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Invisiblepeace of mind 1
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Re: I feel thumbprinting is a completely hoax. [Re: mindgnome] * 2
    #19587694 - 02/19/14 12:31 AM (7 years, 7 months ago)

:imout:


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InvisibleShroomismM
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Re: I feel thumbprinting is a completely hoax. [Re: mindgnome] * 1
    #19587708 - 02/19/14 12:34 AM (7 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

mindgnome said:
Not quite. One of the DEA agents that was involved with the Picard(sp?) lsd lab actually ingested hundreds of thousands of hits. He shaved his neck before handling all of the lsd and the fumes went through his freshly opened pores. He had ingested some ridiculous quantity of lsd. He was rushed to the hospital and started having seizures and convulsions. He actually did recover quite well but he cannot read because it impaired his focus so much. It was part of a video I watched. Sorry for no source I can't seem to find it. So while you say that it didn't harm people, that is sort of relative. It might not have killed them, but it permanently effected their brain function, I guarantee that. Also my aunt who was a doctor in the 70's saw a lot of people go crazy from doing too much. I am not trying to sound like a anti-psychedelics person but acid is definitely the riskiest traditional psychedelic you can ingest. Research psychedelics are worse though because the ld50 is so much lower on rc's.




:goodluckwiththat2:

My brother's uncle's best friend's second mother took too much acid one time, and saw an orange.. ever since then he's been stuck in a corner and will scream in terror whenever someone comes near him and say not to peel him and he thinks everyone is trying to juice him and turn him into orange juice.. He's never been the same since.


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OfflineDa2ra
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Re: I feel thumbprinting is a completely hoax. [Re: mindgnome] * 1
    #19587710 - 02/19/14 12:34 AM (7 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Shroomism said:
The CIA even experimented with bathing people in LSD to try and make supersoldiers. They went crazy. Because they were in a laboratory being probed by scientists and CIA.. being bathed by LSD.. you'd go crazy too. Set and setting.




LSD baths? More info, please.

I gave him some medical documentation, so I'm sure he's convinced now.

Quote:

mindgnome said:
He actually did recover quite well but he cannot read because it impaired his focus so much.




That's from Nat Geo's Hallucinogen's episode of their series, Drugs Inc. Did he say that now he can't read? I don't recall that. If it's true, it's just HPPD, which can happen with any psychedelic in standard doses, the exact mechanism of which is unknown. What point are you trying to make? I already provided evidence of people who did massive doses of LSD and did not report not being able to read.


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Invisiblepeace of mind 1
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Re: I feel thumbprinting is a completely hoax. [Re: Da2ra] * 1
    #19587720 - 02/19/14 12:36 AM (7 years, 7 months ago)

:dontspillme:


:topicsucks:


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OfflineDa2ra
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Re: I feel thumbprinting is a completely hoax. [Re: Da2ra] * 1
    #19587724 - 02/19/14 12:37 AM (7 years, 7 months ago)

I'm also pretty sure that that DEA agent never said anything about seizures and convulsions! The only thing I remember him saying is taht he was in the back of an ambulance and one or several of his fellow officers were with him and he said something like "you wouldn't believe what I'm seeing right now."


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Re: I feel thumbprinting is a completely hoax. [Re: Da2ra]
    #19587728 - 02/19/14 12:38 AM (7 years, 7 months ago)

Also on the topic of research chemicals, Alexander Shulgin is a genius, no one can argue that, but research chemicals are far less safe than their parent molecules. Take for instance, mescaline which has a ld50 of about 1200mg/kg and compare that to 2c-e which has a ld50 of 14mg/kg.


--------------------
"As I walk on through troubled times my spirit gets so downhearted sometimes so where are the strong and who are the trusted? And where is the harmony? Sweet harmony. Cause each time I feel it slippin' away, just makes me wanna cry. What's so funny 'bout peace love & understanding?" - Nick Lowe

"Psychedelic drugs don't change you - they don't change your character - unless you want to be changed. They enable change; they can't impose it...” - Sasha Shulgin


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Offlinemindgnome
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Re: I feel thumbprinting is a completely hoax. [Re: Da2ra]
    #19587734 - 02/19/14 12:39 AM (7 years, 7 months ago)

no he said they had to give him valium because he was convulsing and he claimed he would have died if he hadn't received it.


--------------------
"As I walk on through troubled times my spirit gets so downhearted sometimes so where are the strong and who are the trusted? And where is the harmony? Sweet harmony. Cause each time I feel it slippin' away, just makes me wanna cry. What's so funny 'bout peace love & understanding?" - Nick Lowe

"Psychedelic drugs don't change you - they don't change your character - unless you want to be changed. They enable change; they can't impose it...” - Sasha Shulgin


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InvisibleShroomismM
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Re: I feel thumbprinting is a completely hoax. [Re: Da2ra] * 1
    #19587744 - 02/19/14 12:40 AM (7 years, 7 months ago)



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InvisibleShroomismM
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Re: I feel thumbprinting is a completely hoax. [Re: mindgnome] * 1
    #19587746 - 02/19/14 12:41 AM (7 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

mindgnome said:
no he said they had to give him valium because he was convulsing and he claimed he would have died if he hadn't received it.




Lol because he's a medical doctor.

No he accidentally dosed a lot of acid and was a noob with a weak mind and was having a panic attack and thought he was dying. Happens a lot to noobs that take too much. Valium did not save his life. :lol:


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OfflineDa2ra
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Re: I feel thumbprinting is a completely hoax. [Re: mindgnome] * 1
    #19587749 - 02/19/14 12:42 AM (7 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

mindgnome said:
Take for instance, mescaline which has a ld50 of about 1200mg/kg and compare that to 2c-e which has a ld50 of 14mg/kg.




From what I understand, LD50s for psychedelic drugs are highly questionable. Consider the following two posts.

Thanks, Shroomism. And lol.

--
chinacat72 said:
LD-50's for animals mean nothing when talking about LSD.
As my professor Dr. David Nichols(www.heffter.org.) said they are completly worthless. The neurological differences between different animal species and humans makes testing LSD on animals unreliable. A mouse can consume a amount of LSD that will kill an elephant. Also it seems that some of these studies were done giving the LSD by IV. By giving LSD IV you then have to calculate what that amount is in terms of an oral dosage because taking 5mg. by injection is vastly different than 5mg. oraly in bioavailability.

As Dr. Hoffman says we just don't know the LD-50 of LSD in humans.
I don't see how we ever will. The one person to die from shooting LSD IV'd 320,000 mcg.* ,this is the equivelent of many grams orally. His case can't be considered though becuase he was a junkie and possibly had other drugs in his system.

Also the case about the elephant. The elephant had recieved many different drugs over its life as a test animal. Including a dose of amphetamine some hours before the LSD dose and a massive dose of thorazine after the LSD dose.
--
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showthreaded.php/Number/2102631/vc/1


--
Please provide one credible source that shows an overdose from mescaline(not another phenethylamine, but mescaline). Your not going to.Indians have eaten close to one hundred peyote buttons with no overdoses(or many bad effects). You might want to read the study by John Halpern MD the Harvard researcher that just did a long study on the saftey of peyote in the indian community. Indians eat large doses of mescaline containing cactus and live very long lives with no health problems that can be contributed to mescaline(in fact they show a lower rate of alcoholism if they are regular users) I have yet to see any information that would provid evidence that mescaline was any more dangerous than LSD or psilocybin.

Though you can overdose on anything including water I havn't seen any info that would show mescaline to be more dangerous. I think your stomach would explode from to much cactus before you could consume enough too "overdose" on mescaline.

Like I said if you have any valid data to prove otherwise I would be very interested in seeing it. :thumbup: 
--

08/30/03, chinacat72, http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/1866049#1866049


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Invisiblepeace of mind 1
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Re: I feel thumbprinting is a completely hoax. [Re: mindgnome] * 1
    #19587750 - 02/19/14 12:42 AM (7 years, 7 months ago)

A lot of people say they're going to die, even on low doses :shrug:

What the fuck are we even discussing anymore? People gave personal experiences of cases where heavy dosing didn't cause permanent damage, didn't this answer your question? Nobody's saying it "can't" happen.

:huxleyfacepalm:


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Offlinemindgnome
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Re: I feel thumbprinting is a completely hoax. [Re: Shroomism]
    #19587752 - 02/19/14 12:42 AM (7 years, 7 months ago)

I guess that is a good point to some extent, but he also was having seizures?


--------------------
"As I walk on through troubled times my spirit gets so downhearted sometimes so where are the strong and who are the trusted? And where is the harmony? Sweet harmony. Cause each time I feel it slippin' away, just makes me wanna cry. What's so funny 'bout peace love & understanding?" - Nick Lowe

"Psychedelic drugs don't change you - they don't change your character - unless you want to be changed. They enable change; they can't impose it...” - Sasha Shulgin


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InvisibleShroomismM
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Re: I feel thumbprinting is a completely hoax. [Re: Da2ra] * 1
    #19587763 - 02/19/14 12:45 AM (7 years, 7 months ago)

Yeah I was gonna ask, what's the LD50 for LSD Mr. Guru, since RCs have a higher LD50? Lol

Not sure how you can make that claim, when there is no established LD50 for humans.


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Offlinemindgnome
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Re: I feel thumbprinting is a completely hoax. [Re: Da2ra]
    #19587765 - 02/19/14 12:45 AM (7 years, 7 months ago)

That wasn't even my point in saying the ld50 of the two. I was pointing out that people take something like acid and think they are taking lsd when in actuality they are taking something that does have a registered ld50 and has killed people in the past. That is the point I was making.


--------------------
"As I walk on through troubled times my spirit gets so downhearted sometimes so where are the strong and who are the trusted? And where is the harmony? Sweet harmony. Cause each time I feel it slippin' away, just makes me wanna cry. What's so funny 'bout peace love & understanding?" - Nick Lowe

"Psychedelic drugs don't change you - they don't change your character - unless you want to be changed. They enable change; they can't impose it...” - Sasha Shulgin


Edited by mindgnome (02/19/14 12:49 AM)


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OfflineDa2ra
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Re: I feel thumbprinting is a completely hoax. [Re: mindgnome] * 1
    #19587767 - 02/19/14 12:46 AM (7 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

mindgnome said:
I guess that is a good point to some extent, but he also was having seizures?




Yes and I provided documentation of other people who had seizures, but what's common to both these incidents is that they weren't even expecting to trip on LSD at all! So, it wouldn't be farfetched to say that their seizures and other symptoms were specifically catalyzed by panicking when they started to feel the effects -- a direct result of freaking out on such a high dose.


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InvisibleShroomismM
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Re: I feel thumbprinting is a completely hoax. [Re: mindgnome] * 1
    #19587772 - 02/19/14 12:46 AM (7 years, 7 months ago)

People on bad acid trips can freak out and hyperventilate themselves and THINK they are dying. I've seen it before. That doesn't mean they ARE dying. They are just psyching themselves out for the most part. How you handle an acid trip is all in the mind for the most part. Super high dose or not.

People can't handle the reality shift or mindfuck or whatever, and freak THEMSELVES out by getting stuck in negative thought patterns loops or whatever. It's completely reversible and only in the mind. In essence they give themselves a panic attack.


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Invisiblepeace of mind 1
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Re: I feel thumbprinting is a completely hoax. [Re: Da2ra] * 1
    #19587775 - 02/19/14 12:47 AM (7 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Da2ra said:
Quote:

mindgnome said:
I guess that is a good point to some extent, but he also was having seizures?




Yes and I provided documentation of other people who had seizures, but what's common to both these incidents is that they weren't even expecting to trip on LSD at all! So, it wouldn't be farfetched to say that their seizures and other symptoms were specifically catalyzed by panicking when they started to feel the effects -- a direct result of freaking out on such a high dose.



:thumbup:


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Re: I feel thumbprinting is a completely hoax. [Re: Shroomism]
    #19587778 - 02/19/14 12:47 AM (7 years, 7 months ago)

I was pointing out that research chemicals have a extremely lower ld50. I have read a lot of books including Stanislav Grof so I'm no dummy.


--------------------
"As I walk on through troubled times my spirit gets so downhearted sometimes so where are the strong and who are the trusted? And where is the harmony? Sweet harmony. Cause each time I feel it slippin' away, just makes me wanna cry. What's so funny 'bout peace love & understanding?" - Nick Lowe

"Psychedelic drugs don't change you - they don't change your character - unless you want to be changed. They enable change; they can't impose it...” - Sasha Shulgin


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InvisibleTrentBoyett
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Re: I feel thumbprinting is a completely hoax. [Re: mindgnome]
    #19587791 - 02/19/14 12:50 AM (7 years, 7 months ago)

I would do a thumbprint if ever offered without thinking twice about it... So why wouldn't other people?


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InvisibleDr.Dankhead
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Re: I feel thumbprinting is a completely hoax. [Re: Shroomism]
    #19587795 - 02/19/14 12:50 AM (7 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Shroomism said:
I have dosed 70+ hits of silver in a single dose, my mind is fine.
I know people who have done thumbprints, they are fine.

Psilocybin is not Lysergic Acid Diethylamide.

Just because you refuse to believe it does not mean it does not exist.

The CIA even experimented with bathing people in LSD to try and make supersoldiers. They went crazy. Because they were in a laboratory being probed by scientists and CIA.. being bathed in LSD.. you'd go crazy too. Set and setting.

LSD does not damage your DNA or whatever it is you think




No it doesn't damage DNA, but:

Your definition of "fine" could substantially differentiate from those who could provide actual evidence of cognitive disorders through neurology  before and after tests..

Yeah he may look and seem fine, but the only person that can tell weather or not he suffered any psychological, cognitive or  neuropathy impairment from that thumb print,  is him alone, and most the time they won't notice..


Believe it or not, taking too much of anything can be potentially life altering, in May ways or aspects not just spiritually... Not saying if you take one hit, you'll be fucked for ever, but merely just saying that an overload from too much serotonin has been known to cause people to become "stoic" per say.. Unattached. Messing with short memory, basic motor skills, alertness, and being able to adequately keep basic communication structure while having a conversation..

If you think you can't fuck yourself you from LSD.. Go ahead, be dumb and take as much as you can, you won't remember if it effected your cognitive abilities afterward anyway..By that time it's too late anyway.

I'm not dissing on you big high dosing people, I'm just saying that some psychs have the potential to impair cognitive abilities without the users knowledge or understanding.


Hence the word= fried lol.


--------------------

:mushroom2:**need a check up?**:aliendance: **im a Doctor**:mushroom2:
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i sometimes wish I was a wormy, wiggling all in the cold dirt...tickle tackle pickle dickle think a mackshift thought of broken words broken gears and words of conundrums..I'm not a weiner doctor so take that shit to dr. Gonz free boob inplant consultations.. Photo required


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