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zazaray
FNG

Registered: 09/30/12
Posts: 29
Last seen: 3 years, 26 days
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Rye Grass Jars too wet?
#20224232 - 07/04/14 01:39 PM (10 years, 6 months ago) |
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Not the first time SWIM has done rye grass jars, ratio is 5/8 water to 1 1/4 cup grain. Let soak in the jars about 3-4 hours, after a shake, then PC for 90 mins at 15 PSI. Good results in the past with this method. However, last two batches of jars(14)from the PC knocked up with B+ MS syringe colonized slowly and when attempting to birth, although jar seemed fully colonized, when mycelium chunks were broken up some of the grains seemed slimy. Looked like the jars were waterlogged. Put in monotubs anyway, 20% verm, 80% coir, about a 1:4 ratio and they did nothing. Didn't colonize at all, nothing a month later.
These jars turned out a little better--first 2 pics were PCed 2 days ago and shaken up. Next 2 pics, first one shows right out of the PC, then shook like hell. They still seem pretty wet to me. No gauge on the PC, so unsure if it's the full 15 PSI. Does it seem like PC isn't doing it's job? Hesitant about inoculating these jars if they just stall/rot, whatever happened to them. RR, would love to hear some input from you, if you're around, or anyone with experience with rye grass seed. This is SWIMs fourth grow and doesn't know what's going on this time. Same PC used before, same methods.



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Violet



Registered: 12/06/11
Posts: 4,205
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Re: Rye Grass Jars too wet? [Re: zazaray]
#20224377 - 07/04/14 02:08 PM (10 years, 6 months ago) |
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Slimy? No recovered growth? Sounds like you had bacterial contam.
This is more likely to happen when there's excess water, both because excess water is an ideal grounds for bacteria to thrive and because excess water may also increase the amount of sterilization time that is needed to eliminate all endospores.
Please show us your PC. It's possible it's a kitchen cooker that may only go to 12-13 psi, requiring more time, in which case having too much water could possibly put you behind the line of full sterilization.
I've grown primarily with grass seed for a long time, lots of grows. Many of my successful grows were on grass seed that seemed a bit too wet, as yours does. But my contam rate with wetter seed like that also went up a bit when I didn't sterilize extra-thoroughly.
Be sure you're straining your grass seed thoroughly after you boil it. The seed can take quite a hard boiling, but the tiny seeds retain lots of excess water among their surfaces. Shake as much water off as you can, tossing it up-and-down-and-all-around in a strainer, before loading it for sterilization.
Then make sure your containers aren't letting in lots of steam from the cooker, making them just a bit too wet.
Good luck in the future!
-------------------- Intentionally or not, here in mushcult we are purveyors of love culture and enlightenment movement. Let's try to act like it!
PODS TEK - Growing Invitro with BRF/verm or Grass Seed containers
The simplest, quickest, safest tek! For beginners, culturers, lazy people, stealth lovers, contam haters, and alternative seekers!
• Violet's Teks and Posts •
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zazaray
FNG

Registered: 09/30/12
Posts: 29
Last seen: 3 years, 26 days
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Re: Rye Grass Jars too wet? [Re: Violet]
#20224461 - 07/04/14 02:31 PM (10 years, 6 months ago) |
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OK, here is a pic of the PC--or at least the box it came in and the rocker. It's a 16 QT Presto. What's odd is the rocker that came with it doesn't look like the rocker pictured on the box, making me wonder...
Actually don't do the method of boiling/straining. Put 1 1/4 cup of grain in jar, 5/8 cup water, shake, cover, let sit for 3-4 hours, then PC. 80-90% success rate on jars last grow, approx 28 jars done.
Thanks for the insight. Good to know you grow on wetter grains as well, just seems in the past, with the same methods, the grains seemed drier, more fluffy.
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DetectiveLefty
Nullius in verba



Registered: 10/12/13
Posts: 177
Loc: Floriduh, USA
Last seen: 4 years, 10 months
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Re: Rye Grass Jars too wet? [Re: Violet]
#20224468 - 07/04/14 02:33 PM (10 years, 6 months ago) |
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Tell SWIY to do RR's tp test before loading the jars next time. Put 1 tbsp of hydrated grain on a square of toilet paper for 10 seconds- if there's a wet spot on the TP, the grain is too wet.
RR's videos, by the way, offer a more or less foolproof method for hydrating grains (among other things). Best $9 I ever spent. I keep them on my phone for reference when I'm doing any kind of media prep. Much easier than searching the forums.
-DL
-------------------- I swear on a stack of Bibles that everything I said in the above post is the 100% literal Truth.
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zazaray
FNG

Registered: 09/30/12
Posts: 29
Last seen: 3 years, 26 days
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Thank you, Lefty, yeah, I've watched RR's vids and respect his methods immensely. This tek, with loading the jars with just water/grain has worked for me in the past, but perhaps I should go to a simmer/strain tek since something has obviously changed.
Trying to keep my steps as few as possible, but considering RR's methods are pretty consistent, perhaps I just scrap these jars and go that route? I'll prob knock up half of them and see what happens, start again.
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zazaray
FNG

Registered: 09/30/12
Posts: 29
Last seen: 3 years, 26 days
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Re: Rye Grass Jars too wet? [Re: zazaray]
#20224545 - 07/04/14 02:48 PM (10 years, 6 months ago) |
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Oops, forgot to put SWIM on my last post...cat's outta the bag
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Violet



Registered: 12/06/11
Posts: 4,205
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Re: Rye Grass Jars too wet? [Re: zazaray]
#20225116 - 07/04/14 05:49 PM (10 years, 6 months ago) |
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I also had pretty good luck just adding water and grain to jars, but I found it to be inconsistent. A slight difference in volume of water, or the seed being more or less settled to varying apparent volumes, can throw it off a lot. Also the seed doesn't always hydrate evenly. The ones in the bottom of the jar when loaded to sterilize usually become wetter and the ones on top drier.
Try boiling and straining. Grass seed doesn't take long to be cooked and hydrated, but can also be cooked longer than others since it won't explode like other grains. Although other people have different experiences (I bet it's due to being used to other grains), I feel grass seed is extremely easy to prepare and pretty easy to use, especially in plastic containers.
That cooker should be fine, 15PSI. Just be sure to start the timer (in your case, 90min) once 15PSI is reached, retain it the whole time, then after you turn the stove off when the timer is up let the pressure drop naturally to 0 before opening. (Since you're using glass, you may choose to let the contents cool to room temp as to not burn yourself handling them right after pressure is down)
-------------------- Intentionally or not, here in mushcult we are purveyors of love culture and enlightenment movement. Let's try to act like it!
PODS TEK - Growing Invitro with BRF/verm or Grass Seed containers
The simplest, quickest, safest tek! For beginners, culturers, lazy people, stealth lovers, contam haters, and alternative seekers!
• Violet's Teks and Posts •
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PussyFart
Retired Cultivation Extrodinaire



Registered: 04/08/12
Posts: 22,502
Loc: Orbiting Earth
Last seen: 7 months, 28 days
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Re: Rye Grass Jars too wet? [Re: zazaray]
#20225128 - 07/04/14 05:55 PM (10 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
zazaray said: Oops, forgot to put SWIM on my last post...cat's outta the bag
It was never in a bag to begin with.....you cannot hide behind words here....
--------------------
THIS HOBBY IS NOT FOR THE IMPATIENT! PLEASE BE PATIENT, DON'T BE A PATIENT!
A Tale of 10 Isolates, GT Cluster Clone Monotubs, RR's Let's Grow Mushrooms DVD,
SGFC(Shotgun Fruiting Chamber), Monotub Tek, Damion5050's Coir Tek, TL's Tek List, Frank's Tek List,
EvilMushroom666's Pasteurization Tek, How It Should & Shouldn't Look - NEW CULTIVATORS GUIDE
*** *** AFGHAN KUSH GROW LOG *** ***
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DetectiveLefty
Nullius in verba



Registered: 10/12/13
Posts: 177
Loc: Floriduh, USA
Last seen: 4 years, 10 months
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Re: Rye Grass Jars too wet? [Re: zazaray]
#20231303 - 07/06/14 07:52 AM (10 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
zazaray said: ... Trying to keep my steps as few as possible, but considering RR's methods are pretty consistent, perhaps I just scrap these jars and go that route? I'll prob knock up half of them and see what happens, start again.
Yeah, probably less work in the long run to start over. It'll be interesting to compare results of the two methods anyway.
-------------------- I swear on a stack of Bibles that everything I said in the above post is the 100% literal Truth.
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dietrich
Zauberpilz-Esser



Registered: 07/06/10
Posts: 319
Last seen: 6 years, 7 months
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Re: Rye Grass Jars too wet? [Re: zazaray]
#20231536 - 07/06/14 09:49 AM (10 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
zazaray said: OK, here is a pic of the PC--or at least the box it came in and the rocker. It's a 16 QT Presto. What's odd is the rocker that came with it doesn't look like the rocker pictured on the box, making me wonder...

I have the same pressure cooker, it's been working great for me. The rocker is the right one. On the box, it's pictured set up for lower then 15 PSI, meaning one of the metal rings isn't pictured. For 15 PSI, you will use the whole mechanism without any metal rings removed from it.
-------------------- Ich heiße Dietrich der Zauberpilz-Esser und bringe ich Frieden und Liebe für alle.
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zazaray
FNG

Registered: 09/30/12
Posts: 29
Last seen: 3 years, 26 days
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Re: Rye Grass Jars too wet? [Re: dietrich]
#20242211 - 07/08/14 01:28 PM (10 years, 6 months ago) |
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Thanks to you all for your posts, I decided to knock up half the jars and lets see what happens. Violet, as you said, it will be interesting to compare the two methods. I definitely agree with you, it would seem you have more control and consistent results by boiling, which is what I will do next time.
Dietrich, thanks for the post, yeah, I'm definitely using it with everything on the rocker, so good to go...
Violet, you said you have good results with plastic containers--do you mean for your jars? I've seen others use plastic containers on the forum, but unsure how you'd PC?
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Violet



Registered: 12/06/11
Posts: 4,205
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Re: Rye Grass Jars too wet? [Re: zazaray]
#20243124 - 07/08/14 04:33 PM (10 years, 6 months ago) |
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You PC the containers the same way you microwave them - with a slightly unscrewed lid, so that it's not air-tight. Note the lids say "UNSCREW BEFORE MICROWAVING" or something like that.
I use 16oz and 32oz Ziploc screw-top containers for literally everything.
-------------------- Intentionally or not, here in mushcult we are purveyors of love culture and enlightenment movement. Let's try to act like it!
PODS TEK - Growing Invitro with BRF/verm or Grass Seed containers
The simplest, quickest, safest tek! For beginners, culturers, lazy people, stealth lovers, contam haters, and alternative seekers!
• Violet's Teks and Posts •
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