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Maddhatter25
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Registered: 06/22/14
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Question about FC tub
#20227089 - 07/05/14 04:27 AM (10 years, 6 months ago) |
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So my first grow went mostly well (it got contam. when i put perlite as casing after fruiting had already began; which i found to be my only issue) and I've since fixed the issue i had. I am currently waiting on 2 bags to colonize, 1 is a 2lb, and the other an 8 oz bag. For bulking purposes I have acquired a 5 lb grow bag of 50/50 manure/straw. NOW my question is this; would I be better off colonizing the poo/straw in the bag and the taking out to put into my FC or would it do better to cut open the poo/straw bag and evenly disburse into the FC and colonize it that way? I'm asking in regards to contam possibility and end yield.
I don't think this matters but just in case I am growing Puerto Rican Cubes)
(BTW; even with that late contam i still got 2 LARGE handfuls of immature mushies and some pins that were SUPER POTENT)
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Edited by Maddhatter25 (07/05/14 04:59 AM)
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Maddhatter25
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I love how people on shroomery say to post if needing help and then read and do nothing to help. Over 30 people and not one was helpful enough to answer.
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mushpunx
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Dude sometimes people just click to read your post but don't have an answer. I don't think people will respond well to that attitude.
But as far as I know the manure straw mix is meant to be a bulk substrate that you would need to add spawn to, ive never used straw but usually one would inoculate a jar of grains or bird seed and then once it is colonized mix it into the straw/manure mix.
I think those bags are sold so you don't have to pasteurized the mix yourself.
People use vermiculite as a casing layer, Ive never heard of anyone using perlite. Perlite is usually dampened and used in a fruiting chamber to keep humidity high. I think you got them confused with each other.
What are you using as a fruiting chamber? You would probably have to mix the straw/poo/spawn into a big tray or in a monotub type configuration.
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Edited by mushpunx (07/05/14 08:13 PM)
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Maddhatter25
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Re: Question about FC tub [Re: mushpunx]
#20230605 - 07/06/14 12:10 AM (10 years, 6 months ago) |
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out of 32 people viewing in an hour; 1 on a forum used for questions JUST LIKE THIS 1 had to know the answer lol its ridiculous to think at least 1 in 30 didn't.
I realize the verm/perl issue and fixed it. my question was Should i use the bag once transfer to the manure/straw is ready or should i open the poo bag and dump it into the tub and then mix the myc into it there. I used the first method the last time. I cut the poo bag open and put the myc in and clipped and then just transferred the brick. I'm just curious if the other way would be better or should i do what i did last time.
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shamanamba
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It's difficult to get a clear picture of what exactly you're asking, but it seems as if you're requesting opinions on whether or not you should spawn your colonized bags to bulk.
And that really just depends on how much time/patience you have.
If you feel like spawning it and waiting a little longer for a larger grow, then go for it.
However;
You have a 5 pound bag of bulk substrate and only 1.5 pounds of spawn. That ratio is ballsy if you're a beginner. RR's been known to go as low as 20:1 but he's just that good.
-------------------- The Shaman
Edited by shamanamba (07/06/14 12:42 AM)
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Maddhatter25
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Re: Question about FC tub [Re: shamanamba]
#20231086 - 07/06/14 05:34 AM (10 years, 6 months ago) |
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I'm bulking either way but should I spread the bulk and then mix the myc in or just do it in the bag until it's ready for the tub. I am good for the ratio I think. Last time as 8oz in 1lb but I have no issue waiting and don't have issues with contam. I have a sterile area I work in and plenty of patience.
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mushpunx
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What's in the bags you are using as spawn?
I think its fine to mix it all up in the bag and pour it into the tub to let the spawn colonize the manure.
I think people are having a hard time to answer your questions because your wording is confusing mate
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Maddhatter25
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Re: Question about FC tub [Re: mushpunx]
#20234962 - 07/06/14 10:50 PM (10 years, 6 months ago) |
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Lol that's fair. The bags are brf. If I mix in tub is there a larger chance of contam or no?
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toxetel
׀ǝʇǝxoʇ ●


Registered: 08/13/12
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Quote:
Maddhatter25 said: I love how people on shroomery say to post if needing help and then read and do nothing to help. Over 30 people and not one was helpful enough to answer.
I'm sure giving us shit about not falling over ourselves to serve you will encourage people to help you.
Also, what makes you think those 30 people were qualified to answer? There are waaaaay more newbies than experts on these forums. Do you really want someone who doesn't know what they're talking about to tell you what to do?
Also also, read the rules thread. Bumping your thread after less than 24 hours is grounds for having the thread deleted.

Anyway.
You probably don't have a sterile work area, unless you're referring to the inside of a still-air box. That's okay, though; spawning to bulk isn't a sterile procedure.
Your mentions of a fruiting chamber are a little unclear. Let's clarify: A fruiting chamber is a container of some kind that provides the humidity and fresh air exchange required for a fruiting substrate. A shotgun terrarium is the type of fruiting chamber usually used and recommended for fruiting cakes. In the past, people have used poor man's pods and even just aquariums. Sometimes people build Marthas -- large fruiting chambers made out of mini-greenhouses. In each case, colonized cakes or trays are placed in the fruiting chamber.
A monotub (or the double-tub that preceded it) is a special case -- it's essentially a tray that has a built-in single-use fruiting chamber. The entire bottom of the tub is filled with bulk substrate mixed with spawn, and holes in the sides are covered. The spawn colonizes the substrate in the tub, and then fruiting is initiated by uncovering the holes. The moisture in the bulk substrate provides the needed humidity.
If you want to do a monotub grow, then combine your manure/straw with your crumbled spawn in the tub. The tub should be sized appropriately for the spawn and bulk substrate to, combined, fill the tub to about 4 inches. You should also have the holes already cut in it, and covered with duct tape. Many (maybe most) people also recommend using a plastic liner rather than just tossing your spawn and bulk substrate into the tub directly.
However, if you have a full functional fruiting chamber and want to do a fruiting chamber grow, then you should combine the spawn with the bulk substrate in the bag. Once it's fully colonized, take it out of the bag and put it into your fruiting chamber.
You shouldn't just colonize it in the bag and then put the bag in a tub. While it's possible for an expert to make that work, a beginner should follow some kind of established technique instead.
Neither approach is really more likely to result in contamination than the other. If your bulk substrate is properly pasteurized and your spawn is 100% colonized, it's very unlikely to contaminate.
As for yield, there are way too many variables to make any kind of guess. Neither approach is likely to result in significantly greater yield than the other.
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Maddhatter25
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Re: Question about FC tub [Re: toxetel]
#20235854 - 07/07/14 04:48 AM (10 years, 6 months ago) |
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That answered what I needed. And I have an FC. I have a tub tv with fan and all. Thanks for the reply; I guess I will do it how I did last time without casing
I didn't realized on the bump so I'll remember and your right; I was out of line and they likely didn't know when put like that. So to all I apologize
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toxetel
׀ǝʇǝxoʇ ●


Registered: 08/13/12
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Cool, happy to help. And way to take accountability.
What's a tub tv? And what are you doing with a fan? Most fruiting chamber designs don't use fans; they tend to ruin humidity.
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Maddhatter25
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Re: Question about FC tub [Re: toxetel]
#20236493 - 07/07/14 10:10 AM (10 years, 6 months ago) |
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tub. lol the tv was a typo.
and on accountability; all should lol
i do good with the fan. they grew fast last time. i use it a couple times a day as a means of air flow to reduce contam possibility.
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PsilocyBen17
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Quote:
Maddhatter25 said: out of 32 people viewing in an hour; 1 on a forum used for questions JUST LIKE THIS 1 had to know the answer lol its ridiculous to think at least 1 in 30 didn't.
People arent responding to your thread because they are afraid of sounding rude. As Sham said you havent really painted a clear picture of what your trying to do here and to make things even more convoluted you are mixing up the terms FC and Monotub. Aside from those issues your attitude is pretty crappy.
Those issues asside here are my two cents on your problem:
1) Dont use growkits. If the 50/50 bag you "aquired" was ordered online it will probably fail. Most people have really bad luck with them.
2) I can tell you are probably going to try to fruit it anyway. If it was me, I would sterilize it first, even if it was "presterilized" when you ordered it. Then I would inoculate and let the sub colonize in the bag. After its completely colonized I would transfer it to the MONOTUB and give it a week to recover before casing it with verm/coir.
Dont take this personally but it doesnt sound like you have the experience to succeed with the grows you are trying. Manure/straw is a very diverse sub prone to contamination unless you pasturize it properly and take the proper precautions. I suggest sticking with the PF Tek and bulk trays for 1 or 2 more grows. Once you are ready for a monotub try Verm/Coir. Is almost impossible to mess up.
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Maddhatter25
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This has been answered but thanks.
And poo/straw bags have worked great when i buy from Out Grow
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toxetel
׀ǝʇǝxoʇ ●


Registered: 08/13/12
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Quote:
Maddhatter25 said: This has been answered but thanks.
Careful with this -- you don't want to be dismissive of people trying to offer you help. I'm glad you found my answer helpful, but please don't think my answer is the only "right" answer. You'd be much better off taking everyone's input. PsilocyBen17's post contains wisdom.
As for the tub and fan, well... I do believe it's possible to successfully grow in that chamber you've got, but you really would be better off with a proper shotgun terrarium, with holes on all 6 sides, some kind of support to elevate it off the platform it's sitting on, about 5 inches of damp perlite, and no fan. I'm confident you'd see better results.
Using the fan a couple of times a day isn't a way to reduce contamination possibility... I'm curious what your thought pattern is on that.
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PsilocyBen17
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Re: Question about FC tub [Re: toxetel]
#20237712 - 07/07/14 03:44 PM (10 years, 6 months ago) |
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I agree with what Toxetel has said. Construct a proper SGFC and use it to fruit bulk cakes of BRF spawned to verm/coir. You really need to master the basics before moving on to Mono's, otherwise all you will yield is trichoderma.
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mushpunx
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I think all that fan is going to do is change out some of the stale air. Unless you have it on a timer or something you might as well just fan it with the lid for 30 seconds or so.
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Maddhatter25
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Re: Question about FC tub [Re: toxetel]
#20240760 - 07/08/14 05:12 AM (10 years, 6 months ago) |
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You have a point with dismissing. I am new lol My tub is filled on all sides a top. And perlite i have and will do I also have drilled holes in the lid. The tub is the bed I could afford. Any other advice is welcome from all. Thanks to everyone who has helped thus far ^_^
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Maddhatter25
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I fan directly into tub 3 times a day for a half hour and point a large fan cockeye at the tub otherwise for base so flow. My last grow the mushrooms doubled in size in 24 hours and I had no aborts at all. Had didn't raise t but used 2" perlite and covered with plastic wrap. And I never directly squirted with water but instead squirted the walls so it would be used as needed through air. Misting maybe 6 times a day due to the fan drying it out a bit
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PussyFart
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Quote:
Maddhatter25 said: I fan directly into tub 3 times a day for a half hour and point a large fan cockeye at the tub otherwise for base so flow. My last grow the mushrooms doubled in size in 24 hours and I had no aborts at all. Had didn't raise t but used 2" perlite and covered with plastic wrap. And I never directly squirted with water but instead squirted the walls so it would be used as needed through air. Misting maybe 6 times a day due to the fan drying it out a bit
Fanning out the tub for 30 minutes at a time is pointless....all you need is 30 seconds, after you mist the cakes.
Never have a fan pointed directly at a fruiting chamber, and never have one running in the same room as a SGFC.
And you want to mist the cakes directly, never the walls of the chamber.
We mist the cakes to replace lost moisture from evaporation....we fan out the chamber afterwards to promote evaporation.
Mist the cakes, not the walls of the FC.
--------------------
THIS HOBBY IS NOT FOR THE IMPATIENT! PLEASE BE PATIENT, DON'T BE A PATIENT!
A Tale of 10 Isolates, GT Cluster Clone Monotubs, RR's Let's Grow Mushrooms DVD,
SGFC(Shotgun Fruiting Chamber), Monotub Tek, Damion5050's Coir Tek, TL's Tek List, Frank's Tek List,
EvilMushroom666's Pasteurization Tek, How It Should & Shouldn't Look - NEW CULTIVATORS GUIDE
*** *** AFGHAN KUSH GROW LOG *** ***
Edited by PussyFart (07/08/14 05:22 AM)
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toxetel
׀ǝʇǝxoʇ ●


Registered: 08/13/12
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Read PussyFart's advice.
Is there a reason that you seem to be trying to do everything differently from how everyone says to? If it's because you don't know that it's different, I strongly recommend you watch RogerRabbit's "Let's Grow Mushrooms!" videos.
Like I keep saying, it's possible to get mushrooms with your approach, but you'll be much better off following established teks. Just the fact that whatever fruits you had didn't abort and doubled in size in 24 hours doesn't mean you're doing it right. Cubensis practically grows itself even in unfavorable conditions, but if you provide good conditions you'll get waaaaaaay more yield with less effort.
Moist perlite doesn't really accomplish much without the tub being elevated with holes on the bottom. You need air to be passing through it to make the water evaporate.
Misting water on the walls doesn't produce the high-humidity microclimate at the surface of the substrate that you need to initiate lots of pinning. The mist needs to land on the substrate itself.
And because that's what you're doing with misting, fanning should usually only be done directly after misting, to kick-start the evaporation process. The rest of the time, your fruiting chamber should be providing enough passive fresh air exchange (Cubensis doesn't need all that much fresh air exchange as compared to other species). Your particular fruiting chamber can't do that, though, because you don't have it elevated and you have the top sealed off. Electric fans almost always result in badly dehydrated substrate.
So, to summarize: You've got several people trying really hard to help you, but it's getting very frustrating; you're doing a lot of things wrong, and it sounds like you don't even know it's wrong. Please do the most basic research of watching RR's videos.
Until then, good luck.
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Maddhatter25
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Re: Question about FC tub [Re: PussyFart]
#20240931 - 07/08/14 06:42 AM (10 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
PussyFart said:
Quote:
Maddhatter25 said: I fan directly into tub 3 times a day for a half hour and point a large fan cockeye at the tub otherwise for base so flow. My last grow the mushrooms doubled in size in 24 hours and I had no aborts at all. Had didn't raise t but used 2" perlite and covered with plastic wrap. And I never directly squirted with water but instead squirted the walls so it would be used as needed through air. Misting maybe 6 times a day due to the fan drying it out a bit
Fanning out the tub for 30 minutes at a time is pointless....all you need is 30 seconds, after you mist the cakes.
Never have a fan pointed directly at a fruiting chamber, and never have one running in the same room as a SGFC.
And you want to mist the cakes directly, never the walls of the chamber.
We mist the cakes to replace lost moisture from evaporation....we fan out the chamber afterwards to promote evaporation.
Mist the cakes, not the walls of the FC.
thank you very much I will do this instead then.
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Maddhatter25
Interdimentional Tripper



Registered: 06/22/14
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Re: Question about FC tub [Re: toxetel]
#20240941 - 07/08/14 06:46 AM (10 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
toxetel said: Read PussyFart's advice.
Is there a reason that you seem to be trying to do everything differently from how everyone says to? If it's because you don't know that it's different, I strongly recommend you watch RogerRabbit's "Let's Grow Mushrooms!" videos.
Like I keep saying, it's possible to get mushrooms with your approach, but you'll be much better off following established teks. Just the fact that whatever fruits you had didn't abort and doubled in size in 24 hours doesn't mean you're doing it right. Cubensis practically grows itself even in unfavorable conditions, but if you provide good conditions you'll get waaaaaaay more yield with less effort.
Moist perlite doesn't really accomplish much without the tub being elevated with holes on the bottom. You need air to be passing through it to make the water evaporate.
Misting water on the walls doesn't produce the high-humidity microclimate at the surface of the substrate that you need to initiate lots of pinning. The mist needs to land on the substrate itself.
And because that's what you're doing with misting, fanning should usually only be done directly after misting, to kick-start the evaporation process. The rest of the time, your fruiting chamber should be providing enough passive fresh air exchange (Cubensis doesn't need all that much fresh air exchange as compared to other species). Your particular fruiting chamber can't do that, though, because you don't have it elevated and you have the top sealed off. Electric fans almost always result in badly dehydrated substrate.
So, to summarize: You've got several people trying really hard to help you, but it's getting very frustrating; you're doing a lot of things wrong, and it sounds like you don't even know it's wrong. Please do the most basic research of watching RR's videos.
Until then, good luck.
Im only speaking on what I already did to compare. I changing to all these things you guys are saying. Sorry for the misunderstanding. I am updating my setup to accommodate so it'll be ready when fruiting time arrives. So I should drill holes on the bottom of the tub then on top of what I have everywhere? is there a spacing you'd recommend?
Ill check those videos ASAP also. I'm seeing many flaws in how I was doing things lol Cant wait to see the differences in yield. Thanks again duder!!
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Edited by Maddhatter25 (07/08/14 06:48 AM)
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PussyFart
Retired Cultivation Extrodinaire



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1/4"(6mm) holes every 2" in a grid pattern on all 6 sides.
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THIS HOBBY IS NOT FOR THE IMPATIENT! PLEASE BE PATIENT, DON'T BE A PATIENT!
A Tale of 10 Isolates, GT Cluster Clone Monotubs, RR's Let's Grow Mushrooms DVD,
SGFC(Shotgun Fruiting Chamber), Monotub Tek, Damion5050's Coir Tek, TL's Tek List, Frank's Tek List,
EvilMushroom666's Pasteurization Tek, How It Should & Shouldn't Look - NEW CULTIVATORS GUIDE
*** *** AFGHAN KUSH GROW LOG *** ***
Edited by PussyFart (07/08/14 06:47 AM)
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Maddhatter25
Interdimentional Tripper



Registered: 06/22/14
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Re: Question about FC tub [Re: PussyFart]
#20240949 - 07/08/14 06:49 AM (10 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
PussyFart said: 1/4"(6mm) holes every 2" in a grid pattern on all 6 sides.
I have the first 5 so all i gotta do is the bottom. Thanks man! ill od that as soon as I'm off of here.
Any other tips?
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PsilocyBen17
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Re: Question about FC tub [Re: PussyFart]
#20241500 - 07/08/14 10:42 AM (10 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
PussyFart said:
Quote:
Maddhatter25 said: I fan directly into tub 3 times a day for a half hour and point a large fan cockeye at the tub otherwise for base so flow. My last grow the mushrooms doubled in size in 24 hours and I had no aborts at all. Had didn't raise t but used 2" perlite and covered with plastic wrap. And I never directly squirted with water but instead squirted the walls so it would be used as needed through air. Misting maybe 6 times a day due to the fan drying it out a bit
Fanning out the tub for 30 minutes at a time is pointless....all you need is 30 seconds, after you mist the cakes.
Never have a fan pointed directly at a fruiting chamber, and never have one running in the same room as a SGFC.
And you want to mist the cakes directly, never the walls of the chamber.
We mist the cakes to replace lost moisture from evaporation....we fan out the chamber afterwards to promote evaporation.
Mist the cakes, not the walls of the FC.
Hey Pussyfart. Interesting to hear this about the fan. I have a fan pointed at a plate of shrooms right now to help dry them out. It happens to be in the same room as my SGFC. I mostly do tubs now but my SGFC is filled with some nicely fruiting bulk at the moment and I have had the fan in the same room as the FC in previous grows. Why do you say this is a bad idea?
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PussyFart
Retired Cultivation Extrodinaire



Registered: 04/08/12
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Quote:
PsilocyBen17 said: Hey Pussyfart. Interesting to hear this about the fan. I have a fan pointed at a plate of shrooms right now to help dry them out. It happens to be in the same room as my SGFC. I mostly do tubs now but my SGFC is filled with some nicely fruiting bulk at the moment and I have had the fan in the same room as the FC in previous grows. Why do you say this is a bad idea?
www.mushroomvideos.com/Terrarium-Tek
A fan in the room will mess with the proper functionality of the SGFC.
You want the SGFC in a room with no running fans, so air can naturally circulate around the tub.
A fan could very well make the RH drop.
--------------------
THIS HOBBY IS NOT FOR THE IMPATIENT! PLEASE BE PATIENT, DON'T BE A PATIENT!
A Tale of 10 Isolates, GT Cluster Clone Monotubs, RR's Let's Grow Mushrooms DVD,
SGFC(Shotgun Fruiting Chamber), Monotub Tek, Damion5050's Coir Tek, TL's Tek List, Frank's Tek List,
EvilMushroom666's Pasteurization Tek, How It Should & Shouldn't Look - NEW CULTIVATORS GUIDE
*** *** AFGHAN KUSH GROW LOG *** ***
Edited by PussyFart (07/08/14 10:51 AM)
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Maddhatter25
Interdimentional Tripper



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Re: Question about FC tub [Re: PussyFart]
#20246716 - 07/09/14 08:48 AM (10 years, 6 months ago) |
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If FC is fruiting chamber
What is SGFC?
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Dos Ounce
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shotgun fruiting chamber.
and I saw where you only had 2 inches of perlite? that's a little skimpy, I would go for 4 or 5 inches 
not to say it'll fuck your grow or anything, but I feel like 2 inches may not get the job done quite as well. As in it will exhaust its moisture much faster and you will have to mist/re-hydrate it more frequently.
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Maddhatter25
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Re: Question about FC tub [Re: Dos Ounce]
#20246800 - 07/09/14 09:12 AM (10 years, 6 months ago) |
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What is different with a shotgun chamber?
Ill up the inches lol thanks
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Dos Ounce
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check out the link on SGFCs in pussyfarts sig, it'll tell you all you need to know
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Mdahmer
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Re: Question about FC tub [Re: Dos Ounce]
#20246823 - 07/09/14 09:19 AM (10 years, 6 months ago) |
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Ben I had a fan going with my SGFC, I just misted more often and when I did mist I fucking drenched my cakes and bulk cakes like a mofo and they would dry out a lil bit later,
I wasn't working again yet so I could most a lot and they actually did real well lol, they love fresh air more than anything as long as you don't let em dry out...I wish people emphasized that more to newer folks, I always see everyone tripping on humidity, it's all about he fresh air man..and a lil about the RH
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mushpunx
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Re: Question about FC tub [Re: Mdahmer]
#20246949 - 07/09/14 09:51 AM (10 years, 6 months ago) |
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My tubs seem to be doing fine but I worry because the central air vents are along the floor, its hard to keep the tubs out of it.
I have a fan drying fruits in the room too, im trying to make better space to fix it
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toxetel
׀ǝʇǝxoʇ ●


Registered: 08/13/12
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Re: Question about FC tub [Re: mushpunx]
#20247146 - 07/09/14 10:54 AM (10 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
mushpunx said: My tubs seem to be doing fine but I worry because the central air vents are along the floor, its hard to keep the tubs out of it.
http://www.amazon.com/Thermwell-Products-MC815-8x15-Cover/dp/B001HQF8V2
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PussyFart
Retired Cultivation Extrodinaire



Registered: 04/08/12
Posts: 22,502
Loc: Orbiting Earth
Last seen: 7 months, 28 days
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Quote:
Maddhatter25 said: What is different with a shotgun chamber?
Click the link I posted.
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THIS HOBBY IS NOT FOR THE IMPATIENT! PLEASE BE PATIENT, DON'T BE A PATIENT!
A Tale of 10 Isolates, GT Cluster Clone Monotubs, RR's Let's Grow Mushrooms DVD,
SGFC(Shotgun Fruiting Chamber), Monotub Tek, Damion5050's Coir Tek, TL's Tek List, Frank's Tek List,
EvilMushroom666's Pasteurization Tek, How It Should & Shouldn't Look - NEW CULTIVATORS GUIDE
*** *** AFGHAN KUSH GROW LOG *** ***
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PsilocyBen17
Pin Pornographer


Registered: 10/20/13
Posts: 3,751
Last seen: 2 years, 29 days
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Re: Question about FC tub [Re: PussyFart]
#20250809 - 07/09/14 11:04 PM (10 years, 6 months ago) |
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PLEASE watch the RR VIDEOS!
THEY ARE HERE TO HELP YOU!!!
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