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MindOnMush
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Re: Prescription Meth? [Re: 28064212]
#19563390 - 02/13/14 08:33 PM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Alright man, I've had enough of your cyber-bullying. I said that for the sake of the joke.
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Sophistic Radiance
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tymoteusz3 said:
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Legend said:
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BlindSophist said: Dude, you're lucky if you haven't seen it or experienced it yourself, okay? Ease the fuck off, I'm talking about something that happened to me. Meth is pretty damn safe unless you cross a certain threshold, beyond which it pretty much instantly turns into a complete fucking horrorshow. There is no way for a new or inexperienced user to know where that is, and your claim that it can't be any worse than alcohol is complete horseshit. You dislike ignorance? Swell, good for you. I can tell you're a real fucking smart guy. Me, personally, I dislike people who superciliously claim authority on a subject that has grave consequences for folks gullible enough to think them credible.
I'm sure now you're gonna say it's my fault for being reckless, or some such condescending pablum intended to rescue your ego from acknowledging the fact that you're full of shit.
My thoughts exactly... I thought you were in a science field BS - I am kind of disappointed - I guess not everyone who is studying in a scientific field thinks rationally..
I wonder what this strange threshold is? More importantly I wonder what pharmacological / neurological basis this "threshold" argument has.. I expected better of you.
Your valiant defense of meth from its terrible stigma is really irresponsible to people who might take you seriously enough to think that they can screw around with their limits on meth like most of us do with alcohol and not have to expect serious, lingering consequences. Debilitatingly severe cravings, psychosis, yelling at voices in your head, trigging of anxiety and panic attacks, depression, extreme inattentiveness; the comedown from a bit too much in one night can destroy your ability to work or take pleasure in anything for a week or more.
And to whoever said that you can't die from meth overdose, that's true, but you can die from chronic renal failure caused by rhabdomyolysis caused by chronic abuse.
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Cyclohexylamine
Turn on, Tune in, Drop out
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Quote:
BlindSophist said:
Your valiant defense of meth from its terrible stigma is really irresponsible to people who might take you seriously enough to think that they can screw around with their limits on meth like most of us do with alcohol and not have to expect serious, lingering consequences. Debilitatingly severe cravings, psychosis, yelling at voices in your head, trigging of anxiety and panic attacks, depression, extreme inattentiveness; the comedown from a bit too much in one night can destroy your ability to work or take pleasure in anything for a week or more.
And to whoever said that you can't die from meth overdose, that's true, but you can die from chronic renal failure caused by rhabdomyolysis caused by chronic abuse.
Everything you listed is only an issue with abuse and staying up days on end (abuse). This is the same for any harder drug, meth is no different. What is your point here? Everything you are saying is hyperbole pretending symptoms of abuse happen after normal use.
Rhabdomyolysis in regards to amphetamines is caused by amphetamine overdose, not chronic abuse. Abuse can technically be an overdose, however chronic abuse implies something different. That being said chronic abuse of amphetamines can cause heart issues. I don't think anyone is advocating abusing any drug...
-------------------- Yes this is tymo - I just changed my name Have you ever had a dream that you were so sure was real? What if you were unable to awake from that dream? How would you know the difference between that dream world and the real world? There is NOTHING better than feeling that warm dissociative fuzz creeping up your body from IM K Something abut that anaesthetic rush... Qualitative Research Chemical Effects and Experiences The Wonderful World of Methoxetamine The 3-Meo-PCP Chapters, Part One
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MindOnMush
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Alright guys, all drugs have their pros and cons, just leave it at that. If some people think they can casually use meth than so be it. Arguing isn't going to change anyone's views. If anything it'll just make their views more concrete. So no more speak of whether meth is good or bad, okay? Okay.
-------------------- To Do: LSD Molly Cocaine Xanny Shrooms Grass Mescaline,DMT,GHB,LSA,LSZ Expand Your Mind, Broaden Your Horizons LIVING A CHEMICALLY ENHANCED EXISTENCE
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Sophistic Radiance
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Abuse can also mean taking too much at once, and that can cause symptoms you insist are caused by sleep deprivation literally overnight.
AFAIK, taking significantly more than appropriate to your unique tolerance (which varies widely) is considered both abuse and overdose. There is no known LD50 for meth in humans and no recorded death from acute intoxication, so "overdose" in this case could only refer to a threshold described subjectively by clinicians. Abuse refers to overdosing intentionally, whether it's done chronically or not.
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NotTheDevil
Transhuman
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Quote:
MindOnMush said: Alright guys, all drugs have their pros and cons, just leave it at that. If some people think they can casually use meth than so be it. Arguing isn't going to change anyone's views. If anything it'll just make their views more concrete. So no more speak of whether meth is good or bad, okay? Okay.
You sound pretty biased there in that second sentence.
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MindOnMush
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BlindSophist said: Abuse can also mean taking too much at once, and that can cause symptoms you insist are caused by sleep deprivation literally overnight.
AFAIK, taking significantly more than appropriate to your unique tolerance (which varies widely) is considered both abuse and overdose. There is no known LD50 for meth in humans and no recorded death from acute intoxication, so "overdose" in this case could only refer to a threshold described subjectively by clinicians. Abuse refers to overdosing intentionally, whether it's done chronically or not.
Motherfucka what did I say!!! No more meth facts!
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Cyclohexylamine
Turn on, Tune in, Drop out
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Of course there isn't a known LD50 of meth in humans.. You do understand what LD50 refers to right? We do however know that very doses of meth can cause amphetamine overdose - obviously this dose is dependent on many factors including tolerance, but we do know ranges based on clinical data.
-------------------- Yes this is tymo - I just changed my name Have you ever had a dream that you were so sure was real? What if you were unable to awake from that dream? How would you know the difference between that dream world and the real world? There is NOTHING better than feeling that warm dissociative fuzz creeping up your body from IM K Something abut that anaesthetic rush... Qualitative Research Chemical Effects and Experiences The Wonderful World of Methoxetamine The 3-Meo-PCP Chapters, Part One
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NotTheDevil
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Re: Prescription Meth? [Re: MindOnMush] 1
#19563515 - 02/13/14 09:00 PM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
MindOnMush said:
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BlindSophist said: Abuse can also mean taking too much at once, and that can cause symptoms you insist are caused by sleep deprivation literally overnight.
AFAIK, taking significantly more than appropriate to your unique tolerance (which varies widely) is considered both abuse and overdose. There is no known LD50 for meth in humans and no recorded death from acute intoxication, so "overdose" in this case could only refer to a threshold described subjectively by clinicians. Abuse refers to overdosing intentionally, whether it's done chronically or not.
Motherfucka what did I say!!! No more meth facts!
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MindOnMush
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Im going to throw a gamechanger at y'all....
You can smoke meth too! Holy buckets, I just found this out and it blows my mind, thought you could only plug it.
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Sophistic Radiance
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Quote:
An extremely large overdose may produce symptoms such as adrenergic storm, methamphetamine psychosis, anuria, cardiogenic shock, cerebral hemorrhage, circulatory collapse, hyperpyrexia, pulmonary hypertension, renal failure, rhabdomyolysis, serotonin syndrome, and a form of stereotypy ("tweaking").
Do tweakers die every time they overdose on meth? No. Since there is an established clinical protocol for administering doses of meth considered "safe", anything more than that is considered an "overdose".
Look, I know what I'm talking about here. Please understand that what you said could lead to seriously harmful decisions on the part of other people, and as a moderator at a community that could certainly be described as "at risk" for drug experimentation, you dropped the ball.
-------------------- Enlil said: You really are the worst kind of person.
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MindOnMush
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Quote:
NotTheDevil said:
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MindOnMush said: Alright guys, all drugs have their pros and cons, just leave it at that. If some people think they can casually use meth than so be it. Arguing isn't going to change anyone's views. If anything it'll just make their views more concrete. So no more speak of whether meth is good or bad, okay? Okay.
You sound pretty biased there in that second sentence.
Not biased, ignorant. I've never touched meth, no plan too. I wasn't trying to come off as bias. I was just trying to state that people are entitled to their opinion, if that opinion is that they can casually do meth, who am I to say they can't?
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Murph
Registered: 04/06/13
Posts: 1,678
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Can someone explain to me how speed calms down adha people and why it makes non adha people go into psychosis looking for imaginary bugs?
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Cyclohexylamine
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Re: Prescription Meth? [Re: Murph]
#19563595 - 02/13/14 09:17 PM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
BlindSophist said:
Quote:
An extremely large overdose may produce symptoms such as adrenergic storm, methamphetamine psychosis, anuria, cardiogenic shock, cerebral hemorrhage, circulatory collapse, hyperpyrexia, pulmonary hypertension, renal failure, rhabdomyolysis, serotonin syndrome, and a form of stereotypy ("tweaking").
Do tweakers die every time they overdose on meth? No. Since there is an established clinical protocol for administering doses of meth considered "safe", anything more than that is considered an "overdose".
Look, I know what I'm talking about here. Please understand that what you said could lead to seriously harmful decisions on the part of other people, and as a moderator at a community that could certainly be described as "at risk" for drug experimentation, you dropped the ball.
Why are you even worrying what is considered a clinical overdose or not? How does that have any bearing on the matter. Many drugs are taken in higher doses than what is clinical registered as the "safe" dose but that doesn't mean the user is overdosing and is in any harm.
You don't know what you are talking about. You claimed in a above post that overnight meth use could turn you into a "gollum", whatever that means. You also listed a whole host of issues that can crop up with heavy abuse and listed them as what will happen with any use. Yes - abuse of drugs cause issues - and exceptionally high doses of any hard drug (including your beloved alcohol) will cause severe issues or death. I am not sure what is so unique about meth or any amphetamine in this regard.
Part of harm reduction is actually stating the truth about drugs - not inflating hyperbole because of a personal vendetta against a specific drug or class of drugs.
Quote:
Murph said: Can someone explain to me how speed calms down adha people and why it makes non adha people go into psychosis looking for imaginary bugs?
It only causes those issues with abuse..
-------------------- Yes this is tymo - I just changed my name Have you ever had a dream that you were so sure was real? What if you were unable to awake from that dream? How would you know the difference between that dream world and the real world? There is NOTHING better than feeling that warm dissociative fuzz creeping up your body from IM K Something abut that anaesthetic rush... Qualitative Research Chemical Effects and Experiences The Wonderful World of Methoxetamine The 3-Meo-PCP Chapters, Part One
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Legend
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Re: Prescription Meth? [Re: Murph]
#19563605 - 02/13/14 09:19 PM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
Murph said: Can someone explain to me how speed calms down adha people and why it makes non adha people go into psychosis looking for imaginary bugs?
a low dose of stimulants will calm down almost anyone because of the subtle dopamine release.. Psychosis comes from extremely high doses, or chronic use, and most of the time is amplified by sleep deprivation.
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Sophistic Radiance
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Re: Prescription Meth? [Re: Murph]
#19563611 - 02/13/14 09:20 PM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Murph said: Can someone explain to me how speed calms down adha people and why it makes non adha people go into psychosis looking for imaginary bugs?
At low doses it has a roughly similar effect on everybody, subjective mild stimulation (sometimes less noticeable than caffeine) that increases patience for humdrum tasks. The effect appears like sedation to observers, especially in somebody who is normally hyperactive, since they'll stop acting out and start focusing more.
At high doses it'll fuck up anybody, including psychosis and formication (hallucinating bugs).
AFAIK it's not that it has some sort of "special" effect on ADHD people, it's just very useful for them.
-------------------- Enlil said: You really are the worst kind of person.
Edited by Sophistic Radiance (02/13/14 09:28 PM)
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Sophistic Radiance
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Quote:
tymoteusz3 said: Part of harm reduction is actually stating the truth about drugs - not inflating hyperbole because of a personal vendetta against a specific drug or class of drugs.
My problem is with your attempt to set up an equivalence between it and alcohol. They are not comparable, and the risks to an inexperienced one-time experimenter are not only completely different but potentially more serious than those from alcohol. Since I have a little personal experience with this that contradicts many of your specific claims about its relative safety, and since you insist on calling me "ignorant" about something with which I have personal experience that contradicts your relatively dangerous assertions and mistaken equivalence, I'm a little fucking miffed with your conduct here tonight. I also don't have a "vendetta" against amphetamines, as I use them regularly to treat my ADHD and consider them indispensable. You're full of assumptions.
Do you ever tell people to quit being ignorant about heroin, it's great for people with pain, it's about the same as alcohol?
-------------------- Enlil said: You really are the worst kind of person.
Edited by Sophistic Radiance (02/13/14 09:44 PM)
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MindOnMush
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Quote:
BlindSophist said:
Quote:
tymoteusz3 said: Part of harm reduction is actually stating the truth about drugs - not inflating hyperbole because of a personal vendetta against a specific drug or class of drugs.
My problem is with your attempt to set up an equivalence between it and alcohol. They are not comparable, and the risks to an inexperienced one-time experimenter are not only completely different but potentially more serious than those from alcohol. Since I have a little personal experience with this that contradicts many of your claims about its relative safety, and since you insist on calling me "ignorant" about something with which I have personal experience that contradicts your relatively dangerous assertions and mistaken equivalence, I'm a little fucking miffed with your conduct here tonight.
Do you ever tell people to quit being ignorant about heroin, it's great for people with pain, it's about the same as alcohol?
Check Yourself Before You Wreck Yourself Blindsophist..
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Sophistic Radiance
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-------------------- Enlil said: You really are the worst kind of person.
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MindOnMush
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We don't like your kind in these parts
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