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OfflineRoseM
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Cloning or multi spore?
    #1954713 - 09/26/03 04:41 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

This is weird. My friend, Don Quixote is a newbie. He decided to clone a dry sample (I recently discovered this sample is over two years old) of mushroom in some honey water.

He soaked his mushroom sample in H2O2 for one hour before putting it in sterilized honey water.

Here is a log of his experience:

http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat...;o=&fpart=1

Anyway, the honey water appears to be working. It looks just like it should. Any discoloration is due to honey or rust. The rest is mycelia.

My friend wants to know why this is working. Everything he has read has lead him to believe dry shrooms can't be cloned. He has, also, heard that H2O2 kills all active spores.

This batch of honey water shouldn't have worked because by all accounts it is a dead sample... but the proof is in the pudding. The water is growing textbook mycelia.

Why do you guys think this batch of honey water is working? Do you think it is a cloned piece of mycelium growing in the water or do you think it is a spore that survived the H2O2 and knocked up the honey water? Either way, this appears to be a resilient strain.

Don Quixote wishes he knew why this is working. He has a feeling he may have stumbled on to something new.

Any input would be greatly appreciated.


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Fiddlesticks.



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OfflinetwistedJay
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Re: Cloning or multi spore? [Re: Rose]
    #1955056 - 09/26/03 06:22 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

throw it out the window its the devil!
no, but in all seriousness sounds like the only thing you could be growing is contams.


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this has been a message from a twisted ass mutha fucka. and if you dont like it.........EAT A DICK!


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OfflineRoseM
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Re: Cloning or multi spore? [Re: twistedJay]
    #1955333 - 09/26/03 07:38 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

That is what everyone else says twistedjay, but I've seen Don's stuff with my own eyes. It looks like mycelia. He smelled it when he made a syringe this evening and he said it smelled just like it looked. It smelled like myc in honey.

He injected 10cc of H2O2 into the honey water and withdrew 10 cc of honey water and put the syringe in the fridge.

He will run a PF Tek on 4 jars to test the stuff in the syringe.

I have done a lot of research on this subject (I pass the info I find on to Don) and the only thing this jar is contaminated with is Psylocibe Cubensis.

Contams in Honey water are colorfull, cloud the water, float and fizz and or smell (I've read). Don's jar is only growing a white membrane at the bottom that breaks up a little when stirred. There is a slightly sweet odor. Don has grown more infections than mushrooms in the past so he is as amazed as I am this appears to be working.

I still want to know why it worked. Has anyone had a similar experience? I want to know what the oldest piece of shroom someone resurected.

I thought only spores would work after 2 years. Did the myc survive all this time? Did the spores (both spores and dried mycelia were injected in the honey water) survive the H2O2? How come no other contaminants did? Did the H2O2 re-hydrate the myclea?

Why is this working? I bet Don couldn't get this to work again if he tried!

Any input is helpful.


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Fiddlesticks.



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Invisiblesimplemachine
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Re: Cloning or multi spore? [Re: twistedJay]
    #1955339 - 09/26/03 07:39 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

yep black magic!!
:devil: :devil: :devil: :devil:


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Invisiblesimplemachine
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Re: Cloning or multi spore? [Re: simplemachine]
    #1955349 - 09/26/03 07:42 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

I may be wrong, but I don't think its spore that germinated...
haven't ppl on this board cloned from stems?
If it was spore that sprouted that would be like a multispore innoculation not a clone, right?


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OfflineRoseM
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Re: Cloning or multi spore? [Re: simplemachine]
    #1955385 - 09/26/03 07:50 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

That is my understanding simplemachine... unless just one spore survived. Multi spore means just that: multiple spores are used... and germinated.

Don dunked his sample in H2O2 before he inoculated the honey water. He assumes this killed all spores and contaminants. At the time, he didn't know dry mycelia=dead mycelia.

Something survived. Either the dry mycelia (in which case the honey water contains clones) or the spores (in which case it was multi spore inoculated). That, or an unknown contaminant which looks just like mycelia (Don is growing 4 mycobags right now too. He knows what mycelia looks like at the earliest stage. After shaking, the mycelia in the honey water jar looks the same as the early mycelia in the mycobags... before it turns bright white).

Either way, Don has had some exceptional beginner's luck.

I'll try to post some pics soon.


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Fiddlesticks.



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InvisibleBrainFarmer
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Re: Cloning or multi spore? [Re: Rose]
    #1956000 - 09/27/03 12:52 AM (13 years, 2 months ago)

it takes more than one spore: two spores must mate. and if indeed you have mycellia (gotta admit it seems rather dubious to me) it's almost certainly germinating spores and not a tissue clone. spores can remain viable for longer than two years, if stored properly.

BF


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InvisibleBrainFarmer
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Re: Cloning or multi spore? [Re: BrainFarmer]
    #1956013 - 09/27/03 12:56 AM (13 years, 2 months ago)

i just reread your post and saw the h202 soak at the beginning.  that should have killed the spores, especially if they were 2 yrs old.  so... i just don't see how you could have myc- i ain't call'n you a liar, i really don't know what to say/think about this one  :crazy: 


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OfflineRoseM
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Re: Cloning or multi spore? [Re: BrainFarmer]
    #1956139 - 09/27/03 02:01 AM (13 years, 2 months ago)

Well, I'll make sure Don Quixote grows it in a PF jar to see exactly what he has growing in the honey.

I'm not worried about the honesty factor. I know what I see. You, unfortunately, only get to read it. I'll take some pictures soon.

I can't believe it is growing either. Don didn't know dry mycelia was dead when he made this honey water or he wouldn't have soaked it in H2O2 at all. If he hadn't soaked it though, he's pretty sure it would have contaminated the water. The sample was ground up and kept in a .00 capsule (Perhaps the capsule preserved the myc?) for at least two years.

I am, at least, happy to see others are as confused as I am on this subject.

If this honey syringe grows shrooms, I'll see to it that Don Quixote repeats his experiment with the capsule and the honey water. Perhaps this was just a flash in the pan... perhaps he is on to something.

I wonder what strain was in the capsule...


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Fiddlesticks.



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OfflineRoseM
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Re: Cloning or multi spore? [Re: Rose]
    #1956172 - 09/27/03 02:17 AM (13 years, 2 months ago)

I just thought of something. Don told me these shrooms were very well dried. He has no idea what freeze dried shrooms look like but, these ones (Don, actually ground them into capsules himself. He got a good look at the shrooms before he ground them with a stone and morter.) looked very well preserved.

Do you think mycelia can be preserved if it is dried fast enough?

Don doesn't know enough about the sample. Only it is Psylocibe Cubensis and well preserved.

The grinding surely mixed many spores with the mycelium. Perhaps a few survived the H2O2 but I heard the H2O2 sizzled and bubbled when Don added the sample to the H2O2 glass. He says it looked like the H2O2 was doing its job.

Hmmm... I don't know... don't realy care since it seems to be working. But, if I could get to the bottom of this, I could, perhaps, further the study of mushroom cloning.

I've never heard of anybody having success this way... except Don Quixote... of course.


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OfflineRoseM
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Re: Cloning or multi spore? [Re: Rose]
    #1957441 - 09/27/03 04:40 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

Does anybody have a clue what is happening here?


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