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InvisibleAleon
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Re: Pasteurizing Sawdust with Lime [Re: ghiajake] * 1
    #19553860 - 02/11/14 06:34 PM (10 years, 13 days ago)

Generally 2-3 main flushes, but if i have room up to 5.


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Offlinechefinainteasy
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Re: Pasteurizing Sawdust with Lime [Re: Aleon]
    #19553885 - 02/11/14 06:38 PM (10 years, 13 days ago)

So here are some of the results from my initial two projects. The first one with the peroxide, lime, and chicken compost mix with pellets. It took about 40 days to colonize then about 8 days to fruit. Now I did have them in our cold room at work which stays a constant 55F, so may of been the reason for the slow fruiting. Off a 5# block I harvested 1#1oz. Not bad for a mix and bag preparation.
Here is a 8oz cluster and the block pinning in my make shift SGFC.


Mind you, that spawn bag was a year old.....

Now here are some of the bags pinning that have the varying supplement at different rates. I had a few of them grow green, but those were the ones I thought to wet from the beginning. They did colonize and I will still fruit them.


This one is 10% cotton seed meal.


This one is 20% corn gluten. It is pinning like crazy!

They all took about the same amount of time colonizing, about 30-35 days. Which when was running 20% bran supplemented sterilized blocks this was about the same.

Here is one of the first "grow your own" bags I made up


I have everything at home in my orchid greenhouse, so far everyone is getting along.


Recently I have been playing aroung with adding rice hulls to the pellets to expedieate colonization. Its working well. I have done 20% rice to 80% pellets, and 50/50 rice to pellets. I have done a few preperations with both. I have lime soaked rice for 18 hours, drained, then added pellets to the mix to help absorbe excess water and give the substrate better water holding capacity.


Here is a close up of what the sub looks like.


This spawn run is closer to that of straw logs. The bags I made on 2/8 are about 50% colonized already. They are in poly tubing not filter patch bags as well.



Then 2/9 I mixed up a bag by simply putting 50% rice and 50% pellets dry, then 10% supplemented with chicken manure. The recipe is on the bag. I then simply added 12.5 ph lime water and mixed for 10 minutes until the pellets were broken up and the hulls were hydrated. To this I added about 30% lime processed millet spawn. I know its a lot of spawn, but I didn't have anything else besides the experimental lime millet spawn I made.



All in all everything seems to be going well for low tek, simple, quick preparation methods.

PS- sorry for the long winded post......:crazy:


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Offlinedeadmandave
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Re: Pasteurizing Sawdust with Lime [Re: chefinainteasy]
    #19556265 - 02/12/14 07:37 AM (10 years, 12 days ago)

Interesting results (actually amazing), by my calculations (given 70% moisture content) a 5lb block at 100% BE would be 1.5 lbs of mushroom. so chef and aleon, you are both close to achieving that on the first flush.

It seems you would expect a little higher yield if you had sterilized, any hypothesis as to why lime pasteurization with supplements is less than sterilized substrates?


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Offlineghiajake
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Re: Lime Tek: Pasteurizing Sawdust Pellets with Lime [Re: Aleon]
    #19556685 - 02/12/14 10:28 AM (10 years, 12 days ago)

Quote:

Aleon said:
Though we currently don't use straw on our farm; im sure at some point we will.




Give mixing the two a try.  Shredded straw supplemented with supplemented sawdust, or vice verse. Toss some wood chips in there too. It'd be like eating at the Golden Coral for the mycelium.


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Re: Pasteurizing Sawdust with Lime [Re: deadmandave]
    #19558981 - 02/12/14 08:04 PM (10 years, 12 days ago)

Quote:

deadmandave said:
Interesting results (actually amazing), by my calculations (given 70% moisture content) a 5lb block at 100% BE would be 1.5 lbs of mushroom. so chef and aleon, you are both close to achieving that on the first flush.

It seems you would expect a little higher yield if you had sterilized, any hypothesis as to why lime pasteurization with supplements is less than sterilized substrates?




Two ideas on this:
  1. Lime brings the ph of the actual substrate to a level more suited for mushroom production. Also gives some calcium

  2. Cooking in hot water is breaking down nutrients in the straw. Think of a compost pile...the hotter the pile, the more nutrient (especially nitrogen) lost to the air. Lime treated sub only loses what is leached out in the water


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InvisibleAleon
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Re: Pasteurizing Sawdust with Lime [Re: mrtumnas]
    #19694284 - 03/14/14 06:51 AM (9 years, 11 months ago)

Updated OP.  But ill Paste it here too:

1/3/2014 - Started Brown Oyster "213" experiment.
-Made 9L of warm lime water(5g/L not 2g/L) poured it onto 9KG oak pellets and .5KG pelleted gypsum. 
-Mixed in cement mixer for 10 minutes.
-Added 1.8KG of brown oyster "213" rye grain spawn. (200g wet spawn per 1KG dry sawdust)
-Mixed in cement mixer for 5 minutes.
-Loaded into a large column type bag (and filled 1 filter bag as well)
-Poked holes in bag; incubate at room temp
*Possibly too much lime in water; slow growth?
- 1/13/2014 -Fully colonized with no contams (10 days); Begin consolidation
- 1/31/2014 -Put into FC (28 days incubation); Pins formed invitro within 3T bag
- 2/8/2014 -Harvested 1st flush (9 days in FC); YIELD: .5lbs; pictures on page 5


1/6/2014 - Started Blue Oyster "PL" Experiment
-Made 9L of warm lime water(2g/L) poured it onto 9KG oak pellets and .5KG pelleted gypsum. 
-Mixed in cement mixer for 10 minutes.
-Added 1.8KG of blue oyster "PL" rye grain spawn. (200g wet spawn per 1KG dry sawdust)
-Mixed in cement mixer for 5 minutes.
-Loaded into a large column type bag (and filled 1 filter bag as well)
-Poked holes in bag; incubate at room temp
- 1/16/2014 -Fully colonized with no contams (10 days); Begin consolidation
- 2/3/2014 - put into FC (28 days incubation); cut 2 X's in bag
- 2/15/2014 -Harvested 1st flush (12 days in FC); YIELD: .5lbs


1/6/2014 - Started Shiitake "Jumbo" and "3782" Experiment
-Made 2 batches of 12L of warm lime water(2g/L) poured it onto 12KG oak pellets and .6KG pelleted gypsum. 
-Mixed in cement mixer for 10 minutes.
-Added 1.8KG of shiitake "Jumbo" rye grain spawn to the first batch and 1.8KG shiitake "3782" rye grain spawn to the second batch. (150g wet spawn per 1KG dry sawdust)
-Mixed in cement mixer for 5 minutes.
-Put on gloves and loaded into 8 3T-filter bags at 3.3-3.6KG/Bag
-1/16/2014 -Minute amounts of green mold growing on both the Shiitake batches. So minute that most of the bags have already ate the green, and the small amount left looks like it will be consumed soon.  Besides this, the blocks look great. Contam sources: Not enough spawn (used less than oysters) or not enough lime.
- 1/30/2014 -Green mold has been fully consumed by mycelium.


3/13/2014 - Started Brown Oyster "213" %20 bran experiment.
-Made 13L of warm lime water(4g/L not 2g/L)
-Added 2.4KG of bran to the lime water and stirred to saturate bran
-Poured Lime H2O + Bran slurry onto 9KG oak pellets and .5KG pelleted gypsum. 
-Mixed in cement mixer for 10 minutes.
-Added 1.8KG of brown oyster "213" rye grain spawn. (200g wet spawn per 1KG dry sawdust)
-Mixed in cement mixer for 5 minutes.
-Loaded into 9 3T-filter bags at 2.7KG/Bag


3/13/2014 - Started Shiitake "Jumbo" Experiment
-Made 11L of warm lime water(4g/L not 2g/L) poured it onto 12KG oak pellets and .6KG pelleted gypsum. 
-Mixed in cement mixer for 10 minutes.
-Added 1.8KG of shiitake "Jumbo" rye grain spawn to the first batch (150g wet spawn per 1KG dry sawdust)
-Mixed in cement mixer for 5 minutes
-Loaded into 9 3T-filter bags at 3KG/Bag


3/13/2014 - Started Shiitake "3782" %2 bran Experiment
-Made 12L of warm lime water(4g/L not 2g/L) poured it onto 12KG oak pellets, .6KG pelleted gypsum, and 220g bran 
-Mixed in cement mixer for 10 minutes
-Added 1.8KG of shiitake "3782" rye grain spawn to the first batch (150g wet spawn per 1KG dry sawdust)
-Mixed in cement mixer for 5 minutes
-Loaded into 9 3T-filter bags at 3KG/Bag


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OfflineOICU812
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Re: Pasteurizing Sawdust with Lime [Re: Aleon]
    #19695726 - 03/14/14 03:15 PM (9 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

Aleon said:

1/6/2014 - Started Shiitake "Jumbo" and "3782" Experiment

-Made 2 batches of 12L of warm lime water(2g/L) poured it onto 12KG oak pellets and .6KG pelleted gypsum.
-Mixed in cement mixer for 10 minutes.
-Added 1.8KG of shiitake "Jumbo" rye grain spawn to the first batch and 1.8KG shiitake "3782" rye grain spawn to the second batch. (150g wet spawn per 1KG dry sawdust)
-Mixed in cement mixer for 5 minutes.
-Put on gloves and loaded into 8 3T-filter bags at 3.3-3.6KG/Bag
-1/16/2014 -Minute amounts of green mold growing on both the Shiitake batches. So minute that most of the bags have already ate the green, and the small amount left looks like it will be consumed soon.  Besides this, the blocks look great. Contam sources: Not enough spawn (used less than oysters) or not enough lime.
- 1/30/2014 -Green mold has been fully consumed by mycelium.





Any changes worth noting on Jumbo and 3782 since 1/30/14?


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OfflineAmanita virosa
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Re: Pasteurizing Sawdust with Lime [Re: Aleon]
    #19695737 - 03/14/14 03:19 PM (9 years, 11 months ago)

We have also been experimenting with SRA on lime straw and Shittake straw on lime straw.  We have also had great success with bigger flushes and overall yield by adding well rotted manure to the lime soak water.  It has no effect on contam.  In fact, we have run about 50 buckets at this point and had zero contamination including ones where we used slightly moldy spawn to inoculate.  What has not worked for us is using sawdust spawn.  It just sits there and never colonizes the straw.  Glad to see yalls results on sawdust.  we are going to try this soon.  Keep it up.  A woman came in the store today and asked if we ever "experimented".  I laughted and told her that growing mushrooms WAS a great big experiment.


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Offlinedrake89
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Re: Pasteurizing Sawdust with Lime [Re: Amanita virosa]
    #19696727 - 03/14/14 07:53 PM (9 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

Amanita virosa said:
What has not worked for us is using sawdust spawn.  It just sits there and never colonizes the straw. 




bummer.  it works great for us, except yellow oyster.  we use a ridiculous spawn rate though- 5 or 6 lb block for a 60lb straw log- 30%.

Quote:

Amanita virosa said:
  Keep it up.  A woman came in the store today and asked if we ever "experimented".  I laughted and told her that growing mushrooms WAS a great big experiment.




hell right!


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Offlinechefinainteasy
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Re: Pasteurizing Sawdust with Lime [Re: drake89]
    #19696795 - 03/14/14 08:09 PM (9 years, 11 months ago)

I have several batches of shiitake on a mix of lime sawdust/lime soaked rice hulls that are colonizing very well. All spawned with sawdust at about 12% wet weight. They are supplemented at 10% with cotton seed meal. I also made a batch yesterday with just lime pellets, much in the same fashion Aleon described for his later projects. I mix water, lime, gypsum, and supplement together then added to the pellets and mixed. Once mixed I add the spawn and mix until incorporated. I also have made a few batches this way with king oyster, using grain spawn and different supplements at different rates. I have been having very good success with my mixes of rice hulls and pellets as well as just supplemented pellets. As soon as I figure out how to post an excel file ill share my data so far with some pics I have been taking.


--------------------
Check out my youtube videos. the Mushrooms Naturally series by chefinainteasy

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InvisibleAleon
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Re: Pasteurizing Sawdust with Lime [Re: Amanita virosa]
    #19699013 - 03/15/14 06:22 AM (9 years, 11 months ago)

OICU- The shiitake are browning up.  At this rate, they should be ready in april sometime.

Chef- Im excited to see the yeild on your supplemented lime subs. 

Quote:

Amanita virosa said:
We have also been experimenting with SRA on lime straw and Shittake straw on lime straw.  We have also had great success with bigger flushes and overall yield by adding well rotted manure to the lime soak water.  It has no effect on contam.  In fact, we have run about 50 buckets at this point and had zero contamination including ones where we used slightly moldy spawn to inoculate.  What has not worked for us is using sawdust spawn.  It just sits there and never colonizes the straw.  Glad to see yalls results on sawdust.  we are going to try this soon.  Keep it up.  A woman came in the store today and asked if we ever "experimented".  I laughted and told her that growing mushrooms WAS a great big experiment.




Let us know how the straw goes for those 2.  Thanks for the tip with manure; how much are you adding again?  What are your thoughts on using bagged/dried chicken manure?  Sawdust span never worked well for us either with straw; when we tried years ago.  But for sup. sawdust, sawdust spawn is my favorite!  A woman came in the store today and asked if we ever "experimented".  I laughted and told her that growing mushrooms WAS a great big experiment.  :rofl:!


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Invisiblesolarity
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Re: Pasteurizing Sawdust with Lime [Re: Aleon]
    #19700559 - 03/15/14 03:10 PM (9 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

As soon as I figure out how to post an excel file ill share my data so far with some pics I have been taking.




Stick it on Dropbox or similar and post the link.


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Offlinechefinainteasy
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Re: Pasteurizing Sawdust with Lime [Re: solarity]
    #19701216 - 03/15/14 06:47 PM (9 years, 11 months ago)

Perfect I was waiting for someone to help me out:crazy:


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Check out my youtube videos. the Mushrooms Naturally series by chefinainteasy

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Re: Pasteurizing Sawdust with Lime [Re: chefinainteasy]
    #19701284 - 03/15/14 07:05 PM (9 years, 11 months ago)

https://onedrive.live.com/view.aspx?resid=5D9531B1DBB28F4B!454&app=WordPdf&wdo=2

Well here it is. I don't computer very well so this is the best I can do for now. I'm not sure why it changed the format? Didn't feel like paying for a dropbucket account......

Basically, and these results have yet to be reproduced, but the 5% corn gluten and soy meal at 10% and 15% gave the best first flush yields. The ones without numbers contaminated. Its been hard to really get consistent results as my grow space is very limited. I couldn't even fruit all 16 blocks to get a good judge of speed of fruiting. But all in all the results have been promising for such little effort. And the idea of mixing up a batch to make 100 blocks at a time with no cook time involved with decent yields may be worth it.

Ps- sorry for the recipe in metric and yields in ounces. Old habits.


--------------------
Check out my youtube videos. the Mushrooms Naturally series by chefinainteasy

My new business is now on facebook at https://www.facebook.com/MushroomsNaturally?ref=hl

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Re: Pasteurizing Sawdust with Lime [Re: chefinainteasy]
    #19701304 - 03/15/14 07:09 PM (9 years, 11 months ago)

The link sends me to a microsoft login screen. Have you gotten any fruits yet?


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Re: Pasteurizing Sawdust with Lime [Re: chefinainteasy]
    #19701312 - 03/15/14 07:13 PM (9 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

chefinainteasy said:
I couldn't even fruit all 16 blocks to get a good judge of speed of fruiting.




Sorry didn't read this part. Any pics?


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Offlinechefinainteasy
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Re: Pasteurizing Sawdust with Lime [Re: GreenGills]
    #19701422 - 03/15/14 07:53 PM (9 years, 11 months ago)

Ok ill try to repost it. I have pics ill have to upload.


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Check out my youtube videos. the Mushrooms Naturally series by chefinainteasy

My new business is now on facebook at https://www.facebook.com/MushroomsNaturally?ref=hl

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Offlinechefinainteasy
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Re: Pasteurizing Sawdust with Lime [Re: chefinainteasy]
    #19701528 - 03/15/14 08:26 PM (9 years, 11 months ago)

Here are some of the supplemented lime blocks


Here is a similar mix I'm using for my grow your own bags.


--------------------
Check out my youtube videos. the Mushrooms Naturally series by chefinainteasy

My new business is now on facebook at https://www.facebook.com/MushroomsNaturally?ref=hl

                                                                                                                            MY Garden:grin:


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OfflineGreenGills
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Re: Pasteurizing Sawdust with Lime [Re: chefinainteasy]
    #19701713 - 03/15/14 09:32 PM (9 years, 11 months ago)

Those are nice man! I'm really loving using lime.


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InvisibleAleon
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Re: Pasteurizing Sawdust with Lime [Re: chefinainteasy]
    #19703132 - 03/16/14 07:40 AM (9 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

chefinainteasy said:
Here are some of the supplemented lime blocks


Here is a similar mix I'm using for my grow your own bags.






Great for home growing.  Although, those yields are too low for commercial viability; and at the extremely high spawn rates your using.  Lower yields (by .25lb-.75lb/block) and 4-8 times the amount of spawn i normally use does not sound like a good alternative to heat sterilization; but i do see progress!  Keep experimenting, as you may find that golden ticket :sunny:


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