Home | Community | Message Board


This site includes paid links. Please support our sponsors.


Welcome to the Shroomery Message Board! You are experiencing a small sample of what the site has to offer. Please login or register to post messages and view our exclusive members-only content. You'll gain access to additional forums, file attachments, board customizations, encrypted private messages, and much more!

Shop: Kraken Kratom Buy Kratom Powder & Leaf   Left Coast Kratom Buy Kratom Capsules   Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order   PhytoExtractum Maeng Da Thai Kratom Leaf Powder

Jump to first unread post Pages: < Back | 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | Next >  [ show all ]
InvisibleIcelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Male


Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
Re: After the death of the business man, the Christ child is born [Re: BoulderMushrooms]
    #19311901 - 12/22/13 01:24 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

I just hope that's not all you're getting. :lol:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineBoulderMushrooms
Stranger
Male User Gallery


Registered: 04/21/13
Posts: 61
Loc: Boulder, CO
Last seen: 9 years, 8 months
Re: After the death of the business man, the Christ child is born [Re: Icelander]
    #19312186 - 12/22/13 02:44 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Me too:)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineDeviate
newbie
Registered: 04/20/03
Posts: 4,497
Last seen: 8 years, 5 months
Re: After the death of the business man, the Christ child is born [Re: BoulderMushrooms]
    #19314725 - 12/23/13 04:52 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

BoulderMushrooms said:
Aye, much agreement with the recent posts, especially that there is nothing inherently wrong with the ego - its the ONLY thing that allows us to operate in this world, or even exist in this world at all, without completely dissolving into the oneness/nothingness. 


Most of all I agree with Icelander - Believe whatever you want.  Thanks for the Christmas gift!!!! :smile:  Nobody's argument is going to make us change our opinion unless we are open to that anyways.

~




Ok this is getting annoying. Define your terms. It is useless to say there is nothing wrong with ego without defining what you mean by ego.

this sums up my thoughts on the matter

Plain Selfrealization is the death of the small self that was produced by identification with something that is not Self. But the personality does not vanish, it's just not you anymore. Some say the ego has to go away; that is a matter of definition: if you maintain the personality is the ego, then the ego will remain, if you maintain the ego is the sense of I (I-ness), then yes, ego will vanish.

If you maintain there is nothing wrong with misidentification, it is simply because you haven't suffered enough yet. Some people temporarily enjoy the sense of ego but after your ego has caused you years and years of untold suffering and failure after failure at everything you try, you begin to wonder if perhaps there isn't a better way to be. That is when you discover the spiritual path, the elimination of the misindenfication which impedes smooth functioning of the organism.

If your ego isn't causing you any problems, then have fun being an ego. Remember Jesus said that he came into the world for the sinners, not the righteous. If you can function fine and do what is right and you are happy, you dont need to trouble yourself with endless spiritual seeking. But if you are a total fuck up like me like, its a completely different story.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineDeviate
newbie
Registered: 04/20/03
Posts: 4,497
Last seen: 8 years, 5 months
Re: After the death of the business man, the Christ child is born [Re: all this beauty]
    #19314745 - 12/23/13 05:02 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

all this beauty said:
Quote:

Deviate said:
The ego has no value. It is completely useless.



Nothing wrong with the "ego."  Nothing to escape there.  Doctrines that proclaim otherwise are full of shit.  Buddhists who proclaim otherwise are full of shit.

Your ego -- your sense of separateness, superiority, and invincibility -- is precisely what brings you to forums and discussions like this one.  If you were some cosmically perfect wishy-washy ego-less thing, you'd be boring.  No one would want to listen to you or go to the movies with you.

We have a sense of separateness, superiority, and invincibility because those "senses" serve biological / evolutionary purposes.  There is no cosmic trickster burdening us with attributes that aren't useful to us. 

All in my opinion.




No one wants to listen to me or go to the movies with me anyway. I am a social misfit. 

You are right that our sense of separateness serves an evolutionary purpose but you are wrong in thinking that means that I am somehow wrong for wanting to move beyond it. Crawling serves a biological purpose, you are essentially saying that walking is boring and adults should crawl their whole lives.

THere are some people who enjoy their egos, there are even some very spiritual people (like Timothy Leary) who did not seem particularly gung ho about completely getting rid of their egos. I am not one of those people.

What it comes down to is how much you have suffered. The Buddha went beyond ego not because he wanted to get people to go to the movies with him, but because he sought an end to suffering. I dont want to suffer anymore. I dont care about going to the movies or posting on forums or feeling superior or whatever positive things you think the ego brings. With those things comes such intense suffering that it makes me want to blow my brains out. ALl this suffering and wanting to blow my brains out is a direct result of my ego. Why would you want me to keep something that causes me so much pain?

The egoic mode of consciousness is infantile. Its an incredibly limiting concept that is like walking with blinders on. There is nothing inherently wrong with it of course (unless you consider the creation of suffering inherently wrong) but it stands in the way of the evolution of consciousness. Consciousness is capable of being expanded well beyond the simplistic self centered ego mode that is popular on earth today. DO you disagree and if not why are you opposed to the expansion of consciusness?

its funny how on the spirituality and myscticism forum I receive so much discouragement from actually following my path of mysticism.


Edited by Deviate (12/23/13 05:06 AM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleIcelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Male


Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
Re: After the death of the business man, the Christ child is born [Re: Deviate] * 1
    #19314754 - 12/23/13 05:05 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

  But if you are a total fuck up like me like, its a completely different story.



I'm sorry you consider yourself that way.:sad:  I'm far from totally enamored of my life and the progress I've made but I still can see how that in several ways I've done well and am a pretty cool guy in spite of all of that.  Best to take a balanced view on these things imo. :nicesmile:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineDeviate
newbie
Registered: 04/20/03
Posts: 4,497
Last seen: 8 years, 5 months
Re: After the death of the business man, the Christ child is born [Re: Icelander]
    #19314767 - 12/23/13 05:12 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

That is a balanced view if we go by the enjoyment I get from life vs the enjoyment I could get if I made wiser decisions. I have lived a life of horrible, intense suffering all due to my own stupid decisions which almost always serve to compound and worsen my suffering. Even when I know better my lack of self control causes to make more decisions which bring down more suffering on my self.

Now when I see through the illusion of the ego, all of this recedes away and my natural intelligence is free to work and I am often astounded at what comes out.

Now how can you guys fault me for wanting to stop suppressing my natural intelligence?

See, naturally I am a very kind, compassionate, intelligent, free thinking, loyal, unique, extremely brave individual.

WIth my ego I am a stupid,lazy cowardly selfish wretch. How does it not make sense to get rid of that?


Edited by Deviate (12/23/13 05:15 AM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleIcelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Male


Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
Re: After the death of the business man, the Christ child is born [Re: Deviate]
    #19314787 - 12/23/13 05:22 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Because imo as humans we are always going to be a mix of those things.  Nature is always a mix of things.  IMO much of your suffering is in your inability to accept this.  We are all very flawed. We all suffer, greatly at times, there are joys to be experienced in spite of this.  And that my friend is life 101.  You don't move on until you grokk that in fullness.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineDeviate
newbie
Registered: 04/20/03
Posts: 4,497
Last seen: 8 years, 5 months
Re: After the death of the business man, the Christ child is born [Re: Icelander]
    #19314835 - 12/23/13 05:49 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Move on to where? It seems like thats what I have already been doing, suffering greatly with intermittent bouts of joy and clarity.

If you think much of my suffering is due to my inability to accept this, that means it is an ego problem. Isn't that what I have been saying? my suffering is due to my ego?

You see, non acceptance is the nature of ego. If you can truly accept everything as it is, your ego collapses. The ego must have something to chase after, it must be dissatisfied in some way, that is what it feeds off. Take this away from it and it starves to death.


Edited by Deviate (12/23/13 05:54 AM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleIcelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Male


Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
Re: After the death of the business man, the Christ child is born [Re: Deviate] * 1
    #19314861 - 12/23/13 06:01 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Move on to where?

Move on to acceptance of your state as a human animal and live it without expecting more.

Yes ego can be problematical but that's the nature of the beast.  You will, imo, and are imo, killing your life by expecting to become ego free.  But maybe I'm wrong or maybe that's your path. The path of almost total suffering.  Nature does stuff like that.:shrug:  I seem to have walked that path enough to know it well. :haha:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineDeviate
newbie
Registered: 04/20/03
Posts: 4,497
Last seen: 8 years, 5 months
Re: After the death of the business man, the Christ child is born [Re: Icelander]
    #19314882 - 12/23/13 06:11 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Expecting to become ego free is just another trick of the ego, which as I explained is never satisfied and always needs something to strive for in order to maintain itself, in this case it strives to become ego free. I mean were you paying any attention at all? thats what this thread is about. The ego dresses up as a hitman and offers to kill the ego.

You seem to be implying that I could accept everything at it is while at the same time maintain my ego. That is absurd. When I read your post, I tried to accept myself just as I am. Instantly I felt some of my ego fall away until I encountered resistence (non acceptance). Do you see? I can't have my cake and eat it too. I cant have both happiness and my ego. The more there is of one, the less there is of the other.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleIcelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Male


Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
Re: After the death of the business man, the Christ child is born [Re: Deviate]
    #19314895 - 12/23/13 06:17 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

That's odd. I have a strong ego and am often happy and content.  Maybe we are  playing different games.  Best of luck with yours.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineDeviate
newbie
Registered: 04/20/03
Posts: 4,497
Last seen: 8 years, 5 months
Re: After the death of the business man, the Christ child is born [Re: Icelander]
    #19314907 - 12/23/13 06:21 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Well I have chronic physical pain issues that make 100% complete liberation my only hope of ever experiencing something beyond suffering.

We are indeed playing different games. If you are not seeking liberation, life is very different.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleIcelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Male


Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
Re: After the death of the business man, the Christ child is born [Re: Deviate]
    #19314918 - 12/23/13 06:26 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

I've been living with chronic physical pain for over 20 years now.  I'm pretty used to it believe it or not. Plus a lifetime of emotional pain.  The Kratom helps a lot and I'm not above getting help from anywhere I can find it.  My friends are concerned/disapprove at times but they don't live in here with me.  I'll take full responsibility for the consequences.  I'm already addicted to it but that addiction pales in comparison to the parm meds they'd put me on.

I used to seek liberation but that made me even more miserable than I am today.  Surrender to life has brought me my best relief.  Hardly perfect though. :haha:


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineDeviate
newbie
Registered: 04/20/03
Posts: 4,497
Last seen: 8 years, 5 months
Re: After the death of the business man, the Christ child is born [Re: Deviate]
    #19314920 - 12/23/13 06:27 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

You know, this is like arriving at prison with 3 life sentences. Some of the guys I meet tell me "hey, we think we have found a way to escape. You want in?" and then guys like you tell me "hey it ain't so bad in here. Yeah, I know that longing for freedom you talk about, but that's a pipe dream. Just settle into prison life. There's nothing inherently wrong with it. You get three meals a day and a bunk bed to sleep in. What more could you ask for?"

I am one of those rare ones that is going to try to escape no matter what and risk everything to do it.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleIcelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Male


Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
Re: After the death of the business man, the Christ child is born [Re: Deviate]
    #19314928 - 12/23/13 06:30 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

I never said it ain't so bad in here.  It's hellish much of the time and at best tolerable the rest with a rare moment of beauty.  I'm just saying trying to escape makes it worse imo.  Don't misunderstand me.  I know how you feel.

The real freedom imo is the courage to kill oneself. :wink:  Bet you aren't up for that one. :satansmoking:


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineDeviate
newbie
Registered: 04/20/03
Posts: 4,497
Last seen: 8 years, 5 months
Re: After the death of the business man, the Christ child is born [Re: Icelander]
    #19314960 - 12/23/13 06:40 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Yes trying to escape can make it worse but not if you succeed. I have already gotten several layers of my ego to fall away. Why should I stop here? Why not push this as far as I can? If after 10 years I feel like i am making no further progress toward escaping, maybe I will give up then, but it would seem quite silly to give up now just because you couldn't find your way out. Actually I already gave up once and my life kept on going downhill, getting worse and worse, until I decided Id better go back to spiritual seeking.

It all depends on who you want to listen to. I am inspired by people like Buddha and Jesus and Ramana Maharshi who say that there is a way out and that its worth all the suffering in the universe to get there.

At the same time, I dont have much else to live for. The nice thing about spiritual seeking is that its like a little video game that you can play with yourself anywhere at any time. Its a mobile source of both frustration and entertainment, just like my gameboy was when I was a kid. Its really a lot like playing super mario bros.

I dont even have any money to buy kratom, I have no job, no motivation, barely enough food, health issues, no girlfriend, no friends, etc. What else am I gonna do?


Edited by Deviate (12/23/13 06:42 AM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleIcelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Male


Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
Re: After the death of the business man, the Christ child is born [Re: Deviate]
    #19314970 - 12/23/13 06:44 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

OK then go for it.  Why not if what you say is true?  Report back so others may learn from your experiences if you are that type.

I'm basing my best guess on two things.  My personal experience and what I see out in the world and in other people I have known. 

Seriously, best of luck.  I feel very sad you are suffering so. I don't wish that on any living thing.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleCosmicJokeM
happy mutant
 User Gallery

Registered: 04/05/00
Posts: 10,848
Loc: Portland, OR
Re: After the death of the business man, the Christ child is born [Re: Deviate]
    #19314976 - 12/23/13 06:47 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Deviate said:


I dont even have any money to buy kratom, I have no job, no motivation, barely enough food, health issues, no girlfriend, no friends, etc. What else am I gonna do?





What if most of your problems evaporated if you figured this shit out?  Perhaps you'd have new set of problems, but they might be infinitely better problems to have.  Maybe the enlightenment trip is distracting you from what actually matters at this point in time.  These aren't overly materialistic goals, this isn't fast money, cars, bling...  Just good health, a job, and a decent lady friend you like and are sexually attracted to.


--------------------
Everything is better than it was the last time.  I'm good.

If we could look into each others hearts, and understand the unique challenges each of us faces, I think we would treat each other much more gently, with more love, patience, tolerance, and care.

It takes a lot of courage to go out there and radiate your essence.

I know you scared, you should ask us if we scared too.  If you was there, and we just knew you cared too.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleIcelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Male


Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
Re: After the death of the business man, the Christ child is born [Re: CosmicJoke]
    #19314986 - 12/23/13 06:49 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

That could be of course.  The fact that I have money makes living with some of this other shit a fuck of a lot easier. In fact if I didn't have any money I'd fucking off myself tomorrow most likely. (Well after my Kratom stash ran out of course.):laugh:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineDeviate
newbie
Registered: 04/20/03
Posts: 4,497
Last seen: 8 years, 5 months
Re: After the death of the business man, the Christ child is born [Re: Icelander]
    #19314988 - 12/23/13 06:51 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

I cant promise Ill report back, remember the hidden truth about life is that there is no hidden truth. so what am I going to have to report?

I can come up with all sorts of ways to justify spiritual seeking but the truth is I cant stop. Once you get to a certain point on the path, there is no turning back. For instance, I have tried to stop (although my trying to stop was actually out of the hope that stopping seeking would help me get enlightenment) and i was not able to. Its just like trying to accept things as they are. The trying itself is a form of non acceptance (if you truly accepted things, you wouldnt need to try) so then you try not to try and so on. Spiritual seeking is the exact same. Its a bunch of ego noise. It has to burn itself out, or at least that is my hope. But once youve set the ball in motion and it rolls past a certain point, you no longer have the option to turn around and go back. I am stuck doing this now for better or worse.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Jump to top Pages: < Back | 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | Next >  [ show all ]

Shop: Kraken Kratom Buy Kratom Powder & Leaf   Left Coast Kratom Buy Kratom Capsules   Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order   PhytoExtractum Maeng Da Thai Kratom Leaf Powder


Similar ThreadsPosterViewsRepliesLast post
* Heaven is coming to earth *the sequel*
( 1 2 3 4 ... 51 52 )
zorbman 178,045 1,020 03/15/18 06:53 PM
by BrendanFlock
* Mayan Galactic Signature DB.....
( 1 2 3 4 5 6 all )
vampirism 39,235 113 04/21/05 04:06 AM
by emptywisdom
* The Snakes are inside me...
( 1 2 3 all )
Adamist 13,269 44 02/05/21 10:58 PM
by makalis
* How to Ascend
( 1 2 all )
ShroomismM 12,059 28 09/10/20 12:08 PM
by delusionalpothead7
* Alien/Human Relations v2.0
( 1 2 3 4 all )
Anonymous 23,693 65 12/23/22 02:19 AM
by doolhoofd
* The 4th Density
( 1 2 3 all )
ShroomismM 16,388 49 10/19/08 12:07 PM
by ariark
* Psychological and metaphysical aspects of Music
( 1 2 3 4 5 6 all )
Blastrid 31,963 107 12/08/16 01:45 AM
by Fractaliopsybe
* Drugs, Buddhism, and States of Consciousness
( 1 2 3 all )
Buddha1 11,704 43 05/31/17 10:33 PM
by eve69

Extra information
You cannot start new topics / You cannot reply to topics
HTML is disabled / BBCode is enabled
Moderator: Middleman, Shroomism, Rose, Kickle, yogabunny, DividedQuantum
5,108 topic views. 0 members, 2 guests and 3 web crawlers are browsing this forum.
[ Show Images Only | Sort by Score | Print Topic ]
Search this thread:

Copyright 1997-2024 Mind Media. Some rights reserved.

Generated in 0.026 seconds spending 0.006 seconds on 14 queries.