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Shop: Original Sensible Seeds High THC Strains   Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

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Polish Troops in Iraq find recently produced French Missiles
    #1976343 -

WARSAW, Oct 3 (Reuters) - Polish troops in Iraq have found four French-built advanced anti-aircraft missiles which according to the military were built this year, a Polish Defence Ministry spokesman told Reuters on Friday. "Polish troops discovered an ammunition depot on September 29 near the region of Hilla and there were four French-made Roland-type missiles," Eugeniusz Mleczak said. "It is not the first time Polish troops found ammunition in Iraq but to our surprise these missiles were produced in 2003," Mleczak said. The Roland anti-aircraft system is a short-range air defence missile in service with at least ten countries, including France and Germany. It is mobile, usually mounted on a vehicle, and defence experts say the missiles are highly effective against aircraft attacking at low and medium altitude. Under a strict trade embargo imposed by the United Nations, Iraq was barred form importing arms since the invasion of Kuwait in 1990. Mleczak said Polish troops were notified about the missiles by a local Iraqi, who received a reward for the information...

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Re: Polish Troops in Iraq find recently produced French Missiles [Re: wingnutx]
    #1976361 -

You're really uptight about this failure to find any WMD in Iraq arn't you?


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Don't worry, B. Caapi

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Re: Polish Troops in Iraq find recently produced French Missiles [Re: Xlea321]
    #1976367 -

Alex...it was four missles!!!! think of how many ppl those could have killed in america if they could reach, and the crowd was concentrated... :rolleyes:


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"Know your Body - Know your Mind - Know your Substance - Know your Source.

Lest we forget. "

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Re: Polish Troops in Iraq find recently produced French Missiles [Re: Xlea321]
    #1976370 -

What failure? Read the Kay report. We found violations aplenty.


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Re: Polish Troops in Iraq find recently produced French Missiles [Re: Azmodeus]
    #1976376 -

Alex...it was four missles!!!!

Damn, and remember the single vial of a crappy strain of botulism they found in some scientists drawer? My god the threat was real!!


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Don't worry, B. Caapi

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Re: Polish Troops in Iraq find recently produced French Missiles [Re: Xlea321]
    #1976385 -

From a deadly sinister threat to.....violations...how quaint. :smirk:


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"Know your Body - Know your Mind - Know your Substance - Know your Source.

Lest we forget. "

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Re: Polish Troops in Iraq find recently produced French Missiles [Re: Azmodeus]
    #1976450 -

zing


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All I know is The Growery is a place where losers who get banned here go.

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Re: Polish Troops in Iraq find recently produced French Missiles [Re: Xlea321]
    #1976466 -

congratulations, you've exposed the obvious for all to see. we're all aware that this clearly has nothing at all to do with the phantom WMD's. that wasn't the point anyone was trying to make.

the point is that 4 anti-aircraft missiles, manufactured this year in france were uncovered in iraq.

in elementary school, did you ever get those exercises where you have to read a particular passage and select what the main idea of the passage was? it's to test your critical reading skills... ah... i remember them... color by number, multiplication tables, critical reading...

Edited by mushmaster (10/03/03 01:50 PM)

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Re: Polish Troops in Iraq find recently produced French Missiles [Re: ]
    #1976503 -

mushmaster said:
the point is that 4 anti-aircraft missiles, manufactured this year in france were uncovered in iraq.



so whats the point of this point?


--------------------
"Know your Body - Know your Mind - Know your Substance - Know your Source.

Lest we forget. "

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Re: Polish Troops in Iraq find recently produced French Missiles [Re: Azmodeus]
    #1976535 -

so whats the point of this point?

No-one will ever know.


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Don't worry, B. Caapi

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Re: Polish Troops in Iraq find recently produced French Missiles [Re: Azmodeus]
    #1976565 -

the point is that sometime very recently the french supplied iraq with anti-aircraft missiles. surely i don't have to point out the significance of that for you, do i?

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Re: Polish Troops in Iraq find recently produced French Missiles [Re: ]
    #1976568 -

the point is that sometime very recently the french supplied iraq with anti-aircraft missiles

It says they were french MADE not french supplied. Might be time to work on those critical reading skills mush.


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Don't worry, B. Caapi

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Re: Polish Troops in Iraq find recently produced French Missiles [Re: Xlea321]
    #1976607 -

Should be a very short trail to follow for newly minted SAMs.

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Re: Polish Troops in Iraq find recently produced French Missiles [Re: Xlea321]
    #1976610 -

this isn't the first time they've come across these missiles in iraq. it is however, the first time they've positively identified as have being produced some time this year. here's another article about french missiles in iraq....

from april 30th
French Missiles in Iraq

The Pentagon restrictions came after U.S. Army and Australian special forces teams discovered advanced versions of a French-made surface-to-air missile system in Iraq. U.S. Air Force officials are certain that Iraqi French-made Roland missiles downed at least one A-10 "Warthog" attack jet and may have killed two USAF pilots in an F-15E Strike Eagle.

Australian special forces teams working in Iraq?s western desert uncovered 51 Iraqi MiG fighters hidden near an abandoned airfield. The Aussie soldiers also discovered a cache of Roland 2 missiles and a launcher near the hidden MiG jets.

The Australian special forces members were critical to the success in the Iraqi western desert against possible missile attack against Israel.

In addition, U.S. airborne troops from the 101st division recently stumbled onto a French-made Roland 3 missile system, complete with radar, computer and fire control electronics. The French army first deployed the Roland 3 advanced missile in 1995. The Roland 3 unit supplied to Iraq would be a clear violation of the U.N. arms embargo placed on Iraq after the first Gulf War.

French defense ministry officials recently denied that the Roland 3 was supplied to Iraq. However, French defense industry insiders speculated that Iraq might have acquired the Roland 3 unit illegally from "mafia" sources, suggesting that Paris has a problem with black market theft inside advanced military projects.

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Re: Polish Troops in Iraq find recently produced French Missiles [Re: ]
    #1976665 -

I don't know if now is the time for the US to take someone else to task for defying the UN.

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Re: Polish Troops in Iraq find recently produced French Missiles [Re: infidelGOD]
    #1976670 -

it's some seriously underhanded shit, that's all...

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Re: Polish Troops in Iraq find recently produced French Missiles [Re: ]
    #1976675 -

mushmaster said:
the point is that sometime very recently the french supplied iraq with anti-aircraft missiles. surely i don't have to point out the significance of that for you, do i? 



"Supplied"...with an arsenal of not one....not two, hell not three, but FOUR missles!!....sorry i miss the signifigance... 

Saddam shoulda used those puppies in the war!, coulda change the tide of battle... :tongue: :lol:


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"Know your Body - Know your Mind - Know your Substance - Know your Source.

Lest we forget. "

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Re: Polish Troops in Iraq find recently produced French Missiles [Re: Azmodeus]
    #1976678 -

more than that. read the article i posted. there's probably more.

they're still warm out of the factory too, don't forget that.

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Re: Polish Troops in Iraq find recently produced French Missiles [Re: ]
    #1976692 -

yeah, i just read the article...could be significant...
But i suspect saddam wanted at least some defense in case the worse happened...like it did. But in so doing, he incriminates himself and is rather hypocritical...


--------------------
"Know your Body - Know your Mind - Know your Substance - Know your Source.

Lest we forget. "

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Re: Polish Troops in Iraq find recently produced French Missiles [Re: ]
    #1976727 -

if the French government was involved, I'd have to agree that it's pretty fucked up. I doubt that there were any violations of UN sanctions. the French aren't that dumb, why would they give weapons to Iraq that can easily be traced back to them?

as that article suggested, it was probably from other sources, theres a huge black market for arms, and I don't think the manufacturers can be held accountable for where their products end up. what about all the US made stinger missiles that were in the possesion of Taliban fighters?

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Re: Polish Troops in Iraq find recently produced French Missiles [Re: wingnutx]
    #1976761 -

The Roland anti-aircraft system is a short-range air defence missile in service with at least ten countries, including France and Germany.

Does that mean that France produces these missiles and sells them to ten other countries for their usage? Or that these missiles are produced in ten different countries?


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Once, men turned their thinking over to machines in the hope that this would set them free.
But that only permitted other men with machines to enslave them.

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Re: Polish Troops in Iraq find recently produced French Missiles [Re: trendal]
    #1976813 -

I think produced in France and then sold to the ten different countries.


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Re: Polish Troops in Iraq find recently produced French Missiles [Re: wingnutx]
    #1976825 -

that is correct.

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Re: Polish Troops in Iraq find recently produced French Missiles [Re: ]
    #1976847 -

this isn't the first time they've come across these missiles in iraq

So what? Do you believe the french government are so desperate for money they're selling 4 missiles to Saddam for christs sake?


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Don't worry, B. Caapi

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Re: Polish Troops in Iraq find recently produced French Missiles [Re: infidelGOD]
    #1976861 -

what about all the US made stinger missiles that were in the possesion of Taliban fighters?

And of course they were supplied directly to the nightmarish warlords by the american government.


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Don't worry, B. Caapi

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Re: Polish Troops in Iraq find recently produced French Missiles [Re: Xlea321]
    #1976884 -

(in order to repel a soviet invasion)

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Re: Polish Troops in Iraq find recently produced French Missiles [Re: ]
    #1978001 -

So by the same logic you would support governments selling the taliban weapons in order to repel the US invasion?

Or are wars of aggression allright if George Bush says so?


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Don't worry, B. Caapi

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Re: Polish Troops in Iraq find recently produced French Missiles [Re: Xlea321]
    #1978672 -

no alex. fallacious reasoning. the two are incomparable.

fundamental difference: when the soviets went into afghanistan it wasn't because the government of afghanistan was in cahoots with an international terrorist organization that was attacking russians all over the world. it was simply to install and support an unpopular communist government.

the US's invasion was not a 'war of aggression'.... they clearly had been hitting us first for years.

the invasion by the soviets was.

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Re: Polish Troops in Iraq find recently produced French Missiles [Re: ]
    #1978775 -

I'm afraid saying invading Afghanistan was to stop international terrorism is pure Bush bullshit. Plain and simple. You do not invade Eire to stop the IRA. (Incidentally Bin Laden is still operating)

And if thousands of innocent dead civilians and the widespread use of depleted uranium weapons, cluster bombs and daisy cutters isn't a "war of aggression" I don't know what is.

Remember, your perception of the Russian invasion is merely what people like George Bush have told you. The truth is a little different. Are you aware the Afghan government invited the Russians in to help protect them from CIA backed terrorists operating out of Pakistan for example?

And surely it's a little rich the country that invaded Vietnam complaining about "wars of aggression"?


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Don't worry, B. Caapi

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Re: Polish Troops in Iraq find recently produced French Missiles [Re: Xlea321]
    #1978977 -

I'm afraid saying invading Afghanistan was to stop international terrorism is pure Bush bullshit. Plain and simple. You do not invade Eire to stop the IRA. (Incidentally Bin Laden is still operating)

we've already discussed this. perhaps your memory is worse than mine. here: same argument still applies.

why do you think the united states went to war against the taliban and al-qaeda?

And if thousands of innocent dead civilians and the widespread use of depleted uranium weapons, cluster bombs and daisy cutters isn't a "war of aggression" I don't know what is.

every war is a war of aggression. the real question is: who is the aggressor? the identity of the aggressor of course has nothing to do with the tactics employed by each side, but is determined by which party initiated forceful action.

Remember, your perception of the Russian invasion is merely what people like George Bush have told you. The truth is a little different. Are you aware the Afghan government invited the Russians in to help protect them from CIA backed terrorists operating out of Pakistan for example?

this perception is historically accurate, and one that will be corroborated by many unbiased sources.

which afghan government are you referring to? the People's Democratic Party of Afghanistan?

1978: pro-soviet communist guerrillas assassinate afghani president muhammad daud khan and establish the People's Democratic Republic of Afghanistan.

1979: a coup against the PDPA, bringing Hafizullah Amin to power, provokes an invasion in december of that year by soviet forces and the installation of babrak karmal as president.

the invasion sparked international outcry. guerrilla resistance fighers, the mujahidin, were supported by aid from the united states, china, and saudi arabia, channeled through pakistan, and from iran. eventually soviet forces pull out and the government of the PDPA collapses.

the events are quite clear. the soviet government invaded afghanistan to install and prop up an unpopular pro-soviet government. there was no justifiable reason for them to invade afghanistan. they were the aggressors in the conflict.

And surely it's a little rich the country that invaded Vietnam complaining about "wars of aggression"?

completely fallacious. do i really need to show you why?

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Re: Polish Troops in Iraq find recently produced French Miss [Re: wingnutx]
    #1979347 -

Quote:
Poland Apologizes for French Missiles Report
Sat October 4, 2003 12:46 PM ET
By Pawel Kozlowski and Marcin Grajewski

WARSAW/ROME (Reuters) - Poland apologized to France on Saturday for claiming that its troops had found advanced French-made missiles in Iraq that had been produced this year.

The report sparked strong criticism from French President Jacques Chirac, who called it wrong and drawn up without proper checks.

However, neither Polish nor French authorities denied that the Roland-type anti-aircraft weapons were discovered near the Iraqi town of Hilla in a zone controlled by the Polish-led military force.

"Defense Minister Jerzy Szmajdzinski expresses regret concerning the information on the alleged date of the production of these missiles," the ministry said in a statement, adding that a investigation had been ordered.

The Polish Defense Ministry said on Friday that Polish troops in Iraq had discovered four French-made Roland missiles, which are part of short-range air defense systems in many countries including France and Germany.

Ministry spokesman Eugeniusz Mleczak told Reuters the missiles were manufactured in 2003, but the French Foreign Ministry promptly denied that, saying production of the most modern Roland 3 rocket ended in 1993.

"There could not be any 2003 missiles because those missiles have not been manufactured for 15 years," Chirac told a news conference at a European Union summit in Rome.

"I believe the Polish soldiers have created confusion that could have been avoided with thorough verification," he said, adding that he had made the point to Polish Prime Minister Leszek Miller "in a friendly but frank and firm way."

FRANCE ANGRY

The spat briefly sent France's relations with Poland, the biggest of 10 countries set to join the EU in seven months, to fresh lows after Chirac criticized Poland for supporting the U.S.-led war on Iraq, some diplomats said.

But a senior French diplomatic source told reporters that following the Warsaw's apology "France was satisfied and the issue was clarified."

Many Polish politicians cannot forgive Chirac, an outspoken opponent of the war, for his remark this year that Poland and other EU newcomers "missed a good opportunity to keep quiet" when they signed a joint open letter in support of Washington.

France has been irritated by Poland's refusal to accept a new EU voting system embedded in a draft constitution which EU members and newcomers debated in Rome.

The United States gave a Polish-led force control over a zone in south-central Iraq after Poland emerged as one of its strongest allies in the war against Iraq.

Industrial sources in France said 2003 was the year the missiles were checked in Iraq by an Iraqi company, not the year of manufacture.

A French Foreign Ministry spokeswoman told Reuters on Friday that Roland 1 missile systems were sent to Iraq from 1980 to 1981 and Roland 2 systems from 1983 to 1986. The Roland 3 was never exported to Iraq, she said.

Under a strict trade embargo imposed by the United Nations, Iraq was barred from buying arms after its invasion of Kuwait in 1990. But Baghdad managed to circumvent the ban in the 1990s through shadowy deals with various arms traders.




http://www.reuters.com/newsArticle.jhtml?type=worldNews&storyID=3558044


--------------------
The above is an extract from my fictional novel, "The random postings of Edame".
:tongue:

In the beginning was the word. And man could not handle the word, and the hearing of the word, and he asked God to take away his ears so that he might live in peace without having to hear words which might upset his equinamity or corrupt the unblemished purity of his conscience.

And God, hearing this desperate plea from His creation, wrinkled His mighty brow for a moment and then leaned down toward man, beckoning that he should come close so as to hear all that was about to be revealed to him.

"Fuck you," He whispered, and frowned upon the pathetic supplicant before retreating to His heavens.

Edited by Edame (10/04/03 03:50 PM)

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Re: Polish Troops in Iraq find recently produced French Miss [Re: Edame]
    #1979376 -

Good find.

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Re: Polish Troops in Iraq find recently produced French Miss [Re: Edame]
    #1980510 -

Thanks edame. It was complete bullshit all along.

Strange how anxious our right-wing collegues were for it to be true tho  :smile: 


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Don't worry, B. Caapi

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Shop: Original Sensible Seeds High THC Strains   Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order


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