this "winter growth" cause room temperature is not so good or modern energy saving windows blocks the heat comes from the sun or prevent heat escape out of house. My conclusion to etiolation is simple: Balance of heat and light wave radiation is the key to get cactus grow properly at windowsill or under artificial lights without natural light at all. Everyone knows what cactus (cuttings or not) in poor light and warm place will etiolate cause balance of heat and light radiation is not correct. I think there should no more be talk about etiolation only cause lack of light and there are much of evidence in wild columnar cactus too. I have not mixed cobulars to this cause this is same for them but visible of etiolation will be seen witn columnar cactus plants. Columnars has shown this for decades what I have discovered now and therefore actually etiolation is way more complex than lack of light. In the wild cactus have their "winter growth" cause of low temperature even the light amount is good. I hope some discussion about that topic but it seems that etiolation is failure of balance between light, heat and maybe nutrients too. Actually I have seen evidence of this long time but has not been able to connect them before I realize that light and heat are radiation and if balance of them are wrong, plants like columnar cactus will be grow etiolated. It may not try to "find light" it just grows cause temperature do not allow it to grow fat and everyone know that temperature(heat waves) effects to every living organism. So good light amount but etiolated grow may be indicate that cactus do not want to grow fat cause it has not energy like warmth to do that even light levels are "optimal" This is far more simple that anyone can think: low light and warmth are thin grow without green color, however thin grow with no pale green color indicates in to that the balance is not right between light and heat so cactus is at stage of so called "winter growth" ..only thing is, without light the growth is pale, with light but no heat growth is green but thin. Balance between these two are key to perfect columnar shape and spine formation. If someone has more to add in to my theory of balancing heat and light is the key to prevent etiolation. Write about it. Maybe that's why HPS/MH light bulbs are so good to get fat columnars cause they generate light and heat what cactus(or any plant) needs to grow. And one more, just look the picture from windowsill. Etiolation has really stopped after growth tip do not get light from fluoro, they will generate small amount of heat and heat makes cells work faster in plants obviously so light level can be lower if temperature is good. You can think cloudy warm day, less light but more heat at summer, good balance. But winter there is cold even light amount is actually proper to keep cactus grow thicker. Any indoor and windowsill grower should have known that there is two different types of etiolation. One is pale color and soft growth what indicates to lack of light so cactus receive heat waves but not light. IF Thin grow is normal color and not soft, there is lack of heat and new growth can be get by rising temperature for columnar cactus. However etiolated parts will stay etiolted but increasing light without heat is not solution for etiolation. If someone want to say anything opposite that there is no more than one type of etiolation, let us all know. I just wanted to post this cause I have understand reading trough internet that there is only one type of etiolation but I think there is two kind of etiolation and to fix this there has to be nice lovely balance with heat and light... I just want to share something I have discovered. I have been think this for long time but wanted to make sure before write my discovery and solution for problems what indoor/windowsill cultivars encounter with these columnar plants and maybe do wrong problem solving. Actually I have think this etiolation problems for years and it seems to occur with modern windows cause they are designed to keep heat inside the house in arctic region and there are usually two or three layers of glass. In older houses build at after WW2 at 40's. windows have only 2 layers and sun penetrate glass much better and opposite way these windows will leak warmth out easier at cold winter days. Houses with old windows with layers of 1 or 2, then windowsill grown are better and actually sun light feels more warm than compared to modern day windows. So if windowsill cactus gets southern many hours per day but window is designed for heat isolation there is problem that sun light is not warm enough. But no window can block all the heat but I have seen results from different houses, modern, old and starting to use heat pad for seedlings and also that accidentally fat grown san pedro gives me the answer I have been thinking long time about etiolaton of cactus. Balancing the heat and light is best way to keep columnar cactus growing. Visible light waves are only one side of a coin. And in light grown etiolated cactus are not soft and pale green, it is normal but cause lack of heat it doesn't have enough "power" to build fat grow in good light. In bad light and warm place cactus do not have that visible power to build green tissue. Balancing the non-visible heat waves and visible light-waves are not so easy in windowsill and it depends very much of window. If it's designed for maximum isolation there should be some kind of heat source to get the "balance" of these two important waves. I would want to talk about wave lengths of visible light and how tiny area of these human eye can see but plants can use, but it is not actually related to this. At the moment I build yesterday 550Watt HPS/MH +125Watt fluoro lights and bring few cacti of mine there under hot lights with day lenght of 18hours, then I have some cacti in greenhouse and my precious lophophoras and ariocarpus cactis are indoors at windowsill cause lophs will do fine at windowsill here, they are not so hungry for light than trichos. They are hungry for heat and I planned to buy heat pad under all my adult lophs too what I think is good cause they need heat more than light and windowsill can offer light to them. I cannot offer them as much heat as they native get in nature but that experiment goes later when I find out where I can get good but cheap heating pads. Then I put times to these so they get that cool night and warm day what seems to be important to cactus. This is still offtopic for this but when I get heating pads and so on, maybe I keep thin thread up without posting new ones. I Hope you get something information from this post even this is my speculation but I have research this by my self 2years and now this san pedro gives me answer for indoor growing and balancing these heat and light waves to get columnars grow nice. Also I have 3 different places where I grow my cacti now so I can get some data later, cacti grows slow so these things doesn't happen in a second or even in few months. Peace and have a nice summer
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shaman Registered: 08/19/12 Posts: 1,229 Loc: third eye Last seen: 9 years, 6 months |
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wow dude
![]() you really are a mad scientist, like nikola tesla of cactus
-------------------- All posts are entirely, 100%, conclusively false or complete works of fiction... but I can levitate lol "Any fool can criticize, condemn and complain and most fools do." Benjamin Franklin if I owe you seeds from a previous trade send me a PM, I will rectify my shortcomings and compensate you for your patience
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Untamed Registered: 05/09/13 Posts: 151 Last seen: 3 years, 19 days |
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Very interesting. Let us know how those heating pads work.
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Registered: 01/02/13 Posts: 161 Last seen: 8 years, 8 months |
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I skimmed your post as it seems to mostly follow ideas that I have applied with my indoor plants for quite awhile...
One thing I didnt see mentioned was that cacti, ime, seem to grow better with a temperature drop at night. If you are keeping your plants constantly warm some species will not grow as well as they with consistently fluctuating temperatures. Of course then there are other species who like to stay nice and warm all the time...but those dont seem to be hurt by the temperature variations that I allow for my plants. -------------------- ![]()
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Noaidi Registered: 10/18/10 Posts: 2,627 Loc: EU Last seen: 7 years, 5 months |
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I cannot let you know cause there is no heating pads with san pedro. I just made offtopic talk about heating pads growing lophophora to get day soil temperatures up and night down indoors. But it's not so related to my started topic about two kind of etiolation and elements what makes cactus grow.
I have had to learn, test, try and practice myself cactus cultivation in over there above arctic circle cause outdoor cultivation is hard. Mid-summer can be snow if wind blows from arctic sea and it's rainy, last time 20years ago there was snowing at midsummer, sun is shining all the time at mid-summer and day length changes ~6 minutes per day. After mid-summer day will get shorter that amount till mid-winter when it is total darkness, sun will not rise above horizon but there is some dusk last about 1-1,5 hours so about 23hours per day is total darkness. After mid-winter spring starts coming fast and before my self can even notice days are longer and when summer comes dark time of a day will disappear fast. Sunset and sunrise and long 2-3 hours cause sun will not go "down" at spring or fall. Sun will set/rise in very small angle towards north so that's why sun light are visible long and actual nature is totally different than even 2000-3000 kilometers south from there. Actually many people have to be year or two at arctic circle to understand totally how hard it is to get proper species to grow there and how hard it is to grow species like trichocereus here without artificial lights.. Trichocereus seems to need that small night time with temperature drop and hot day to get fat. So I have not made This is my local average day temperatures over year and rainfall. I just translated the text from my language, you should all still know from picture: So snow is in the ground ~7 months or in worst case 8 months. Indoor growing is only way cause even if I use greenhouse, I do not have money to build heated greenhouse and even money to buy electricity to keep year around plants alive in there cause minimum recorded temperature at winter has been almost -50C and greenhouse should be able to handle in worst case 1-1.3 meter(3-4feet) of snow and that much of snow will weight but anyway, snow is very good cover to keep native plants dormant without so serious frost bites. ..However this spring at May temperature record has been +31C and this kind of hot air has never been measured. Temperatures lasts about 3weeks without almost any rain but last year has not even one day over +20C.. So I have studied cactus species in general to see what is suitable for indoors and what is not. I have them in my friends windowsill my relatives windowsills and under artifial lights so I have just only started to collect information what is possible and what is not. Lophophora is only species indoors and maybe some easy flowering mammillaria and small cobular echinopsis what are able to flower indoors. Lophophora will flower for sure. If not normally, heat pads help that but it's another topic. This is about columnars and their etiolation what can be cause of cool temperature and not cause lack of light. I mean with that san pedro cactus cutting tip I have given to my friend. It has been always grow at that place, no where else. After the top grows over that small fluoro bulb and start to get support from that light on the table what generates heat, etiolation stopped and light level decreased. So if etiolation is caused only by the light this doesn't make sense and cells of the plant needs heat too to grow. Cold air will cause etiolation too, no matter how much light there is.. Practically only thing what has get that san pedro what is related to this topic to start grow without etiolation is radiating heat from light reflector cause as I said. Light level decreased and heat has increased. I estimate that this reflector are about +40C or more warm and cause heat rise up it will heat the cactus and light comes from window. IF Only light effects the etiolation, it should have start to grow before it reach heigh that small light and it's reflector there in pictures at first post. But etiolation stopped after heat increased and light decreased. That is the major thing what pays my attention and as I know light and heat are actually same "waves" but heat is not visible and only can be feel. Heat will help plants to grow fast and good with light. Pictures of that san pedro are from my friends windowsill and these lights are off at night and on when it is day so it get's heat at day and night it will be at room temperature. If I would have collected more data over past 2-3years I have think about this there would be much of evidence that there is two types of etiolation and one caused by lack of heat, one is cause lack of light. If these are not in balance cactus will etiolate. Etiolated growth in cool temperatures can look very "adult" but thin. With poor light etiolation is more like pale green color and soft. This is simple cause cuttings will etiolate if they are in too warm place and top of the plant is fked up. I know that too that if fat cactus have small roots and it starts to grow, it will not grow as fat as it is at the first, but that is not the case with that san pedro in pictures. I still want to remind that this fat grow has happened by accident and only thing what has changed in environment is that the cactus has started to grow above that light and got rising hot air as heat. Light amount is decreased and growth is changed. These things do not matter to these who grow cactus outdoors year around without serious frosts and long dark winters. Also I have one echinopsis (don't have take pictures) what has made much of offshoots. I have give the offshoots to different peoples. Best growth has happened in old house where is window facing south what has only two glasses and house is old from 1940 builded. Modern arctic windows are so effective to keep heat getting away and they have 3 layers of thick glass so that will reduce the sun light amount lots, also it will reduce the warmth of sun light compared to old build houses where windows are not so thick and sun radiation(heat, light and UV-light) will penetrate the window better and plants are growing much better without etiolation at these windows like my spread echinopsis plants has witnessed. First year I was confused cause I was just think about light and do not even cross my mind to think about all radiation what sun and high pressure sodium or metal halide lights release. I have actually keep trichos just cause they are growing fast and environmental changes can be seen very easy compared to lophophora and ariocarpus what are at very nice condition and I have kept them indoors at southern window.. Now they are at west window cause of this we repair this house and there is big build "stage"(don't know english word for it) but it used to paint the house so it block south window now. However This is also kinda of not related to topic. I am interested to study now about etiolation. Everyone know that the winter etiolation maby can prevented if plants got same heat than summer cause in their native habitat the day length is not so dramatic so the "balance" of light and heat disturbance cause slim growth. I have find out that worst etiolation is lack of light. So in constantly cool temperature with good light do not help to prevent columnar cactus to grow slim. Heat is energy what cactus needs so if there is lack of heat and good amount of light cacti do not concentrate to fat grow cause more important is to make tissue what is able to use light so etiolated dark green part is better in that kind of situation. What I am going go make sure that with cacti seems that more important is tissue with chlorophyll in skin so small amount of heat and good amount of light priority seems to be to cacti to grow rather etiolated grow with chlorophyll cause there is no energy(heat) to grow fat tissue with chlorophyll so it grows as thick as there is energy as form of heat waves. Worst etiolation happens with poor light and warm place cause there is energy(heat) to grow tissue but no light to produce chlorophyll in tissue. So light equals chlorophyll growth in tissue and heat equals tissue growth. If this balance is disturbed, etiolation will happen and wrong balance etiolation is worse cause it's without important chlorophyll. In my climate the "balance" of these sun or artificial equipment generated waves are wrong way and causes growth without chlorophyll in tissue at winter. These climates where cacti is native and winter winter etiolation is normal etiolation can be considered as winter growth so these two different etiolations maybe is not good to keep together cause if talking about heat and light balance there are actually two problems what causes etiolation. Usually balance is disturbed by lack of light and increasing light without get heat like sun light have both radiated as strong levels.. It seems that etiolated growth do not recover. Example is indoor san pedro with fluoro light. These lights will generate heat but it radiate upwards(away from cactus) and light is towards the cactus it doesn't matter how much fluoro light there are, san pedro cannot just simply grow without good heat waves. So there is available "heat bulbs" ..they are used to replace light so they radiate heat instead of light and maybe these facing in to cacti at window sill can give almost every waves what sun can offer straight to cactus skin. I don't have these heat bulbs yet, only heating pad for seedlings but I think to try windowsill grown by placing heat generating bulb near cactus and see can it give heat to windowsill cacti so they grow fat with non direct sun light. I don't know how many understand all of this what I have tested and done cause I have not documented all and this is my first "documentary" discovery about heat radiation and maybe it is not even studied cause where big gardens are these problems do not occur. However in nature this heat-light balance disturbance occurs only at winter when temperatures are low but still enough light. In here cacti are considered as indoor house plants and at summer there are enough light but no heat, in winter there are same heat or maybe more cause houses are heated and if no artificial light are available that "balance" will be very badly wrong and new growth is only tissue without chlorophyll. Summer growth is someway etiolated cause temperature will not rise when needs so much. I was think to buy heat bulb what are able to installed like normal light bulb but instead of light it will radiate heat so I use it at day time and at night time I do not use them. that should result fat growth. Cause of that san pedro in pictures has grow etiolated under light but get much better at top of the light so plant will got enough light from window, problem is that room temperature is not enough to get growth like it should. If etiolation really is only problem of light it should have grown fat where is light and started to grow thin again when it grows over light. Only difference is that these lights will not radiate heat below and normal room temperature is not enough to columnar in windowsill to grow without etiolation. It is growing season going on and I find out about these light bulb style heat radiators and if I have money for these I am going to test trichocereus at windowsill by using small heat radiator bulbs near the plants and see will this have effect to growth at windowsill without any lights, except light what comes from window. I need to study more but it really seems that windowsill light is enough to grow fatter and proper columnar cacti indoors if temperature is high enough cause at windowsill when sun is not shining temperatures are here +20C to +25C and if sun is shining trough the window, it doesn't heat house so much cause of here are windows and houses designed to be warm at winter. I would start testing right now but problem is that I do not have these heat bulbs what I can just let be somewhere near the cactus growth top. So this topic and my studied of etiolation seems that if indoor plants don't have enough heat during the day, chlorophyll containing etiolated growth continues. And these heat bulbs will not be need IF window glass is not so high quality and do not keep the radiating heat from sun outside and let heat comes inside too. When I have material about this and if I am want to buy one or two cheap heat bulbs what are just like light bulbs but generate heat waves instead of visible light waves. So these bulbs heat radiating heat can only be seen trough thermal camera. It doesn't mean that if something cannot be seen it doesn't exists. I think that tips of etiolation prevention needs more information that light have to be with heat. Maybe that's why commercial plants growers prefers HPS/MH lights cause they are really generating light, heat and UV-radiation? These light are best for growing plants and are around the world used by professional growers (no matter of plant) but they are only lights available for amount of money what imitates sun enough.. If these HPS/MH lights are shit, why professional growers prefers them in big industrial grown of plants? It is only light what I know what can be used for cactus and no need to worry of etiolation at all. Also cannabis growers prefers these lights cause of strength of light. I would want to try to proof that windowsill cactus can be grown with light what windowsill can offer without any visible "waves" like light is. That san pedro fat growth after it grows in to more shady but warmer place gives me spark to figure out whole indoor cactus cultivation. However the windowsill should be facing at least to east or west to give cacti some real sun but south facing windowsill is best and maybe only they need is extra heat wave radiator to success windowsill growth? This is a question still but I hope I can find out will heating the growth top of cacti let it grow fat with windowsill light cause what happened with that san pedro it seems that is the case and cacti needs more heat at windowsill to get used to lower level of light. I would compare this to "cloudy summer day" cause heating the growth top by radiating the heat to them maybe the key to let cactus needs less light in windowsill. I will find out cause of this san pedro what I know it only gets radiating heat from that small light reflector in to the growth top of the cactus. ![]() I don't even try to grow as big and nice columnar cacti what they are in nature but it seems that etiolation with chlorophyll is symptom of lack of heat instead of light. That's all. It will take time to get cactus grow so I cannot promise any results than this san pedro I show pictures to you what stopped etiolation by starting to get radiating heat from metal light reflector what is "hot" when lights are on. And that windowsill is not mine. San pedro is from me given as small cutting, and grown by friend and she mentioned that for some weird reason cactus started to grow fat after amount of light decreases and amount if heat rises. She lives almost as north as I but not above arctic circle so conditions are quite same. Only way to grow cacti is indoor growing and if shes accidentally heated growth top results something revolutionary, I will give credits to her. Shes etiolated san pedro just grows too long and after it started to take support of heat radiating light reflector whole plant seems to be it starts to get "real" light but only benefit is that waste heat what comes from reflector. There are nothing else environmental changes in shes indoor garden so that exciting me much of using small amount of radiating heat to growth tops of columns when grown indoor plants without proper lights. ![]() I promise results but it takes time cause cactus is not the fastest grower even if it's trichocereus so results can be seen after summer. I want to create similar conditions than garden table in picture from my friend and make a simple test will heat radiation help windowsill etiolated cactus to grow better even they got sun some time of a day but still room temperature seems to be not enough.
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Hi Registered: 02/03/13 Posts: 413 |
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I can't wait to see the results of your experiment once you've got your heat lamp and everything set up! I'm sure it'll help a lot of people in colder climates. The fact that you're even able to grow cactus in an environment like that is very impressive to me.
Off topic: The word you were looking for that you described as a "building stage" is "scaffolding"
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Noaidi Registered: 10/18/10 Posts: 2,627 Loc: EU Last seen: 7 years, 5 months |
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Thank you.
I am going to make soon in this topic peyote cultivation with heat pad in cold climates so it is possible to imitate summer days/night. Adults and seedlings with heat pad cause there is not enough warm places (only if sun is shining trough window. However. I have now only loph and arioccarpus indoors now. I am going to start use heat pads for adult lophs and ariocarpus too. I have just enough good table for them to make it. Trichos are under HPS/MH/fluoro mix at outdoor storage without window so they get 18hour day and 6hour night. "night" starts at 9PM, and day starts at 2AM. I don't know can I get result at this season cause I have apartment problems but I am trying. However this san pedro this is actually proof but maybe next summer is the time to try heating radiating bulbs. One vendor I look there are not them. In this climate, lophs and ariocarpus are best plants indoors. Columnars are hard. I find out that 24hour natural light in greenhouse is not good for tricho, they seems not to open stomata good. My growing lights will let them grow better and they are best lights cause they radiate almost same waves than sun. Also I have wide artificial light spectrum cause of 3 different bulbs for trichos. I hope I can get some results at fall but if winter comes. I cannot use sun, there is no sun at winter so experients will go to next season. What I am going to proof and trying to find out that I want to make some documentary to grow cactus good in cold cliimates indoors. So later it will help many people. I don't want to keep all things to my "own secret" I want to share my knowledge collected over years and this is just beginning. Later I hope i have big columns. In greenhouse I have bigger plants T. pasacana, T. Terschekii and some cobular/columnar style fat trichos. T. Pasacana and T. Terschekii will grow nice spines in greenhouse tho. San pedros and other for some reason grow like in worse windowsill in greenhouse when compare it to under professional greenhouse lights. Pics and results are coming when summer is over. Also result of adults lophs under heat pad(to get growth faster) is on way to test. I need to wait to get heat pads from mail. Now it is mid-summer holidays so mail will not come. +20 or +25C will not be good and root temperature +20C is not good to grow lophs what can tolerate hot desert temperatures. Results of this will be visible soon. I am sure that growth is going to be faster with heat pad no matter what size lophophora is. I have all size 1week old seedling to dozens of years old specimens. So later I continue! Now I have nothing more to say, need to wait cacti to grow. ![]() Peace to all and I hope that colder climate cacti growers who want to grow san pedro use as sacrament can get really plants where can be harvested plant tissue. I am sure and tested that etiolated growth what have chlorophyll but grown at cool temperature are as potent as fat growth. But dosage have to be measured by different way and this is not topic for that. I can say only for advice that normal dosage information is not proper for thin san pedro cactus preparation. I have no idea does san pedro contains alkaloids without light but with heat. without proper heat but good lights even growth is thin, there is "magic" for sure, I have been testesd it long time ago. Actually it needs just more length but what is usually been "known" the is still very less difference with fat and thin san pedro. Cannot say more.. This is not for that even I want to advice and learn to grow sacrament in cold climates. I have think to make whole documentary with pictures later when I have finished my long lasting test of grown cactus. I have not ingested plants for long time tho. But for sure I know lets call it "winter etiolation" is as potent as "summer growth" only difference is dosage advice and there are not that data exists. When I finish my work I can say more and make all information of growing and making sacraments.. this can last many years cause I need to grow plants from small cuttings so they are grown in north. I do not use tissue what is grown elsewhere so I can be very sure can sacraments grown more like "bonsai style" at windowsill without extra light but with extra heat. I have accomplished different specimens to grow 20-30cm per year. Usually cactus will double the growth per year, problem is I cannot use big container per one cactus cause this is kind of a indoor growing for sacramental purposes (also for decoration cause etiolated plants are ugly) Peace!
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Burner Registered: 05/30/14 Posts: 1,319 Last seen: 7 years, 7 months |
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Any updates to your experiments?
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Friend to all Registered: 01/18/13 Posts: 11,726 Loc: In heaven bored |
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![]() I'm interested in learning more about this.
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you really are a mad scientist, like nikola tesla of cactus





