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Offlinesirreal
devoid
Registered: 01/11/03
Posts: 1,775
Loc: In the borderlands
Last seen: 9 years, 11 months
It's getting hard!
    #1936407 - 09/20/03 10:55 PM (13 years, 7 months ago)

After spending about nine months reading the posts here, I see a strong tendency towards nihilism. Even those posters who would absolutely deny being a nihilist seem to have strong leanings toward that way of thinking.

I admit, it is getting hard to hold anything as true because of this.

Nietzsche said that nihilism could eventually be the destruction of mankind. How do you feel about this?


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I may not always tell the truth, but atleast I'm honest
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I see what everyone is saying. It is so hard to form an opinion when you see both sides so clearly!


Edited by sirreal (09/20/03 10:58 PM)


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InvisibleShroomismM
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Re: It's getting hard! [Re: sirreal]
    #1936445 - 09/20/03 11:16 PM (13 years, 7 months ago)

One definition of nihilism, is The belief that destruction of existing political or social institutions is necessary for future improvement. ... if I subscribe to any nihilistic view at times it is that one, which I think is a healthy one.

Yet the other definition is:

a An extreme form of skepticism that denies all existence.
b A doctrine holding that all values are baseless and that nothing can be known or communicated.
2 Rejection of all distinctions in moral or religious value and a willingness to repudiate all previous theories of morality or religious belief.

To me this seems like a destructive frame of mind, so I will agree with Nietzsche. However I think that nihilism is not necessarily worthless, for it may serve a primary function of balance.

Thoughts come in waves.. this too shall pass.


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Offlinesirreal
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Registered: 01/11/03
Posts: 1,775
Loc: In the borderlands
Last seen: 9 years, 11 months
Re: It's getting hard! [Re: Shroomism]
    #1936480 - 09/20/03 11:35 PM (13 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Shroomism said:
Thoughts come in waves.. this too shall pass.




I hope not. I agree for the most part.

I am so tired of hanging out with non-thinking people!

Thank you for thinking!


--------------------
I may not always tell the truth, but atleast I'm honest
-----------

I see what everyone is saying. It is so hard to form an opinion when you see both sides so clearly!


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InvisibleShroomismM
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Re: It's getting hard! [Re: sirreal]
    #1936489 - 09/20/03 11:41 PM (13 years, 7 months ago)

For Creation to exist, there must be Destruction.
For Order, there must exist Chaos.
They are symbiotic, and without one, the other would not exist.


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InvisibleJellric
altered statesman

Registered: 11/08/98
Posts: 2,261
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Re: It's getting hard! [Re: Shroomism]
    #1936504 - 09/20/03 11:48 PM (13 years, 7 months ago)

I agree that nihilism can be useful as part of a process one is going through. I experienced it briefly in two periods of my life and it looks as though I'm out of it for good. It did serve to obliterate many illusions I held, which was of course excruciating. It shakes your foundations apart and it can be very frightening when you start falling with no end in sight. But eventually you WILL land on solid ground- The Ultimate Ground of Being. It's a very personal process and no book or person can really tell you what it's like. You have to experience it for yourself.






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I AM what Willis was talkin' bout.


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Offlinesirreal
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Registered: 01/11/03
Posts: 1,775
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Re: It's getting hard! [Re: Jellric]
    #1936510 - 09/20/03 11:52 PM (13 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Jellric said:
It shakes your foundations apart and it can be very frightening when you start falling with no end in sight.

 




Oh my God! That is how I feel right now. I just don't know exactly how to feel now. :frown: 


--------------------
I may not always tell the truth, but atleast I'm honest
-----------

I see what everyone is saying. It is so hard to form an opinion when you see both sides so clearly!


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InvisibleShroomismM
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Re: It's getting hard! [Re: sirreal]
    #1936525 - 09/20/03 11:58 PM (13 years, 7 months ago)

Examine your beliefs one at a time and determine if they need to stay or go. That's a start.


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Offlinesirreal
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Re: It's getting hard! [Re: Shroomism]
    #1936528 - 09/21/03 12:01 AM (13 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Shroomism said:
Examine your beliefs one at a time and determine if they need to stay or go. That's a start.





I know. But it is so hard. Hard to tell the difference, If you know what I mean?


--------------------
I may not always tell the truth, but atleast I'm honest
-----------

I see what everyone is saying. It is so hard to form an opinion when you see both sides so clearly!


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InvisibleJellric
altered statesman

Registered: 11/08/98
Posts: 2,261
Loc: non-local
Re: It's getting hard! [Re: sirreal]
    #1936550 - 09/21/03 12:14 AM (13 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Oh my God! That is how I feel right now. I just don't know exactly how to feel now.




Ride the shockwave. It's hard to talk about these things due to the limitations of language. But it's kind of like in those cartoons where Wiley Coyote looks down, realizes there's nothing there and starts falling. If you can answer for yourself why he only falls when he looks down and what makes that funny, you're halfway there.





--------------------
I AM what Willis was talkin' bout.


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InvisibleShroomismM
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Re: It's getting hard! [Re: sirreal]
    #1936567 - 09/21/03 12:21 AM (13 years, 7 months ago)

Yeah... it doesn't have to be hard though..you can make it easy. Figure out what makes you believe the things you do and then examine them and think why, and does it help you..does it hinder you..does it hurt your relationships with others? Weigh all of these things into the equation and more and then if you decide this belief is no longer healthy to your current path then stamp it with a big red CANCELLED!, and burn it into the atmosphere with a violet flame, saying for that belief to return from whence it came, thus transcending it..if that helps the visualization process at all.


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Offlinesirreal
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Re: It's getting hard! [Re: Jellric]
    #1936570 - 09/21/03 12:22 AM (13 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Jellric said:
But eventually you WILL land on solid ground- The Ultimate Ground of Being. It's a very personal process and no book or person can really tell you what it's like. You have to experience it for yourself




I love you! I hope you are right.


--------------------
I may not always tell the truth, but atleast I'm honest
-----------

I see what everyone is saying. It is so hard to form an opinion when you see both sides so clearly!


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Offlinesirreal
devoid
Registered: 01/11/03
Posts: 1,775
Loc: In the borderlands
Last seen: 9 years, 11 months
Re: It's getting hard! [Re: Shroomism]
    #1936575 - 09/21/03 12:24 AM (13 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Shroomism said:
Figure out what makes you believe the things you do and then examine them and think why, and does it help you..does it hinder you..does it hurt your relationships with others?




That is the hard part!


--------------------
I may not always tell the truth, but atleast I'm honest
-----------

I see what everyone is saying. It is so hard to form an opinion when you see both sides so clearly!


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OfflineSpokesman
The HighPhilosopher

Registered: 08/05/03
Posts: 847
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Re: It's getting hard! [Re: sirreal]
    #1936580 - 09/21/03 12:28 AM (13 years, 7 months ago)

# 1. This is a horrible tittle for a thread

# 2. I hate when they smack lables on people.


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Offlinesirreal
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Posts: 1,775
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Re: It's getting hard! [Re: Spokesman]
    #1936584 - 09/21/03 12:30 AM (13 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Spokesman said:
# 1. This is a horrible tittle for a thread

# 2. I hate when they smack lables on people.






What the fuck are you talking about?


--------------------
I may not always tell the truth, but atleast I'm honest
-----------

I see what everyone is saying. It is so hard to form an opinion when you see both sides so clearly!


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InvisibleShroomismM
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Re: It's getting hard! [Re: sirreal]
    #1936587 - 09/21/03 12:31 AM (13 years, 7 months ago)

Then just make it easy...kill all your beliefs, and start over with neutrality.


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Offlinesirreal
devoid
Registered: 01/11/03
Posts: 1,775
Loc: In the borderlands
Last seen: 9 years, 11 months
Re: It's getting hard! [Re: Shroomism]
    #1936595 - 09/21/03 12:36 AM (13 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Shroomism said:
Then just make it easy...kill all your beliefs, and start over with neutrality.




That is so hard! What have I been "talked into" and what is natural?
I cannot seem to tell the difference.


--------------------
I may not always tell the truth, but atleast I'm honest
-----------

I see what everyone is saying. It is so hard to form an opinion when you see both sides so clearly!


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Anonymous

Re: It's getting hard! [Re: sirreal]
    #1936615 - 09/21/03 12:44 AM (13 years, 7 months ago)

destroy that what defines you, and you lose yourself more and more.

don't do anything for "enlightenment"...

for all we know that could be the darkest corner of hell, but if its the truth, then you are "enlightened"?

we love ourselves, and we love things we can point to which defines ourselves.

for me, i'm happy being nothing


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InvisibleJellric
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Posts: 2,261
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Re: It's getting hard! [Re: ]
    #1936653 - 09/21/03 01:05 AM (13 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

destroy that what defines you, and you lose yourself more and more.





Only if you believe you and your beliefs are one and the same. You'd be chasing your own tail in that case creating a whirlwind around yourself. Get in the center of the storm! There is peace there.

Don't identify so strongly with your beliefs. You are not your beliefs. Stop defending them. Doing so only allows them to grow stronger. Allow the invalid beliefs surrounding you to fall away until you reach the core which is your very self. You will know it as That Which Cannot Be Destroyed. "The peace that passeth all understanding". When you reach it, it will be a strangely familiar feeling. Like coming home.


--------------------
I AM what Willis was talkin' bout.


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Offlinesirreal
devoid
Registered: 01/11/03
Posts: 1,775
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Re: It's getting hard! [Re: Jellric]
    #1936693 - 09/21/03 01:17 AM (13 years, 7 months ago)

It is a hard concept to grasp jellric!

I would love to be able to reach the utopian ideal! I need someone to understand!Please understand!


--------------------
I may not always tell the truth, but atleast I'm honest
-----------

I see what everyone is saying. It is so hard to form an opinion when you see both sides so clearly!


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Anonymous

Re: It's getting hard! [Re: Jellric]
    #1936720 - 09/21/03 01:31 AM (13 years, 7 months ago)

Only if you believe you and your beliefs are one and the same. You'd be chasing your own tail in that case creating a whirlwind around yourself. Get in the center of the storm! There is peace there.

peace where? what are you if you can't even define it? the only thing i am is consciousness. i am ME.. not you, not anyone else... but when i say ME... i don't mean the dude who likes squash and sunday tea..... the fact that "i" only see out of "my" eyes.

You are not your beliefs. Stop defending them. Doing so only allows them to grow stronger.

couldn't agree more.

Allow the invalid beliefs surrounding you to fall away until you reach the core which is your very self.

"your very self"... interesting in words, but in reality... is this just a state of nothing?


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