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Anonymous

WET GRAINS!
    #2023208 - 10/19/03 04:59 PM (20 years, 8 months ago)

HI there! I have this problem many times!
I boil the grain for about 30-45 min. depending on strain. Just to see they have water inside. Then let the soak. Then put in jars and sterilize. AFTER I do it, if I look in the jar I see few or more grains WET. Meaning they have water droplets around them. This is stopping mycelium do grow. What to do? :laugh: Thanks in advance.

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Invisibledog
straw dog

Registered: 06/20/02
Posts: 2,790
Loc: Route 66
Re: WET GRAINS! [Re: ]
    #2023225 - 10/19/03 05:06 PM (20 years, 8 months ago)

My friend does not boil his grains at all. He simply lets them soak for 36 hours or so in water, lets them drain for 1/2 hour and then loads into jars and PC's.

This method has worked well for every grain he's tried.  :laugh: 


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Fascism (fash'izem) n. A governmental system marked by a centralized dictatorship, stringent socioeconomic controls, and often belligerent nationalism. see also: the Bush Administration.

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Anonymous

Re: WET GRAINS! [Re: dog]
    #2023326 - 10/19/03 05:41 PM (20 years, 8 months ago)

They look ok before sterilizing. After I see wet grains. I used polyfill filters. and no coverage during sterilization. Maybe this is the problem? :smile:

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OfflineShrooomKing
Revolving

Registered: 09/12/03
Posts: 153
Loc: Returning to OZ...
Last seen: 14 years, 3 months
Re: WET GRAINS! [Re: ]
    #2023693 - 10/19/03 08:07 PM (20 years, 8 months ago)

Well I had this same problem. Answer: Foil is your friend. Cover the entire jar with foil. Example....





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A driver knows that it is not the road that is his biggest obstacle, rather it is the poles.
A great driver understands, the poles will always be there, and he must learn to adjust.

I can't keep doing this on my own... with all these... people. -daniel plainview

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Invisibledaussaulit
Forgetful

Registered: 08/06/02
Posts: 2,894
Loc: Earth
Re: WET GRAINS! [Re: ShrooomKing]
    #2023953 - 10/19/03 09:52 PM (20 years, 8 months ago)

What about shaking the jars? My cat just pours in 1/2 cup of rye and water and gypsum. PC for an hour, the top half of the grain looks dry and the bottom half is wet, so he just shakes it to evenly distribute the moisture. It's worked good for him.

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Anonymous

Re: WET GRAINS! [Re: ShrooomKing]
    #2024546 - 10/20/03 02:00 AM (20 years, 8 months ago)

I don't think the entire jar has to be covered. Are those grain jars?
Cause if you look at fungifun.org He doesnt cover them. And at pf tek he just puts some foil over the top. I'll try your way anyway. :smile: Thanks.
Maybe shaking is a good ideea. Do you shake while still HOT?

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OfflineAnnoA
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Re: WET GRAINS! [Re: ]
    #2024560 - 10/20/03 02:11 AM (20 years, 8 months ago)

>Do you shake while still HOT?

This is a must.

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Anonymous

Re: WET GRAINS! [Re: Anno]
    #2027585 - 10/21/03 01:06 AM (20 years, 8 months ago)

Shaking while still hot it's a must, EVEN if I boiled them before? I mean they are all wet inside.

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OfflineAnnoA
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Re: WET GRAINS! [Re: ]
    #2027598 - 10/21/03 01:11 AM (20 years, 8 months ago)

Still the bottom kernles are wetter than the top ones.

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Offlineshirley knott
not my real name
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Registered: 11/11/02
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Re: WET GRAINS! [Re: Anno]
    #2027971 - 10/21/03 05:52 AM (20 years, 8 months ago)

grains, eh? there are probably as many ways of preparing them as there are members at the shroomery. i still struggle to get them the right moisture.

in the FAQ agar section is this interesting article: www.mykoweb.com/articles/cultivation.html

and from this i have cut and pasted a bit for you:
..................................

Preparing Grain, Method No. 1
Materials Needed

Clear 12 oz. or 28 oz. beer, water or soft drink bottles
Rolled cotton or cotton or polyester fiberfill such as pillow stuffing
Grain (wheat, rye, millet or sorghum) or wild bird seed
Recipe for 12 oz. bottle:

1/3 level cup wheat or other grain
1/4 cup water
Recipe for 28 oz bottle:

1 level cup wheat
2/3 cup water
Guidelines for grain and bottles
An important consideration when preparing grain is that it will roughly double in volume when cooked or sterilized. A rule of thumb is to fill a container only one third full with dry grain. If using bottles, a breathable plug closure can be fashioned from rolled cotton (available at pharmacies) or polyester/fiberfill material (at fabric stores).

Cooking/Sterilizing
Grain can be cooked/sterilized in either one or two steps. The two step process produces a very uniform product, but if time is limited, cooking and sterilizing can be done simultaneously.

Two Step Process
After the bottles are loaded with grain and water, place them in the pressure cooker and cover with a sheet of aluminum foil. The foil will help to prevent the filter plugs from getting wet from condensate. Cook the grain in the pressure cooker by bringing the pressure up to 15 psi for seven minutes. Let the pressure cooker cool and use oven mitts to shake the hot bottles so that wet and dry grain is mixed. Place the containers back in the pressure cooker and sterilize by cooking at 15 psi for 45 minutes. Do not count the time required to bring the pressure cooker up to pressure. Then let the pressure cooker cool slowly.

Remove the bottles and shake once again to mix the grain. Cover the filter plugs with a paper dust shield. The will help prevent contamination. Store the bottles in a dust-free box or cabinet. Since the grain will gradually dry out over time, avoid making cultures too far in advance of your needs.

One step process
Proceed as above, but simply cook for 45 minutes at 15 psi. After the pressure cooker has cooled, but while the bottles are still hot, use oven mitts to shake the bottles to mix wet and relatively dry grain.

Well-prepared grain is plump and shakes readily with a soft "ring." Overcooked grain prepared with too much water will often rupture. Then the starchy contents cause clumping, making it difficult to shake. Grain prepared with too little water will be flinty, shriveled and unsuitable for mycelial growth.

Spawn Method No. 2
Materials needed:

Pint or quart sized canning jars
Micro-porous filters fitting inside canning jar lid ring (Mycological supply or homemade)
Aluminum foil
Paint strainer bags (from hardware or paint store)
Grain preparation
Measure one jar of grain for every three jars you will prepare into a paint strainer bag until the bag is half full. Use more bags as needed, keeping in mind that you can only cook as many jars at once as you have room for in the available pressure cooker(s). Tie the bag closed with twine, place in a large pot or the pressure cooker bottom (setting the lid aside), fill with water until just covering the grain, and boil for 30 minutes. Remove into the sink and rinse for a few minutes in cool water. This will remove some of the released starch so the grain will not stick together as readily.

Let drain for a few minutes. While draining, insert the canning jar lid filters into the lid rings. The filters may be obtained commercially (see sources at the end of this article), or may be cut out of appropriate fabric, such as a stiff, heavy polyester to fit the lid ring. Instead of using a filter, you may invert the disk that comes with the lid to provide for a small amount of air exchange, but the filtering capability of this method is questionable and a greater possibility of contamination may result. In the long-run, the commercially available filters or handmade filters are re-usable and probably worth the investment.

Cooking/Sterilizing
Untie the bag and fill the jars with grain. The jars should be 1/2 to 2/3 full. Place the lids with filters on the jars and seal loosely. Pressure cookers generally have some sort of rack to hold the jars away from the bottom of the cooker. Add water to the cooker so that it almost reaches the bottom of the jars when they are placed on the rack. (There should be at least a couple inches of water.)

Load the pressure cooker with the jars. Please see the manufacturer's instructions for the pressure cooker and observe all safety guidelines. Bring the cooker up to 15 psi (250 degrees F.) and maintain that pressure/temperature for 2-1/2 hours. Turn off heat and let cool for 30 minutes. Carefully remove jars from cooker, using a clean potholder or oven mitt if the jars are still too hot to handle. Tighten the lids and cover with a small square of aluminum foil. Shake the jars vigorously to ensure that the grain is not sticking or clumping. Store in a clean, dust free location until ready to use.

Grain Amenities
For some mushrooms, the acidity of the media, as measured by Ph, can influence growth. Acidity can be adjusted by adding 1 tbsp of ground limestone (CaCO3) to a gallon of water and using the latter to mix with the grain. Limestone may be purchased at a garden supply store (it's sometimes called "agricultural lime"). Agaricus bisporous (the button or Portobello mushroom) is an example of a species that benefits from adding CaCO3 to the grain. For more information on the requirements of various species, consult a cultivation guide such as Paul Stamets' The Mushroom Cultivator (see "Sources" at the end of this article).

.....................
any good?


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buh

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