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Offlinekoods
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Re: so like... the minimum wage is a socialist crime now [Re: myc_check1212]
    #19365290 - 01/03/14 07:30 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

I just meant, by definition, with credit comes debt. A debt free economy wouldn't be much of an economy.


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Invisiblemyc_check1212
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Re: so like... the minimum wage is a socialist crime now [Re: koods]
    #19365417 - 01/03/14 07:52 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Only if you fail on the play, but make the call right and you can make a windfall. Business wise that is. With that profit the correct call is pay back creditors and reinvest back in your business.


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Offlineimachavel
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Re: so like... the minimum wage is a socialist crime now [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #19365795 - 01/03/14 09:10 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

luvdemshrooms said:
Quote:

koods said:
I think there should be national standards. Without them, you setup situations where essentially parts of this country are the 3rd world.




So you'd pay the guy in the country the same as the guy in the city?

Why do you hate the guy in the city?




Why do you hate the guy in the country? Don't I wish everything you said was true. You swear I don't. People work for what they are worth. If only everyone was honest and forthcoming about how much someone's service was worth. If only doctors couldn't charge tens of thousands for a simple surgery, if only a guy who flipped burgers started out at $13 if he proved he did better at it at the last 5 places he flipped burgers and could cook faster then anyone in there, if only rent was only expensive to the SUPER nice places and property tax was virtually nil

Well we don't live in that world. We face a nightmare in this country of epic proportions where prices are sold to the highest lender, and the difference between the price of a candy bar and land is ridiculous by all standards. Sure property is worth more, it has indestructible value compared to the candy bar. But in this day and age a guy in the country can't make shit because everyone is copying the city people. We face an issue where there isn't enough income for people to spend on the moderate businesses and only the wealthiest companies profit. And now that that exists the only real solution is if everyone is paid a little tiny bit more, life is a little better and people spend more. The wealthy companies don't HAVE to hire more people, they are not required to what so ever, they just don't have to.

Depending on only companies with revenue of $500,000,000 or more no matter what their profits are just isn't going to work. You need constantly new and expanding businesses to make this continue to work, so college graduates get jobs.

Now you think on a level practical day to day. I cut a guys lawn, I charge the guy $150. I don't want to pay the person who helps me $75 and split it, he didn't work as hard as me, I only want to pay him $43 which is fair because he accepts it. Well isn't that nice, maybe we can all just get along and play fair? Not going to happen. You need to see this on a bigger level. The smaller level is a minimum wage that is higher blocks out people from ass hole companies that can use it as an excuse to not want to share, whether they can afford it or not. It sucks. On the larger level the lack of monetary equality and the growth of wealth inequality in this country seriously threaten college boy graduate kids who need a first level job that can get them in the door. Right now it looks like those options are going out the door, and so the country is saying "well since they can't get their first time $14 an hour entry level career jobs that are supposed to one day be $40 an hour career jobs, and are flipping burgers, we at least need the students to be able to pay back the loans and spend some money and continue job searching until they get higher up on the ladder, therefore while they are flipping burgers, we will raise the $7.50 burger flipping rate to $8.50

That is about as polite of an answer as I can provide without just being really rude and saying "how can you expect a person to realistically live on $50 fucking dollars a day, do you realize how expensive this country is? That is like $1000 a month, and college graduates who go live in fucking Compton aren't going to be motivated to work harder for better careers in the future"

You make it seem as though logically, I am all about a minimum hand holding wage, which shows co dependence between employer and employee, to which an employee can't bargain a better wage. Well I am not about it, I think it's retarded. But this to me is a worst case scenario situation, people need to grow above the poverty level, $7 an hour is a ridiculous amount of money to live on, despite how nice $1000 a month is as SPENDING MONEY, well that's a different story. But living expenses, health care, rent, clothes, etc. BEYOND the food and t.v. that people enjoy and their iphones, that's just not cutting it.

If we were discussing a perfect world where people were happy to be on a person to person basic level with their employees and allow them to negotiate etc. I'd be all with you. But in corporate America that's often hard to do 95% of employees never meet the person who owns the business, they meet the "employer/manger." I've had the great opportunity to know some of the direct people who owned the business I've worked at quite a few times. I've had the luck to understand this, despite that even at that a lot of bosses were ass holes. But you are just not understanding the nature and direction of the country we live in, and how the inequality between classes is just continuing to grow. Making it REQUIRED that people make a little more money, is perhaps the best course of action we could take right now.


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:kingcrankey: I did not say to edit my signature soulidarity! Now forever I will never remember what I said about understanding the secrets of the universe by paying attention to subtleties!

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Offlineimachavel
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Re: so like... the minimum wage is a socialist crime now [Re: DebuteMachine]
    #19365819 - 01/03/14 09:14 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

DebuteMachine said:
I simple think that we all only have so much time on this earth. no one HAS to live in poverty, we just choose to allow it because it was what we're taught. the status quo will never change, and that's why i think all these filthy ass rich MF'ers don't need more than 50 million dollars.

if you think it's okay that walmart is allowed to pay a lower minimun wage in DC while the workers are barely able to make ends meat, you're a sick fucker.

@gilgamesh




I'd have no problem with the alternative. A wage cap, where no one can make over a few hundred mil in their life. I am assuming that will never happen as people will crawl the walls of the white house fence and fucking start stabbing out peoples eyes in the streets freaking out about the economic implications of such a thing :rolleyes: lol

But in reality I'd find raising the minimum wage a $1 or so a much better alternative. One thing about Americans, we sure don't like to compromise much, I mean people can't expect to have it all. I can't imagine paying someone $65 a day instead of $58 doing much harm, to any except the most lowest small income businesses, which imho maybe are in the process of taking a fucking dive anyway, in which case maybe we need to raise the damn M W to like $9.50 to weed out all the shitty little crack house looking stores that are just sucking up the commercial revenue space.

I mean, who really complains about minimum wage in the first place? The largest companies. More then anyone, and they'll get hurt the least


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:kingcrankey: I did not say to edit my signature soulidarity! Now forever I will never remember what I said about understanding the secrets of the universe by paying attention to subtleties!

:facepalm: I'm never giving you the password again. Jerk


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Offlineimachavel
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Re: so like... the minimum wage is a socialist crime now [Re: koods]
    #19365864 - 01/03/14 09:23 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

koods said:
Well, I'm pretty far left politically, but any modern economy would cease to function without credit.




Well in that case why even argue minimum wage. Just raise the minimum wage to $20 an hour, everyone prospers, and businesses can just "borrow." I mean as long as everyone believes in credit, then I no longer feel any remorse for business owners.

I was assuming we were relating to sad, poor business people, who have no people skills/experience, and only knowledge of a product, and just run a day to day thing sort of sleeping when no one shows up, and how sad their life is when their shit going down the drain spot that is taking up commercial revenue space is about to shut down because they were JUST BARELY GETTING BY paying people $58 a day instead of $67 a day or whatever.

I mean if credit is ok, then perhaps only experienced reliable people should operate businesses? If everyone is feeling bad for the entrepreneurs, well there is no shortage of jobs people can do just on their own, including but not limited to

installing floors
computer development
commission based sales based on warehouse purchasing then shipping to an address after a current customer has purchased a product at a higher value
painting walls
landscaping
hot dog stand
wine making with a liquor license
contract based work
baby sitting
accounting
etc.

No offence of course


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:kingcrankey: I did not say to edit my signature soulidarity! Now forever I will never remember what I said about understanding the secrets of the universe by paying attention to subtleties!

:facepalm: I'm never giving you the password again. Jerk


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InvisibleDebuteMachine

Registered: 09/29/06
Posts: 6,457
Re: so like... the minimum wage is a socialist crime now [Re: imachavel]
    #19365904 - 01/03/14 09:30 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

The theory of raising minimum wage and getting rid of welfare was really attractive to me. I am an alternative and independent thinker though, people hate me for it.

What can you do!


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Offlinetripp23
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Re: so like... the minimum wage is a socialist crime now [Re: DebuteMachine]
    #19366111 - 01/03/14 10:15 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

i dont understand the point of inflation. 

They raise min. wage.. All its doing is rendering the dollar more and more worthless.  You inflate min. wage, that means everything else will go up eventually anyways to even out the difference.

The more they inflate, the more our money is completely worthless.

not like it aint already.

Money = tool of enslavement.


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InvisibleDebuteMachine

Registered: 09/29/06
Posts: 6,457
Re: so like... the minimum wage is a socialist crime now [Re: tripp23]
    #19366149 - 01/03/14 10:28 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

the only people responsible for inflation are the feds.


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Offlinemorrowasted
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Re: so like... the minimum wage is a socialist crime now [Re: Mad Season]
    #19366157 - 01/03/14 10:30 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Mad Season said:
IT'S QUITE OBVIOUS THAT WITHOUT MINIMUM WAGE AND U HAD TO BARTER WITH EMPLOYERS THEY'D ALWAYS CHOOSE THE EMPLOYEE WITH THE LOWEST PRICE. IF MINIMUM WAGE WAS UP EMPLOYERS WOULD SLASH EMPLOYEES IN AN ATTEMPT TO MAINTAIN THEIR PROFITS. THE MINIMUM WAGE SHOULD BE IN THE SWEET SPOT AND IT WILL BE DIFFERENT DEPENDING ON UR LOCATION. MINIMUM WAGE SHOULD BE IN THE HANDS OF MUNICIPAL GOVERNMENT OR STATE. NOT FEDERAL.



is english your third language..?


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Offlinek00laid
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Re: so like... the minimum wage is a socialist crime now [Re: deCypher]
    #19366214 - 01/03/14 10:47 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

deCypher said:
If the minimum wage goes up then employers will have to cut costs elsewhere.  I have a hunch that the results won't be pretty.



well

they will just raise prices

walmart will take massive losses to compete

they'll win

they'll monopolize

we'll all be fucked.


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Offlineimachavel
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Re: so like... the minimum wage is a socialist crime now [Re: k00laid]
    #19366404 - 01/03/14 11:44 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

k00laid said:
Quote:

deCypher said:
If the minimum wage goes up then employers will have to cut costs elsewhere.  I have a hunch that the results won't be pretty.



well

they will just raise prices

walmart will take massive losses to compete

they'll win

they'll monopolize

we'll all be fucked.




:facepalm:

oh no what will the billionaires do they will have to cut costs. The dollar will go to shit because the value of things will change :flowstone: all those houses for hundreds of thousands of dollars that is about the normal selling price these days will become worthless. $9 an hour will turn into $90 an hour, a sandwich will cost like $200, money will be useless, Donald Trump will have to fire like all his employees



:lolwut:


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:kingcrankey: I did not say to edit my signature soulidarity! Now forever I will never remember what I said about understanding the secrets of the universe by paying attention to subtleties!

:facepalm: I'm never giving you the password again. Jerk


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Offlineteamkiller
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Re: so like... the minimum wage is a socialist crime now [Re: imachavel]
    #19366459 - 01/04/14 12:04 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

didn't read thread.

I wish i could move to one of the socialist utopias where the minimum wage is 20$ an hour, healthcare is free and school is free.

I wish i could move to one of those countries because they're the healthiest, happiest and have the tallest people.

Too bad they don't let foreigners become citizens.


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Invisibleelax420
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Re: so like... the minimum wage is a socialist crime now [Re: teamkiller]
    #19366547 - 01/04/14 12:50 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

The language in the OP is so loaded. Its like you aren’t even trying to have a  civil conversation.

Damn dude you act like the rich do everything in this county even though the rich pay less in taxes than middle classes? Explain to me how raising the minimum wage would hurt this class that you most certainly do not belong to, and furthermore why you care?


Personally i think it would be foolish to raise the Federal minimum wage until employment gets better. if the states want to do it, who gives a flying fuck :shrug:
I find it a little ironic that the guys who cry about states rights the most, are opposing something that the states are doing by themselves.





The thing that makes me laugh the most about politics on this site, is that i would assume most the people on this site are white, drug using males, in their 20s, yet they are the most ardent neo-cons around as a whole. WTF? guys...


THE ESTATE TAX IS TYRANICAL, TYRANY I SAY!!!!--while you work at starbucks :rofl:
people vote for politicians that would hurt them in their current economic state, in the very slim hopes that they win the mega lotto and end up not having to pay taxes, like the other uber rich.


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InvisibleGilgamesh18
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Registered: 03/01/12
Posts: 11,671
Re: so like... the minimum wage is a socialist crime now [Re: DebuteMachine] * 1
    #19367259 - 01/04/14 08:41 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

DebuteMachine said:
I simple think that we all only have so much time on this earth. no one HAS to live in poverty, we just choose to allow it because it was what we're taught. the status quo will never change, and that's why i think all these filthy ass rich MF'ers don't need more than 50 million dollars.

if you think it's okay that walmart is allowed to pay a lower minimun wage in DC while the workers are barely able to make ends meat, you're a sick fucker.

@gilgamesh



Class envy the hallmark of leftist thought. There is no "free lunch" when the government mandates a minimum wage. If the government requires that certain workers be paid higher wages, then businesses make adjustments to pay for the added costs, such as reducing hiring, cutting employee work hours, reducing benefits, and charging higher prices. Now this doesn't sound like the best way to lift people out of poverty. Leftist economic policies actually create dependence and poverty.


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Offlineqman
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Registered: 12/06/06
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Re: so like... the minimum wage is a socialist crime now [Re: k00laid]
    #19367313 - 01/04/14 09:09 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

k00laid said:
Quote:

deCypher said:
If the minimum wage goes up then employers will have to cut costs elsewhere.  I have a hunch that the results won't be pretty.



well

they will just raise prices

walmart will take massive losses to compete

they'll win

they'll monopolize

we'll all be fucked.





Large corporations like Wal-Mart, McDonald's, and Target can afford to pay higher wages, and it wouldn't make any difference except one thing- profit margins.

Now if they didn't already have decent profit margins today, then yes they might attempt to hike prices, whether the higher prices would be sustainable is a different story.


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InvisibleShins
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Re: so like... the minimum wage is a socialist crime now [Re: qman]
    #19367495 - 01/04/14 10:17 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Hey guys why not make minimum wage $100?  $1000?

dont you see any problems with making minimum wsge $1000 / hour? 

Same problems apply to any amount.


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InvisibleDebuteMachine

Registered: 09/29/06
Posts: 6,457
Re: so like... the minimum wage is a socialist crime now [Re: Shins]
    #19367505 - 01/04/14 10:19 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Shins said:
Hey guys why not make minimum wage $100?  $1000?

dont you see any problems with making minimum wsge $1000 / hour? 

Same problems apply to any amount.




making the minimum wage $15 vs $1000 is a big difference...

The point is to eliminate welfare i suspect it would make things smoother, but it's just a theory.


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OfflinePatlal
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Re: so like... the minimum wage is a socialist crime now [Re: Shins] * 1
    #19367508 - 01/04/14 10:20 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

How is it, that countries where the minimum salary is higher than in the US can still prosper and have higher growth than the US?

:ancientaliens:

It's as if the minimum salary has no extreme effects of raising prices and putting the rich on the streets.


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Offlineimachavel
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Re: so like... the minimum wage is a socialist crime now [Re: Shins]
    #19367517 - 01/04/14 10:25 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Shins said:
Hey guys why not make minimum wage $100?  $1000?

dont you see any problems with making minimum wsge $1000 / hour? 

Same problems apply to any amount.




Yeah I know dude, raising the minimum wage from $7 to $8 has serious implications man, next thing you know the minimum wage will be $1000 an hour. Oh god the horror :zomgwtf:


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:kingcrankey: I did not say to edit my signature soulidarity! Now forever I will never remember what I said about understanding the secrets of the universe by paying attention to subtleties!

:facepalm: I'm never giving you the password again. Jerk


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InvisibleGilgamesh18
Herbivore Man

Registered: 03/01/12
Posts: 11,671
Re: so like... the minimum wage is a socialist crime now [Re: Patlal]
    #19367540 - 01/04/14 10:30 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Patlal said:
How is it, that countries where the minimum salary is higher than in the US can still prosper and have higher growth than the US?

:ancientaliens:

It's as if the minimum salary has no extreme effects of raising prices and putting the rich on the streets.



Unemployment is alot higher in europe bro hmm I wonder why? :wink:


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