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OfflineEdmunter
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Re: How I Do WBS [Re: TheEaglesGift]
    #20265323 - 07/13/14 12:48 AM (10 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

TheEaglesGift said:
Cooked rice does taste better to humans. To mycelium? I don't think so.




There are a few reasns it could be better.  It may be easier for the mycellium to break down the molecules if it has been slightly cooked leaving it more energy to fruit.  Also right in the centre of the grain a simmer beforehand may allow this to absorb slightly more water.  In that case it probalbly would produce more yield.

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Invisibleelasticaltiger
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Re: How I Do WBS [Re: TheEaglesGift]
    #20265354 - 07/13/14 01:02 AM (10 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

TheEaglesGift said:
Cooked rice does taste better to humans. To mycelium? I don't think so.




Despite the lack of nervous system and dopamine to create a sensation of 'reward'

How can you be so sure? :wink:


--------------------
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InvisibleTheEaglesGift
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Re: How I Do WBS [Re: elasticaltiger]
    #20265355 - 07/13/14 01:03 AM (10 years, 6 months ago)

:mindblown:

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OfflinecronicrMFacebook
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Re: How I Do WBS [Re: TheEaglesGift] * 1
    #20265462 - 07/13/14 01:48 AM (10 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Edmunter said:
Quote:

TheEaglesGift said:
Cooked rice does taste better to humans. To mycelium? I don't think so.




There are a few reasns it could be better.  It may be easier for the mycellium to break down the molecules if it has been slightly cooked leaving it more energy to fruit.  Also right in the centre of the grain a simmer beforehand may allow this to absorb slightly more water.  In that case it probalbly would produce more yield.



wouldn't matter to me i dunk my spawn:wink:
you guys are talking about what now? how you guys do shit? thats cool and all but this is how spitball does it so take it as is and write your own teks:lol:


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InvisibleTheEaglesGift
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Re: How I Do WBS [Re: cronicr]
    #20265496 - 07/13/14 01:59 AM (10 years, 6 months ago)

Wasn't trying to detract from this tek or derail it, sorry if it seemed that way. I actually do my grains almost the same way as this tek. It's a good tek. :thumbup:

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OfflineEdmunter
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Re: How I Do WBS [Re: cronicr]
    #20265503 - 07/13/14 02:02 AM (10 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

cronicr said:
Quote:

Edmunter said:
Quote:

TheEaglesGift said:
Cooked rice does taste better to humans. To mycelium? I don't think so.




There are a few reasns it could be better.  It may be easier for the mycellium to break down the molecules if it has been slightly cooked leaving it more energy to fruit.  Also right in the centre of the grain a simmer beforehand may allow this to absorb slightly more water.  In that case it probalbly would produce more yield.



wouldn't matter to me i dunk my spawn;)
you guys are talking about what now? how you guys do shit? thats cool and all but this is how spitball does it so take it as is and write your own teks:lol:




But we were talking about testing it out with the OP.  Might as well discuss the reasons why or why not hey buddy :shrug:

I might have to throw in another 2 tubs of dunked spawn too

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OfflinecronicrMFacebook
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Re: How I Do WBS [Re: Edmunter]
    #20265515 - 07/13/14 02:09 AM (10 years, 6 months ago)

oh yeah no worries there i get that part i was just quoting you about the whole dunking spawn thing, my grains re always plump when i spawn them :thumbup:


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InvisibleSpitballJedi
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Re: How I Do WBS [Re: cronicr]
    #20265925 - 07/13/14 08:19 AM (10 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Asura said:
Ok, I did this this tonight with 7 jars.

The jars look too wet for me. And then there's that 2 hour dry time.

I follow RR's rye grain tek but with a 5-6 minute boil. No burst grains.
Perfect moisture. No waiting. I keep turning the WBS until the steam stops
coming off the grains, then I put it in the jars.

I'm going to stick with that. Sorry man. :shrug:




No need for apologies. To each their own. But this is WBS and you don't need too wait so long. And yes, they look to wet if you are used to steam evaporating, but they are not too wet.


Quote:

SpitballJedi said:
5) Drain
    After the soak, I pour in to a colander to drain for about 2 hours. I don't rinse it again; it just drains. I shake it up a few times,but that's about it. It doesn't matter really how long you let it drain; all the water that will drain off does so in the first 10-15 minutes.


6) Load in to jars
    After draining a couple hours, load in to jars. The WBS appears wetter than you are used to. That's okay. The extra moisture will be soaked up during sterilizing and then cooling.




In light of this conversation, I realize there may be some confusion, so I changed the OP for clarity. I know what I meant, but I can see how it could be interperated. I have cut out "a couple hours"

Quote:

Edmunter said:
It may be easier for the mycellium to break down the molecules if it has been slightly cooked leaving it more energy to fruit.  Also right in the centre of the grain a simmer beforehand may allow this to absorb slightly more water.  In that case it probalbly would produce more yield.




It will be more than slightly cooked after 90-105 mins in a PC at 15 PSI. Even if there is more water absorption by cooking first, there is no way it is enough to make a difference in yields, especially if you dunk your grains and/or mix with a bulk substrate.

Quote:

cronicr said:
wouldn't matter to me i dunk my spawn;)
you guys are talking about what now? how you guys do shit? thats cool and all but this is how spitball does it so take it as is and write your own teks:lol:




exactly. Thank you. Not every method is going to seem right to everybody.

Quote:

cronicr said:
oh yeah no worries there i get that part i was just quoting you about the whole dunking spawn thing, my grains re always plump when i spawn them :thumbup:




It's all good. Mine are always plump after the dunk too.

Quote:

SpitballJedi said:
At this point, some of you some may be confused. It's been drilled in to your head to boil/simmer/cook your grains so they steam evaporate, the grain absorbs more water, and whatever other logic. This is not Rye Berries. Cooking is not needed. This is a fact.




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Edited by SpitballJedi (07/13/14 08:27 AM)

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OfflineQuat

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Re: How I Do WBS [Re: SpitballJedi]
    #20311219 - 07/22/14 02:12 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

I'm following this tek but I can't find any gypsum locally. I just finished my 24 hour soak, but I didn't add any gypsum before the soak obviously.

What does gypsum do and what happens if you don't use any?


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InvisibleTheEaglesGift
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Re: How I Do WBS [Re: Quat]
    #20311272 - 07/22/14 02:30 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Quat said:
I'm following this tek but I can't find any gypsum locally. I just finished my 24 hour soak, but I didn't add any gypsum before the soak obviously.

What does gypsum do and what happens if you don't use any?




It helps prevent the grains of sticking and gives the mycelium some additional nutrients(sulfur and calcium).

Nothing will happen if you don't use any. It's not critically needed.

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InvisibleSpitballJedi
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Re: How I Do WBS [Re: TheEaglesGift]
    #20311293 - 07/22/14 02:38 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

:whathesaid:


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InvisibleTheEaglesGift
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Re: How I Do WBS [Re: Quat]
    #20311343 - 07/22/14 02:57 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Quat said:
I'm following this tek but I can't find any gypsum locally. I just finished my 24 hour soak, but I didn't add any gypsum before the soak obviously.

What does gypsum do and what happens if you don't use any?




You should definitely source some gypsum for your substrates though. 5 percent dry volume. It's amazing stuff, nutritionally speaking.

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InvisibleMudaFuka
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Re: How I Do WBS [Re: TheEaglesGift]
    #20311736 - 07/22/14 04:54 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

I just break up drywall offcuts from my construction sites to get my gypsum.


--------------------
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Offlinecooldave
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Re: How I Do WBS [Re: TheEaglesGift]
    #20814160 - 11/09/14 01:07 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

I know this is super old but it got me really curious, I wonder if he meant 2 oz dry or wet? I'd assume dry but I guess you never know :confused: Either way I still don't see it making much of a difference.

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OfflineOppiumNitrates
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Re: How I Do WBS [Re: SpitballJedi]
    #21205095 - 01/31/15 12:08 AM (9 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

SpitballJedi said:
Quote:

36fuckin5 said:
I've done the tests myself. Simmering my grain always gets me more fruits.

If you're getting a lot of burst grains, you're probably boiling and not actually simmering. Most people don't know how to hold a proper simmer compared to a low boil. 5 bubbles per minute or so is all you want.

I'm not saying this way won't work, I'm just saying it's not 100% optimal. Yes, perfectly hydrated is perfectly hydrated, but you can get more water in that grain by simmering, be it WBS, rye, whatever. Keeping your soak water hot helps a lot, too.




That's where your wrong. It is 100% optimal. The water stuck to the WBS after draining seems to be the right amount of water for proper hydration.

WBS, when compared to rye, has a greater surface area to volume ratio. This may be why it can be done with WBS but not so ideal with rye.

You may be right. You might be getting more water in to the WBS by simmering, but that doesn't mean skipping it is less optimal. I'm confident that the difference in water is measured in the low gram area and has no measurable impact on yields, at least when considering other water sources that come in to the equation during the cultivation process.

Just to see, because I'm guessing, I will prepare WBS for 2 monos. I will weigh the grain so they are equal and use a typical amount. I will simmer one batch and PC, and no cook and PC the other. After they are cool, I will dump them and weigh them again. This will tell me the water difference. Sound reasonable?

After a couple hundred pounds each of no cook WBS and boiling rye, I have seen no difference in jar colonization times or yields. Maybe the equalizer is the fact that I dunk my grains after colonizing.

Although your logic seems reasonable, sometimes reality flies in the face of logic. I'm not trying to convince anyone to stop cooking WBS. I'm just offering an alternative that works equally well.





I'm really curious if you (or anyone) did this test, above in red.  I posted pics of my WBS jars earlier because I thought they weren't plump enough after a simmer and 90 minutes in a PC and you (SpitballJedi) linked me to this thread. I am still learning, and have a serious thirst for knowledge, so this test seems very interesting to me.

Sorry for resurrecting an old thread. . . but not really because some noobs might stumble upon it who otherwise might never have found it and it seems like a good tek (with some good debate as well).


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InvisibleSpitballJedi
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Re: How I Do WBS [Re: OppiumNitrates]
    #21206040 - 01/31/15 09:27 AM (9 years, 11 months ago)

It's all good. Asking a question or offering to do a test is a perfectly reasonable reason to resurrect a thread, especially for a Tek thread.

Let me know what you find. Even if the no-cook has less water, I predict the difference is negligible when compared to the grand scheme of things, like as a percentage of missing water once spawned to bulk substrate.


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OfflineOppiumNitrates
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Re: How I Do WBS [Re: SpitballJedi]
    #21206662 - 01/31/15 12:27 PM (9 years, 11 months ago)

Actually I was asking if you ever got around to doing that test. . . . Guess not.
:slowreaction:

I will give it a try but this is my first bulk grow so I'm not going to try it until I do a few bulks normal.


--------------------
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InvisibleTheEaglesGift
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Re: How I Do WBS [Re: OppiumNitrates]
    #21207705 - 01/31/15 05:12 PM (9 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

Even if the no-cook has less water, I predict the difference is negligible when compared to the grand scheme of things, like as a percentage of missing water once spawned to bulk substrate.




After prepping grain in every conceivable way for years I'd have to agree with this.

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Offlinetropics23to33c
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Re: No Cook WBS [Re: SpitballJedi]
    #23578154 - 08/25/16 11:43 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

SpitballJedi said:
[url=/forums/showflat.php/Number/19140341#19140341]
    After rinsing, cover with hot tap water. I let the water get good and hot and fill the pot to about 3 inches above the WBS. Then, I sprinkle about 3tbls of gypsum on it. Don't mix it in because the gypsum will just settle to the bottom. I let soak 12-24 hours.





Hi, total noob here, currently doing my second batch of WBS for g2g. I feel these questions need to be asked.

Oops. I misread that and used freshly boiled water instead. I wonder if that's alright.

Also, 3tbsp of gypsum applies to what weight of WBS? is that 3tbsp to whatever amount? I can't find gypsum and just used 3tbsp lime / kilo of red millet for the reason  better than nothing since I read that I can getaway without gypsum. I'll give it a 24 hr soak.

Also, I could only find pure red millet or pure white millet and can't find a mix with various seeds so I'm wondering if the water retention capacity will severly differ and if I need to make adjustments.

Thank you all.

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OfflineTrippyJuice
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Re: No Cook WBS [Re: tropics23to33c]
    #23613092 - 09/04/16 10:54 PM (8 years, 4 months ago)

I used this tek how does this jar look after PC'ing it?



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