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OfflineGum Base
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Question about home made bulk humidifer
    #19365792 - 01/03/14 09:08 PM (10 years, 27 days ago)

I am setting up a bulk humidifier for six 4-tier green houses. I'm using a 55 gallon barrel. I have a few questions.

1) - will a 5 - 20mm Teflon head pond fogger suffice for this volume?(six 4-tier G.H.'s)

2) - I have a 8" 210CFM duct fan and am wondering if this will be enough for my application in a 55 gallon barrel supporting 6 four-tier greenhouse?

3) - I have two 4.7 Micro Farad capacitors that I'm going to put onto the duct fan. Should I use one of them or two?

Any input is much appreciated. I searched for answers on here, but couldn't pin point my precise questions.

Thanks!


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OfflineCMOS
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Re: Question about home made bulk humidifer [Re: Gum Base]
    #19366491 - 01/04/14 12:18 AM (10 years, 27 days ago)

Why the capacitors for the duct- fans? I feel like he fan would already have the capacitor needed to start it? :shrug:


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OfflineAmanita virosa
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Re: Question about home made bulk humidifer [Re: Gum Base]
    #19366681 - 01/04/14 02:13 AM (10 years, 27 days ago)

Don't use a 55 gal drum. The water will get nasty very quick. Use a smaller container with a float valve.  The container shown here is much too big but shows the float valve. .

It will be much easier to clean as needed. No need for the capacitir on the fan. Use a dimmer switch variable speed controller device  instead.

A five head fogger will be too much fog to run continuously into your enclosed greenhouses. You will likely need it on a timer.


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OfflineGum Base
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Re: Question about home made bulk humidifer [Re: Amanita virosa]
    #19367568 - 01/04/14 10:39 AM (10 years, 27 days ago)

Quote:

Amanita virosa said:
Don't use a 55 gal drum. The water will get nasty very quick. Use a smaller container with a float valve.  The container shown here is much too big but shows the float valve. .

It will be much easier to clean as needed. No need for the capacitor on the fan. Use a dimmer switch variable speed controller device  instead.

A five head fogger will be too much fog to run continuously into your enclosed greenhouses. You will likely need it on a timer.





- I did buy this precision timer. Starts at 15 seconds on time. This will control the 5 head fogger.  cycle timer

- I searched the floater in our wonderful search engine, I now see what you're saying. I think I'm going more towards a different type of bulk humidifier. Like these; Myco-Curious's humidifier
&
TheDeathryder's

I'm looking to run one humidifier for all of the six 4-tier GH's. Is this a bad idea? I already purchased all of these things. I also just bought this Digital Air humidity controller. - I did this so I can set this up in one of the green houses. Hypothetically speaking if they're all set up the same each one should be the same. I'm sure not exact, but close.

- What if I use distilled water in the 55 gallon drum? Will this make it last longer before the water goes nasty?

Will the 210CFM fan running 24/7, 5 head fogger on precision timer running a few minutes every hour, 2 nebulizers attached to circular air stones for 24/7 FAE, & a 55 gallon drum be enough to run all six 4-tier green houses?

Amanita - I looked up the floater and is this the type of application you are speaking of? Nineinchnail's

If not, feel free to send a few links that I didn't find.

I greatly appreciate the input of everybody!


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OfflineAmanita virosa
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Re: Question about home made bulk humidifer [Re: Gum Base]
    #19367676 - 01/04/14 11:27 AM (10 years, 27 days ago)

Distilled water will actually get nasty quicker than anything else. Use a float valve in the smallest container tht it will comfortably fit into (probably 5-10 gal). This will allow you to periodically dump and clean. The float valve is designed to be connected to a hose bib that continuously feeds water to the valve. In order for your system to work you will need a high quality humidistat that turns the fogger on and off and a variable speed controller to adjust the fan. Ideally the fan is damped down enough to run 24/7 and the humidistat kicks the fogger on and off to adjust humidity. What you are proposing is pretty complex, with lots of important variables to control. Impossible to know the exact parameters you will need until you get it set up so design it to be tweak able.  Be s,ure to design a way to cap off each humidity line in case you don't have all your ghs filled. And remember to use rigid pipe. There can be no dips or low spots at all or water will condensate and collect and block flow. I.e. needs negative pitch back into the container. And remember that NO system is completely automated. You will still have to be around.


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OfflineGum Base
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Re: Question about home made bulk humidifer [Re: Amanita virosa]
    #19368178 - 01/04/14 01:10 PM (10 years, 26 days ago)

This is the Humidistat that I ordered.
humidistat

How does it look? I put this in one of the green houses correct?

I will be buying a variable speed controller for the fan to find the correct speed.


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OfflineAmanita virosa
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Re: Question about home made bulk humidifer [Re: Gum Base]
    #19370000 - 01/04/14 07:39 PM (10 years, 26 days ago)

This one works a lot better!  It stays calibrated and is designed for ductwork. We use these in our grow rooms. It can be wired to either a solenoid or a relay. In your case a relay going to the fogger transformer.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/schneider-duct-humidistat-model-hc-201-/201009484531?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2ecd1952f3

But try the one you bought first. They are easy enough to switch around.


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OfflineGum Base
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Re: Question about home made bulk humidifier [Re: Amanita virosa]
    #19385031 - 01/07/14 08:56 PM (10 years, 23 days ago)

From reading this article on the installation of this exact humidistat that I'll have WH8040 humidistat it seems like I wire it up from my fogger into the humidistat I'm getting, then to a plug. This is correct right? I don't have to wire in a relay in between the fogger and the humidistat correct? Thanks!


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OfflineAmanita virosa
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Re: Question about home made bulk humidifier [Re: Gum Base]
    #19392402 - 01/09/14 06:19 AM (10 years, 22 days ago)

yes you will need a relay.  you cannot wire the thermostat directly to the fogger.  it is not rated to run that much current, most likely.  there fore you would want a small relay.


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OfflineGum Base
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Re: Question about home made bulk humidifier [Re: Amanita virosa]
    #19400413 - 01/10/14 05:47 PM (10 years, 20 days ago)

I've been doing some ongoing research about how relays work and different types. I lack electrician knowledge. I have this relay from a car HID headlight kit with 25Amp fuse. I assume this won't work because this is for a 12V battery application and not for the 110V plug application I'm going to be using. Below are pictures.



So I've been doing on going research on how to hook up my humidistat and fogger to a 110V house plug. The specs on my fogger are; Power: AC24V 60W

the specs on the 110V Digital Air Humidity Control Controller WH8040 are;
Sensor Type: HM-40
• Power Suppler: AC 110V
• Current: MAX 200MA
• Data retention: YES
• Power consumption: < 3W, Max 200mA
• Relay contact current: AC 5A/110V

I'm not looking for you to do my homework for me, but while I'm still researching this I thought I'd post this and see if you could point me in the right direction. perhaps an example of a relay that would for my application? What are the specs that I should be looking for in a relay for my application. Please don't get offended by me asking for answers that I should be find out on my own, Amanita you've been a phenomenal help thus far. I greatly appreciate the input.

Thanks,


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OfflineCMOS
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Re: Question about home made bulk humidifier [Re: Gum Base]
    #19400635 - 01/10/14 06:50 PM (10 years, 20 days ago)

Quote:

I have this relay from a car HID headlight kit with 25Amp fuse. I assume this won't work because this is for a 12V battery application and not for the 110V plug application I'm going to be using.




Correct, you would want a AC rated relay, otherwise its going to be turning on and off continously as the current alternates.  You can generally substitute a AC relay into a DC circuit though, just not vice versa.

But, I'm not entirely sure that you need a separate relay hooked up to your output.

I don't particularly know humidity controllers and foggers, but looking at the controller you purchased I think that it should be able to safely turn on your fogger. 

On the description it says AC 5A/110V.  I assume this is a relay for the output of your humidity controller.  The fogger you are trying to use is AC24V/60W.  (about 2.5A)

If so I would think that it is within spec to turn on the fogger.  I'm guessing that once the controllers internal relay is triggered, it will close the secondary and complete whatever circuit is connected to it.  The secondary of the relay can just be thought of as a switch, so make a break in your fogger power chord and have that hooked up to the output.

I looked at some of the DATASHEET for Amanita's controller, and it looked like it was only for triggering low voltage loads, where a relay WOULD be needed.  But take his word over mine, I don't have any direct experience with ethier of these. :shrug:


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OfflineGum Base
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Re: Question about home made bulk humidifier [Re: CMOS]
    #19406090 - 01/11/14 10:26 PM (10 years, 19 days ago)

I appreciate the input, Likewise I don't know much about electrical work. I went to radio shack the other night looking at their relay's. Seems everything is measured in Amperage. So if the Humidistat has a rating of AV 5A/110V my fogger cannot exceed a 5 amperage output. Is this correct?

Thanks,


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InvisibleJ. Jack Flash
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Re: Question about home made bulk humidifier [Re: Gum Base]
    #19406362 - 01/11/14 11:50 PM (10 years, 19 days ago)

Quote:

Gum Base said:
I appreciate the input, Likewise I don't know much about electrical work. I went to radio shack the other night looking at their relay's. Seems everything is measured in Amperage. So if the Humidistat has a rating of AV 5A/110V my fogger cannot exceed a 5 amperage output. Is this correct?

Thanks,




did your fogger not come with a transformer?  that's all it needs to attach to the mains (or output from the controller)  what is it designed to plug into?

as for load demand...
http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/hbase/magnetic/transf.html#c1

put simply, the power demand of the fogger, (60W) must not exceed the power output limit of the controller, (110V*5A=550W).  check.  your fogger could theoretically draw nearly 23A before blowing the controller... a ridiculous amount of current.  it could fog an office building.

i don't think it wise to attach a 110v source to the 24V device.  if you do, be sure to post the vid on youtube.


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OfflineGum Base
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Re: Question about home made bulk humidifier [Re: J. Jack Flash]
    #19407990 - 01/12/14 11:46 AM (10 years, 19 days ago)

Both the fogger and the humidistat are made for 110V power sources.
The specs on the humidistat are:
Power Suppler: AC 110V
Current: MAX 200MA
Data retention: YES
Power consumption: < 3W, Max 200mA
Relay contact current: AC 5A/110V

The specs on the fogger's power supply which I assume has a transformer in it includes:
It's a TDC Power
Model Number: DA-120-24W
Input: 120VAC - 60 Hz 145VA
Output: 24VAC 5.0A 120VA
In the manual it states that the power consumption is <4.5A so less than 4.5A.

I've been reading up on that link that you posted J. Jack. Thanks for that.

Now is this all the information I need to know if I will need a relay or not? I will keep reading up on electricity and hopefully Amanita or someone that has definite information on this topic can help out.

Everyone has been a great help, and I appreciate the feedback. This is a great learning experience for me.

Will post pictures when everything is complete!


Edit: It should be noted that the fogger's power supply has a built in fuse.


Edited by Gum Base (01/12/14 11:51 AM)


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InvisibleJ. Jack Flash
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Re: Question about home made bulk humidifier [Re: Gum Base]
    #19408224 - 01/12/14 12:48 PM (10 years, 18 days ago)

i assure you, you do not need a relay.  it's built into the controller. 

Relay contact current: AC 5A/110V

just wire up the output leads from the controller to a standard 15A receptacle, and plug the fogger into that.  easy cheese.  you'll want some kind of enclosure of course, so there ain't loose wiring floating around.

these are the in and out of the transformer. 
Input: 120VAC - 60 Hz 145VA
Output: 24VAC 5.0A 120VA

and i thought you wrote someplace it's a 24vac 60w device.  P=IV.  or I=p/v  so 60/24 or 2.5A.  A fair amount of current, but well below the spec of the transformer, which itself is well below the output capability of the controller.  but don't take my word for it.  keep reading and learning.  this stuff is super useful to know and understand.  just don't forget to give reality a check once in a while, and it'll be fine.  also, don't cross the streams.

:ruggedwink:


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2020 new years grow along


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OfflineAmanita virosa
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Re: Question about home made bulk humidifier [Re: J. Jack Flash]
    #19409136 - 01/12/14 04:48 PM (10 years, 18 days ago)

Sorry, yes it appears that your humidistat has a built in relay that will power the fogger and the easiest way to do it as was suggested is to simply wire it into a 110 v electrical socket, since the fogger transformer already has a plug.  However I am also not an electrician. I have just be forced to be one from time to time as a vegetable farmer and mushroom grower.


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OfflineGum Base
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Re: Question about home made bulk humidifier [Re: Amanita virosa]
    #19419174 - 01/14/14 07:26 PM (10 years, 16 days ago)

I started wiring everything up. Will post results. Should be interesting. I appreciate the feedback everybody!

Gum Base,


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OfflineGum Base
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Re: Question about home made bulk humidifier [Re: Gum Base]
    #19453506 - 01/21/14 03:56 PM (10 years, 9 days ago)

I'm having an issue with attaching a dimmer switch onto the 8" inline duct fan. The duct fan has a Hot, neutral, & ground wire. The dimmer switch has 2 black wires and 1 ground. After reading the instructions I'm confused. The dimmer doesn't have a hot or neutral wire, just one for power in and one for power out.. I'm not quite sure how I can hook this single-pole dimmer.. Did I by chance buy the wrong dimmer switch? Any help is appreciated. Thanks!


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OfflineAmanita virosa
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Re: Question about home made bulk humidifier [Re: Gum Base]
    #19454062 - 01/21/14 05:48 PM (10 years, 9 days ago)

Dunno what you bought but this one is awesome. Requires no wiring. Just plug your duct fan straight into it. Our had run continuously for almost two years http://www.hydroponics.net/i/132531


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Offlineaudiophoenix
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Re: Question about home made bulk humidifer [Re: Gum Base]
    #19874802 - 04/20/14 05:00 PM (9 years, 9 months ago)

Hey any news on if the WH8040 humidistat worked ok? I am looking get one but am apprehensive since a lot of digital hygrometers don't do well above 80% RH. Would love some feedback from someone trying to do what I'm doing.

Thanks!


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