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quadracer
Porcini Hunter



Registered: 12/14/08
Posts: 596
Loc: Here, Now
Last seen: 20 days, 3 hours
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Trichocereus identification
#19395886 - 01/09/14 08:44 PM (10 years, 21 days ago) |
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I picked this up at the swap meet about 10 years ago when it was labeled as "San Pedro" but i don't think it is.
The larger cacti I can take pictures of when it is daylight is very impressive, and the spines vary from very long 1"+ to very short.

Thinking it might be kk242 but really have no idea. Any help is appreciated!
Edited by quadracer (01/09/14 08:45 PM)
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KBG1977
Registered: 08/23/08
Posts: 11,017
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Re: Trichocereus identification [Re: quadracer]
#19395940 - 01/09/14 09:00 PM (10 years, 21 days ago) |
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It's pretty unique man,could be a hybrid.
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theMallacht
Clandestine Hero


Registered: 04/25/09
Posts: 3,428
Last seen: 1 year, 30 days
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Re: Trichocereus identification [Re: KBG1977]
#19395974 - 01/09/14 09:08 PM (10 years, 21 days ago) |
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Quote:
KBG1977 said: It's pretty unique man,could be a hybrid.
It is pretty unique. I'm leaning towards Peruvianus or some type of non-PC San Pedro though.
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hookahhead
Planeteer



Registered: 01/10/11
Posts: 638
Loc: The Middle of Penns Woods
Last seen: 10 years, 18 days
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Re: Trichocereus identification [Re: theMallacht]
#19396017 - 01/09/14 09:19 PM (10 years, 21 days ago) |
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We will never know without molecular analysis.
-------------------- "My worm farm" "96 Gallon Worm Tote" "Let Your Freak Flag Fly" "Respect Your Roots" "A KNEW IDEA"
"Nothing New" "Willkommen im EthnoGarten" "Don't Be a Backeberg" "Mites and Mealy Bugs" "The Heart and the Sun"
If someone doesn't want your LIGHT, shine it some where else. Everyday there are people who LOVE, ACCEPT, and LOOK FORWARD to making CONTACT with you. YOU are capable of GREAT THINGS even if you feel neglected or mistreated in OUR current SPACE. Change your ways, change our WORLD, there is SAFTEY in NUMBERS. Welcome to the PRESENT. ~ 144,000 Anonymous Voices “Call it a clan, call it a network, call it a tribe, call it a family: Whatever you call it, whoever you are, you need one. [NOW]” - Jane Howard
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karode13
Tāne Mahuta




Registered: 05/19/05
Posts: 15,290
Loc: LV-426
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Re: Trichocereus identification [Re: quadracer]
#19396742 - 01/10/14 12:11 AM (10 years, 21 days ago) |
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One on the far right would be a peruvianus. Here's mine:

Others not sure for now. Need better pictures.
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hookahhead
Planeteer



Registered: 01/10/11
Posts: 638
Loc: The Middle of Penns Woods
Last seen: 10 years, 18 days
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Re: Trichocereus identification [Re: karode13]
#19396884 - 01/10/14 12:47 AM (10 years, 21 days ago) |
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<troll> Doesn't look like my IcarosDNA peruvians? The skin color is all wrong and the spines, v-notches look different TO ME 
 </troll>
But let's save the bickering and simply state.
"Yes you have a a member of the trichocereacea , and they are beautiful. Please take good care of them, and ask us if you need any help. In the mean time please feel free to do some further reading on your own, here at our WUNDERBAR GARTEN  "
-------------------- "My worm farm" "96 Gallon Worm Tote" "Let Your Freak Flag Fly" "Respect Your Roots" "A KNEW IDEA"
"Nothing New" "Willkommen im EthnoGarten" "Don't Be a Backeberg" "Mites and Mealy Bugs" "The Heart and the Sun"
If someone doesn't want your LIGHT, shine it some where else. Everyday there are people who LOVE, ACCEPT, and LOOK FORWARD to making CONTACT with you. YOU are capable of GREAT THINGS even if you feel neglected or mistreated in OUR current SPACE. Change your ways, change our WORLD, there is SAFTEY in NUMBERS. Welcome to the PRESENT. ~ 144,000 Anonymous Voices “Call it a clan, call it a network, call it a tribe, call it a family: Whatever you call it, whoever you are, you need one. [NOW]” - Jane Howard
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theMallacht
Clandestine Hero


Registered: 04/25/09
Posts: 3,428
Last seen: 1 year, 30 days
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Re: Trichocereus identification [Re: hookahhead]
#19396910 - 01/10/14 12:52 AM (10 years, 21 days ago) |
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The Icaro Peruvianus does look far different than all of my other Peruvianus' though. I have some as well and they look just like yours. I also have a couple of different torches that look more similar to that one, and karode's.
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intelligentlife
Noaidi



Registered: 10/18/10
Posts: 2,627
Loc: EU
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Re: Trichocereus identification [Re: hookahhead]
#19396912 - 01/10/14 12:53 AM (10 years, 21 days ago) |
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I have similar plant sold as "t. peruvianus"
But vendor and friend of mine said they're all hybridized anyway.
I believe t. peruvianus are subspecies of t. pachanoi. Afaik there are only two known different "real" trichos, bridgesii and pachanoi. I can be wrong about but never find proper information about peruvian torch or t. peruvianus as own species.
Also I think t. peruvianus are just trichocereus with spines. Peruvian torch nickname for plant are probably spiny hybrid, spiny t. pachanoi variant or t. cuzcoensis.
But yes, this kind of plant are sold as peruvian torch or t. peruvianus in there europe but some peruvian torch nick named plants are t. cuzcoensis or hybrids.
Like one big nursery said to me.. "every seed grown plant are hybridized someway or another and there is nothing we can do about it"
Spine variation of your plant can be genetics of caused by environmental factors. But it looks like common seed grown "peruvian torch" around there.
Edited by intelligentlife (01/10/14 12:58 AM)
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theMallacht
Clandestine Hero


Registered: 04/25/09
Posts: 3,428
Last seen: 1 year, 30 days
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Quote:
intelligentlife said: but some peruvian torch nick named plants are t. cuzcoensis or hybrids.
Yep, like that flat obvious Cuzco ones that BBB is still selling to this day as Peruvianus. Bastards.
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intelligentlife
Noaidi



Registered: 10/18/10
Posts: 2,627
Loc: EU
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Re: Trichocereus identification [Re: theMallacht]
#19396939 - 01/10/14 01:00 AM (10 years, 21 days ago) |
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Trichocereus Peruvianus or Peruvian Torch?
Afaik there are difference about these names... Peruvian Torch doesn't actually mean t. peruvianus but t. peruvianus basically means it's Peruvian Torch.
Peruvian Torch isn't any proper name for species like t. peruvianus, pachanoi or bridgesii. It's a nickname for spiny trichocereus in nurseries.
Also I do not think there is such species of t. peruvianus, some cactus collectors doesn't recognize this species separated from t. pachanoi. I can be wrong but in my mind t. peruvianus should be called as subspecies of t. pachanoi. OR someway as "wild spiny trichocereus"
I don't know why most informative sites doesn't have listed t. peruvianus at all on their sites. Only what they recognize are t. bridgesii and t. pachanoi and their hybrids or subspecies.
What I have experience about growing t. pachanoi and t. peruvianus in that sentence. They're acting similar but t. bridgesii are way more harder and more picky species.
Correct me if I am wrong but I don't see t. peruvianus are completely own species of trichocereus. It may be natural hybridized trichocereus. Most "peruvian torch" are more close to t. pachanoi or t. cuzcoensis.
But, I am not a botanical scientist, however I have read dialog and documents about trichocereus species and only "pure" ones are bridgesii, pachanoi and cuzcoensis.. Peruvianus can be somewhere between cuzco and pachanoi. And like my friend who have nursery said they're all hybridized, no matter are seeds from europe, asia or south america.
Seems nurseries sell certain strains with spines as peruvian torch and another strain with smaller spines as pachanoi.. When we talk about seed grown plants, not cuttings.
What about spine growth, their size and so on.. environmental factor can have huge role in certain clones of trichocereus what kind of spines they form.. I have few bridgesii, one have grown spineless, two have grown randomly one spines here or there, when light environment get stronger and they got dose of fertiliziers, spine growth comes back..
Maybe there are some study about what explain some strain of trichocereus growing very randomly their spines.. Sometimes growth are spineless or very short spines. Sometimes very vigorous spines grows at sunny side of the plant. I don't know this for sure and I can say, my text should be not taken as information, only as dialog and hypothesis...
Edited by intelligentlife (01/10/14 01:13 AM)
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karode13
Tāne Mahuta




Registered: 05/19/05
Posts: 15,290
Loc: LV-426
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Quote:
Trichocereus Peruvianus or Peruvian Torch?
I am so late for an important date but to be quick:
One is a common name and one is a Botanical name.
Common names are what the general population calls plants and one plant with a common name could mean something else in another area. Common names cause confusion and ambiguity and should not be used.
Botanical names accurately identify the plant and how it fits into the classification system and they're internationaly excepted. You can easily identify and find information on a plant if you know this name.
That picture I posted is of an Aussie T. peruvianus 'Roseii' plant. Google the name for its history. Very close to plants still found in the wild.
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theMallacht
Clandestine Hero


Registered: 04/25/09
Posts: 3,428
Last seen: 1 year, 30 days
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Re: Trichocereus identification [Re: karode13]
#19397015 - 01/10/14 01:40 AM (10 years, 21 days ago) |
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quadracer
Porcini Hunter



Registered: 12/14/08
Posts: 596
Loc: Here, Now
Last seen: 20 days, 3 hours
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Re: Trichocereus identification [Re: karode13]
#19397937 - 01/10/14 09:06 AM (10 years, 21 days ago) |
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Quote:
karode13 said: One on the far right would be a peruvianus. Here's mine:

Others not sure for now. Need better pictures.
That's the thing. They are all cuts taken from the same cactus. Here is the mom. She's quite the beauty.
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KBG1977
Registered: 08/23/08
Posts: 11,017
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Re: Trichocereus identification [Re: quadracer]
#19398010 - 01/10/14 09:24 AM (10 years, 21 days ago) |
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Man,she's a looker
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hookahhead
Planeteer



Registered: 01/10/11
Posts: 638
Loc: The Middle of Penns Woods
Last seen: 10 years, 18 days
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Re: Trichocereus identification [Re: KBG1977]
#19398108 - 01/10/14 09:47 AM (10 years, 21 days ago) |
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Your all simply fantastic! We have really STEPPED UP our GAME here the past couple of weeks. Don't stop now, thank you all for your OWN intelligent thoughts and IDEAS!
-------------------- "My worm farm" "96 Gallon Worm Tote" "Let Your Freak Flag Fly" "Respect Your Roots" "A KNEW IDEA"
"Nothing New" "Willkommen im EthnoGarten" "Don't Be a Backeberg" "Mites and Mealy Bugs" "The Heart and the Sun"
If someone doesn't want your LIGHT, shine it some where else. Everyday there are people who LOVE, ACCEPT, and LOOK FORWARD to making CONTACT with you. YOU are capable of GREAT THINGS even if you feel neglected or mistreated in OUR current SPACE. Change your ways, change our WORLD, there is SAFTEY in NUMBERS. Welcome to the PRESENT. ~ 144,000 Anonymous Voices “Call it a clan, call it a network, call it a tribe, call it a family: Whatever you call it, whoever you are, you need one. [NOW]” - Jane Howard
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karode13
Tāne Mahuta




Registered: 05/19/05
Posts: 15,290
Loc: LV-426
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Re: Trichocereus identification [Re: quadracer]
#19400348 - 01/10/14 05:31 PM (10 years, 20 days ago) |
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Quote:
quadracer said:
That's the thing. They are all cuts taken from the same cactus. Here is the mom. She's quite the beauty.

Well if that's definitely the case then they're all the same plant. Just expressing themselves differently due to environmental conditions, probably light intensity.
Others mentioned it resembles the Icaros DNA T. peruvianus and I would agree.
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