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Invisiblesilversoul7
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Quebec
    #1973857 - 10/02/03 08:45 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

I was wondering where the Canadian Shroomerites here stood on the issue of Quebec becoming independent. I'm trying to better understand the arguments for and against this.


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"It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong."--Voltaire


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OfflineZahid
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Re: Quebec [Re: silversoul7]
    #1973996 - 10/02/03 09:33 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

I think it's dumb. It would make the map of Canada look really stupid, it would probably cost alot of money, and it would be alot more difficult for me to visit relatives in Montreal. Not to mention other provinces have stupid seperatist groups like Alberta, although Quebec is a little different. I believe in the 1970's there was a terrorist group called Freedom Liberation Quebec who terrorized Canada for a short while - in the mid 90's there was some political development for the cause, but ultimately Quebec remained one with the Leaf.


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Offlined33p
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Registered: 07/12/03
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Re: Quebec [Re: Zahid]
    #1974031 - 10/02/03 09:49 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

They are of french descent, did you really expect anything less.


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OfflineZahid
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Re: Quebec [Re: d33p]
    #1974055 - 10/02/03 09:57 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

I don't generalize people as a whole. Myself, I am French. I have spoken to French people who are for seperation and some who are against it. The majority oppose it, and I'm guessing that's what motivated the formation of the FLQ.


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OfflinePhred
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Re: Quebec [Re: silversoul7]
    #1974080 - 10/02/03 10:02 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

I lived through the time when martial law was declared in Canada by Pierre Trudeau during the FLQ crisis.

There are occasional flare-ups every now and then, but mostly it's a way for Quebec politicians to bludgeon the federal government into giving them even more concessions -- the urge to separate is not strong in the majority of Quebecers.

pinky


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OfflinePhluck
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Re: Quebec [Re: silversoul7]
    #1974120 - 10/02/03 10:15 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

There are people in Quebec who want to be independant, but at the moment the movement isn't too big. They've had two referrendums, and both times people voted against separating.

I'd rather not see them separate, but I think that the whole debate is fading into the past, slowly. This whole deal is really rooted in French/English relations from centuries ago, and there's not a whole lot of basis for it nowadays.


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"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us


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OfflinePhluck
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Re: Quebec [Re: Zahid]
    #1974144 - 10/02/03 10:23 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

"Not to mention other provinces have stupid seperatist groups like Alberta"

Well, there's also a group that wants Texas to separate from the US, it's really just a fringe cause.

The FLQ and the October crisis are an interesting part of Canadian history. Pierre Laporte, the minister of labour in Quebec was kidnapped and murdered. It's one of the craziest times in (fairly) recent Canadian history, and it always amazes me how little young Canadians today know about this. It's a very wild story. Do a search on Google if you want to learn more, seriously.


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"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us


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OfflineBaby_Hitler
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Re: Quebec [Re: Phluck]
    #1974227 - 10/02/03 10:51 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

There are some people that want Hawaii to seperate from the U.S.


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Offlined33p
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Re: Quebec [Re: Zahid]
    #1974250 - 10/02/03 10:57 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

From now on maybe ill have to put sarcasm in quotes to distingush when i use it. I was just joking and by the way i was born in canada so i really wouldnt have anything against them.


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InvisibletrendalM
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Re: Quebec [Re: d33p]
    #1974267 - 10/02/03 11:04 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

was born in canada so i really wouldnt have anything against them

Trust me, I've lived here my whole life and there are lots of poeple with something against "them".

I'd rather not see Quebec separate. I don't think they will in any case. I've got nothing against Quebec folk...but the ones who whine and bitch about having their own nation are good for nothing, IMHO.

Attention-seekers.


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You're here because you know something.
What you know you can't explain,
But you feel it;
You've felt it your entire life.
That there's something wrong with the world.
You don't know what it is, but it's there....
Like a splinter in your mind...
Driving you mad.


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Offlined33p
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Re: Quebec [Re: trendal]
    #1974304 - 10/02/03 11:13 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

Well by them i meant candians or just french candians as a whole. But as for those few who actually wish to slice up their onw country i pity them. As if their life is so horrible they must separate. Now i havent heard much about their position on the topic but the governemtn is fun by mainly french canadians so i dont see why they are mad.


--------------------
I'm a nihilist. Lets be friends.

bang bang


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InvisibletrendalM
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Re: Quebec [Re: d33p]
    #1974354 - 10/02/03 11:27 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

That's my point exactly :smile:

They're complaining about nothing. Almost makes me sick to see people complaining about living in Canada of all places when there are so many people suffering in other places of the world.


--------------------
You're here because you know something.
What you know you can't explain,
But you feel it;
You've felt it your entire life.
That there's something wrong with the world.
You don't know what it is, but it's there....
Like a splinter in your mind...
Driving you mad.


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OfflineZahid
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Re: Quebec [Re: d33p]
    #1974675 - 10/03/03 01:11 AM (13 years, 2 months ago)

I know you were being sarcastic; I was merely trying to ridicule you.


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Offlinewingnutx
Registered: 09/25/00
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Re: Quebec [Re: Phluck]
    #1975695 - 10/03/03 11:39 AM (13 years, 2 months ago)

I'm going to look that up. Sounds interesting. Thanks :smile:

Quote:

An angry Trudeau replied: "There's a lot of bleeding hearts around who just don't like to see people with helmets and guns. All I can say is go on and bleed."

"How far are you going to go?" Ralfe insisted.
"Just watch me!" said Trudeau.



And Canadians across the country watched as, at 3 o'clock in the morning, Friday, October 16, Trudeau invoked the War Measures Act. The Press Gallery was packed. Trudeau was careful, cold, analytic - and brilliant.

The invocation of the War Measures Act meant the suspension of traditional Canadian civil liberties. Anyone belonging to the FLQ, or to any cultural or political association suspected of being linked to the FLQ, could be rounded up in the dead of night without a search warrant and incarcerated without the right of habeas corpus. Under the sweeping authority of the act, 465 Canadians were so rounded up.

 




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OfflinePhluck
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Re: Quebec [Re: d33p]
    #1975725 - 10/03/03 11:51 AM (13 years, 2 months ago)

"Well by them i meant candians or just french candians as a whole. But as for those few who actually wish to slice up their onw country i pity them. As if their life is so horrible they must separate."

I don't think you quite understand their position. It's not about improving the quality of life, or about how they feel Canada is a shithole. They feel that they never really were a part of Canada. They feel patriotic about Quebec, not about Canada. They don't see it as slicing up their own country, to them Quebec has always been a separate entity that was attached to the english land against their wishes.

"Now i havent heard much about their position on the topic but the governemtn is fun by mainly french canadians so i dont see why they are mad. "

No it's not. The prime minister happens to be french Canadian, but the vast majority of the MPs are english speaking, I don't think there are any french MPs from anywhere other than Quebec.


--------------------
"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us


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OfflineBhairabas
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Registered: 07/21/03
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Re: Quebec [Re: Phluck]
    #1976093 - 10/03/03 01:55 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

I think alot of them are actually rascist.. The block Quebequois main reason for sepperation is to create a completely french society.. They want more control over immigration and have even made laws that force anyone who advertises to feature french writing being bigger than english or any other language for that matter..


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OfflinePhluck
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Re: Quebec [Re: Bhairabas]
    #1976391 - 10/03/03 03:15 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

"The block Quebequois main reason for sepperation is to create a completely french society"

When did they say that? There are lots of english speakers in Quebec, and I'm sure they'd be allowed to continue to speak english.

I agree that the language laws are kind of fucked, but that doesn't have anything to do with racism.


--------------------
"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us


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OfflineBhairabas
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Re: Quebec [Re: Phluck]
    #1976741 - 10/03/03 05:05 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

Yes it does the block Quebeqouis say themselve's that they are trying to create a state which reflects their french heritage which sets them aside from English society.. In other words they want everyone in Quebec to be French.. There not much different than the heratage front.. You just have to read between the lines.. There not as hardline now that Bouchard is gone but they were definately if not rascist prejudice against anyone who doesn't have pure French background..


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OfflinePhluck
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Re: Quebec [Re: Bhairabas]
    #1977001 - 10/03/03 06:18 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

"Yes it does the block Quebeqouis say themselve's that they are trying to create a state which reflects their french heritage which sets them aside from English society.. In other words they want everyone in Quebec to be French."

That's not what it means at all. They want the official language to be french, (which it already is), and to be independant. They haven't said one thing that would give the impression that they want to force everyone to speak a certain language.

Pariseau blamed the failure of the last campaign on the "ethnic vote", which was certainly a racist statement. This does not reflect the opinions of most of the Quebecois.


--------------------
"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us


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OfflineBhairabas
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Re: Quebec [Re: Phluck]
    #1977053 - 10/03/03 06:33 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

I think it does and did reflect an element of french society which they are not proud of which is why alot of people have stopped supporting them..


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