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OfflineDavid_Scape
Anti Genius
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Registered: 08/05/02
Posts: 878
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Are you sweetheart?
    #1943381 - 09/23/03 04:15 AM (13 years, 7 months ago)

I sometimes entertain the idea that we all have this nature at the core of us. A nature that can be categorized on a spectrum between selfishness and sensitivity. Notice i dont consider the opposite pole of selfishness to be selflessness, because i think that even the most selfless acts are innocently built from selfish building blocks.

I consider myself to be on the more selfish side of the spectrum.
Now, i didnt make it that way... I just happen to find myself in this predicament. That does'nt mean that im evil, but it does mean that i have motivations and thoughts that tend to disturb or disgust the more sensitive type. Keep in mind this doesnt mean im a narcissus either. As a matter of fact im quite shy, a little socially incompetent and akward, and i even tend to be embarrased easier than most. My biggest dream is to be working with people i like, spending time with women i adore (and who adore me) and to have my work be meaningfully wrapped into my life. Does this sound horrible? no it doesnt. But take carefull notice of what it DOES NOT include.

I dont consider myself the epitomy of selfishness and meet MANY people who's motivations offend and bother me. AS a matter of FACT, i believe that most of america(dare i say, the world?) is more selfish than me. but i still believe myself to be so.

Im pretty sure that all these personality traits came from a general absence of good healthy relationships in my life; a lack of good women relationships, a little physical abuse, a lot of social withdrawl, a lot of avoidance, a lot of inferior feelings. All this stuff pretty much made me what i am today. Most of my intellectual endevors are structured around trying to regulate my turbulent emotions. I can only thank (god?) myself for not getting addicted to drugs or other types of acting out as ways to regulate emotions.

Anyways, this post is to help you recognize typical selfishness and to essentially help you understand selfishness in others. the external world is indifferent to you and EVERYTHING has its own agenda. That hurricane will continue its destructive path despite the major cities in its way, A virus will not stop doing what's in its nature just because it's inside an innocent child and your loved one has needs that eventually will mean departing you. Most people are afraid of how dark they are, and dont even really think or confront it. We even tortured ourselves by thinking in 'shoulds'. Like 'how we SHOULD act' or 'what we SHOULD be'. Just let the 'shoulds' go, and be yourself. You are justified. Then ask yourself....

...Are you selfish or are you a sweetheart?


--------------------
focusing
Flow
The Enneagram


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OfflineMAIA
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Re: Are you sweetheart? [Re: David_Scape]
    #1943721 - 09/23/03 10:37 AM (13 years, 7 months ago)

Selfishness is ego at work. If you think about the fact everyone has an ego, everyone is selfish .... some are more than others though. It's in our nature to have an ego, it fouls you now and then, so we have to use our intelligence to understand it and educate it.

MAIA


--------------------
Spiritual being, living a human experience ... The Shroomery Mandala



Use, do not abuse; neither abstinence nor excess ever renders man happy.
Voltaire


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Offlinefireworks_godS
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Re: Are you sweetheart? [Re: MAIA]
    #1943972 - 09/23/03 12:52 PM (13 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

MAIA said:
Selfishness is ego at work. If you think about the fact everyone has an ego, everyone is selfish .... some are more than others though. It's in our nature to have an ego, it fouls you now and then, so we have to use our intelligence to understand it and educate it.





It just cannot be educated, it can only be used to find the holes in the ship so that they can be fixed, and then the ego can be put out to pasture or the old folk's home...
Peace.


--------------------
:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you

:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:


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OfflineAlan Stone
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Registered: 11/23/02
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Re: Are you sweetheart? [Re: fireworks_god]
    #1944757 - 09/23/03 04:29 PM (13 years, 7 months ago)

While selfishness might be tied to the ego, I believe it has more to do with the way the West thinks. We live in a part of the world that encourages personal greed, selfishness and amoral behavior, all in the name of personal freedom. There are other forms of society that emphasise the group as most important, and not the individual.

Anyway, it depends on the way I feel that day whether I'm selfish or not. I can be altruistic to such a degree that I have nothing to gain by helping people, and even loose out on certain things to help another. Even worse - I can be that altruistic AND not feel any better because I do help people. I suppose that's because I'm Belgian, and we Belgians have a tendency to be highly suspicious of pride. I suppose I really don't feel any better about myself when I help people, because I feel it is something I HAVE to do. I would, however, feel bad about my self if I didn't help out.
But between that fact and the assumption that anything we do would be selfish, is a world of difference. I don't help others in the hope they would help me, and I don't do it because I feel better about myself when I do, because, as stated, I don't. I help people out of genuine love and respect for my fellow man.


--------------------
It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it.

- Aristotle


Edited by Alan Stone (09/23/03 04:35 PM)


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OfflineDavid_Scape
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Re: Are you sweetheart? [Re: Alan Stone]
    #1945165 - 09/23/03 06:33 PM (13 years, 7 months ago)

Okay,guys, my post was very vague. Sorry.
I am trying to express a small epiphany that i had.

Alot of people who would consider themselves sensitive are actually selfish in hiding. The people who appear to be 'walking mats' or those who are avoidant. Those who feel inadequate or are particularly pliable in social situations. These feelings, I believe, come from one's inability to assert himself selfishly. That sometimes you should insist your surroundings adapt to YOU. Large amounts of shame or failure to express feelings to others are signs that you suffer from denial of selfishness.

Most people inherently have this selfishness. But others like myself, dont. We struggle with society and culture, often to the point that we withdraw. Failing to assert our lives.

Understanding this shows how necessary selfishness is. and how it is actually just as much a treasure as selflessness.


--------------------
focusing
Flow
The Enneagram


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OfflineRhizoid
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Re: Are you sweetheart? [Re: David_Scape] * 1
    #1946556 - 09/24/03 01:53 AM (13 years, 7 months ago)

A person who helps others but never helps himself has turned self-attachment into self-hate. That is a mistake.


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InvisibleJellric
altered statesman

Registered: 11/08/98
Posts: 2,261
Loc: non-local
Re: Are you sweetheart? [Re: David_Scape]
    #1946633 - 09/24/03 02:26 AM (13 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

the external world is indifferent to you and EVERYTHING has its own agenda.




I couldn't agree more. Swami had a good thread on this recently. "Romantic Love" was the title I think. Yes, every creature and group of creatures is operating in its own self interest. And that's fine to a point. But each interest group is pushing its own agenda too often at the expense of our group or nation as a whole. A good example is the oil industry which is harming our shared environment while funding the VERY terrorism its governmental sponsors are fighting against!! (Arabs funding terrorists with oil money). The right hand doesn't know what the left hand is doing! Ignore the big picture at your own peril!

Every action of ONE segment of society impacts upon ALL OTHER segments of society to one degree or another. As the world "grows smaller" through technology, what was going on all along is now becoming increasingly clear: The problem comes when one segment attempts to screw all other segments to fulfill its own goals. Since all things are connected, it only screws itself in the long run.

A good example is the Arab oil embargo in the 1970's. At that time OPEC drastically cut oil production to increase prices which created runaway inflation in the US which is OPEC's main customer which in turn created a crappy economy which decreased demand for OPEC's oil which resulted in lower oil prices.

Everything is connected. When you hurt others, you hurt yourself.
This is known as karma. What you do comes back to you.

These statements are not mystical nonsense.
They are demonstrable common sense.

All is One and One is All.
All boundaries are an illusion.


.


--------------------
I AM what Willis was talkin' bout.


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Offlinefireworks_godS
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Re: Are you sweetheart? [Re: Jellric]
    #1946998 - 09/24/03 06:54 AM (13 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Jellric said:
All is One and One is All.
All boundaries are an illusion.





And these boundaries have been continously reinforced in the minds of all of us, making it that much more difficult to transcend... Fuck, Native Americans back in the day used to be able to shape shift into animals. That was natural to them. Damn it, society has ruined my fucking ability to shape shift into an eagle and soar. It pisses me off.

Last night I was trying to astral project, and I was getting somewhere, I was breathing slower and slower, and the slower I would breathe, the more it felt like I was getting away, but then I had to start gasping for air, which pissed me off, I actually tried yanking myself out of myself, if that makes sense... I made some sort of effort to rip my astral arm out of my real arm, but alas it didn't work... it wasn't exactly going with the flow, now was it? :grin:

But yeah, believing in something so strongly makes it real.
Peace.


--------------------
:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you

:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:


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OfflineGrav
 User Gallery

Registered: 02/06/02
Posts: 4,454
Last seen: 4 years, 4 months
Re: Are you sweetheart? [Re: Jellric]
    #1947023 - 09/24/03 07:11 AM (13 years, 7 months ago)

i've felt alot better ever since i started thinking about myself exclusively
i guess i'm adopting the healthy American every-man-for-himself attitude. maybe that's why i feel less twacked in the head lately, I'm not trying to be a utopian saint anymore.

i was assuming i had the answers to things that i dont

now i'm shrinking my world down to what's around me. when you step out of my bubble i don't want to think about you anymore. can't handle it any other way because your faces just climb on top of me and i begin to time-travel.

all i can do is have a little faith that maybe you and me are trying to get to the same sort of place
ultimately a place where we can all get along

whatever is truely important, i'll let time tell, and do my own thing until then. but i'll never stop dreaming


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OfflineMAIA
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Re: Are you sweetheart? [Re: Grav]
    #1947215 - 09/24/03 09:45 AM (13 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

a place where we can all get along




That's exactly what i'm searching for. I guess that phrase means a lot of things.

MAIA


--------------------
Spiritual being, living a human experience ... The Shroomery Mandala



Use, do not abuse; neither abstinence nor excess ever renders man happy.
Voltaire


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Offlineentiformatie
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Re: Are you sweetheart? [Re: David_Scape]
    #1948144 - 09/24/03 03:44 PM (13 years, 7 months ago)

i very much agree with you on this issue, that "selflessness" is usually just somebody's inability to speak their mind, be themselves, or sometimes who do things for others because it makes THEM happy, not for those whom their doing it. i wish i could do things for others and not for my appreciation of somebody elses smile, and sometimes i do. i feel fulfilled after making a person happy. but am i doing it for the sense of fulfillment. actually, come to think of it, i wouldnt experience the sense of fulfillment if that were the case. When you want to do something for the end goal, you never truly find fulfillment in what you were doing, because the end goal keeps getting farther and farther away. I'm having problems expressing this, lol, but I do believe it's possible to be selfless without being selfish


--------------------
/opinion
.sean


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