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leafing


Registered: 12/23/04
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a quote to beat all the quotes
#19309248 - 12/21/13 07:41 PM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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the psychedelic experience is just a disruption of psychophysics
prove me wrong
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JacksonMetaller
Stranger

Registered: 03/13/11
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Re: a quote to beat all the quotes [Re: leafing]
#19309281 - 12/21/13 07:48 PM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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"just" is a very narrow word. The human experience is just an instance of orderly energetic motion. Doesn't quite capture the magic now does it?
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leafing


Registered: 12/23/04
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Quote:
JacksonMetaller said: "just" is a very narrow word. The human experience is just an instance of orderly energetic motion. Doesn't quite capture the magic now does it?
what do you mean by orderly energetic motion?
sounds a little vague to me..
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JacksonMetaller
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Re: a quote to beat all the quotes [Re: leafing] 1
#19309404 - 12/21/13 08:20 PM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
leafing said:
Quote:
JacksonMetaller said: "just" is a very narrow word. The human experience is just an instance of orderly energetic motion. Doesn't quite capture the magic now does it?
what do you mean by orderly energetic motion?
sounds a little vague to me..
About as vague as your original statement. I'm talking about the evolution of energetic forces into particles, nuclei, atoms, molecules, RNA, self replicating cells, simple multicellular beings, sentient beings, ecosystems, societies, economies, etc. you can reduce everything to an energetic motion of which life is orderly. but reductionism for the sake of demystifying reality is pointless. If thats your intent it doesn't do justice to phenomenal experience. So sure... You can say psychedelic experiences are just disruptions of psychophysics, but then your family and loved ones are just conglomerations of energetic particles. We all know this. It doesn't make anyone smarter to point it out and it doesn't convey the true power of experience. Now if you can reduce things as a method of appreciation for the complexity of experience, that's great. But if you find reductionism making things black and white you're doing it wrong. Life has spectrum.
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leafing


Registered: 12/23/04
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isn't everything you said about the psychedelic experience just encapsulated into our perspective which is the disruption of psychophysics brought on by an hallucinogen.. im not being reductionist.. im being more precise and eliminating logical fallacies that our perspective and interpretation is actual a interplay by two separate systems.. if there were one though it would be psychophysics.. also maybe iam a reductionist but only of a psychosis which has been played pout far too long..
because in the long run you really think that flashing visual is a real protein transport or ion pump..because i doubt it
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JacksonMetaller
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Re: a quote to beat all the quotes [Re: leafing]
#19309491 - 12/21/13 08:49 PM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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Hmmm I may have misinterpreted you then. I thought this was another "psychedelics can't be spiritual because they're just drugs" argument.
As far as to the specifics of which systems result in the experience I don't know. From what I've heard they cause decreases in brain activity so I would guess its not it's own system, but rather the result of a lack of activity in those proteins and pumps but I really don't know. Only basic knowledge in biology, not neuroscience
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MindDrips
Telephasic Workshop



Registered: 09/10/13
Posts: 677
Loc: USA
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Psychedelic experience can be put into whatever words you want, but it will still be inaccurate to some extent.
One of my past mushrooms trips taught me that although human language can be a great tool for connecting with other humans, it is wholly inadequate when it comes to translating the universe into "words". There really is no true simplification of the psychedelic experience or the universe, because all are incredibly complex.
Plus, from our limited perspective, humans don't know jack shit. We just explain things how we understand them.
-------------------- "Pebbles and marbles like things on my mind, Seem to get lost and harder to find. When I am alone I am inclined, If I find a pebble in sand, To think that it fell from my hand..."

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leafing


Registered: 12/23/04
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Re: a quote to beat all the quotes [Re: MindDrips]
#19313466 - 12/22/13 07:56 PM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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by orderly energetic motion do you mean synchronicity?
Edited by leafing (12/22/13 07:56 PM)
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healing
Strangest



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Re: a quote to beat all the quotes [Re: leafing]
#19313746 - 12/22/13 09:19 PM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
leafing said: by orderly energetic motion do you mean synchronicity?
Physics.
He described the evolution of energy from the big bang as it condensed into matter which then conglomerated into stars which burned until their cores crushed hydrogen atoms together strongly enough to create all of the chemicals on the periodic table up to iron, which caused the star to explode, creating all of the chemicals that are heavier than iron, some of which condensed into second generation stars, like our Sol, some of which had planets, like Earth, which are covered in a layer of carbon that has slowly evolved over time into carbon chains, like RNA, that are ever increasing in complexity which eventually became lifeforms like you and me.
-------------------- Open mind, open heart, open book.
Edited by healing (12/22/13 09:20 PM)
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