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OfflineCujo
Stranger
Registered: 10/08/03
Posts: 6
Last seen: 12 years, 10 months
Illegal Search?
    #1991315 - 10/08/03 10:27 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

Alright, me and 2 friends were sitting in a parkling lot late at night, when we saw a cop pull up behind us, and get out of his car. My friend had about 1/2 a gram of weed and a homemade bong on him, and he didn't have much time to hide anything, but he told me he got everything out of sight.

So the cop got out of his car and started to question us. After a few questions, he asked me if he could search my car. I told him no, because i needed to be going soon because of my curfew. Then, he asked me to step out of the car, so i asked him a question about if that would wave my right not to consent to a search. He told me that his probable cause was that there was some snuff on the outside of my car(i've never had chewing tobacco in my life, it was a VERY SMALL dried drop of mud).

I got out of the car, looked at the "snuff", and started to tell him that it was mud and it was fairly obvious that my car hadn't been washed in months and i had mud all over my car. He didn't care, and began opening my doors and looking through my car with his flashlight. When he got to the passenger side, he saw part of the bong and told my friend to pull it out, kindof like the cop wasn't allowed to pull it out himself, right?

After that we admitted to having the weed and he arrested us. We're being charged with an MIP and a ticket for drug paraphanalia. Yes I know I'm stupid for letting my friend have that stuff on him, but I'm just wondering if anyone here could give me any advice on if that was an illegal search or not?


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Offlinetrippy_mind
shroomin

Registered: 10/08/03
Posts: 15
Last seen: 13 years, 2 months
Re: Illegal Search? [Re: Cujo]
    #1991581 - 10/09/03 12:14 AM (13 years, 2 months ago)

yes its illegal but its hard to proove and since he admitted to having the pot theres not much u can do


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Offlinecherokee
tennis shoes
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Registered: 10/25/02
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Re: Illegal Search? [Re: Cujo]
    #1991695 - 10/09/03 01:02 AM (13 years, 2 months ago)

Snuff is perfectly legal. And he started to search your car without your permission? I say fight it. We need to show the police that we aren't going to put up with them taking our rights.


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Anonymous

Re: Illegal Search? [Re: Cujo]
    #1991728 - 10/09/03 01:21 AM (13 years, 2 months ago)

you should know that cops are trained to look for that kind of shit. he knew something was up as soon as he saw you guys. two young men sitting in a parking lot late at night? you guys were fucked from the start.

the fact that he had no reason to search your car might help. cops need to have "clear and articulate facts" leading them to believe that if they search the car, they will find evindense of a crime. having shit smeared on the outside of your car doesn't cut it. tobacco products are legal anyway.

So the cop got out of his car and started to question us. After a few questions, he asked me if he could search my car.

what did he ask you, and what did you tell him?

Then, he asked me to step out of the car, so i asked him a question about if that would wave my right not to consent to a search.

you don't bring up the topic of a search unless he does. cops ask people to step out of their cars all the time. the only way you can consent to a search is by consenting to a search. seeming overly concerned about getting searched didn't help you at all.

think about things from the pig's perspective. he was totally on to you guys.

He told me that his probable cause was that there was some snuff on the outside of my car

total bullshit, and you should have called him on it. it may not hold up in court. sure doesn't sound like "clear and articulate facts" to me. fight it.

he saw part of the bong and told my friend to pull it out, kindof like the cop wasn't allowed to pull it out himself, right?

did he tell him to or ask him to?

what country are you in?

that search doesn't sound legal. it's a good thing you did not consent to the search, but you could have been more articulate about it. stating, "i do not consent to this search. what clear and articulate facts lead you to believe that by searching my vehicle, you will find evidence of a crime?". he says, "blah blah bullshit bullshit". you say, "i don't think that is a valid reason and i do not consent to any search". then he searches your shit. it's easier to fight it in court then.

people... know your rights. know the actual legal terminology particular to your state. you want to sound like a damn lawyer when the cops are talking to you, but you don't want to come across like someone with something to hide... just a freedom-loving citizen who knows their rights and doesn't give them away just 'cause someone asks.

and don't hang out in parking lots at night. seriously. you guys were fucked as soon as he pulled in.


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Invisiblepoke smot!
floccinocci floofinator
Male

Registered: 01/08/03
Posts: 5,231
Re: Illegal Search? *DELETED* [Re: ]
    #1992716 - 10/09/03 10:37 AM (13 years, 2 months ago)

Post deleted by poke smot!

Reason for deletion: x



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OfflineJackal
Well Versed In Etiquette
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Registered: 10/16/02
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Re: Illegal Search? [Re: poke smot!]
    #1992802 - 10/09/03 11:15 AM (13 years, 2 months ago)

Good advice.

Cops suck.

:shake:


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OfflineAnnomM
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Registered: 12/22/02
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Re: Illegal Search? [Re: Cujo]
    #1993119 - 10/09/03 01:47 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

That really sucks. A car search because you were just sitting in your car, arrested for 0,5g pot and a bong... I just can't imagine that.  :shake: :nonono:

You make me love Dutch cops.  :smirk: :crazy: 


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Invisiblebuckwheat
Cynically Insane

Registered: 12/09/02
Posts: 11,179
Loc: Not Enough Characters to ...
Re: Illegal Search? [Re: Annom]
    #1993148 - 10/09/03 01:57 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

This is why im getiing a camera and a tape recoder in my car.if you had video or audio tape evidence charges would be dropped.


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OfflineSeussA
Error: divide byzero

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Registered: 04/27/01
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Re: Illegal Search? [Re: buckwheat]
    #1993213 - 10/09/03 02:13 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

> This is why im getiing a camera and a tape recoder in my car.

Been there... doesn't work. The cops get really really really pissed off when you pull out the camera. I mean really pissed... at least the one time it happened with me and my friends.

I was in the back seat with the video camera when we got pulled over for not using a turn signal while changing lanes. I started to tape the cop before we even came to a stop. The frist thing he does is tell me to turn off the camera. I refuse, siting my right to freedom of press. He asks if I am a 'licenced journalist'. I tell him no, I am a freelance photographer and it is my right to film whatever I wish. Oooh, that didn't go over well at all... no sir...

He charged me with obstruction of justice and I sued him for false arrest. The laywers got a couple of grand from each of us and both cases were dropped. I also never got back my video camera. The tape out of the camera also 'disappeared' while it was in police lockup.


--------------------
Just another spore in the wind.


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InvisibleTinMan
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Registered: 10/01/02
Posts: 2,956
Loc: Russia
Re: Illegal Search? [Re: Seuss]
    #1993217 - 10/09/03 02:15 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

Typical police... they will do anything to keep from getting fired or charged with a crime. As for having a video camera in your car, im sure you could get a micro pinhole camera and a hi8 VCR. You could find a lot of places to hide camera. But how would you know where to angle it?


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Invisiblebuckwheat
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Registered: 12/09/02
Posts: 11,179
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Re: Illegal Search? [Re: TinMan]
    #1993259 - 10/09/03 02:31 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

Yea i was thinking of lots of small pinhole cameras the cop would never know they were there and an microphones too. then maybe all of this hooked up to some modem that would send a recording to a computer at home.i dont know i still havent worked it out.

i also need to know if they would acept such evidence in court anyone know??


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Anonymous

Re: Illegal Search? [Re: Cujo]
    #1993268 - 10/09/03 02:34 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

the bong was in plain view. what he did probably doesn't constitute a search. he didn't need probable cause to look for things in plain view. he saw something in plain view and seized on it. i'm afraid you're screwed as far as fighting this goes.

my friend and i used to do that shit in high school. we'd make a single-use bong out of a plastic bottle, a straw, some aluminum foil, and toilet paper to seal it up. we'd go to this sports equipment store, smoke everything we'd brought back behind the store, and disassemble and throw away the bong. then we'd walk back to the car wicked stoned, turn up the music, and sit there with no contraband and no worries.

the best thing to do is to avoid these situations in the first place. don't bring anything you're not going to smoke, and try to smoke out of things you don't have to carry away with you when you're done. peices of fruit (apples work well), disposable bongs\bowls, and joints work well for this. that way... you don't have shit on you. the best thing is a joint because you can get rid of one quickly. i had to eat a joint once when a cop on a bike rolled up on us when we were smoking. he searched us, but he couldn't do shit.

the real lesson here is not to keep shit in plain view.


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Offlinetreyute
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Registered: 03/05/03
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Re: Illegal Search? [Re: ]
    #1993644 - 10/09/03 04:07 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

My number one tip for anyone that may have anything illegal on them at any time is to get a lawyer. Pay him a retainer (for some public defender quality lawyers this can be a pretty small amount). Then put his number on speed dial in your cell phone. When the cop pulls you over immediately call your lawyer and tell him what is happening, tell the cop you have an open connection with your lawyer and that your conversation is being recorded for your safety. You have the right to consult an attorney before answering ANY questions, even stupid ones such as "do you know how fast you were going". If the cop violates your rights in any way (which they do almost anytime they get the chance) then your attorney will hear it, or his answering machine will if its the middle of the night. I have been arrested and convicted on bullshit charges where cops were clearly violating my rights and could do nothing about it. At least this way I have the evidence on MY side, not the other way around.


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OfflineSeussA
Error: divide byzero

Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 04/27/01
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Re: Illegal Search? [Re: treyute]
    #1993981 - 10/09/03 05:28 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

> You have the right to consult an attorney before answering ANY questions, even stupid ones such as "do you know how fast you were going"

The only information that you are required by law to provide, without an attorney being present, is your legal name / identification.


--------------------
Just another spore in the wind.


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Anonymous

Re: Illegal Search? [Re: Seuss]
    #1994008 - 10/09/03 05:35 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

unless you are in an automobile, in which case you may be required by law to submit more.

if the bong was in plain view, there's nothing this guy can do.


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OfflineCujo
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Registered: 10/08/03
Posts: 6
Last seen: 12 years, 10 months
Re: Illegal Search? [Re: ]
    #1994143 - 10/09/03 06:18 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

what did he ask you, and what did you tell him?

-All i remember is him asking us for some Identification, where we live, what school we go to, stuff like that. Nothing that I thought by answering it would hurt me.

you don't bring up the topic of a search unless he does. cops ask people to step out of their cars all the time. the only way you can consent to a search is by consenting to a search. seeming overly concerned about getting searched didn't help you at all.

-I've been to the website http://www.flexyourrights.org/ and it says that just by unlocking your doors you can consent to a search, so I just wanted to make sure that the cop wasn't trying to abuse his power and confuse me into letting him search my car. Also, after i asked that question, he got pretty pissed and yelled at me to get out of the car.

-As for the whole snuff thing, it really pissed me off when he told me that was his probable cause, so i started to "argue" with him about how that IS total bullshit, but he kept telling me that he didn't care and that he was going to do his wingspan search anyway. He even told my parents that his probable cause was the whole snuff thing also, so i guess he's sticking to that and not another one.

-As for the bong, now that i got the story from my friend, it was inbetween the seat and the window, but while i was talking with the cop about the snuff, my friend took it and threw it underneath the car because he knew the cop would've seen it when he opened the door. When the cop saw it, i think his words were, "Why don't you grab that for me". I think it makes it completely different that the bong was underneath my car and not actually in it, so i dunno.

I'm in the U.S....Texas to be exact.

-I didn't admit to having the pot until they asked me, and if i would've said no, he still would've found it in 10 seconds, i just had it hidden in my center console.

-Thanks for your guys help so far, I'll be more than happy to answer any other questions. I'm talking to my attourney tomorrow, so I'll find out if i have a chance then, but i doubt that I do.







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Offlinecherokee
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Re: Illegal Search? [Re: Cujo]
    #1994298 - 10/09/03 07:07 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

I'm having trouble understanding the snuff part. Snuff is perfectly legal.


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OfflineCujo
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Registered: 10/08/03
Posts: 6
Last seen: 12 years, 10 months
Re: Illegal Search? [Re: cherokee]
    #1994343 - 10/09/03 07:19 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

The thing is, it wasn't even snuff, it was a stupid tiny dried drop of mud that he claimed was snuff.


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Anonymous

Re: Illegal Search? [Re: Cujo]
    #1994438 - 10/09/03 07:36 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

in what nazi state is it illegal for minors to have tobacco???  :confused:

the only thing smeared on the outside of your car that might cause for suspicion would be blood. that's ridiculous.

how much "searching" did he have to do before he found the bong?

the fact that he said he had probable cause for a search probably means that he thought was he was doing was indeed a search.

... get a lawyer. 


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OfflineCujo
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Re: Illegal Search? [Re: ]
    #1994509 - 10/09/03 07:54 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

he looked around pretty good on the drivers side and on the passenger side, then i think when he was talking to my friend, he noticed the bong underneath the car


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