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OfflineChopperDave
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Registered: 08/10/03
Posts: 177
Last seen: 19 years, 10 months
Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal?
    #2029062 - 10/21/03 02:39 PM (20 years, 3 months ago)

Ive always wondered this. Why exactly are they illegal? I understand why meth, crack, heroin, coke and the like are, because those really screw you up. But why mushrooms and marijuana?


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OfflineSeussA
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Re: Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal? [Re: ChopperDave]
    #2029076 - 10/21/03 02:43 PM (20 years, 3 months ago)



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Just another spore in the wind.


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OfflineInfrared
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Re: Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal? [Re: ChopperDave]
    #2029093 - 10/21/03 02:46 PM (20 years, 3 months ago)

fear of the unknown, and fear of not being able to control the masses.


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When chemistry is outlawed.. Only outlaws have chemistry:rainbowdrink:


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Offlinegnrm23
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Re: Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal? [Re: Infrared]
    #2029103 - 10/21/03 02:48 PM (20 years, 3 months ago)

psychedelics seem to make it possible for folks to practice thinking in, ummm, unapproved modalities...


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old enough to know better
not old enough to care


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OfflineChopperDave
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Re: Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal? [Re: gnrm23]
    #2029117 - 10/21/03 02:54 PM (20 years, 3 months ago)

So is that what it boils down to? The government is afraid of people thinking in differant (IE: Bad) ways, therefore they wouldnt be able to control them. Im asking because Im writing an essay on marijuana and psilocybin vs tobacco and alcohol. On a related note, anyone here been to Amsterdam? Whats it like there, since marijuana is legal there? How is the crime? Ive heard that you have a 70% chance of getting mugged whereever you go, but I highly doubt that...


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Offlinedibbles
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Re: Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal? [Re: ChopperDave]
    #2029231 - 10/21/03 03:33 PM (20 years, 3 months ago)

the govt says a lot that driving under certain influences will not be good, which of course isnt in a lot of cases, most of the laws and shit seemed to be bias against people that do stupid shit, the laws dont even touch upon responsible use, drug users make up a smaller percent of the population so instead the govt finds it easier to just shun it, they dont account for or care about the positive effects, because to them the detriments are all people doing stupid shit in a state of intoxication,that could hurt others, they dont care what you do to yourself, they never even admit positive uses, to them it doesnt matter at all, and a lot of politicians i would think personaly dont have a bias against drug reform, but alot of the older(gerneraly) politicians dislike drugs because of what has been instated in their heads, so because the newer thinkers may want drug reform, it would make them loose credibility, or at least thats what i think.


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You've succumb to an empty fate, your false prophets are gone, your life,meaningless, your heart and head broken, and we're all laughing.


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OfflineChopperDave
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Re: Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal? [Re: dibbles]
    #2029267 - 10/21/03 03:42 PM (20 years, 3 months ago)

dibbles, i was thinking the same thing you are, kinda. i believe US congressman would like to instate a drug reform, but by doing that they would lose credibilaty, and not get elected again.


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Offlinedibbles
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Re: Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal? [Re: ChopperDave]
    #2029356 - 10/21/03 04:06 PM (20 years, 3 months ago)

exactly something that everyone in society wants, and its even more of a big thing in upper society situations like in the govt, people dont want to be known as "that congressmen who is pro drugs"


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You've succumb to an empty fate, your false prophets are gone, your life,meaningless, your heart and head broken, and we're all laughing.


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InvisibleXochitl
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Loc: the brainforest
Re: Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal? [Re: ChopperDave]
    #2029502 - 10/21/03 04:48 PM (20 years, 3 months ago)

Historically, certain substances have made illegal for racist reasons in order to justify the discrimination of Chinese, Mexicans, and Blacks.

Mix racism, puritanism, and hysteria with a few ounces of misguided concern for others' wellbeing and then add in some authoritarian tendencies of the statist variety. Spice it up with big business profiteering and imperial tendencies of various world superpowers and their need for pretext and you have a sweet cake of Drug War. Fear of change and the eternal devotion to the status quo is a recommended frosting.



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As we know, there are known knowns. There are things we know we know. We also know there are known unknowns. That is to say we know there are some things we do not know. But there are also unknown unknowns, the ones we don't know we don't know.

-Donald Rumsfeld 2/2/02 Pentagon


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OfflineHarveyWalbanger
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Re: Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal? [Re: ChopperDave]
    #2029745 - 10/21/03 06:00 PM (20 years, 3 months ago)

Because they like drug dealers of course. How else would they make the biggest cashcrop of a country worth more than gold? Thin the heard, create a market where lots of money can be made cause of prohibition, and then employ police against your dealers whom reap the biggest and ripest ops. Liquify the dead to feed the living :smile:


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OfflineMickel
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Re: Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal? [Re: HarveyWalbanger]
    #2030281 - 10/21/03 08:25 PM (20 years, 3 months ago)

"Ive heard that you have a 70% chance of getting mugged whereever you go, but I highly doubt that... "

30 percent of all statistics are fictitious.


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OfflineStrongBad
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Re: Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal? [Re: Mickel]
    #2031829 - 10/22/03 09:08 AM (20 years, 3 months ago)

Do you know how many idiots, even on this board, who have dosed on shrooms and then driven? A lot. Smoke a cig and drive, then eat some shrooms and drive. Yeah, alcohol is bad for driving, but at least they have ways of testing for that on the spot. I don't want some punk ass 16 year old kid dosing on shrooms and driving around b/c it's sooo l33t fun, get pulled, shows up not drunk, so he goes on his way....right into my car.

There's other stuff you gotta think about. I think it should be legal to grow and use your own. I doubt they'll legalize the trafficking and flooding of the market of mushrooms.


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Invisibleafoaf
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Re: Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal? [Re: Xochitl]
    #2031873 - 10/22/03 09:27 AM (20 years, 3 months ago)

don't forget the profitability of prisons!


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All I know is The Growery is a place where losers who get banned here go.


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OfflineSin Bad
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Re: Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal? [Re: StrongBad]
    #2031893 - 10/22/03 09:33 AM (20 years, 3 months ago)

chopper,

Strickly speaking weed in Amsterdam is not legal, it has simply been decriminalised. This means that you are allowed to be in possession of small amounts, and you can sell small amounts also. Officially you are not allowed to smoke it everywhere, only in designated zones (ie certain coffee shops). It is still actually illegal to grow it on a large scale, although I presume there are many people doing this and a blind eye is turned.

There are a lot of head shops selling mushrooms, and I think peyote and san pedro cacti too, although I think they have made dried ones illegal to sell. You can also now buy freshly grown psilocybin mushrooms in the UK too. In Amsterdam up until a few years ago you could by lots of (now) illegal drugs, over the counter at head shops, such as 2-CT-7, and various other derivatives.

In terms of the crime there, that figure about 70% chance of being mugged is a load of bollox. Of course there are certain dodgy areas, like any city, but the most people I know (including myself) that have visited have had no problems. I think overall they have fewer drug related crimes in Holland compared to the rest of Europe and the USA.



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Anonymous

Re: Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal? [Re: ChopperDave]
    #2031970 - 10/22/03 10:05 AM (20 years, 3 months ago)

marijuana is a way to hold down/criminalize a vast portion of the counter culture.

also, stoners spend too much money on pot.


you cant be a drug addict and an american lifestyle addict.


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Anonymous

Re: Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal? [Re: Xochitl]
    #2031985 - 10/22/03 10:10 AM (20 years, 3 months ago)

nice!


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InvisibleXlea321
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Re: Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal? [Re: ChopperDave]
    #2032197 - 10/22/03 11:41 AM (20 years, 3 months ago)

Like Xochitl says most drugs like heroin and marijuana were made illegal as a cover for racist attacks on groups which would get votes for scumbag politicians.

Mushrooms just got caught up in the right-wing hysteria about LSD.


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Don't worry, B. Caapi


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OfflineEkstaza
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Re: Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal? [Re: ChopperDave]
    #2032426 - 10/22/03 12:52 PM (20 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

ChopperDave said:
On a related note, anyone here been to Amsterdam?



I have. It's nice.

Quote:

Whats it like there, since marijuana is legal there?




SWEET

Quote:

How is the crime? Ive heard that you have a 70% chance of getting mugged whereever you go, but I highly doubt that...




Crime associated with drugs usually only occurs when the drugs have been made illegal. When drugs are legal, people don't have to resort to illegal activities to obtain and produce them. Our government likes to point out the things that are wrong in society because of drugs, but what they are really pointing out are all of the things that are wrong in society because of prohibition.


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YOUR EXPERIENCE WITH ANY GIVEN DRUG ISN'T THE DEFINITIVE MEASURE OF THE DRUGS EFFECTS.


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OfflineAnnom
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Re: Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal? [Re: ChopperDave]
    #2032472 - 10/22/03 01:07 PM (20 years, 3 months ago)

> On a related note, anyone here been to Amsterdam? Whats it like there, since marijuana is legal there? How is the crime? Ive heard that you have a 70% chance of getting mugged whereever you go, but I highly doubt that...

Amsterdam is the capital of Holland(the Netherlands). All major cities in Holland have coffee shops(my city = 250.000 citizens, 15 coffee shops and 4 smart shops(mushrooms etc)), nothing negative happened since it's "legal". The 70% chance is 100% bullshit. It's just a normal city.

> Officially you are not allowed to smoke it everywhere, only in designated zones (ie certain coffee shops).

Wrong. Using (all) drugs is legal in Holland.

Here's my summary of the dutch drugs-law:
Quote:

In Holland we have 2 opium acts. The first is for Hard Drugs and the second for Soft Drugs. Only cannabis products fall under Soft Drugs(list 2). Buying, selling, possessing and growing of Soft and Hard drugs is illegal. Using Hard and Soft drugs is legal, even for minors! Using drugs isn't illegal so that people don't need to be scared to search for help(heroin, crack, cocaine addicts).

The dutch government tolerates small production(5plants pp), possession(5g) and selling(only coffeeshops/max 5g pp) of Soft Drugs(Cannabis products). Tolerating is "legal" but i'm not able to explain that part of the dutch law in English.

Smart Drugs/Eco Drugs (Mushrooms, Salvia, LSA seeds, San Pedro, Peyote and Ayahuasca) are totally legal! Psilocybin falls under the first opium act but judges in Holland say that natural plants containing Psilocybin aren't illegal because blablabla . They interpret the law in a good manner . But sometimes a judge has some american blood in his veins and says that it is illegal to grow enormous amounts of mushrooms It's all about how judges interpret the dutch law. But nearly nobody is accusing mushroom growers/sellers etc so that's nice.

Dutch source: http://www.justitie.nl/publiek/criminali.....................





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OfflineAnnom
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Re: Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal? [Re: Annom]
    #2032807 - 10/22/03 02:52 PM (20 years, 3 months ago)

I just read that our fucking conservative government will make it illegal for foreigners to buy weed in coffee shops... all because Germany and French were complaining about the drugs-tourists.


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Invisibleafoaf
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Re: Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal? [Re: Annom]
    #2033103 - 10/22/03 04:15 PM (20 years, 3 months ago)

I doubt that will get passed.

can you imagine the boon a law like that
would be to the tourist economy in Holland?

any links?


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All I know is The Growery is a place where losers who get banned here go.


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OfflineAnnom
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Re: Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal? [Re: afoaf]
    #2033285 - 10/22/03 05:01 PM (20 years, 3 months ago)

yep, I know. I think it's just a friendly word to our German neighbors, but the only political party that is not rational about our drug policy is the CDA(Christians). And they have much power right know....

Here's the dutch source:
http://www.omroep.nl/nos/nieuws/binnenland/2003/oktober/221003/coffeeshops.html


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Invisibledaussaulit
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Re: Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal? [Re: Annom]
    #2033744 - 10/22/03 07:22 PM (20 years, 3 months ago)

This is why marijuana is illegal.

The campaign in 1936 to make Marijuana an illegal substance was
championed by two large companies, Dupont Chemicals and Hearst Newspapers, that
gained financially by having Marijuana banned. For Hearst Newspapers it was to
protect the investment that they had just made buying a large amount of paper
trees. Marijuana can produce about 4 times the amount of paper per acre than
trees, and twice as many fibers per acre than cotton. (Hempnet 1) Hearst was
well aware of this and moved to ban Marijuana. Marijuana costs little to grow
and can be made into cloth, canvas, and other high quality textiles. The use of
Marijuana for textile production would have seriously hurt Dupont who had
invested heavily in both paper production and the use of cotton. In 1936 Dupont
joined Hearst and using scare tactics and effective lobbying were able to ban
the growth, sale, and use of Marijuana.

Scare Tactics = Propaganda.


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OfflineChopperDave
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Re: Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal? [Re: daussaulit]
    #2033997 - 10/22/03 08:27 PM (20 years, 3 months ago)

Ohhhh yeah! Daussaulit, did you by chance read that in an Uncle John's Bathroom Reader? I read that in mine =/


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InvisibleXochitl
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Re: Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal? [Re: ChopperDave]
    #2034847 - 10/23/03 12:58 AM (20 years, 3 months ago)

I highly recommend The Emperor Wears No Clothes by Jack Herer for more background info on the prohibition against marijuana/hemp.



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As we know, there are known knowns. There are things we know we know. We also know there are known unknowns. That is to say we know there are some things we do not know. But there are also unknown unknowns, the ones we don't know we don't know.

-Donald Rumsfeld 2/2/02 Pentagon


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Invisiblemjshroomer
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Re: Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal? [Re: Xochitl]
    #2035758 - 10/23/03 10:29 AM (20 years, 3 months ago)

Herer's is a good book but he did not put the references in his chapters to where they belong. My favorate story from his book is the Popular Mechanics 1938 issue witht he hemp harvesting machine with the title labeled something like the One Billon Dollar Crop.. It was wrtten right before the law was passed but published a few months after they passed the law,.

mj. Of course anouther book I came across one day while in the US library, an actual distant ancestor of my (Learned about this from my parents) who had relatives in Kentruckty. His writing is simialr to that of nathanial hawthorne, he even wrote a whole book about the kentucky warbler, a bird, his name,, James Allen and he wrote "The Reign of Law", a tale of the kentucky hemp Farmers with numerous black and white paintings of the hemp and the harvest process.

Written in the late 1890s or early 1900s. IT had a majuana leaf embossed cover.

mj


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Anonymous

Re: Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal? [Re: ChopperDave]
    #2035827 - 10/23/03 10:57 AM (20 years, 3 months ago)

i think it's mostly puritanical christian morality.

that combined with the idea held by far too many that the government is our nanny.

and a general lack of lack of concern for personal liberty and responsibility.


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Invisibledaussaulit
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Re: Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal? [Re: ChopperDave]
    #2041562 - 10/25/03 02:44 AM (20 years, 3 months ago)

no, someone told me that a while back, and I just went to google and searched. I just copied and pasted.


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InvisibleXenophobic
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Re: Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal? [Re: daussaulit]
    #2044216 - 10/26/03 07:35 AM (20 years, 3 months ago)

Probably because everyone would be trippin all the time and never work or contribute to society, resulting in no economy and social havoc (so they think anyway).


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Only will man realise, when he cuts down the last tree, that he cannot eat money


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InvisibletrendalM
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Re: Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal? [Re: ChopperDave]
    #2044422 - 10/26/03 10:06 AM (20 years, 3 months ago)

At first I thought it was because they were harmful.

Then I read and learned the Truth.

Now I see two possibilities. One is that the guys in power really do think that these drugs are harmful to society as a whole. Maybe they really do believe in "dope fiends".

I find this highly unlikely. It takes a smart man to reach such seats of power. The evidence is overwhelming...there is no way they could deny it.

So possibility two is much more likely. They know that drugs aren't all that bad. Worse, they know that some drugs are actually very good for people and when used properly. So they are lieing to us. The question, to me, then becomes Why? Why would they wish to make drugs illegal? Why would they go so far to keep them that way?

Drugs may help to foster feelings of rebellion.

Psychedelics can help expand your mind, allow you to become more aware. They also quite often create a feeling of connection. They bring people together. Society as a whole benefits.

But drugs do not benefit in a manner which suits the existence of our current forms of government.

They promotes free thought.


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Once, men turned their thinking over to machines in the hope that this would set them free.
But that only permitted other men with machines to enslave them.


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OfflineDailyPot
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Re: Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal? [Re: dibbles]
    #2044508 - 10/26/03 11:08 AM (20 years, 3 months ago)

Because there are bad drug stories. Thats it. There are alot of people that do drugs but if one out of a thousand tell their story of how they tryed pot and then this, then that and the next thing they know they're under and expressway sucking dick for drugs and they destroyed their family, bank account, and whatever else their life was made of...then they want to save others by saying if you do any drug you'll end up like them because they didnt think they would be like that either.

It touches hearts, especially parents who dont want their young stupid children using drugs. So they do what they can to push drugs farther and farther away not realizing that they just pushing them more into schools where kids can get them. Then when by surprize the kids get them they have to push hard to save them. Maybe they're not pushing hard enough?

It doesn't matter if alcoholics have the same story. Cuz look at how many people use alcohol and are fine. But you only see the drug users w/ fucked up lives going to jail so drugs must be bad.


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OfflineDailyPot
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Re: Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal? [Re: DailyPot]
    #2044539 - 10/26/03 11:28 AM (20 years, 3 months ago)

Plus why shouldn't the government be anti-drugs? People who use them are just hopeless addicts that think they're not addicted. Want proff? Go arrest afew hundred drug users, let them get out of jail and get there life in motion and then ask them if they are greatful the law put them back on track. I bet you atleast one will say they were addicted and that the law is doing a wonderful thing. When they do and then they say everyone is an addict or going to be one it makes you feel good that you're taking all those people off the streets and helping them out. :mad:

Here is why I think it is *currently* illegal. I think in the minds of many a world w/ legal drugs would be horrible. They picture doctors doing brain surgery stoned, NASA building rocketship on crack, people drive on special K, parents too fucked up to care for thier kids and everyone else just laughing and tripping life away, having too much fun to work and make a planet function.


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Anonymous

Re: Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal? [Re: trendal]
    #2045041 - 10/26/03 03:06 PM (20 years, 3 months ago)

So possibility two is much more likely. They know that drugs aren't all that bad. Worse, they know that some drugs are actually very good for people and when used properly. So they are lieing to us. The question, to me, then becomes Why?

because the people that elect them see it a little differently.

thank the imbecilic masses.


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Anonymous

Re: Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal? [Re: ]
    #2046097 - 10/26/03 11:35 PM (20 years, 3 months ago)

our systems are based on making money off the commoners!
if we lived in a crimefree and sickness free society what would the doctors and the police do for a living?dig sewer pits?not likely!
the government needs crime and sickness so they keep drugs illegal so there is always a revenue raising vent to feed off.


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Invisibledaussaulit
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Re: Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal? [Re: Xenophobic]
    #2046293 - 10/27/03 12:34 AM (20 years, 3 months ago)

I don't think everyone would be tripping all the time and not work, they might work and innovations and productivity may soar, but there are people out there without any self-restraint. They lack the control to not abuse, and they do abuse. These are the types of people that give non-lethal drugs bad names.


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Invisibleniteowl
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Re: Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal? [Re: daussaulit]
    #2046823 - 10/27/03 08:09 AM (20 years, 3 months ago)

Fear is the main reason they are illegal.

They have no control over the growth of a natural plant. The government WANTS to have control over your life, and cant if these plants are legal.


--------------------
Live for the moment you are in now
Don't be bogged down by your past
Don't be afraid of what lies in your future


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OfflineAnnom
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Re: Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal? [Re: ]
    #2047241 - 10/27/03 11:48 AM (20 years, 3 months ago)

> because the people that elect them see it a little differently.
thank the imbecilic masses.

That's it.  :nonono: :shake:

Even if Bush would be smart enough to understand how hypocrite the war on drugs is, he would never say it. He only says what the imbecilic mass wants to hear(REDUCE TAX!!!!!) 


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OfflineEkstaza
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Re: Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal? [Re: Annom]
    #2047337 - 10/27/03 12:25 PM (20 years, 3 months ago)

Besides the fact that our politicians are only saying what the public wants to hear, they are also using our tax money and the media to program us to want to hear certain things. Let's face the facts here. The average American citizen does not want to research the facts about what our government tells them. They go on the principal that government officials are paid to have all of the answers and therefore they are credible. When the government tells these people that, lets say for instance "Salvia Divinorum causes frostbite in users and induces hallucinations for hours.", the people believe it. Then when election time comes, those politicians had better do something about the growing epidemic of 'dangerous salvia users' or the good law abiding people of their jurisdiction will be damned if they'll vote for them. By doing things this way the politicians not only know what the people want to hear, but have known it long before the people have and therefore have had plenty of time to prepare their responses to questions that they themselves raised in the first place.

Ain't America Grand


Change the momentum of our country


Let's get rid of self-serving Republicans and Democrats


Let's take back our Constitutional rights


Bring back the Liberty that Americans deserve


VOTE LIBERTARIAN


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YOUR EXPERIENCE WITH ANY GIVEN DRUG ISN'T THE DEFINITIVE MEASURE OF THE DRUGS EFFECTS.


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InvisibleXlea321
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Re: Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal? [Re: ]
    #2047340 - 10/27/03 12:26 PM (20 years, 3 months ago)

thank the imbecilic masses.

You seriously underestimate the power of propaganda.

Within 6 months the Bush administration and their media helpers were able to create the myth that Iraqs WMD were a threat. They've had 100 years to create the myth that drugs are a threat.


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Don't worry, B. Caapi


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InvisibleXenophobic
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Re: Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal? [Re: Xlea321]
    #2047407 - 10/27/03 12:51 PM (20 years, 3 months ago)

Mushrooms aren't illegal here unless they are dried or prepared in any way.

Isn't it ironic how English people within the colonies revolted against their own country to be "free" and here we are having this coversation? Food for thought.....


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Only will man realise, when he cuts down the last tree, that he cannot eat money


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OfflineEkstaza
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Re: Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal? [Re: Xenophobic]
    #2047493 - 10/27/03 01:13 PM (20 years, 3 months ago)

Yea, but we stopped supporting freeloaders that call themselve royalty. Give and take, give and take.

Don't get me wrong, the idea of Kings and Queens of royal stature is very romantic and all, but it just looks even better when you don't have to foot the bill.


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YOUR EXPERIENCE WITH ANY GIVEN DRUG ISN'T THE DEFINITIVE MEASURE OF THE DRUGS EFFECTS.


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InvisibleXenophobic
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Re: Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal? [Re: Ekstaza]
    #2047777 - 10/27/03 03:20 PM (20 years, 3 months ago)

North America in general (excluding Canada) is more of a "police" state than any other country in the world. Their are some things you can be arrested for that no other country has even heard of being a crime. The most common argument put across by North Americans is the issue of taxation, so why don't they do what they did in 1773 in Boston Harbour and challenge the Government, maybe because of self-obsessivness of ones own power. That's not meant in a rude manner at all, just a statement.

Yes, what you say is true to you, but it doesn't matter whichever way it "looks" as you say. It's the people that suffer from the governments morals. Royalty have no effect on my life or anyone elses apart from the Queen passing legislation which is given to her from the Government, and holding the power to "dissolve" Government at any time, it's the Government that has (just to contridict your point). Anyway I could argue this point way beyond this but nevermind...... as I said "food for thought".


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Only will man realise, when he cuts down the last tree, that he cannot eat money


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OfflineEkstaza
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Re: Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal? [Re: Xenophobic]
    #2048434 - 10/27/03 08:07 PM (20 years, 3 months ago)

I understand that your queen only has a ceremonial position, but my point (and it was mostly just in jest), was that you and your countrymen are allowing one family to hold on to the idea that they are better than the rest of the people in the world just because they have successfully inbred. I personally would be mad as hell if I knew that a certain portion of my governments resources went towards supporting people who don't deserve welfare. Yea, I know that the aristocracy is wealthy and that they use their own money, but they are so because of the hard work of the common Englishman, not their own deeds. I'm not trying to argue about who has power, the queen or the government, rather that it's just so alien to me that their should be a queen at all. I also understand that part of it is tradition, but it just seems belittling to me.

Things have changed a lot since 1773. Government has become too big for a hand full of citizens to overcome. Besides that, our nation has become so diverse that it would be almost impossible to rally enough people behind one cause to effectively cause an upheaval.


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YOUR EXPERIENCE WITH ANY GIVEN DRUG ISN'T THE DEFINITIVE MEASURE OF THE DRUGS EFFECTS.


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InvisibleTODAY
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Re: Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal? [Re: Xenophobic]
    #2049112 - 10/27/03 11:08 PM (20 years, 3 months ago)

marijuana has benefits as a medicine and many other things including food, clothing, and oil...etc. (many, many uses for hemp). it grows very fast and therefore would deliver alot of products very quickly to the market.

WOW, marijuana/hemp sounds very good...i mean, it isn't hard to grow and it is very productive so why is it illegal? well, many companies that produce the same products that hemp could make are using other less productive plants to make their products. if hemp were legal then other companies would use it to make products that could be sold cheaper and take away the market from all of these established companies. these companies can't have that and they because these companies have so much money they have their feet in the government's door. they can't lose any money because they are so greedy so they needed to call in favors to the government (as payback for contributing money to certain elected politician's campaigns). the politicians have to grant the company's favor so they put it on a bill to become illegal.
politicians are hesitant to legalize marijuana as a medicine because the pharmacutical companies that have so much hold over the government would lose their money because marijuana is a cheaper way of treating the ill than the expensive medications that the companies sell.

maybe i'm a conspiracy theorist hbut i think i've heard this somewhere and i believe it because it makes mucho sense!


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ca'rouse (k-rouz)
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To engage in boisterous, drunken merrymaking.


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OfflineSuby
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Re: Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal? [Re: TODAY]
    #2053027 - 10/29/03 06:11 AM (20 years, 3 months ago)

simple answer as to why....$money$.

corps make more money off synthetic fibers.
cops get new equipment after taking your house.
gov't rakes in fine dollars when ya busted.
the prision system supports jobs, duh.

we're capitalists at heart. And, not to mention, there's probably alot of blue collar guys out there supporting there families right now growing/selling pot. probably farmers too. think what would happen if it were legal.


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"Why don't they make the whole plane out of that black box stuff."
Steven Wright.

Some say the glass is half empty, some say the glass is half full, I say, are you going to drink that?

"I'm desperately trying to figure out why kamikaze pilots wore helmets."


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OfflineAnnom
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Re: Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal? [Re: Suby]
    #2053323 - 10/29/03 10:13 AM (20 years, 3 months ago)

No way $$$$!

The war on drugs isn't good for money. It only costs $$$$$$$$$$.

Legalising drugs would create thousands of (legal, tax paying)jobs.


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OfflineEkstaza
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Re: Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal? [Re: Annom]
    #2053353 - 10/29/03 10:30 AM (20 years, 3 months ago)

I agree that the war on drugs is costing tax payers enormous amounts of money, but there are special interest groups that are definately profiting from it.


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YOUR EXPERIENCE WITH ANY GIVEN DRUG ISN'T THE DEFINITIVE MEASURE OF THE DRUGS EFFECTS.


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OfflineSeussA
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Re: Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal? [Re: Annom]
    #2053368 - 10/29/03 10:41 AM (20 years, 3 months ago)

> simple answer as to why....$money$
> The war on drugs isn't good for money. It only costs $$$$$$$$$$.

In a way, you are both correct, I think...

There are many sides that have a reason for making / keeping drugs illegal.

1) you have a government that has been lying to the people about the dangers of drugs. The government cannot change it's position and admit that it has been lying to people for the last 50+ years.

2) you have a government that gets a lot of tax money from the people by scaring them with the dangers of illegal drugs. Of course, the government could make back the lost money by taxing the drugs directly.

3) you have greedy corps that want to make money from their synthetic products. It is in their best interests to keep hemp, mescaline, etc illegal. The alcohol and tobacco lobbies are huge and they do not want competition.

4) you have moral crusaders that have been given a mandate by the almighty to ensure that nobody does anything that the crusaders feel might be immoral. This follows from the famous line in the Bible, "Judge others, but do not let others judge you!"

5) you have all of the people that are employed by the war on drugs that would loose their jobs if it were to go away... lawyers, prosecuters, police, border guards, dea, informants, prison guards, prison construction workers, etc

6) you have a government that doesn't like people to think on their own. Drugs and free thinking seem to go hand-in-hand. Free thinkers are much safer in jail where they cannot taint the sheep watching TV.

7) you have non-responsible users that do stupid things and give drugs a bad name. Same thing with drunks that wreck and kill people, etc. Many people would rather give up their rights to drugs in order to feel safer.

8) I forget what eight was for...


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Just another spore in the wind.


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Anonymous

Re: Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal? [Re: Sin Bad]
    #2056531 - 10/30/03 07:52 AM (20 years, 3 months ago)

do you get punks bashing stoners in amsterdam?


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OfflineOook
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Re: Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal? [Re: ]
    #2056865 - 10/30/03 11:01 AM (20 years, 3 months ago)

Has anyone remembered that pot demotivates you?

It seems a bit unrealistic to think that because something is legal its use automatically become habitual. Do people that drink alcohol get pissed all the time? I think not. If we treated alcohol the way its assumed we would treat decriminalised drugs, wouldnt the world just be filled with alcoholics only concerned for alcohol.

The legality of a substance also effects its use, quite a lot of illegal drug users would fail to see the appeal when there isnt a rule to be broken.

Aside from the politics involved in drugs, all drugs have bad points which can be targeted/exaggerated.

In england i cant see pot being that much cheaper, if at all if its ever legalised. The government likes to charge us for anything possible and weed will just be another thing on the list.


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OfflineEkstaza
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Re: Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal? [Re: Oook]
    #2056935 - 10/30/03 11:32 AM (20 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Oook said:
It seems a bit unrealistic to think that because something is legal its use automatically become habitual. Do people that drink alcohol get pissed all the time? I think not. If we treated alcohol the way its assumed we would treat decriminalised drugs, wouldnt the world just be filled with alcoholics only concerned for alcohol.




In some peoples reasoning, there are many more alcoholics than people who just appreciate alcohol.

I had to go to an alcohol awareness class because of a DUI(The stupidest thing I have ever done). Well, the theory taught by the class was that anyone who drinks to get a buzz, even on occasion, is an alcoholic. They even provided an example of one man who does not touch a drop of alcohol except for one week a year when he visits a fishing resort with a group of close friends. During that week his group of friends drinks while they are fishing and relaxing by the lake. The instructors of the class said that this is alcoholism.

According to the instructors, to not be an alcoholic one must only drink one or two alcoholic drinks at a time, and that even that is best limited to only once or twice a week or less.

As it seems, most of my friends and aquaintences are alcoholics.
I personally don't see the point in drinking an alcoholic beverage if you are not after the effects of alcohol. Non-alcoholic drinks are so much cheaper.


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YOUR EXPERIENCE WITH ANY GIVEN DRUG ISN'T THE DEFINITIVE MEASURE OF THE DRUGS EFFECTS.


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OfflineOook
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Re: Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal? [Re: Ekstaza]
    #2058038 - 10/30/03 05:09 PM (20 years, 3 months ago)

Was this in america by any chance?


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OfflineEkstaza
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Re: Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal? [Re: Oook]
    #2058535 - 10/30/03 07:56 PM (20 years, 3 months ago)

Yes. The good ol' USA.


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YOUR EXPERIENCE WITH ANY GIVEN DRUG ISN'T THE DEFINITIVE MEASURE OF THE DRUGS EFFECTS.


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OfflineDailyPot
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Re: Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal? [Re: Annom]
    #2092949 - 11/11/03 02:42 PM (20 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Annom said:
No way $$$$!

The war on drugs isn't good for money. It only costs $$$$$$$$$$.

Legalising drugs would create thousands of (legal, tax paying)jobs.
 



I'll vote for you :tongue:

Quote:

Oook said:
If we treated alcohol the way its assumed we would treat decriminalised drugs, wouldnt the world just be filled with alcoholics only concerned for alcohol. 



We did, that was an argument during prohabition. If alcohol was legal doctors would be operating on you drunk, children would be running around intoxicated, pilots wouldn't be able to fly in a strait line...

Quote:

Ekstaza said:
I personally don't see the point in drinking an alcoholic beverage if you are not after the effects of alcohol. Non-alcoholic drinks are so much cheaper. 



Cuz they taste good :smile: btw, that class was bullshit :mad: 


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Invisiblemuhurgle
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Re: Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal? [Re: DailyPot]
    #2093712 - 11/11/03 06:34 PM (20 years, 2 months ago)

Here is a nice comic which shows how and why drugs were made illegal in the US:

http://www.adrugwarcarol.com/index.html


--------------------
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Take half a gram of phanerothyme."

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OfflineDailyPot
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Re: Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal? [Re: muhurgle]
    #2103082 - 11/13/03 07:13 PM (20 years, 2 months ago)

Crazy comic :smile:


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Offlineaskwhy2all
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Re: Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal? [Re: Ekstaza]
    #4421483 - 07/18/05 10:58 PM (18 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Ekstaza said:


I personally don't see the point in drinking an alcoholic beverage if you are not after the effects of alcohol. Non-alcoholic drinks are so much cheaper.




There is a lot more to alcohol than simply getting drunk.

The number 1 reason I enjoy alcohol is because there is NO OTHER beverage than can create tastes and flavors on your palate than alcohol.

Take wine, you can't re-create the huge spectrum and intricate tastes and smells of a glass of wine. What about single Malt Scotches? Beer? Humans cannot make anything to taste like that without the traditional alcohol fermentation. Think about the complexity of non-alcoholic beverages. They are so boring and one dimensional. It doesn't even come close.

Ever since I turned 21 and started having 2-3 drinks 4-5 nights a week I have acquired a palate for alcohol and really appreciate the taste. I rarely get drunk, but just really like the taste, especially when properly paired with food.


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Offlinedemon66
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Re: Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal? [Re: askwhy2all]
    #13620912 - 12/12/10 11:28 AM (13 years, 1 month ago)

I really do believe that a large proportion of politicians don't agree with the current drug laws.  Granted, they don't care enough to change them.  A HUGE number of chemicals (drugs) were scheduled to Categories I, II, and III back in the 1960's.  These laws were made with much haste and passed with out any real vote or much thought.  These laws have remained on the books ever since.

If these laws were never passed all that time ago, I am not sure if todays politicians would put in the effort to pass them.

It would be interesting to figure out how such laws were passed.  Was it a select few in government that made them nation wide law.  Was there a vote amongst citizens of each state, etc?  I am guessing that a handful or more people drafted these laws.  Brought the bill before some commitee of one or two dozen law makers.  Gave a brief summary of what the bill was.  They voted and passed it without the VAST majority of the population having any say.


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OfflinePoisonCrazy
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Re: Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal? [Re: demon66]
    #13621139 - 12/12/10 12:44 PM (13 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

demon66 said:
If these laws were never passed all that time ago, I am not sure if todays politicians would put in the effort to pass them.




This.
And one way they get around this is by giving the DEA authority to schedule chemicals (I'm not sure of the details but I know they can at least emergency schedule it.)
And the DEA is a bunch of Zealots


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InvisibleLibertin
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Re: Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal? [Re: PoisonCrazy]
    #13621430 - 12/12/10 01:52 PM (13 years, 1 month ago)

:beatadeadhorse:

Also, this thread is an ancient artifact.


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InvisibleFleshCap
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Re: Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal? [Re: ChopperDave]
    #13621669 - 12/12/10 02:38 PM (13 years, 1 month ago)

Simply put, psychedelics are illegal because they scare the people in power. :boo:


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Offlinea2theDawG

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Re: Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal? [Re: FleshCap]
    #13622275 - 12/12/10 04:43 PM (13 years, 1 month ago)

OP are you seriously that stupid


Edited by a2theDawG (12/12/10 04:43 PM)


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InvisibleDoc_T
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Re: Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal? [Re: Libertin]
    #13622317 - 12/12/10 04:51 PM (13 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Libertin said:
:beatadeadhorse:

Also, this thread is an ancient artifact.




Let it rest in peace, people.


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Offlinepowertoke33
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Re: Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal? [Re: Doc_T]
    #13623353 - 12/12/10 07:57 PM (13 years, 1 month ago)

In my opinion weed should be %100 legal and sold in shops.. but shrooms should only be legal to grow at home because so many people would take to much and do something stupid.


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OfflinePoisonCrazy
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Re: Why are mushrooms and other drugs illegal? [Re: powertoke33]
    #13623945 - 12/12/10 09:59 PM (13 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

powertoke33 said:
In my opinion weed should be %100 legal and sold in shops.. but shrooms should only be legal to grow at home because so many people would take to much and do something stupid.



It is not the proper place of a government to babysit its citizens.


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