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InvisibleXlea321
Stranger
Registered: 02/26/01
Posts: 9,134
"Not a single trace"
    #1950071 - 09/25/03 01:53 AM (13 years, 2 months ago)

The hunt for weapons of mass destruction yields - nothing

Intelligence claims of huge Iraqi stockpiles were wrong, says report

Julian Borger in Washington, Ewen MacAskill and Patrick Wintour
Thursday September 25, 2003
The Guardian

An intensive six-month search of Iraq for weapons of mass destruction has failed to find a single trace of an illegal arsenal, according to accounts of a report circulated in Washington and London.
A draft of the report, compiled by the CIA-led 1,400-strong Iraq Survey Group (ISG), has been sent to the White House, the Pentagon and Downing Street, a US intelligence source said, and will contain no evidence of Iraqi stockpiles of biological, chemical or nuclear weapons.

"It demonstrates that the main judgments of the National Intelligence Estimate (NIE) in October 2002, that Saddam had hundreds of tonnes of chemical and biological agents ready, are false," said the source.

The timing of this disclosure could hardly be worse for Tony Blair, just days before the start of the Labour party conference. Iraq has dogged the prime minister almost continuously for five months, overshadowing the domestic agenda. Downing Street had been hoping for respite after the end of Lord Hutton's inquiry, which closes today.

Mr Blair put forward Iraq's weapons of mass destruction as the reason for going to war and he has repeatedly insisted that the weapons would be found.

He told a sceptical Conservative MP in the Commons on April 30 that he was absolutely convinced that Iraq had such weapons and predicted that, when the report was published, "you and others will be eating some of your words."

Although Downing Street last night officially dismissed the leak as speculation, government sources confirmed that it was accurate.

A No 10 spokesman said: "People should wait. The reports today are speculation about an unfinished draft of an interim report that has not even been presented yet. And when it comes it will be an interim report. The ISG's work will go on."

He added: "Our clear expectation is that this interim report will not reach firm conclusions about Iraq's possession of WMD."

The government defence will be to stress that failure to find WMD does not mean that it does not exist.

Last night's leak will fuel the anti-war sentiment ahead of Saturday's demonstration in London for withdrawal of US and British troops from Iraq. It will also make it harder for Labour party organisers to resist grassroots pressure for a debate on Iraq.

The interim report is at present pencilled in for publication next week but the Labour, party, anxious to avoid it landing in the middle of its conference, is trying to get that changed.

The results of the ISG's search are also disappointing for the White House.

There is a debate within the administration over whether the report would be delivered to Congress at all, but congressional aides said they expected to hear from the head of the ISG, the former UN in spector David Kay, as early as next week.

He arrived back from Iraq last Wednesday and since then has been working on the report.

It is now thought that the ISG investigation will dwell on Saddam Hussein's capability and intentions.

The NIE was put together by the CIA and other US intelligence agencies, and claimed that the Iraqi leader had chemical and biological stockpiles, and a continuing nuclear programme that could produce a home-made bomb before the end of the decade.

The NIE became a key document in the propaganda war waged by President Bush in the runup to the invasion of Iraq in March, although intelligence officials warned that many of the nuances and cautionary notes from original reports had been removed from the final documents.

According to accounts of the ISG draft, captured Iraqi scientists gave the investigation an account of how weapons were destroyed, but those accounts refer back to the period immediately after the 1991 Gulf war.

The nuclear section of the survey group has also finished its work and left Iraq.

After addressing the Senate in July, a bullish Mr Kay claimed "solid evidence" was being gathered and warned journalists to expect "surprises".

No such surprises appear to be in the draft.

The CIA took the unusual step of playing down expectations of the report yesterday. "Dr Kay is still receiving information from the field. It will be just the first progress report, and we expect that it will reach no firm conclusions, nor will it rule anything in or out," the chief agency spokesman, Bill Harlow, said.

An intelligence official added yesterday that the timing of the report's release "had yet to be determined".

In London, a Foreign Office spokesman said: "It is David Kay's report. We do not have it. We will comment on it when it is presented.

"When it comes, it will be an interim report. ISG's work will continue. The reports are speculation about an unfinished draft of an interim report that has not yet even been presented yet."

David Albright, a former UN weapons inspector, said: "It's clear that the US and British governments wildly exaggerated the case for going to war." But he added that the fact that the survey group had not found concrete evidence of weapons did not mean that the Baghdad regime did not have programmes to quickly reconstitute programmes and weapons at short notice.

"Just because they can't find it, doesn't mean its not there," Mr Albright said.

"I'm not surprised, given how incompetent this search had been. They've had bad relations with the [Iraqi] scientists from the start because they treated them all as criminals."

Many of the Iraqi scientists and officials who surrendered to US forces have been held in detention for months without contact with their families, despite assurances they would be well treated if they cooperated.

But recently the Bush administration, under mounting pressure to justify the invasion, has been trying to improve the incentives for former Saddam loyalists to provide information.

Reuters quoted a senior US official yesterday as saying that the former defence minister, Sultan Hashim Ahmed, had been given "effective" immunity in the hope that he would provide information on Saddam's weapons programmes.

The foreign secretary Jack Straw, speaking at the United Nations general assembly in New York, declined to comment on the ISG report.

"If people want evidence, they don't have to wait for Dr Kay's report, what they can do is look at the volumes of reports from the weapons inspectors going back over a dozen years including the final report from Unmovic on March 7 this year, which set out 29 separate areas of unanswered disarmament questions to Iraq," he said.

The shadow foreign secretary, Michael Ancram, described the leak as "another damaging blow to the prime minister's credibility" and renewed calls for a judicial inquiry into the war.

The Liberal Democrat foreign affairs spokesman, Menzies Campbell, said: "If this report is true, there was no such threat. What there was was deception."

http://www.guardian.co.uk/Iraq/Story/0,2763,1049228,00.html



--------------------
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OfflineSquattingMarmot
Inquiring Mind
Registered: 08/19/03
Posts: 418
Last seen: 2 years, 5 months
Re: "Not a single trace" [Re: Xlea321]
    #1950236 - 09/25/03 03:22 AM (13 years, 2 months ago)

Absolutely nothing. Zero. Not a Single Trace. How many different ways do we have to repeat that Bush's claims were false. Made up. He lied, repeatedly. They all lied.


--------------------
"In the United States anybody can be president. Thats the problem."

"The gray-haired douche bag, Barbara Bush, has a slogan: "Encourage your child to read every day." What she should be is encouraging children to question what they read every day."

- George Carlin


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Offlinest0nedphucker
Rogue State
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Re: "Not a single trace" [Re: SquattingMarmot]
    #1950356 - 09/25/03 05:28 AM (13 years, 2 months ago)

They have found a huge network of fake facilities and vast security infrastructure which conveniently hasn't been widely reported.


--------------------
The punishment which the wise suffer, who refuse to take part in government, is to live under the government of worse men.


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OfflineGazzBut
Refraction

Registered: 10/15/02
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Re: "Not a single trace" [Re: st0nedphucker]
    #1950467 - 09/25/03 07:47 AM (13 years, 2 months ago)

Source?


--------------------
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Offlinest0nedphucker
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Re: "Not a single trace" [Re: GazzBut]
    #1950473 - 09/25/03 08:00 AM (13 years, 2 months ago)

The draft ISG report....


--------------------
The punishment which the wise suffer, who refuse to take part in government, is to live under the government of worse men.


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OfflineGazzBut
Refraction

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Re: "Not a single trace" [Re: st0nedphucker]
    #1950526 - 09/25/03 09:05 AM (13 years, 2 months ago)

where can i view this?


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InvisibleStarter
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Registered: 05/16/03
Posts: 1,148
Loc: Australia
Re: "Not a single trace" [Re: GazzBut]
    #1950533 - 09/25/03 09:15 AM (13 years, 2 months ago)

I don't think this will save him...

*********************

http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/news/articles/6885555?source=Evening%20Standard

Mr Blair has repeatedly urged the sceptics to wait for the verdict of the ISG. But the leaked draft of the interim report due to be published next month gives him little comfort.

The document is said to have found evidence of "deception" by Saddam Hussein over his plans to develop weapons of mass destruction programmes. But it has not found any laboratories or delivery systems, let alone any hardware.

***********

....Blair (I mean) :wink:


--------------------
Convert Metric and Imperial.


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InvisibleXlea321
Stranger
Registered: 02/26/01
Posts: 9,134
Re: "Not a single trace" [Re: st0nedphucker]
    #1950828 - 09/25/03 12:51 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

They have found a huge network of fake facilities and vast security infrastructure which conveniently hasn't been widely reported.

Eh? So there's now a conspiracy not to report security infrastructure?

It's WMD we're interested in stoned. Blair didn't threaten us with "Saddam has a vast security infrastructre" for pity's sake.


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Invisibleafoaf
CEO DBK?
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Registered: 11/08/02
Posts: 32,665
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Re: "Not a single trace" [Re: Xlea321]
    #1950978 - 09/25/03 02:09 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

I think you're missing his point.

I think he's trying to imply that this infrastructure
was misidentified by intelligence agencies as that
of bio and nuclear weapons facilities.

...or at least that's how I read it.


--------------------
All I know is The Growery is a place where losers who get banned here go.


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Offlineshakta
Infidel
Registered: 06/03/03
Posts: 2,633
Last seen: 12 years, 6 months
Re: "Not a single trace" [Re: afoaf]
    #1951022 - 09/25/03 02:18 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

Exactly.


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InvisibleXlea321
Stranger
Registered: 02/26/01
Posts: 9,134
Re: "Not a single trace" [Re: afoaf]
    #1951028 - 09/25/03 02:20 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

Not much of a point is it...?


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OfflineAzmodeus
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Re: "Not a single trace" [Re: Xlea321]
    #1951074 - 09/25/03 02:31 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

No...it isn't.


--------------------
"Know your Body - Know your Mind - Know your Substance - Know your Source.

Lest we forget. "


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Invisibleafoaf
CEO DBK?
 User Gallery

Registered: 11/08/02
Posts: 32,665
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Re: "Not a single trace" [Re: Xlea321]
    #1952263 - 09/25/03 09:29 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

if you mean whether or not claiming 'he tricked us'
is a valid defense...no...not at all.



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All I know is The Growery is a place where losers who get banned here go.


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Offlined33p
Welcome to Violence

Registered: 07/12/03
Posts: 5,381
Loc: the shores of Tripoli
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Re: "Not a single trace" [Re: afoaf]
    #1953966 - 09/26/03 12:09 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

"Not a single trace".........

of the evidence saddam needed to provide showing he destroyed all of his wmd's after the gulf war by un regulations,

"Not a single trace"


--------------------
I'm a nihilist. Lets be friends.

bang bang


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InvisibleXlea321
Stranger
Registered: 02/26/01
Posts: 9,134
Re: "Not a single trace" [Re: d33p]
    #1953981 - 09/26/03 12:18 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

Does it matter to you at all that you were lied to?


--------------------
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Offlined33p
Welcome to Violence

Registered: 07/12/03
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Re: "Not a single trace" [Re: Xlea321]
    #1953992 - 09/26/03 12:22 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

Yes, yes it does and thats the reason why i cringe reading every one of your posts.


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I'm a nihilist. Lets be friends.

bang bang


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InvisibleXlea321
Stranger
Registered: 02/26/01
Posts: 9,134
Re: "Not a single trace" [Re: d33p]
    #1953998 - 09/26/03 12:24 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

Well if it bothers you then that's ok d3.

Go easy on the cringing.


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Offlineshakta
Infidel
Registered: 06/03/03
Posts: 2,633
Last seen: 12 years, 6 months
Re: "Not a single trace" [Re: Xlea321]
    #1954006 - 09/26/03 12:29 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

LOL. Alex if after the war is over Bush is proven to have knowingly lied to us, I would support locking him up for the rest of his life.


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Offlined33p
Welcome to Violence

Registered: 07/12/03
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Re: "Not a single trace" [Re: Xlea321]
    #1954023 - 09/26/03 12:40 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

cringing on, my friend


--------------------
I'm a nihilist. Lets be friends.

bang bang


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OfflineAzmodeus
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Re: "Not a single trace" [Re: shakta]
    #1954536 - 09/26/03 03:39 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

shakta said:
LOL. Alex if after the war is over Bush is proven to have knowingly lied to us, I would support locking him up for the rest of his life. 




Well first i was going to laugh...make some comment and be done with it....but this is no laughing matter...no.....


I mean here we have an american who seriouslly believs bush did not knowingly lie.....
...
.........
....................
i rest my case. :shake:


--------------------
"Know your Body - Know your Mind - Know your Substance - Know your Source.

Lest we forget. "


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