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InvisibleOrgoneConclusion
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Re: Our Lady of Guadalupe [Re: Sleepwalker]
    #19991853 - 05/15/14 11:52 AM (9 years, 10 months ago)

:sherlock:


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OfflineAztecWarrior
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Re: Our Lady of Guadalupe [Re: fireworks_god]
    #19991884 - 05/15/14 11:56 AM (9 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

fireworks_god said:

Quote:


http://www.nbcuniversalarchives.com/nbcuni/clip/5112449660_s04.do

...

ALSO SEEN STUDYING THE SITE IS COMPUTER ENHANCEMENT SPECIALIST DONALD LYNN OF THE JET PROPULSION LAB.





NBCUniversal has video footage of him on site.




Ok he did not mention the examination having "nothing unsual" about it other than this website. Which is a blog..and find non-credible.
http://skeptoid.com/episodes/420;

I agree with you completely, this painting has not being analyzed in over 30 years, there's no denying that, i wish they could do more research.


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OfflineAztecWarrior
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Re: Our Lady of Guadalupe [Re: AztecWarrior]
    #19991987 - 05/15/14 12:10 PM (9 years, 10 months ago)

And as mentioned before Dr. Phillip Callahan found the multiple layers of paint within the crown and hand and he could tell they were obviously painted(brush strokes) on which were the restorations to the painting.

Wouldn't you think he could notice the rest of the brush strokes caused by a paintbrush? He said he "seemed" as there is no other explanation of how it could have been done with one single brush stroke.


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OfflineAztecWarrior
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Re: Our Lady of Guadalupe [Re: Sleepwalker]
    #19992016 - 05/15/14 12:14 PM (9 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Sleepwalker said:
I think it was probably a human.  Most likely with a paintbrush.




Ok i respect your thought, I'm glad you don't know for sure it was:)


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Offlinefireworks_godS
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Re: Our Lady of Guadalupe [Re: AztecWarrior]
    #19992066 - 05/15/14 12:24 PM (9 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

AztecWarrior said:
Ok he did not mention the examination having "nothing unsual" about it other than this website. Which is a blog..and find non-credible.





The alternative explanation, of course, is that his remarks were made many years before the advent of the Internet, and have thus not been documented. Considering the extent to which believers in this are quick to promulgate any factoid which attests its miraculousness, if his findings were more astonishing than a mere "nothing unusual", one would be inclined to imagine they would be similarly quick to cite his analysis. At the very least, it seems plausible he was looking into the matter, just as he was involved with investigating The Shroud of Turin.

Quote:


I agree with you completely, this painting has not being analyzed in over 30 years, there's no denying that, i wish they could do more research.




Unfortunately, the Catholic Church has no vested interest in attesting to its miraculousness, which, at an innocent first glance, would seem counter-intuitive, considering what they'd have to gain by having a confirmation of the miraculousness of one of their treasured symbols. :wink:


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OfflineAztecWarrior
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Re: Our Lady of Guadalupe [Re: fireworks_god]
    #19992197 - 05/15/14 12:52 PM (9 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

fireworks_god said:

The alternative explanation, of course, is that his remarks were made many years before the advent of the Internet, and have thus not been documented. Considering the extent to which believers in this are quick to promulgate any factoid which attests its miraculousness, if his findings were more astonishing than a mere "nothing unusual", one would be inclined to imagine they would be similarly quick to cite his analysis. At the very least, it seems plausible he was looking into the matter, just as he was involved with investigating The Shroud of Turin.





This is an assumption. He was working on The Shroud of Turin around the same time as the painting and there’s  far more information of him working on The Shroud of Turin.

Oh and this investigation (below) was also many many years before the advent of the Internet as well, and could not have not have been documented as well. :shrug:

Quote:

http://www.examiner.com/article/the-virgin-of-guadalupe-the-us
"Dr. Richard Kuhn, Director of the Department of Chemistry at the University of Heidelberg in Germany, and Nobel Prize in Chemistry in 1938, analyzed fibers of the ayate to determine the origin and nature of the pigments in the colors of the image of the Virgin. His resulting statement was as follows: “…in the fibers analyzed, one red and one yellow, there are no vegetable colors, nor animal color pigments, nor any mineral colorants” (mexico, udg.mx, 2004)."




Well there's nothing when can do i guess :tongue:

Edited by AztecWarrior (05/15/14 12:54 PM)

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Offlinefireworks_godS
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Re: Our Lady of Guadalupe [Re: AztecWarrior]
    #19992276 - 05/15/14 01:10 PM (9 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

AztecWarrior said:
This is an assumption. He was working on The Shroud of Turin around the same time as the painting and there’s  far more information of him working on The Shroud of Turin.




Of course; their conclusions regarding it were, essentially, inconclusive. Yet, when he says "nothing unusual", anyone with a vested interest in the matter dares make a meme out of that. :lol:

Quote:


Oh and this investigation (below) was also many many years before the advent of the Internet as well, and could not have not have been documented as well. :shrug:

Quote:

http://www.examiner.com/article/the-virgin-of-guadalupe-the-us
"Dr. Richard Kuhn, Director of the Department of Chemistry at the University of Heidelberg in Germany, and Nobel Prize in Chemistry in 1938, analyzed fibers of the ayate to determine the origin and nature of the pigments in the colors of the image of the Virgin. His resulting statement was as follows: “…in the fibers analyzed, one red and one yellow, there are no vegetable colors, nor animal color pigments, nor any mineral colorants” (mexico, udg.mx, 2004)."








Naturally, the Catholic Church has no qualms propagating a horribly dated piece of information that supports their interests. Yet, when an employee of NASA in the 70's analyzes the same painting, where is the information? Where is the recommended, additional examinations? :tongue:


--------------------
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If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
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Like being here
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:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:

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OfflineAztecWarrior
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Re: Our Lady of Guadalupe [Re: fireworks_god]
    #19992453 - 05/15/14 01:51 PM (9 years, 10 months ago)

Like I said before thers nothing we can do i guess. As of now this painting seems unsolved until further investigations (if any).

It doesn't really matter really either, You either Believe or not.

And i provided you with credible links that prove it was not a painting.

-(We've been just talking about the painting, how do science explain the explosion in 1921, 4 centuries of preservation, star constellation on 12/12/1531 that is identical and is on her mantle?.

Just saying, I'm not totally religious i just like debating im open minded to both ideas.


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Offlineqman
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Re: Our Lady of Guadalupe [Re: AztecWarrior]
    #19992777 - 05/15/14 02:54 PM (9 years, 10 months ago)

Having an un-explainable natural occurrence doesn't mean the "supernatural" is at work, it's simply un-explainable at the moment.

The burden of proof is on the person making the assertion that something beyond the natural world is taking place, you're trying to make the burden of proof on the person that is skeptical of the assertion, it doesn't work that way, the burden of proof is on the person making the claim.

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Offlinefireworks_godS
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Re: Our Lady of Guadalupe [Re: AztecWarrior]
    #19992806 - 05/15/14 03:00 PM (9 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

AztecWarrior said:
And i provided you with credible links that prove it was not a painting.




Your opening link was from the blog of a woman who is just trying to figure out how to be holy in order to get into heaven, where she wants to be patron saint of lifeguards. :smirk:

Regarding the other stuff unaddressed, like four centuries of preservation or star constellations, something more concrete would need to be provided in order for it to be scrutinized. :shrug:


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If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
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Like being here
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OfflineAztecWarrior
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Re: Our Lady of Guadalupe [Re: qman]
    #19992842 - 05/15/14 03:09 PM (9 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

qman said:

Having an un-explainable natural occurrence doesn't mean the "supernatural" is at work, it's simply un-explainable at the moment.

The burden of proof is on the person making the assertion that something beyond the natural world is taking place, you're trying to make the burden of proof on the person that is skeptical of the assertion, it doesn't work that way, the burden of proof is on the person making the claim.




Yes i never jump into any conclusions. I agree i just want to make a challenge to those skeptical.


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OfflineAztecWarrior
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Re: Our Lady of Guadalupe [Re: fireworks_god]
    #19992911 - 05/15/14 03:25 PM (9 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

fireworks_god said:

Your opening link was from the blog of a woman who is just trying to figure out how to be holy in order to get into heaven, where she wants to be patron saint of lifeguards. :smirk:

Ooops HAHA! Ok well lets face it we have both made non-credible claims :tongue2:

I really wish these documentary were in English.
But here is more evidence
(15:55 Smith and Callaghan, confirmed that there was no preparation of the painting) Meaning that no calcium sulfate were used to prepared as mentioned by a source you claimed.


this documentary also goes into detail about the bombing,the constellations at 24:00


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Offlinefireworks_godS
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Re: Our Lady of Guadalupe [Re: AztecWarrior]
    #19996222 - 05/16/14 06:55 AM (9 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

AztecWarrior said:
Ooops HAHA! Ok well lets face it we have both made non-credible claims :tongue2:




I think the only claim I've made that could possibly touch on "non-credible" is that it has already been demonstrated to be an ordinary painting, although the only reason it might not be wholly credible is simply due to their refusal to further examine it. For as much as there has been scrutiny of it, the results have come out in favor of it being an ordinary painting, and, regarding the remaining inconclusiveness, a specific lack of interest from their part in clarifying the matter has allowed that inconclusiveness to remain. :shrug:

Quote:


I really wish these documentary were in English.
But here is more evidence
(15:55 Smith and Callaghan, confirmed that there was no preparation of the painting) Meaning that no calcium sulfate were used to prepared as mentioned by a source you claimed.


this documentary also goes into detail about the bombing,the constellations at 24:00




The fact is that their findings are contradictory, and, considering the great lack of investigation that even the analysts you referred to now recommended take place, it'd be entirely premature to entertain the notion that the painting is in some way unusual. :shrug:

Bombings and constellations veer too far away from my interest in the subject, so I won't address them. :grin:


--------------------
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If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
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:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

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InvisibleElVatoFirme
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Re: Our Lady of Guadalupe [Re: fireworks_god]
    #19997202 - 05/16/14 11:31 AM (9 years, 10 months ago)

The story of "Our" Lady of Guadalupe is straight BULLSHIT.

Because of that bullshit story, being Mexican = being Catholic.
Oppress and brainwash much?


--------------------
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Is stronger than the knife?
And they can kill you once
But they can't kill you twice
Did you know destruction of the flesh
Is not the ending to Life?
Fear not of the Anti-Christ

- Damian Marley -

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InvisibleCosmicJokeM
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Re: Our Lady of Guadalupe [Re: AztecWarrior]
    #20000903 - 05/17/14 07:24 AM (9 years, 10 months ago)

i think she's an extraterestrial, who has gone under multiple archetypal aliases, BVM & Nuit etc...  and she's largely responsible for the papal tiara, the conic head is an homage of course.... :stoned:


--------------------
Everything is better than it was the last time.  I'm good.

If we could look into each others hearts, and understand the unique challenges each of us faces, I think we would treat each other much more gently, with more love, patience, tolerance, and care.

It takes a lot of courage to go out there and radiate your essence.

I know you scared, you should ask us if we scared too.  If you was there, and we just knew you cared too.

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InvisibleElVatoFirme
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Re: Our Lady of Guadalupe [Re: CosmicJoke] * 1
    #20001377 - 05/17/14 10:29 AM (9 years, 10 months ago)

I always thought she was Columbus dressed in drag.


--------------------
Did you know the pen
Is stronger than the knife?
And they can kill you once
But they can't kill you twice
Did you know destruction of the flesh
Is not the ending to Life?
Fear not of the Anti-Christ

- Damian Marley -

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Offlinefireworks_godS
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Re: Our Lady of Guadalupe [Re: ElVatoFirme]
    #20001400 - 05/17/14 10:39 AM (9 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

ElVatoFirme said:
I always thought she was Columbus dressed in drag.




:rofl2:

:rofl2:


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If I should die this very moment
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For I've never known completeness
Like being here
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Loving every breath of you

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