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OfflineChowder
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A few question about my results [+crazy underfruting photo]
    #20203413 - 06/29/14 02:55 PM (10 years, 6 months ago)

So two quick topics here. I'd really like to hear a short feedback from more experienced people.

1)This grow. PE6 on rye to coir+verm. Really small fruits, but good pinset. I had to patches of trich going on. So I suspect that the myc put the energy into fighting the infection rather than big fruits.
However, when I got to harvesting, I kinda felt something on the side, and I decided to turn the "slab" over:

What a beautiful surprise. 2oz dry. And I think the underfruiting was about 60% of it. But I still dont understand why this happened. I did use liner.

2) I also crumbled some cakes into a monotub, same substrate. Here too, I'm getting only side pins


Is that fact that I dont have a fan working 24/7 in the room?
It's true, though I was not supposed to touch the tubs this whole time, I did fan them once a day, trying to replace the fan somehow.
I am doing something wrong, but not quite sure what.
Thanks!


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OfflineSagescruffy
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Re: A few question about my results [+crazy underfruting photo] [Re: Chowder]
    #20203431 - 06/29/14 02:59 PM (10 years, 6 months ago)

Maybe your tub isn't dialed in?


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OfflineSmokeDaDabs
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Re: A few question about my results [+crazy underfruting photo] [Re: Sagescruffy]
    #20203514 - 06/29/14 03:27 PM (10 years, 6 months ago)

shit I got two cased cakes about to start futing you got me all nervous :confused:


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OfflineChowder
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Re: A few question about my results [+crazy underfruting photo] [Re: SmokeDaDabs]
    #20203730 - 06/29/14 04:20 PM (10 years, 6 months ago)

Yeah, probably they aren't dialed in properly, but I'm wondering what conditions can cause the fruits to grow so much on the other side of the substrate. Or the side pins


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OfflineMdahmer
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Re: A few question about my results [+crazy underfruting photo] [Re: Chowder]
    #20203744 - 06/29/14 04:25 PM (10 years, 6 months ago)

Normally because that's the best conditions for them to grow in, when things aren't right up top it will fruit where it's got the nice micro climate on the sides and bottom, your liner must not be sticking very well to the substrate, is it taped to the tub or anything?

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OfflineChowder
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Re: A few question about my results [+crazy underfruting photo] [Re: Mdahmer]
    #20206500 - 06/30/14 05:19 AM (10 years, 6 months ago)

So if the liner was sticked next to the substrate, leaving no space, that would force the fruiting on top? No, it wasnt taped to the sides.

What would you recommend doing different in the next grow? Except for not getting a contamination... I dont suppose the contamination made the myc fruit on the other side.

For now, all I can think of for next time is to give the coir/verm sub a bit less water, and maybe not tamper with the tubs once they're done, a.i. fan them once a day... I'm guessing the fruits liked the more moist and less FAE environment under the sub. Despite the fact that there was no light.. Is my reasoning correct?

Any other hint about the fruiting conditions would help.


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Invisiblemushmagic
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Re: A few question about my results [+crazy underfruting photo] [Re: Chowder]
    #20206595 - 06/30/14 06:36 AM (10 years, 6 months ago)

I've seen it recommended that you use bags like the "forceflex" which has that design that allows it to stretch farther which gives the myc a better grip on the bag.


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InvisibleCH HELL
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Re: A few question about my results [+crazy underfruting photo] [Re: mushmagic]
    #20206861 - 06/30/14 08:51 AM (10 years, 6 months ago)

Mushrooms fruit where the conditions are best.  So this would mean your RH isn't high enough or your substrate is a little dry.  Try loosening the polyfill and giving it a good mist this will increase evaporation, RH, FAE and promote pinning.
CH

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OfflineMdahmer
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Re: A few question about my results [+crazy underfruting photo] [Re: mushmagic]
    #20206862 - 06/30/14 08:51 AM (10 years, 6 months ago)

It could've been a few different things, the center could've been too dry maybe and all the water was pulled to th sides and bottom...maybe try casing it next time so you have a nice micro climate up top as well

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OfflineChowder
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Re: A few question about my results [+crazy underfruting photo] [Re: Mdahmer]
    #20207106 - 06/30/14 10:12 AM (10 years, 6 months ago)

Thanks y'all!

Yeah, I'll definitely try and case next time.
But I think the RH was fine. The hygrometer showed 95+...

Anyway, thanks again for the hints, I have a better direction for next time.


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InvisibleCH HELL
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Re: A few question about my results [+crazy underfruting photo] [Re: Chowder]
    #20207521 - 06/30/14 12:33 PM (10 years, 6 months ago)

Digital hygrometer?
You can tell there is a good amount of moister in there by the condensation but that doesn't mean the RH/FAE are good. You just need to get things dialed in.  It looks like the room you have the tub in is cool/cold or you have it near a a/c duct.  The cold outside air and the heat of the tub are pushing the moister to collect on the walls and run down the sides.  This will leave the top and center dry.  Loosening the polyfil to increase the FAE and evaporation this will help correct your problem.  Right now the tub is fruiting on the sides and bottom because that is the best environment it has more moister and the co2 levels are about the same as the top of the substrate so why would it fruit on top. Get the RH and air dialed in and it will fruit on top.
Good luck,
CH

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OfflineChowder
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Re: A few question about my results [+crazy underfruting photo] [Re: CH HELL]
    #20212337 - 07/01/14 07:51 PM (10 years, 6 months ago)

CH! What can I say more than :thanx:!
This is the reply I was looking for  :seriousthankyou:

I am using this hygrometer. Seems really accurate, both from personal tests and others' reviews. But I think its not very relevant if I hang it on the side, since its so close to the tub wall. I should probably find a way to hang it from the lid, in the same way I do it my SGFC.

My room doesn't have A/C neither is it cold.

But yes, below this PE6>rye tub, I have two other B+>BRF crumbled to same substrate, and I have the same thing happening. Small clusters to the side of the tub. One has maybe 10 huge pins, the other has about 5 of the biggest fruits I've ever seen! (the ones in the second pic above; I shall post tomorrow on harvest most likely! ~25cm tall) But yes, I have much more the learn to get the even pinset and that beautiful canopy. What could be causing this effect: small number of huge fruits?

Anyway, having different varieties on different spawn type, giving the same effect says something.

Loosening the polyfil you say... on all holes? or only top ones? I'm tempted to weigh the amount I have now so I know how much to use next time.

Say the moisture runs down the sides of the tub, but the edges of the liner are slightly folded inwards, so that the water collects under the liner... would the moisture content be more equal?

How important is the air circulation in the room? Since I have to sleep in the same room, it's annoying to keep a little fan on 24/7


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InvisibleCH HELL
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Re: A few question about my results [+crazy underfruting photo] [Re: Chowder]
    #20212977 - 07/01/14 09:54 PM (10 years, 6 months ago)

Loosen the poly in all holes co2 is heavier than o2 so be sure to loosen the bottom so the co2 can escape.  It will take some fine tuning to get it perfect.  Some people have great results removing all the polyfil while others need to have the polyfil tighter so keep things from drying out.  For now I would remove about 50% of the poly and see how that goes.  There is no need for a fan if you loosen the polyfil.
The small number of huge fruits could be genetic.  Get the fae dialed in and this could change also.
I don't use liners anymore they were always a pita.  No matter what you do there will always be some side and bottom fruits so I choose not to use any liner.

CH

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OfflinePussyFart
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Re: A few question about my results [+crazy underfruting photo] [Re: CH HELL]
    #20213774 - 07/02/14 02:09 AM (10 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

CH HELL said:
Loosen the poly in all holes co2 is heavier than o2 so be sure to loosen the bottom so the co2 can escape. 



Co2 never sinks to the bottom of a fruiting chamber.

It mixes with the air and leaves thru the top holes, riding the heat and humidity currents.....

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Re: A few question about my results [+crazy underfruting photo] [Re: PussyFart]
    #20213782 - 07/02/14 02:13 AM (10 years, 6 months ago)

:whathesaid:
i like the top loose and the bottom tight so the air is forced out under the canopy:hehehe:


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OfflineMarch Hare
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Re: A few question about my results [+crazy underfruting photo] [Re: cronicr]
    #20213827 - 07/02/14 02:34 AM (10 years, 6 months ago)

That sounded reallly dirty.


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OfflineDos Ounce
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Re: A few question about my results [+crazy underfruting photo] [Re: March Hare]
    #20213841 - 07/02/14 02:43 AM (10 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

March Hare said:
That sounded reallly dirty.



:mustnotfap:

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OfflineChowder
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Re: A few question about my results [+crazy underfruting photo] [Re: Dos Ounce]
    #20213871 - 07/02/14 03:06 AM (10 years, 6 months ago)

Thanks.

Actually I had a PE6 rye jar lagging behind, and I spawned that into a coir/verm tray in a SGFC. Presumably the physics of the SGFC are different, but I'm also getting all pins on the side of the tray.
SGFC has RH 93+ and 3-4 fans+mists a day. ...genetics?

PS: Whats the best source to start learning more about genetics of mycology? Especially the things that apply to our interests. With MS, I understand it's a lottery. Is there any point in getting the biggest caps and print them? Will that actually influence the next gen? Anyway, I'm abusing the attention a bit. Maybe Im a bit of a lazy ass.

PSS: These are the fruits I was mentioning above


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Edited by Chowder (07/02/14 03:12 AM)

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Re: A few question about my results [+crazy underfruting photo] [Re: Chowder]
    #20213879 - 07/02/14 03:12 AM (10 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Chowder said:
Thanks.

Actually I had a PE6 rye jar lagging behind, and I spawned that into a coir/verm tray in a SGFC. Presumably the physics of the SGFC are different, but I'm also getting all pins on the side of the tray.
SGFC has RH 93+ and 3-4 fans+mists a day. ...genetics?





your rh isn't really relivant and for the sake of ease of mind  i'd say stop measuring it, what ch is reffering to is more surface humiity and not ambient humidity, mist your sub and boom you got 100% humidity or close enough to on the surface of your sub at all times, the highly humid growing enviroment lightens the workload and makes out job easier

i'd say your getting sidepins due to a micro climate and not genetics, they will pin where you give them good condidtions to do so and fruit from every known spot of the sub if the condidtions are ideal


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Re: A few question about my results [+crazy underfruting photo] [Re: Chowder]
    #20213888 - 07/02/14 03:17 AM (10 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Chowder said:


PS: Whats the best source to start learning more about genetics of mycology?



HERE
Quote:

Chowder said:
Is there any point in getting the biggest caps and print them? Will that actually influence the next gen? Anyway, I'm abusing the attention a bit. Maybe Im a bit of a lazy ass.





No point to it just get into agar work foir that sorta thing

Quote:

Chowder said:


PSS: These are the fruits I was mentioning above




i suspect you were getting condensation running down the walls and it was geting between your liner and your sub creating voids/microclimates
nice fruits though!


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It doesn't matter what i think of you...all that matters is clean spawn
I'm tired do me a favor

Edited by cronicr (07/02/14 03:17 AM)

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OfflineChowder
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Re: A few question about my results [+crazy underfruting photo] [Re: Chowder]
    #20213904 - 07/02/14 03:37 AM (10 years, 6 months ago)

I was misting in the beginning, but then I was having large-ish blobs of water standing, and I was afraid of aborts. I guess I could do with misting and less polyfil that will increase evaporation.


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Re: A few question about my results [+crazy underfruting photo] [Re: Chowder]
    #20213906 - 07/02/14 03:38 AM (10 years, 6 months ago)

if you dial your tubs in you won't even need to mist, you will get a nice build up of moisture beads right across the surface


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InvisibleCH HELL
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Re: A few question about my results [+crazy underfruting photo] [Re: PussyFart]
    #20216121 - 07/02/14 06:20 PM (10 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

PussyFart said:
Quote:

CH HELL said:
Loosen the poly in all holes co2 is heavier than o2 so be sure to loosen the bottom so the co2 can escape. 



Co2 never sinks to the bottom of a fruiting chamber.

It mixes with the air and leaves thru the top holes, riding the heat and humidity currents.....





So you are telling all these years that I thought co2 was heavier I was just wrong .  Wow!  Thanks Pussy...
 
You won't get any current if the holes on the bottom are too tight.  It really doesn't matter as long as you get it dialed in looser, tighter or fully removed all depends on the environment outside of the tub.
CH

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Re: A few question about my results [+crazy underfruting photo] [Re: CH HELL]
    #20216133 - 07/02/14 06:24 PM (10 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

CH HELL said:
Quote:

PussyFart said:
Quote:

CH HELL said:
Loosen the poly in all holes co2 is heavier than o2 so be sure to loosen the bottom so the co2 can escape. 



Co2 never sinks to the bottom of a fruiting chamber.

It mixes with the air and leaves thru the top holes, riding the heat and humidity currents.....





So you are telling all these years that I thought co2 was heavier I was just wrong .  Wow!  Thanks Pussy...
 

CH



i don't see where he said it wasn't heavier, just that it doesn't sink:shrug:


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Re: A few question about my results [+crazy underfruting photo] [Re: cronicr]
    #20216156 - 07/02/14 06:33 PM (10 years, 6 months ago)

:shrug:

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OfflinePussyFart
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Re: A few question about my results [+crazy underfruting photo] [Re: CH HELL]
    #20216175 - 07/02/14 06:38 PM (10 years, 6 months ago)

I never said it was not heavier than air....it is heavier, but only by a fraction.....when any type of currents are present it mixes in evenly with the air.

In a fruiting chamber there are always constant heat and humidity currents, these currents rise, carrying the co2 with it.

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Re: A few question about my results [+crazy underfruting photo] [Re: cronicr]
    #20216189 - 07/02/14 06:43 PM (10 years, 6 months ago)

Dont mind me. Carry on...



That cluster only was 340g :wooyeah:

On the other hand, that's all I got from 25 crumbled cakes in a monotub...but still a record


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Edited by Chowder (07/02/14 06:45 PM)

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InvisibleCH HELL
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Re: A few question about my results [+crazy underfruting photo] [Re: PussyFart]
    #20216205 - 07/02/14 06:49 PM (10 years, 6 months ago)

I just found it funny that you would quote a small part of my post and try to pick it apart.
Co2 drops because it is heavier heat mixed with co2 dropping causes currents.  If there were no holes or the holes on the bottom or the poly is too tight there will be NO current for the co2 to "mix".  If you know heat currents explain don't just pop in and say "Co2 never sinks".

Nice cluster Chowder!  Now lets get a nice canopy of those shrooms and you will be set.:rockon:
Cheers,
CH

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Re: A few question about my results [+crazy underfruting photo] [Re: CH HELL]
    #20216232 - 07/02/14 07:00 PM (10 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

CH HELL said:
If there were no holes or the holes on the bottom or the poly is too tight there will be NO current for the co2 to "mix".



What do holes have to do with the mycellium generating heat?

A sealed container with a heat source(mycellium) in it has a constant convection goin on.

Quote:

CH HELL said:
If you know heat currents explain don't just pop in and say "Co2 never sinks".
CH



I didn't say it never sinks, you took it out of context.

I said it never sinks "in a fruiting chamber".....and it doesn't.....a sealed tub is not a fruiting chamber.....but even if it was, co2 still would not sink if there is some kind of substrate constantly generating heat.....

Edited by PussyFart (07/02/14 07:01 PM)

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Re: A few question about my results [+crazy underfruting photo] [Re: PussyFart]
    #20216241 - 07/02/14 07:02 PM (10 years, 6 months ago)

stale air is the enemy, not co2:hehehe:


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It doesn't matter what i think of you...all that matters is clean spawn
I'm tired do me a favor

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Re: A few question about my results [+crazy underfruting photo] [Re: PussyFart]
    #20216299 - 07/02/14 07:23 PM (10 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

cronicr said:
stale air is the enemy, not co2:hehehe:



:super:

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