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OfflineCrystal G
I'm a teapot


Registered: 06/05/07
Posts: 19,584
Loc: outer space
Last seen: 8 months, 30 days
Re: Thinking of working a trade (electritian?) and quitting college [Re: pwnasaurus]
    #20111144 - 06/10/14 06:44 PM (9 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

pwnasaurus said:
:rolleyes:

I am not a "computer programmer" I am a software engineer.  I hold an undergraduate degree in electrical engineering.  I design hugely complicated, massively scalable systems capable of servicing tens of thousands of requests per second while being fault-tolerant, highly tested, and extensible.  My software systems span the globe and are used by millions of people every day.  It is not even remotely akin to saying that a Subway worker is a "sandwich engineer".




Oh okay, gotcha.

So on average, how many hours would you say the average electrical or mechanical engineer works? I wonder why all the ones that I know work 60-80 hours a week. Is it truly possible to work only 40 hours or less a week as an engineer?


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Invisiblebadchad
Mad Scientist

Registered: 03/02/05
Posts: 13,373
Re: Thinking of working a trade (electritian?) and quitting college [Re: pwnasaurus]
    #20111152 - 06/10/14 06:45 PM (9 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

pwnasaurus said:

To teach.  A PhD in almost any field gives no advantage over your peers unless you want to teach at a university level.  Pursuing a PhD in most fields is pretty useless if you want to work in industry.  The years of work experience a Master's would have over a PhD in most cases would far outweigh any advantage of having a PhD.

If you are a pursuing a PhD it is usually because you are extremely passionate about learning and pioneering that subject not for any conceivable advantage in the job market.




Definitely not true in the sciences.  Even in industry/pharma etc., there are entire subsets of jobs that are PhD only.


--------------------
...the whole experience is (and is as) a profound piece of knowledge.  It is an indellible experience; it is forever known.  I have known myself in a way I doubt I would have ever occurred except as it did.

Smith, P.  Bull. Menninger Clinic (1959) 23:20-27; p. 27.

...most subjects find the experience valuable, some find it frightening, and many say that is it uniquely lovely.

Osmond, H.  Annals, NY Acad Science (1957) 66:418-434; p.436


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OfflineBeanhead
IS IRONIC PARADOX
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Registered: 10/11/08
Posts: 17,257
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Re: Thinking of working a trade (electritian?) and quitting college [Re: pwnasaurus]
    #20111155 - 06/10/14 06:46 PM (9 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

pwnasaurus said:
Quote:

Shins said:
Quote:

pwnasaurus said:
Quote:

Crystal G said:
I believe the work hours are somewhere around the same, perhaps engineers slightly more (which could be a factor, I personally wouldn't want to be an engineer because the ones that I know literally have ZERO lives outside of work, some that I know that work for Parker or Northrop Grumman are even required to work Saturdays too from 8am until 10pm.)



You have a very skewed view of how many hours engineers work.  You have posted this before and it is simply not true.  I'm a software engineer for a Fortune 50 company and I work 9am-6pm most days.  I occasionally have to work later or get called in for something on the weekend but that's the exception not the rule.




Lol but computer programmers aren't really real engineers though are they?

I mean, to me it sounds lije you're comparing appkes and oranges....  kind of like saying "I work at subway as a sandwich engineer!  I'm an engineer! "



:rolleyes:

I am not a "computer programmer" I am a software engineer.  I hold an undergraduate degree in electrical engineering.  I design hugely complicated, massively scalable systems capable of servicing tens of thousands of requests per second while being fault-tolerant, highly tested, and extensible.  My software systems span the globe and are used by millions of people every day.  It is not even remotely akin to saying that a Subway worker is a "sandwich engineer".




PLS UPDATE KERNEL

Someday I will rule the internet with my custom firmware:datass:


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Invisiblepwnasaurus
Stranger
I'm a teapot User Gallery


Registered: 07/16/08
Posts: 12,317
Loc: Canada Flag
Re: Thinking of working a trade (electritian?) and quitting college [Re: Crystal G]
    #20111164 - 06/10/14 06:49 PM (9 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Crystal G said:
Quote:

pwnasaurus said:
:rolleyes:

I am not a "computer programmer" I am a software engineer.  I hold an undergraduate degree in electrical engineering.  I design hugely complicated, massively scalable systems capable of servicing tens of thousands of requests per second while being fault-tolerant, highly tested, and extensible.  My software systems span the globe and are used by millions of people every day.  It is not even remotely akin to saying that a Subway worker is a "sandwich engineer".




Oh okay, gotcha.

So on average, how many hours would you say the average electrical or mechanical engineer works? I wonder why all the ones that I know work 60-80 hours a week. Is it truly possible to work only 40 hours or less a week as an engineer?



It obviously varies but my experience has been that most people in a professional field work 45-60 hours per week on average.  Working 60-80 on average is uncommon and is generally reserved for directors, high-powered consultants/lawyers, and some traders and financial analysts.

That being said, I certainly COULD work that many hours if I wanted to and I would probably get a bigger bonus, but I already make enough money and I value my free time to enjoy my life.


Quote:

Crystal G said:
Yeah that's what I was wondering... because I thought the two "main" types of engineering were electrical and mechanical engineering.



Not even remotely true.  Civil, chemical, geological, mining, aeronautic, etc.  There are SO many streams of engineering that to say there are any two "main" paths is laughable.

Quote:

Is "computer engineer" basically the same thing as "software programmer?



It can mean a great many things.  A computer engineer can be a hardware engineer who designs CPUs, he can be a test engineer who works on automated testing for manufacturing electrical components, a software developer, the list goes on and on.  You really cannot pigeonholing very vast and vague fields into such specific ideas.  It does not work that way in the real world.


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InvisibleShins
Fun guy
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Registered: 09/15/04
Posts: 16,337
Re: Thinking of working a trade (electritian?) and quitting college [Re: pwnasaurus]
    #20111165 - 06/10/14 06:49 PM (9 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

pwnasaurus said:
Quote:

Shins said:
Quote:

pwnasaurus said:
Quote:

Crystal G said:
I believe the work hours are somewhere around the same, perhaps engineers slightly more (which could be a factor, I personally wouldn't want to be an engineer because the ones that I know literally have ZERO lives outside of work, some that I know that work for Parker or Northrop Grumman are even required to work Saturdays too from 8am until 10pm.)



You have a very skewed view of how many hours engineers work.  You have posted this before and it is simply not true.  I'm a software engineer for a Fortune 50 company and I work 9am-6pm most days.  I occasionally have to work later or get called in for something on the weekend but that's the exception not the rule.




Lol but computer programmers aren't really real engineers though are they?

I mean, to me it sounds lije you're comparing appkes and oranges....  kind of like saying "I work at subway as a sandwich engineer!  I'm an engineer! "



:rolleyes:

I am not a "computer programmer" I am a software engineer.  I hold an undergraduate degree in electrical engineering.  I design hugely complicated, massively scalable systems capable of servicing tens of thousands of requests per second while being fault-tolerant, highly tested, and extensible.  My software systems span the globe and are used by millions of people every day.  It is not even remotely akin to saying that a Subway worker is a "sandwich engineer".




Of course I was exaggerating with the sandwhich engineer.  To me it just seems like you are patronizing real engineers by implying that programming software is conparable to designing a bridge or skyscraper.

I mean I see how you're an engineer and designer and all, but you sure aren't on the same level as a real physical engineer.


--------------------
http://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/


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OfflineBeanhead
IS IRONIC PARADOX
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Re: Thinking of working a trade (electritian?) and quitting college [Re: Shins] * 1
    #20111169 - 06/10/14 06:50 PM (9 years, 8 months ago)

C++ moar difficult then bridges bro


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InvisibleShins
Fun guy
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Registered: 09/15/04
Posts: 16,337
Re: Thinking of working a trade (electritian?) and quitting college [Re: Beanhead]
    #20111177 - 06/10/14 06:52 PM (9 years, 8 months ago)

No, no it isn't.


--------------------
http://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/


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OfflineCrystal G
I'm a teapot


Registered: 06/05/07
Posts: 19,584
Loc: outer space
Last seen: 8 months, 30 days
Re: Thinking of working a trade (electritian?) and quitting college [Re: pwnasaurus]
    #20111181 - 06/10/14 06:52 PM (9 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Shins said:
Of course I was exaggerating with the sandwhich engineer.  To me it just seems like you are patronizing real engineers by implying that programming software is conparable to designing a bridge or skyscraper.

I mean I see how you're an engineer and designer and all, but you sure aren't on the same level as a real physical engineer.




Um... that's what civil engineers do, and that's a totally different type of engineering from mechanical or electrical engineers... actually civil engineering is way easier than mechanical/electrical.


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Invisiblepwnasaurus
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I'm a teapot User Gallery


Registered: 07/16/08
Posts: 12,317
Loc: Canada Flag
Re: Thinking of working a trade (electritian?) and quitting college [Re: Shins]
    #20111186 - 06/10/14 06:53 PM (9 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Shins said:
Quote:

pwnasaurus said:
:rolleyes:

I am not a "computer programmer" I am a software engineer.  I hold an undergraduate degree in electrical engineering.  I design hugely complicated, massively scalable systems capable of servicing tens of thousands of requests per second while being fault-tolerant, highly tested, and extensible.  My software systems span the globe and are used by millions of people every day.  It is not even remotely akin to saying that a Subway worker is a "sandwich engineer".




Of course I was exaggerating with the sandwhich engineer.  To me it just seems like you are patronizing real engineers by implying that programming software is conparable to designing a bridge or skyscraper.

I mean I see how you're an engineer and designer and all, but you sure aren't on the same level as a real physical engineer.



Yes, I absolutely am, and you seriously have no idea what you're talking about.  Engineering is such a broad field you clearly just have a very, very narrow (and incorrect) view on the subject.

I am working towards my professional engineering certification and software engineering is recognized by the Professional Engineers of Ontario as a legitimate engineering discipline.

You can't seriously tell me that you think the systems designed at Google, Amazon, and many other companies are not impressive displays of engineering just as much as any bridge or skyscraper.  If you don't see that you simply do not have a clear understanding the work that goes into designing such complex systems.

To give you an idea of some of the major engineering fields:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_engineering_branches


Edited by pwnasaurus (06/10/14 07:16 PM)


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InvisibleShins
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Re: Thinking of working a trade (electritian?) and quitting college [Re: pwnasaurus]
    #20111273 - 06/10/14 07:14 PM (9 years, 8 months ago)

I know I know... sorry if I was patronising you.  I have respect for software designers.. Maybe I'm just a dummy. ..  its just.. comparing website design to structural engineering and acting like they are the  same just seems wrong to me.


--------------------
http://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/


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Invisiblepwnasaurus
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Re: Thinking of working a trade (electritian?) and quitting college [Re: Shins]
    #20111298 - 06/10/14 07:20 PM (9 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Shins said:
I know I know... sorry if I was patronising you.  I have respect for software designers.. Maybe I'm just a dummy. ..  its just.. comparing website design to structural engineering and acting like they are the  same just seems wrong to me.



Here's where the disconnect is.  I'm not talking about "website design" with regards to making "Mom & Pop's Flower Shop" website.

I'm talking designing the systems that power the backend of Google's search, or the systems to service the tens of millions of orders a year at Amazon and to fulfill them through a massive, automated, distribution system.  You have some very incorrect preconceived notions of what an engineer is and what goes into designing the software systems used by many corporations around the world.


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Offlinezappaisgod
horrid asshole


Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
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Re: Thinking of working a trade (electritian?) and quitting college [Re: pwnasaurus]
    #20111324 - 06/10/14 07:25 PM (9 years, 8 months ago)

Almost all physical engineering done now is just boilerplate calculations and then triple them.  I see so much over-design it's ridiculous.  They don't care.  They don't have to pay for or lift the fucking beams.  They admit it.


--------------------


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OfflineCrystal G
I'm a teapot


Registered: 06/05/07
Posts: 19,584
Loc: outer space
Last seen: 8 months, 30 days
Re: Thinking of working a trade (electritian?) and quitting college [Re: pwnasaurus]
    #20111505 - 06/10/14 08:16 PM (9 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

pwnasaurus said:
Quote:

Shins said:
I know I know... sorry if I was patronising you.  I have respect for software designers.. Maybe I'm just a dummy. ..  its just.. comparing website design to structural engineering and acting like they are the  same just seems wrong to me.



Here's where the disconnect is.  I'm not talking about "website design" with regards to making "Mom & Pop's Flower Shop" website.

I'm talking designing the systems that power the backend of Google's search, or the systems to service the tens of millions of orders a year at Amazon and to fulfill them through a massive, automated, distribution system.  You have some very incorrect preconceived notions of what an engineer is and what goes into designing the software systems used by many corporations around the world.




Yea I'm pretty sure pwn does way more than basic HTML or Java scripting.


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InvisibleMoonshoe
Blue Mantis
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Registered: 05/28/04
Posts: 27,202
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Re: Thinking of working a trade (electritian?) and quitting college [Re: zappaisgod]
    #20111700 - 06/10/14 09:09 PM (9 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

zappaisgod said:
Quote:

pwnasaurus said:
Quote:

Jvells said:
what does everyone think? also will i ever grow out of this? I've been obsessed with tripping and bud for like 5 years now. I'm 19 now and currently my major is in engineering science because its been my dream for quite some time but I'm hearing from my friends in a good college majoring in engineering (one that I would be transferring to most likely after two years) that its no fucking cake walk. I know I have the brains but it's more like can i stay clean...i think a trade would be best for me now huh? Get my shit together then go back to college later? idfk..



I think you should take a year off and get your head straight.  You can't keep tripping and smoking weed constantly and expect to make it very far in life.

Of course engineering isn't a cake walk.  It's one of the hardest degrees you can take but there's a reason for that - there's TONS of job opportunities and you will never have trouble finding work.

Doing a trade for 20-30 years is going to ruin your body.  By the time you're 40 you're body is going to be broken.






This is not true.  I'm 57 and still doing whatever carpentry is necessary including framing.  It has also kept me in decent shape without ever having to deal with gym douches.  I admit I do not tote lumber all day like I used to but with my skill set I would be stupid to waste my time that way.  On top of that, electrician is pretty light work for construction.  Roofing will definitely fuck you up, though, as will hardwood flooring.

The trades offer the best opportunity to have your own company.  That was important to me.  Engineers are pretty much always going to be employees.  Don't forget that engineering is a difficult course of study.  Not many people can complete it.




Don't be afraid of gym douches.

Just rinse them off and use them again.


--------------------


Everything I post is fiction.


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Offliner00tuuu123
Now I'm just really piseed
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Re: Thinking of working a trade (electritian?) and quitting college [Re: Jvells]
    #20111810 - 06/10/14 09:38 PM (9 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Jvells said:
So confused what i want to do as im a freshman in college majoring in engineering science. im really considering switching to a trade thoug like an electritian, mechanic maybe, welder or plumber...fuck it whatever. I just want a job thatll be friendly when im 50 years old and will still be pretty interested in...do i wanna be under a sink or wtf. I get interested in a lot easy, i worked tobacco for 5 years and loved it so im a more hands on worker for sure i think.

Welding sounds badass but im reading its always bad conditions. I just wanna guarantee i get a job thatll pay off when i graduate and kinda dont wanna all the debt from college. I NEED OPINIONS, fuckin badd...this shits annoying the hell outta me. At the moment im the most interested in becoming an electritian...can anyone fuckin help my ass...



Well you can make good money in a trade union and learn a bunch more than you can in College Plus they pretty much train you for free and you get your package on top of it. So as an apprentice your looking at the very least 25 an hour. And if you work Prevailing wage jobs like 35 an hour plus time and a half for anything over 40 and double time after 48 or 50 depending on your contract. I have a few good friends in different trades who make bank even being laid off 3 months a year.


--------------------
:kingcrankey: Please report me to a Mod for hurting your punk ass hippie feelings :flipthebird: And all time Champion thread killer.:thatsayes:


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Offlinex Ju x
Aubergine Of The Sun
Male


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Posts: 6,511
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Last seen: 3 years, 17 days
Re: Thinking of working a trade (electritian?) and quitting college [Re: r00tuuu123]
    #20112808 - 06/11/14 03:39 AM (9 years, 8 months ago)

I'm doing occupational health and safety. OH&S or whatever you want to call it.

There's a massive demand for it and it's a 6 figure salary if you get the right certifications and credentials to build upon. It's a broad field as well. You can go construction, environmental, health. etc.

either way, quiting college is a bad idea in my opinion. Why not finish it and have those credentials anyway?


Edited by x Ju x (06/11/14 03:50 AM)


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InvisibleMagicman69
All About the Benjamins
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Registered: 05/29/13
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Re: Thinking of working a trade (electritian?) and quitting college [Re: x Ju x]
    #20112822 - 06/11/14 03:55 AM (9 years, 8 months ago)

HVAC is a good trade. Median income is like 50 grand a year. My uncle did HVAC on a Navy base for 20 years and retired at 45 with a fat pension. Now he gets his pension checks and owns his own AC company. Makes good money.

Heating, Ventilation, and Air Conditioning. They also teach you refrigeration.


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