Home | Community | Message Board


This site includes paid links. Please support our sponsors.


Welcome to the Shroomery Message Board! You are experiencing a small sample of what the site has to offer. Please login or register to post messages and view our exclusive members-only content. You'll gain access to additional forums, file attachments, board customizations, encrypted private messages, and much more!

Shop: MagicBag.co All-In-One Bags That Don't Suck   Mushroom-Hut Mono Tub Substrate   Original Sensible Seeds Autoflowering Cannabis Seeds   PhytoExtractum Maeng Da Thai Kratom Leaf Powder   North Spore Boomr Bag   Left Coast Kratom Buy Kratom Extract

Jump to first unread post Pages: < Back | 1 | 2  [ show all ]
Some of these posts are very old and might contain outdated information. You may wish to search for newer posts instead.
InvisibleHypnotoadCroaked
Retired, but will check MSGs

Registered: 01/05/13
Posts: 1,168
Re: Coco peat coir used as casing? [Re: Edmunter]
    #19376881 - 01/06/14 11:23 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Edmunter said:
so use as a substrate in this case and not a casing layer?



If  you are using grain spawn, I would spawn the grain to a 70/30% mix of coir verm, and allow for full colonization.  After colonization you have a choice to case or not.  Casing the surface area with a mix of verm/coir is certainly a viable option at that point, and depending on your environment may benefit.  The dry winter can really screwed with uncased substrates.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineEdmunter
Mr
Male User Gallery


Registered: 05/01/13
Posts: 5,699
Last seen: 1 month, 12 days
Re: Coco peat coir used as casing? [Re: cronicr]
    #19376890 - 01/06/14 11:24 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Nice one, So Im going to bulk the rye seed up a little and then try the bubble wrap tek.  I will report back later.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleViolet
 User Gallery


Registered: 12/06/11
Posts: 4,205
Re: Coco peat coir used as casing? [Re: Edmunter]
    #19376922 - 01/06/14 11:30 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Rye grass seed has lots of potential, but (partially for that very reason I've realized) it won't be much used without something to retain its moisture & provide more, offer an ideal humidity microclimate, and a low-nutrition environment to pin on.
A casing layer perfectly hits all 3, which is why even people growing with 'bulk' subs benefit from using casing layers especially in drier conditions.  Bulk subs themselves do all 3 also which is why results are much better with bulks than uncased unwatered grains, but they don't do all 3 as well (microclimate) as a casing layer + watering.

Coir works nicely as a casing layer AND a substrate due to its low nutrition, ideal pH, water-holding capability, and fine fluffiness.
Peat works as a casing layer WHEN pH-treated, but I still see more contams on them than I'd like...  It would also work as a "bulk" substrate I suppose, due to water holding, but definitely wouldn't be as nice and may have more contams.  I don't like peat without some garden lime and a hefty share of verm, and I have great distaste for buying verm.
I've switched to sifted potting soil for casing layers and it gets the best of all that and is way cheaper too.  Give that a shot.


--------------------
Intentionally or not, here in mushcult we are purveyors of love culture and enlightenment movement. Let's try to act like it!

PODS TEK - Growing Invitro with BRF/verm or Grass Seed containers
The simplest, quickest, safest tek!  For beginners, culturers, lazy people, stealth lovers, contam haters, and alternative seekers!
Violet's Teks and Posts


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineKizzle
Misanthrope
 User Gallery

Registered: 08/30/11
Posts: 9,865
Last seen: 1 day, 21 hours
Trusted Cultivator
Re: Coco peat coir used as casing? [Re: Edmunter]
    #19376927 - 01/06/14 11:32 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Edmunter said:
so use as a substrate in this case and not a casing layer?



Yup. Same thing basically except you let it fully colonize and generally you mix it evenly together with the rye instead forming a single layer over it.

Alternatively you can fruit rye in vitro with no casing or bulk substrate but you'll get much lower yields.

Edit: Actually I haven't tried rye seed in vitro, but rye berries works so I'm assume it would too.


--------------------


Edited by Kizzle (01/06/14 11:36 AM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflinecronicrFacebook
 User Gallery


Registered: 08/07/11
Posts: 61,436
Loc: Van Isle Flag
Last seen: 2 years, 1 month
Trusted Cultivator
Re: Coco peat coir used as casing? [Re: Edmunter]
    #19376941 - 01/06/14 11:35 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Edmunter said:
Nice one, So Im going to bulk the rye seed up a little and then try the bubble wrap tek.  I will report back later.



don't bother with bubble wrap if your gonna have a casing layer, the casing layer gives you all you need and the bw won't give you any more benifit


--------------------

It doesn't matter what i think of you...all that matters is clean spawn

I'm tired do me a favor


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleViolet
 User Gallery


Registered: 12/06/11
Posts: 4,205
Re: Coco peat coir used as casing? [Re: Kizzle]
    #19376985 - 01/06/14 11:45 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Kizzle said:
Alternatively you can fruit rye in vitro with no casing or bulk substrate but you'll get much lower yields.




MUCH lower, whether it's invitro or not.  Grains need more water than they have on hand to realize all their yield potential.

My straight-grain cakes of grass seed weigh average ~115 grams with ~58 of that being seed, making them ~50% water with ~60 grams of water at the most.
Since mushrooms are ~90% water, that means I cannot grow more than 6 dry grams from that container in the first flush.  Likely less since some is lost over time and evaporation.
I expect like four times or more that much yield from said containers, so they'll need well over four times that much water to do it, hence bottom-watering.


In my recent round of culture tests on 1/3 cup of prepared rice, the 2 cultures that are showing to be my best so far first yielded 10 grams wet each from their cakes due to water limitation... but the following 3 flushes were 16, 17, and 15 grams.  HELL YEAH WATERING


Also the fruiting behaviors I almost always get from straight-grains is kindof pathetic, invitro or not.  A casing layer (even invitro) makes the magic difference that causes the same substrate to explode with fruits.



--------------------
Intentionally or not, here in mushcult we are purveyors of love culture and enlightenment movement. Let's try to act like it!

PODS TEK - Growing Invitro with BRF/verm or Grass Seed containers
The simplest, quickest, safest tek!  For beginners, culturers, lazy people, stealth lovers, contam haters, and alternative seekers!
Violet's Teks and Posts


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinemagickspore
Male User Gallery


Registered: 12/11/12
Posts: 798
Loc: Center of the universe. Flag
Last seen: 8 months, 29 days
Re: Coco peat coir used as casing? [Re: Tangich]
    #19377037 - 01/06/14 12:00 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Tangich said:
Quote:

magickspore said:
Quote:

Tangich said:
Coco coir is great as a casing material, especially mixed with vermiculite or perlite. Works as a substrate as well, if you have nothing else.




Until someone proves this with consistent grows I think coir is NOT a good casing and IS a good sub.

If you can't find peat moss and you absolutely need a casing look into bubble wrap or wax paper. There are a few alternatives to a peat CASING.



People have been growing with coir casing for years, very successfully, before someone came out and said 'coir is rubbish and peat is the only thing to use', and everybody started parroting it. :shrug:
Peat is a horrible material IME, but I mainly use it in gardening capacity, when I absolutely have to. And coir is great for that as well.
And nothing beats horse manure for P. cubensis as a substrate, it's naturally preferred substrate for thousands of years, with some water retaining material added to make it even better.




My apologies I usually stick to posts newer then 1-2yrs (if possible). As you said I saw it repeated again and again randomly and somehow it got stuck in my head. Since I haven't had to use casings yet (other then a few experiments). It never occurred to me that it was inaccurate.

Thank you for setting my straight.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflinecronicrFacebook
 User Gallery


Registered: 08/07/11
Posts: 61,436
Loc: Van Isle Flag
Last seen: 2 years, 1 month
Trusted Cultivator
Re: Coco peat coir used as casing? [Re: magickspore] * 1
    #19377042 - 01/06/14 12:02 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

it's an old school casing material that seems to have disappeared, don't worry about it your not the only one:thumbup:


--------------------

It doesn't matter what i think of you...all that matters is clean spawn

I'm tired do me a favor


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleHypnotoadCroaked
Retired, but will check MSGs

Registered: 01/05/13
Posts: 1,168
Re: Coco peat coir used as casing? [Re: cronicr]
    #19377086 - 01/06/14 12:17 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

cronicr said:
it's an old school casing material that seems to have disappeared, don't worry about it your not the only one:thumbup:



If you look over older posts, there are 2 things that pop up:

Roger Rabbit made a few statements that coir casings can lead to overlay....So everyone and their brother started questioning if their substrate had overlay.

but then he has made statements to the effect of wishing he never said overlay, he has only seen it a few times. 

Lots of definitions have changed over the last 10 years, and discoveries are being made every day.  This is a very dynamic type of hobby.  PF cakes were groundbreaking in their time, and in the big scheme of things really only happened a heartbeat ago.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflinecronicrFacebook
 User Gallery


Registered: 08/07/11
Posts: 61,436
Loc: Van Isle Flag
Last seen: 2 years, 1 month
Trusted Cultivator
Re: Coco peat coir used as casing? [Re: HypnotoadCroaked]
    #19377094 - 01/06/14 12:19 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

i played with it alot, the best method i found for it was a sorta "late casing" and by doing so my casing never got fully colonized right through all my flushes:thumbup:


--------------------

It doesn't matter what i think of you...all that matters is clean spawn

I'm tired do me a favor


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Jump to top Pages: < Back | 1 | 2  [ show all ]

Shop: MagicBag.co All-In-One Bags That Don't Suck   Mushroom-Hut Mono Tub Substrate   Original Sensible Seeds Autoflowering Cannabis Seeds   PhytoExtractum Maeng Da Thai Kratom Leaf Powder   North Spore Boomr Bag   Left Coast Kratom Buy Kratom Extract


Similar ThreadsPosterViewsRepliesLast post
* Coco Coir Casing Question? Squeeky 5,607 1 06/10/02 04:16 PM
by henryp
* coir casing colonization!!!!!!!!!! michael_ahji 2,838 3 05/30/02 06:21 AM
by Anonymous
* what is your favorite coir casing mix??? BashoPoem 1,653 2 03/24/02 07:09 PM
by BashoPoem
* Coco Coir casing LaCasta 4,116 8 06/07/02 12:47 PM
by UHID
* Coco Coir casing tek?
( 1 2 all )
josh666 7,891 22 03/04/02 04:45 PM
by esin
* Coco Coir Casing Tek???? Squeeky 12,799 12 07/12/09 10:31 PM
by The shroomy 1
* Coco Coir Casing Countdown the_Landotter 1,744 4 06/23/02 03:09 AM
by BillyGrass
* Coco Coir casing pics bassplayer74 3,202 6 02/02/02 08:48 AM
by Syd_barret

Extra information
You cannot start new topics / You cannot reply to topics
HTML is disabled / BBCode is enabled
Moderator: Shroomism, george castanza, RogerRabbit, veggie, mushboy, fahtster, LogicaL Chaos, 13shrooms, Stipe-n Cap, Pastywhyte, bodhisatta, Tormato, Land Trout, A.k.a
2,925 topic views. 36 members, 197 guests and 24 web crawlers are browsing this forum.
[ Show Images Only | Sort by Score | Print Topic ]
Search this thread:

Copyright 1997-2024 Mind Media. Some rights reserved.

Generated in 0.025 seconds spending 0.007 seconds on 13 queries.