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jdshoom
Stranger

Registered: 01/03/14
Posts: 19
Last seen: 10 years, 24 days
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´lime´ pasteurisaion with KOH, NaOH or other base?
#19431513 - 01/17/14 01:14 AM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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lime pasteurisation seems very promising especially if larger quantities of substrate are needed. it saves time (pasteurisation with steam for instance take a lot of time), money (big high presure steralisation machines are very pricey) and energy (for pasteurisation with steam and steralisation a lot of energy is needed to created the amount of heat).
as the basic idea of lime pasteurisation is creating a high base water solution (PH 12,5) i wonder if this can be done with other strong base products as well. for instance KOH or NaOH. Escpecially i am interested in using KOH. i live in an area that is famous for its greenhouses (tomatoes, paprikas etc), here KOH is used to up ph in rockwool. i have used KOH in liquid form to up the ph for another hobby. its dirtcheap, easy to use as it is liquid, is a very strong base and clean (its only KOH and in lime there are sometimes other stuff like high amounts of Mg and stuff). could KOH work as a high PH pasteurisation method? dont know how mysc reacts to high K ratios compared to high Ca ratios.
furthermore, one problem with high ph pasteurisation is supplementing. bran is said not to be added because of high contamps. on the other hand supplementing with a nitrogen source will end up in significant higher yields. What if supplements like osmocote is used (coated furtilizer that gives slow release of elements). will chemical fertilizers used as supplement in ph pasteurised substrate also create high contamination like bran is said to do? also i think chemical fertilizers are prety much bacteria free so it can be added after pasteurisation. any one has any ideas?
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forrest



Registered: 11/16/12
Posts: 1,011
Loc: The Netherlands
Last seen: 4 years, 7 months
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Re: ´lime´ pasteurisaion with KOH, NaOH or other base? [Re: jdshoom]
#19431685 - 01/17/14 02:11 AM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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i'm also wondering if after the lime soak neutralizing with something acid like vinegar or citric acid would help in that some species are not responding well to the alkaline substrate.
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Buthoscorpio

Registered: 01/05/11
Posts: 96
Last seen: 2 years, 6 months
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Re: ´lime´ pasteurization with KOH, NaOH or other base? [Re: forrest]
#19431881 - 01/17/14 04:37 AM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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The problem with neutralizing the alkaline pH is that airborne contamination (spores) can easily contaminate the substrate. Spores don´t germinate in alkaline environment , but they do in neutral or acidic environment.
KOH and NaOH will rise up the osmolarity. lime doesn´t (because it will react with CO2, and the resulting calcium carbonate is not soluble in water and doesn´t affect the osmolarity).
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forrest



Registered: 11/16/12
Posts: 1,011
Loc: The Netherlands
Last seen: 4 years, 7 months
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Re: ´lime´ pasteurization with KOH, NaOH or other base? [Re: Buthoscorpio]
#19431976 - 01/17/14 05:55 AM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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good thinking! thanks
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jdshoom
Stranger

Registered: 01/03/14
Posts: 19
Last seen: 10 years, 24 days
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Re: ´lime´ pasteurization with KOH, NaOH or other base? [Re: Buthoscorpio]
#19432089 - 01/17/14 07:09 AM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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and rising osmolarity is not good? apperently not... so not use any other base for high ph pasteurisation? its also that there are so many kinds of lime i can get i dont know which one is ok... i know for instance some forms are with high mg contents... everybody speaks of hydrated lime, but here in netherlands its called different and so many names: tuin kalk, gebluste kalk, lucht kalk, metsel kalk, etc etc
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forrest



Registered: 11/16/12
Posts: 1,011
Loc: The Netherlands
Last seen: 4 years, 7 months
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Re: ´lime´ pasteurization with KOH, NaOH or other base? [Re: jdshoom]
#19432318 - 01/17/14 09:14 AM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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yeah, you have to use ''gebluste kalk'', calcium hydroxide, they also use it as ''metsel kalk''. not gardening lime.
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jdshoom
Stranger

Registered: 01/03/14
Posts: 19
Last seen: 10 years, 24 days
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Re: ´lime´ pasteurization with KOH, NaOH or other base? [Re: forrest]
#19432376 - 01/17/14 09:36 AM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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tks mate! you speak dutch
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