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OfflineSeussA
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Tom Perkins' big idea: The rich should get more votes
    #19566946 - 02/14/14 03:58 PM (9 years, 11 months ago)

http://money.cnn.com/2014/02/14/investing/tom-perkins-vote/index.html?hpt=hp_t2

Quote:

Tom Perkins suggested Thursday that only taxpayers should have the right to vote -- and that wealthy Americans who pay more in taxes should get more votes.

The venture capitalist offered the unorthodox proposal when asked to name one idea that would "change the world" at a speaking engagement in San Francisco moderated by Fortune's Adam Lashinsky.

"The Tom Perkins system is: You don't get to vote unless you pay a dollar of taxes," Perkins said.

"But what I really think is, it should be like a corporation. You pay a million dollars in taxes, you get a million votes. How's that?"

The audience at the Commonwealth Club reacted with laughter. But Perkins offered no immediate indication that he was joking. Asked offstage if the proposal was serious, Perkins said: "I intended to be outrageous, and it was."




He makes an interesting point... why shouldn't people that pay more taxes have more say in how the tax money they pay is used?  I'm not saying to cut out everybody, or to have a system where non-tax payers have no voice at all.  In a company, the stakeholders that have the most stake in a company have the most say with how the company is run.  Why should the government be different?


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InvisibleShins
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Registered: 09/15/04
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Re: Tom Perkins' big idea: The rich should get more votes [Re: Seuss]
    #19566979 - 02/14/14 04:06 PM (9 years, 11 months ago)

Hey I'm all for people being able to choose to join some kind of business co-opt or tax federation and pay as much tax as they want to do things, just don't force me to join if I don't want to.do those same things.

I guess a question could be; is a voluntary free market more free, fair and "democratic" than an authoritarian forced democracy?


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Offlinebloodsheen
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Re: Tom Perkins' big idea: The rich should get more votes [Re: Shins]
    #19567097 - 02/14/14 04:41 PM (9 years, 11 months ago)

Um, obviously this is a terrible idea. The reason more money shouldn't get more votes is because then laws would only benefit rich people. If you think your idea is a good one, get more people to like it through propaganda, lies, coercion, and least of all, logic.

What hes really saying is that if rich people got all the votes, eventually there wouldn't even be taxes.


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A cautious young fellow named Lodge / Had seat belts installed in his Dodge. / When his date was strapped in / He committed a sin / Without even leaving the garage. That's clever, isn't it?-A boy and his dog


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Offlinezappaisgod
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Registered: 02/11/04
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Re: Tom Perkins' big idea: The rich should get more votes [Re: Seuss]
    #19567118 - 02/14/14 04:48 PM (9 years, 11 months ago)

No


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Offlinesweeper54
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Re: Tom Perkins' big idea: The rich should get more votes [Re: zappaisgod]
    #19567136 - 02/14/14 04:52 PM (9 years, 11 months ago)

Exxon gets ZERO votes?

It would be a way to get some of these fuckers to pay taxes.


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Offlinezappaisgod
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Re: Tom Perkins' big idea: The rich should get more votes [Re: sweeper54]
    #19567157 - 02/14/14 05:00 PM (9 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

sweeper54 said:
Exxon gets ZERO votes?

It would be a way to get some of these fuckers to pay taxes.



http://www.usatoday.com/story/money/personalfinance/2013/03/17/companies-paying-highest-income-taxes/1991313/

Quote:

Regardless of how this debate will shake out, each of the 10 companies on this list paid at least $4 billion in taxes, and one of them, ExxonMobil (XOM), paid more than $30 billion. It is at least some evidence that America's large companies often pay extraordinary amounts.




Stop lying.


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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
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Re: Tom Perkins' big idea: The rich should get more votes [Re: Seuss]
    #19567161 - 02/14/14 05:01 PM (9 years, 11 months ago)

I'm fully in favor of only those who make a net tax payment being allowed to vote.

Your neighbors who don't contribute to your household have no say in what you do with your money, neither should those who leech from society.


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You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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Offlinezappaisgod
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Re: Tom Perkins' big idea: The rich should get more votes [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #19567172 - 02/14/14 05:04 PM (9 years, 11 months ago)

No.


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InvisibleShins
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Re: Tom Perkins' big idea: The rich should get more votes [Re: bloodsheen]
    #19567241 - 02/14/14 05:23 PM (9 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

bloodsheen said:
Um, obviously this is a terrible idea. The reason more money shouldn't get more votes is because then laws would only benefit rich people. If you think your idea is a good one, get more people to like it through propaganda, lies, coercion, and least of all, logic.

What hes really saying is that if rich people got all the votes, eventually there wouldn't even be taxes.




Democracy should be restricted by certain laws; as in a republic. People should not be able to vote themselves money then forcably extract it from unwilling participants


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Offlinebloodsheen
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Re: Tom Perkins' big idea: The rich should get more votes [Re: Shins]
    #19567306 - 02/14/14 05:39 PM (9 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

Shins said:
Quote:

bloodsheen said:
Um, obviously this is a terrible idea. The reason more money shouldn't get more votes is because then laws would only benefit rich people. If you think your idea is a good one, get more people to like it through propaganda, lies, coercion, and least of all, logic.

What hes really saying is that if rich people got all the votes, eventually there wouldn't even be taxes.




Democracy should be restricted by certain laws; as in a republic. People should not be able to vote themselves money then forcably extract it from unwilling participants



Actually thats exactly what democracy is all about. In fact, a real democracy would require you to go and vote every day on every issue (i.e. why its a democratic republic). And voting means that a majority (the classic 50% + 1) decides for everyone. If the majority says burglary is punishable by death, everyone has to live by that idea. Yes, your life is unwillingly taken from you if you choose to burglarize.

If you know the tax laws, you pay the taxes the majority decides for you. Again, I'm aware its actually a republic in many respects, but the point stands. Taxes are no different from any other law


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A cautious young fellow named Lodge / Had seat belts installed in his Dodge. / When his date was strapped in / He committed a sin / Without even leaving the garage. That's clever, isn't it?-A boy and his dog


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InvisibleShins
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Re: Tom Perkins' big idea: The rich should get more votes [Re: bloodsheen]
    #19567473 - 02/14/14 06:34 PM (9 years, 11 months ago)

The majority is relatively stupid and incompetent though, most people aren't qualified to make good government decisions, its folly.


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OfflineSmokey420
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Re: Tom Perkins' big idea: The rich should get more votes [Re: Shins]
    #19567567 - 02/14/14 07:06 PM (9 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

Shins said:
The majority is relatively stupid and incompetent though, most people aren't qualified to make good government decisions, its folly.




Sounds like you want a dictatorship.


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InvisibleShins
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Re: Tom Perkins' big idea: The rich should get more votes [Re: Smokey420]
    #19568106 - 02/14/14 10:00 PM (9 years, 11 months ago)

To be honest I'd prefer a benevolent dictatorship over democracy of the morons.


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Invisiblememes
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Re: Tom Perkins' big idea: The rich should get more votes [Re: sweeper54]
    #19568138 - 02/14/14 10:09 PM (9 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

sweeper54 said:
Exxon gets ZERO votes?

It would be a way to get some of these fuckers to pay taxes.



loved this!


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Offlinestarfire_xes
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Re: Tom Perkins' big idea: The rich should get more votes [Re: memes]
    #19568172 - 02/14/14 10:20 PM (9 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

memes said:
Quote:

sweeper54 said:
Exxon gets ZERO votes?

It would be a way to get some of these fuckers to pay taxes.



loved this!





the government makes more in taxes from exxon than exxon makes profits.

exxon, philip conoco, and chevron paid the highest tax rates of any companies in the us.

And anyone who says they don't pay taxes is talking right out the asshole they call a mouth.


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Offlinesweeper54
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Re: Tom Perkins' big idea: The rich should get more votes [Re: starfire_xes]
    #19569184 - 02/15/14 07:11 AM (9 years, 11 months ago)

I guess not wholly out my ass


The company paid no taxes at all to the U.S. federal government in 2009 on its domestic profits of nearly $2.6 billion. It appears that they avoided the tax man that year by legally funneling their profits through wholly owned subsidiaries in countries like the Cayman Islands, and reinvesting their earnings overseas.


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Offlinelwheidt
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Re: Tom Perkins' big idea: The rich should get more votes [Re: sweeper54]
    #19569210 - 02/15/14 07:25 AM (9 years, 11 months ago)

You have to be kinda stupid to think the rich people out there are better than you.
I have a job making deliveries. When you go to a rich persons house, you realize they have nice things, but they are very ugly people. They are always afraid of visitors and love to yell at everyone and be rude. Basically,  rich people are the worst people to deliver packages too. They are often huge jerks.
I've met enough rich people to see they are completely out of touch, paranoid, and selfish creatures on earth.

Of course they would like more power, but why would we give it to them?

Do rich people (or dumb people) realize everyone is paying taxes. Sales tax is paid by everyone,  so we all get to vote!


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Offlinesweeper54
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Re: Tom Perkins' big idea: The rich should get more votes [Re: lwheidt]
    #19569261 - 02/15/14 07:41 AM (9 years, 11 months ago)

Dude if you had read more then one (1) of my post AND my sig you'd know how I really felt about the rich



To quote Aerosmith



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Offlinepsilynut
aka Patchraper

Registered: 10/22/09
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Re: Tom Perkins' big idea: The rich should get more votes [Re: Seuss]
    #19569313 - 02/15/14 08:01 AM (9 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

I'm not saying to cut out everybody, or to have a system where non-tax payers have no voice at all.  In a company, the stakeholders that have the most stake in a company have the most say with how the company is run.  Why should the government be different?



 
Kinda sounds like thats what your saying. Sounds like your saying our country should be for sale to the highest bidder. And rich people should be your master.
  How would you propose this change in our voting and tax laws is instituted ? Seems to me either people will vote for it, or it will be violently forced upon us. Im thinking the second one is more likely.

Quote:

I'm fully in favor of only those who make a net tax payment being allowed to vote.



sounds like the fasttrack to this.



If you take away a free man or woman's right to vote , then society loses the power to exorcise authority over them , otherwise its just slavery.
.


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OfflinePhred
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Re: Tom Perkins' big idea: The rich should get more votes [Re: sweeper54]
    #19569414 - 02/15/14 08:34 AM (9 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

The company paid no taxes at all to the U.S. federal government in 2009 on its domestic profits of nearly $2.6 billion.



Wrong again. From the editors at Forbes who got it wrong the first time, sparking dozens of repetitions of the error in Leftie websites everywhere --

Quote:

What the financial statement says is that ExxonMobil, in 2009, after a handful of deferrals, recorded a total U.S. income tax benefit (i.e., a refund) of $46 million. Next to this, it shows total non-U.S. income taxes of $15.165 billion.

My mistake was in thinking that these figures somehow reflected actual tax benefits and liabilities. So what we should have written was that ExxonMobil “recorded” no U.S. income taxes for 2009 instead of “paid.” All you re-bloggers out there, please note the clarification. Mea culpa.

And for all you commenters outraged that Exxon isn’t paying taxes in the U.S., don’t worry, it is. Our article only focused on income taxes, but it’s worth noting that the 10-k also records $7.7 billion in other taxes in the U.S. (like sales taxes) and more than $50 billion of other taxes and duties paid (I mean recorded) overseas.


Bolding by Phred.

So Exxon paid 7.7 billion in taxes to the US government as well as overpaying their income tax by 46 million.


Phred


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