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aww
Stranger

Registered: 07/04/14
Posts: 44
Last seen: 10 years, 2 months
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Simple LC questions
#20223875 - 07/04/14 12:33 PM (10 years, 6 months ago) |
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Hi
I am considering trying LC for my first grow and making it from a print. What are the reasons people use LC? Do I have to remove the needle because of the thickness?
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Pastywhyte
Say hello to my little friend



Registered: 09/15/12
Posts: 37,972
Loc: Canada
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Re: Simple LC questions [Re: aww]
#20223942 - 07/04/14 12:43 PM (10 years, 6 months ago) |
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Do not inoculate LC with spores. Agar is the only safe inoculate for LC in my opinion. LC is a fast method of mycelium expansion but is prone to contamination and difficult to judge how clean It actually is. Because cubes can be expanded quicky via G2G and recover from shaking quickly LC is kinda frowned upon for cubes. It is definitely not a good method for working with culture for a new grower. Start with agar first and get that skill down. It fun and easy.
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MonkeyJesusFresco
am i suspended in agar?



Registered: 10/09/12
Posts: 3,308
Loc: South East USA
Last seen: 24 days, 19 hours
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Re: Simple LC questions [Re: Pastywhyte]
#20223953 - 07/04/14 12:46 PM (10 years, 6 months ago) |
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and you can check the journal links in my sig for a quick, up-to-date, place to start!
-------------------- LAGM v 2.024
- endo cabendo
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HybridprX
Biodegrader of coir



Registered: 01/29/08
Posts: 2,588
Loc: Canada
Last seen: 7 years, 4 months
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Liquid cultures work just fine but you need to have the proper lid setup for them.
You can start one direct from spores or use a piece of mushroom tissue to create a cloned culture, or as suggested; inoculation via a agar wedge.
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refried

Registered: 06/14/13
Posts: 3,675
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Re: Simple LC questions [Re: Pastywhyte]
#20224097 - 07/04/14 01:16 PM (10 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
Pastywhyte said: Do not inoculate LC with spores. Agar is the only safe inoculate for LC in my opinion. LC is a fast method of mycelium expansion but is prone to contamination and difficult to judge how clean It actually is. Because cubes can be expanded quicky via G2G and recover from shaking quickly LC is kinda frowned upon for cubes. It is definitely not a good method for working with culture for a new grower. Start with agar first and get that skill down. It fun and easy.
Hmm, I've made 2 lc with spores and it worked out great. Made 2 syringes into 100. For some this is ideal because they don't have the ability to do more because of various circumstances. My LC stay in the fridge and I just used one that was a year old to successfully knock up 12 grain jars.
Works for me.
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airdragon333
LC Advocate lol



Registered: 03/14/14
Posts: 325
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Re: Simple LC questions [Re: refried]
#20224150 - 07/04/14 01:26 PM (10 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
refried said: Works for me.
Lol, me too. Here is a link to a tek, I recommend the SITR - best growth with easy to procure ingredients.
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I'm not a mycologist but I did stay at a Holiday Inn last night.
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refried

Registered: 06/14/13
Posts: 3,675
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That's the tek I used. I used LME and dextrose. Hard to find that shit. Look for a home beer brewing supply store.
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MonkeyJesusFresco
am i suspended in agar?



Registered: 10/09/12
Posts: 3,308
Loc: South East USA
Last seen: 24 days, 19 hours
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Re: Simple LC questions [Re: aww]
#20224234 - 07/04/14 01:40 PM (10 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
aww said: I am considering trying LC for my first grow and making it from a print. What are the reasons people use LC? Do I have to remove the needle because of the thickness?
If this is your first grow, your effort/time/energy will be better spent learning to use agar and practicing your sterile technique. From there you can make as much LC as you damn well please, but I've yet to find a use for it (for cubes, that is)
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Pastywhyte
Say hello to my little friend



Registered: 09/15/12
Posts: 37,972
Loc: Canada
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I think the problem is that IME sporeprints are often dirty things. The only time I ever see contaminatoin on my agar is from spore or tissue inoculate. It is the most important vector to eliminate. So ya made 2 LC from spores. Great But after 200 you might feel different.
Where you got the spores is no guarantee either. Funny enough is that vendor prints are pretty bad, I trust my own prints more 
I use LC. I have 3 in my fridge right now and am making a new one right now But its use is limited for me when it comes to cubes, I find it far more useful for other species. I always inoculate it with agar.
I know people have gotten away with spores or tissue to LC, but it is not something I make a practice of doing, nor can I recommend it to someone new. Especially when they have no/little sterile inoculation experience.
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refried

Registered: 06/14/13
Posts: 3,675
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Re: Simple LC questions [Re: Pastywhyte]
#20224416 - 07/04/14 02:17 PM (10 years, 6 months ago) |
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Well, for my purposes I haven't needed any more than the 2 lc I made and maybe this guy won't need 200 either.
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DetectiveLefty
Nullius in verba



Registered: 10/12/13
Posts: 177
Loc: Floriduh, USA
Last seen: 4 years, 10 months
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Re: Simple LC questions [Re: aww]
#20224442 - 07/04/14 02:26 PM (10 years, 6 months ago) |
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Definitely recommend agar over LC. I've personally had good luck germinating a drop of spore solution on popcorn in 4 oz. jars (Fahtjars), then making a suspension of mycelium in sterile water for inoculation of BRF jars and quarts of rye grain. Fahtjars are also good for propagating clone material, and storage of strains for at least 6 months. My latest grow is giving 0% contamination from 6-month old cloned mycelium in fatjars (knock on wood), which has certainly saved me a lot of labor.
Bottom line, spore prints/syringes are almost never 100% clean- I've had 50% contamination rates on BRF jars from multispore. Plus, contams are hard to spot in LC until you've grown it out in media, and by then it's too late. Using fahtjars (agar would also work), I was able to salvage a syringe that was giving me 100% contamination when inoculating to BRF.
-DL
-------------------- I swear on a stack of Bibles that everything I said in the above post is the 100% literal Truth.
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Pastywhyte
Say hello to my little friend



Registered: 09/15/12
Posts: 37,972
Loc: Canada
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Re: Simple LC questions [Re: refried]
#20224443 - 07/04/14 02:26 PM (10 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
refried said: Well, for my purposes I haven't needed any more than the 2 lc I made and maybe this guy won't need 200 either. 
True but if he gets a dirty print (I would say that is actually pretty likely, at least 25% probably more) ends up with a dirty LC, and grows a lot of nasty, he might be pretty turned off of his first attempt. Your sample size of 2 is no indication of reliability. I am also not saying he needs to make 200 LC's, I am saying that would be a number you would need to accurately project what the probability of success would be. LC is a fickle bitch, she can turn on you at any time. OP can do as he wishes, as can anyone. But I will not ever have to feel bad cause I told someone to do something not guaranteed and they triched out on their first try.
Really myc expansion is not so difficult that we should need to cut corners. Agar is easy and is a great way to start an LC or inoculate a grain master.
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refried

Registered: 06/14/13
Posts: 3,675
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Re: Simple LC questions [Re: Pastywhyte]
#20224452 - 07/04/14 02:29 PM (10 years, 6 months ago) |
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Right, you have the issues straight, but other experience and advice is all I'm offering. For a grower like me it works great and I did it on my 2nd grow and I have no ability or desire to use anything else right now.
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Edmunter
Mr



Registered: 05/01/13
Posts: 5,699
Last seen: 3 months, 7 days
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Re: Simple LC questions [Re: Pastywhyte]
#20224460 - 07/04/14 02:31 PM (10 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
Pastywhyte said:
I find it far more useful for other species.
Hey Pasty! Hows it going bro?
Can you expand on this a little to explain why it better for other species and how and why you use it?
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Edmunter
Mr



Registered: 05/01/13
Posts: 5,699
Last seen: 3 months, 7 days
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Re: Simple LC questions [Re: Pastywhyte]
#20224476 - 07/04/14 02:35 PM (10 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
Pastywhyte said:
Quote:
refried said: Well, for my purposes I haven't needed any more than the 2 lc I made and maybe this guy won't need 200 either. 
True but if he gets a dirty print (I would say that is actually pretty likely, at least 25% probably more) ends up with a dirty LC, and grows a lot of nasty, he might be pretty turned off of his first attempt. Your sample size of 2 is no indication of reliability. I am also not saying he needs to make 200 LC's, I am saying that would be a number you would need to accurately project what the probability of success would be. LC is a fickle bitch, she can turn on you at any time. OP can do as he wishes, as can anyone. But I will not ever have to feel bad cause I told someone to do something not guaranteed and they triched out on their first try.
Really myc expansion is not so difficult that we should need to cut corners. Agar is easy and is a great way to start an LC or inoculate a grain master.
Totally correct and only an idiot would argue against it. Agar is easier than LC to use. It is a sure way of knowing your LC is clean.
Op- listen to this guy, he's taught me loads, including Pastys easy agar tek which is fool proof....... and im the proof and the fool.
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MonkeyJesusFresco
am i suspended in agar?



Registered: 10/09/12
Posts: 3,308
Loc: South East USA
Last seen: 24 days, 19 hours
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Re: Simple LC questions [Re: Edmunter]
#20224486 - 07/04/14 02:36 PM (10 years, 6 months ago) |
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refried

Registered: 06/14/13
Posts: 3,675
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Op, keep an open mind about your grow and don't take anything anybody tells you as the word of Jesus.
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Pastywhyte
Say hello to my little friend



Registered: 09/15/12
Posts: 37,972
Loc: Canada
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Re: Simple LC questions [Re: Edmunter]
#20224532 - 07/04/14 02:44 PM (10 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
Edmunter said:
Quote:
Pastywhyte said:
I find it far more useful for other species.
Hey Pasty! Hows it going bro?
Can you expand on this a little to explain why it better for other species and how and why you use it?

Well for some things it does make a difference. I like it for mexicana and galindoi for sure. I mean I have used agar and ms solution for those and LC is far better way to get em going. I also love how it performs with reishi which is fast enough on its own or G2G but with LC it just goes so fast. Its nice for pans too, and I like to do some of my edible experiments with it as well.
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Edmunter
Mr



Registered: 05/01/13
Posts: 5,699
Last seen: 3 months, 7 days
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Re: Simple LC questions [Re: refried]
#20224557 - 07/04/14 02:50 PM (10 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
refried said: Op, keep an open mind about your grow and don't take anything anybody tells you as the word of Jesus.
Everyone who are saying do Agar are experienced growers. All we are saying is that if you want a definitely clean LC then grow multispores on agar first. Making agar in tubs is a piece of piss. When you get round to learning it you will wonder why you were so scared of it in the first place. Growing any culture on agar first is the proven practised way, not the word of Jesus. Jesus would definitely isolate on agar and forget Liquid cultures completely.
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Edmunter
Mr



Registered: 05/01/13
Posts: 5,699
Last seen: 3 months, 7 days
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Re: Simple LC questions [Re: Pastywhyte]
#20224567 - 07/04/14 02:53 PM (10 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
Pastywhyte said:
Quote:
Edmunter said:
Quote:
Pastywhyte said:
I find it far more useful for other species.
Hey Pasty! Hows it going bro?
Can you expand on this a little to explain why it better for other species and how and why you use it?

Well for some things it does make a difference. I like it for mexicana and galindoi for sure. I mean I have used agar and ms solution for those and LC is far better way to get em going. I also love how it performs with reishi which is fast enough on its own or G2G but with LC it just goes so fast. Its nice for pans too, and I like to do some of my edible experiments with it as well.
Makes sense.
But still start the culture off on Agar to eliminate bacteria and mold would be the cleverest thing to do for these LC
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