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Offlinestarfire_xes
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Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... * 2
    #19309525 - 12/21/13 08:58 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Aren't they the ones that badmouth CEO's and say that 'no one needs to have that much money' or 'no one needs to make that much money' or 'we should limit the pay of CEO's?

Fucking commie socialist bullshit if you ask me.


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InvisibleShins
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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: starfire_xes] * 1
    #19309598 - 12/21/13 09:24 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Price fixing bad


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Offlinetheindian
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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: Shins]
    #19319495 - 12/24/13 02:15 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Yes, a huge number of news portal are just doing so well if we can see the most revealing, and most interesting news articles ever published in the major media. Now, its fine news portal. You can also find us if you search online politics news sites then you will get a online portal. which is a best news portal they serve words breaking news. You should have to visit atleast once.


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Invisiblemyc_check1212
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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: theindian]
    #19319850 - 12/24/13 06:43 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Your news portal sucks, just curry recipes mostly


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OfflineLord_McLovin
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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: myc_check1212]
    #19325951 - 12/25/13 03:27 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

What's bad about a maximum wage? None of us is going to get it anyhow and I don't really see how having several castles and private jets while others work their asses off for a tiny wage to feed their family is fair in any way. Especially when it is the latter, larger part of the people that is exploited to support the former's lifestyle.


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Offlinezappaisgod
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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: Lord_McLovin]
    #19326068 - 12/25/13 04:14 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

If you have a tiny wage you shouldn't have children.


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Offlinepsyconaught
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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: Lord_McLovin]
    #19326217 - 12/25/13 04:56 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Lord_McLovin said:
What's bad about a maximum wage? None of us is going to get it anyhow and I don't really see how having several castles and private jets while others work their asses off for a tiny wage to feed their family is fair in any way. Especially when it is the latter, larger part of the people that is exploited to support the former's lifestyle.



please explain to me how Elon Musk has exploited anyone to get his fortune? And how does his wealth prevent you from making money?


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OfflineLord_McLovin
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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: psyconaught]
    #19328305 - 12/26/13 10:46 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

How should I know? It's the first time I've heard his name.


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Offlinepsyconaught
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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: Lord_McLovin] * 1
    #19328359 - 12/26/13 11:03 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

I don't really see how having several castles and private jets while others work their asses off for a tiny wage to feed their family is fair in any way. Especially when it is the latter, larger part of the people that is exploited to support the former's lifestyle.



he's a multi billionaire. You claimed people with his lifestyle exploited the working class to get where he is today. So please explain that to me. And please explain why it is not 'fair'


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InvisibleGilgamesh18
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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: zappaisgod]
    #19328521 - 12/26/13 11:52 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

zappaisgod said:
If you have a tiny wage you shouldn't have children.



:kaneclap:


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Offlineimachavel
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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: starfire_xes]
    #19328621 - 12/26/13 12:23 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

starfire_xes said:
Aren't they the ones that badmouth CEO's and say that 'no one needs to have that much money' or 'no one needs to make that much money' or 'we should limit the pay of CEO's?

Fucking commie socialist bullshit if you ask me.




Yeah really :rolleyes: a guy really needs a billion just as personal spending for his own recreation

And of course, you have just dropped fathomable proof that people who want to raise minimum wage laws also want maximum wage laws. Because of course minimum wage is the same as maximum wage :stoned:

Oh lordy what shall we do, they are going to raise the wages that people who take the bus and subway make $1 an hour. :facepalm: Oh no prices will sky rocket the cost of labour is too high oh no those poor CEO's are going to lose so much stock. Remember kids, the reason that we have cheap production in this country is because of cheap wages. It has nothing to do with supply and demand, for example the fact that a burger is only a few dollars because anyone can make one and land less then an acre can be a few million because people want it so bad. That's not it at all, it's because of wage laws, and paying someone more in an hour then the cost of a sandwich is surely a cause for financial collapse? :laugh2:






































:rofl2:






















yeah, honestly I don't know why I read this horse crap anymore :whocares:


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Offlineimachavel
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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: psyconaught]
    #19328633 - 12/26/13 12:27 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

psyconaught said:
Quote:

I don't really see how having several castles and private jets while others work their asses off for a tiny wage to feed their family is fair in any way. Especially when it is the latter, larger part of the people that is exploited to support the former's lifestyle.



he's a multi billionaire. You claimed people with his lifestyle exploited the working class to get where he is today. So please explain that to me. And please explain why it is not 'fair'




It's just as fair as raising the fucking lowest possible wage 50 cents a fucking hour. You can't have your cake, eat it too, have a billion, wine and moan and make another cake too. Deal with it, as for people saying "raising the minimum wage will make it impossible for gardeners to hire people they will have to pay too much." Gardeners pay their helpers $100 a day, less then 8 hours at $8 an hour, and besides they don't claim any money anyway quit being pompous they get paid cash don't claim taxes and can pay people whatever they want and never get in trouble for it.

Grow up, I'm tired of people in these posts acting as though they grew up on the nickel then complain about $1 an hour wage raise. Yeah right, :rolleyes: you grew up on the nickel, watched your mom be a bartender then when they decided to pay her an extra $1 an hour you started complaining that democracy has been desecrated :lolwut:


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InvisibleShins
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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: imachavel]
    #19329034 - 12/26/13 02:04 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Its easy to make more than minimum wage, you just have to put some effort into it.


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Offlinepsyconaught
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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: imachavel]
    #19329311 - 12/26/13 03:22 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

imachavel said:
Quote:

psyconaught said:
Quote:

I don't really see how having several castles and private jets while others work their asses off for a tiny wage to feed their family is fair in any way. Especially when it is the latter, larger part of the people that is exploited to support the former's lifestyle.



he's a multi billionaire. You claimed people with his lifestyle exploited the working class to get where he is today. So please explain that to me. And please explain why it is not 'fair'




It's just as fair as raising the fucking lowest possible wage 50 cents a fucking hour. You can't have your cake, eat it too, have a billion, wine and moan and make another cake too. Deal with it, as for people saying "raising the minimum wage will make it impossible for gardeners to hire people they will have to pay too much." Gardeners pay their helpers $100 a day, less then 8 hours at $8 an hour, and besides they don't claim any money anyway quit being pompous they get paid cash don't claim taxes and can pay people whatever they want and never get in trouble for it.

Grow up, I'm tired of people in these posts acting as though they grew up on the nickel then complain about $1 an hour wage raise. Yeah right, :rolleyes: you grew up on the nickel, watched your mom be a bartender then when they decided to pay her an extra $1 an hour you started complaining that democracy has been desecrated :lolwut:



you dodged the question. Answer it please


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Offlinepsyconaught
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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: Shins]
    #19329315 - 12/26/13 03:23 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Shins said:
Its easy to make more than minimum wage, you just have to put some effort into it.



qft
i've never had to work a min. wage job in my life even coming from a very poor family because i made the effort to make something better for myself.


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Offlinezappaisgod
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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: psyconaught]
    #19329453 - 12/26/13 04:08 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

I made minimum wage when I was a teenager living in a depressed area during a recession.  The area stayed depressed but me making minimum wage didn't.  If you are in your twenties making minimum wage you are a fucking loser with no redeeming value.  Basically the market is telling you that you suck.  Because you do.  Change something because what you are doing is not working out.


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Offlinepsyconaught
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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: zappaisgod]
    #19330492 - 12/26/13 08:29 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

zappaisgod said:
I made minimum wage when I was a teenager living in a depressed area during a recession.  The area stayed depressed but me making minimum wage didn't.  If you are in your twenties making minimum wage you are a fucking loser with no redeeming value.  Basically the market is telling you that you suck.  Because you do.  Change something because what you are doing is not working out.



yup.


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Offlinepsilynut
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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: psyconaught]
    #19330746 - 12/26/13 09:39 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Perhaps if we raised minimum wage we could attract some of our loser citizens off of welfare into the farm jobs they don't want that are currently being stolen by illegals. 
    And besides wouldnt food taste better if it was picked by American hands rather than greasy law breaking foreigner hands ? I'd pay a little more for that .


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Offlinestarfire_xes
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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: Lord_McLovin]
    #19330777 - 12/26/13 09:50 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Lord_McLovin said:
What's bad about a maximum wage? None of us is going to get it anyhow and I don't really see how having several castles and private jets while others work their asses off for a tiny wage to feed their family is fair in any way.




So what?  They need to change the term 'income inequality' to 'income envy' because that is what it is. 

I can tell you one thing that would happen with 'Income INequality' legislation that limited maximum earnings.  The first thing would be that the Elitists in Government and their buddies would carve out exemptions for themselves.  Union leaders would probably be exempt.

The legislation would be carefully targeted on the types of businesses that are demonized by the Facists oh whoops I meant progressives.


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Offlinezappaisgod
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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: psilynut]
    #19331465 - 12/27/13 01:57 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

psilynut said:
Perhaps if we raised minimum wage we could attract some of our loser citizens off of welfare into the farm jobs they don't want that are currently being stolen by illegals. 
    And besides wouldnt food taste better if it was picked by American hands rather than greasy law breaking foreigner hands ? I'd pay a little more for that .



Well then I got a better idea.  Let's actually enforce our immigration laws and kick the fuckers out.  For once I don't give a fuck what the business community wants and am siding foresquare with the working AMERICAN.  Kick the fuckers out and penalize the shit out of employers who cheat.


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OfflineLord_McLovin
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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: psyconaught]
    #19331888 - 12/27/13 06:35 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

psyconaught said:
Quote:

I don't really see how having several castles and private jets while others work their asses off for a tiny wage to feed their family is fair in any way. Especially when it is the latter, larger part of the people that is exploited to support the former's lifestyle.



he's a multi billionaire. You claimed people with his lifestyle exploited the working class to get where he is today. So please explain that to me. And please explain why it is not 'fair'




You misunderstood. My criticism was not directed at specific examples, but at the general situation. What I am saying is: We have reached a point in our society where we have, in principle, generated enough wealth for everyone to have a decent life without having to fear existential problems.
In reality, however, this is not the case.
Overall poverty is increasing while wealth is increasing as well, which leads me to the conclusion that there is a problem concerning the distribution of wealth. This in turn implies there is a growing inequality of wealth and this does not resonate well with the principle that economy should benefit the larger part of the people and not just a tiny part of it. That is what I consider unfair.
Do you not agree?

Concerning Elon Musk, I do not know whether he pays his employees well or takes care of good working conditions or not. I do not know whether he gives his workers a fair share of the cake they earned together. Do you?


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OfflinePhred
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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: Lord_McLovin]
    #19331899 - 12/27/13 06:39 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Lord_McLovin said:
Overall poverty is increasing…



Incorrect. World poverty has been decreasing steadily for decades now.


Phred


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OfflineLord_McLovin
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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: Phred]
    #19332239 - 12/27/13 09:19 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

I was talking about the US, but the rest of the world is even more fucked up. Here's the most recent figure that popped up:



taken from this article.


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Offlinepsyconaught
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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: Lord_McLovin]
    #19332497 - 12/27/13 10:40 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

but the rest of the world is even more fucked up



care to elaborate?


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OfflineLord_McLovin
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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: psyconaught]
    #19333108 - 12/27/13 01:56 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

1$ a day. :shrug:
And you call that just?


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Offlinepsyconaught
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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: Lord_McLovin]
    #19333113 - 12/27/13 01:59 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

That graph is showing the amount of people who are getting out of earning more than $1 a day. Also 'just' means nothing. Cost of living is not comparable across the globe, or the country. Its why i don't believe in a Federal minimum wage.


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OfflineLord_McLovin
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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: psyconaught]
    #19333135 - 12/27/13 02:05 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

You are right cost of living can differ a lot. But you do agree that the average standard of living most non-Western countries have is not even remotely comparable to ours (even compared to most of what we consider poor), don't you?


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Offlineqman
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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: psyconaught]
    #19333340 - 12/27/13 03:12 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

psyconaught said:
Quote:

but the rest of the world is even more fucked up



care to elaborate?





It's not inflation adjusted, either way, what's the major accomplishment for reaching the $1.50-$2.00 per day level?


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Offlinepsyconaught
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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: Lord_McLovin]
    #19333893 - 12/27/13 05:59 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Lord_McLovin said:
You are right cost of living can differ a lot. But you do agree that the average standard of living most non-Western countries have is not even remotely comparable to ours (even compared to most of what we consider poor), don't you?



of course poor countries have different lifestyles. Whats your point?

Quote:

what's the major accomplishment for reaching the $1.50-$2.00 per day level?



if you're making $0.50 a day then the accomplishment is massive.


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OfflineLord_McLovin
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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: psyconaught]
    #19335581 - 12/28/13 04:48 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Quote:

what's the major accomplishment for reaching the $1.50-$2.00 per day level?



if you're making $0.50 a day then the accomplishment is massive.




That's difficult to say, you may be right or not. What matters at the end is how much more you can actually afford with such a wage increase and that depends heavily on the local development of prices. We would need more data to say anything about that.

Quote:

psyconaught said:
Quote:

Lord_McLovin said:
You are right, cost of living can differ a lot. But you do agree that the average standard of living most non-Western countries have is not even remotely comparable to ours (even compared to most of what we consider poor), don't you?



of course poor countries have different lifestyles. Whats your point?




My point is that one of the major reasons we can live like this today is that we have oppressed and exploited the people living in those areas throughout history and are still doing so. We treat them like the capitalists treat us, the workforce.


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Offlinepsyconaught
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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: Lord_McLovin]
    #19336403 - 12/28/13 10:32 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

bullshit. Third world countries being third world has nothing to do with Capitalism. Capitalism raises people out of poverty, those people have a choice to work at sweat shops because its better than the alternative.


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Offlineimachavel
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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: psyconaught]
    #19336458 - 12/28/13 10:47 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

psyconaught said:
Quote:

imachavel said:
Quote:

psyconaught said:
Quote:

I don't really see how having several castles and private jets while others work their asses off for a tiny wage to feed their family is fair in any way. Especially when it is the latter, larger part of the people that is exploited to support the former's lifestyle.



he's a multi billionaire. You claimed people with his lifestyle exploited the working class to get where he is today. So please explain that to me. And please explain why it is not 'fair'




It's just as fair as raising the fucking lowest possible wage 50 cents a fucking hour. You can't have your cake, eat it too, have a billion, wine and moan and make another cake too. Deal with it, as for people saying "raising the minimum wage will make it impossible for gardeners to hire people they will have to pay too much." Gardeners pay their helpers $100 a day, less then 8 hours at $8 an hour, and besides they don't claim any money anyway quit being pompous they get paid cash don't claim taxes and can pay people whatever they want and never get in trouble for it.

Grow up, I'm tired of people in these posts acting as though they grew up on the nickel then complain about $1 an hour wage raise. Yeah right, :rolleyes: you grew up on the nickel, watched your mom be a bartender then when they decided to pay her an extra $1 an hour you started complaining that democracy has been desecrated :lolwut:



you dodged the question. Answer it please




The question wasn't towards me, but I'll answer it. You know why it's unfair to exploit the working class? Because a rich guy can do it and not even feel like he is doing anything wrong. It's completely legal to hire someone and pay them nothing but $7 an hour. The reason the rich exploit everything is because we let them. So as much as people say it's unfair to have a minimum wage, there is no MAXIMUM in the name middle wage. It does not forbid paying more. But as for caping wages, now that you mention it I'm not against it. It should be capped in dividends, not in salary. The reason the working class is exploited it because society let's them.

I think I propose a dividend cap, no company owner shall take in more then $250 million a year, through salary, stock, or other. If making more then so, the resulting extra profit shall be put back into a company account and not allowed to be drawn back out, until the next $250 million next year. I think that's fair, a quarter million a year earnings cap.

If you think that'll stagnate democracy, to be limited on pulling out too much money out of your corporate account for personal use, that is, a quarter of a million, then you must be crazy :lol::facepalm:

I can't imagine anyone having a hard time living on that :stoned:


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Offlineimachavel
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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: psyconaught]
    #19336479 - 12/28/13 10:51 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

psyconaught said:
Quote:

Lord_McLovin said:
You are right cost of living can differ a lot. But you do agree that the average standard of living most non-Western countries have is not even remotely comparable to ours (even compared to most of what we consider poor), don't you?



of course poor countries have different lifestyles. Whats your point?

Quote:

what's the major accomplishment for reaching the $1.50-$2.00 per day level?



if you're making $0.50 a day then the accomplishment is massive.




Do you think if the minimum wage was removed in our country that it would be hard to pay someone $0.50 a day? I am trying to figure out what people think would happen if there was no minimum wage and someone could be paid whatever someone would offer. Of course perhaps competitively other people work for more and it might be more then $.50 a day, perhaps even $5.00 a day. But for sure there would be no law to stop it, that can for sure be said


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: psilynut]
    #19336507 - 12/28/13 10:54 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

psilynut said:
Perhaps if we raised minimum wage we could attract some of our loser citizens off of welfare into the farm jobs they don't want that are currently being stolen by illegals. 
    And besides wouldnt food taste better if it was picked by American hands rather than greasy law breaking foreigner hands ? I'd pay a little more for that .




Yeah this make sense.

There are already laws against hiring illegals and paying them under minimum wage or anything at all for that matter. You are proposing we get rid of current regulations and laws to help other regulations and laws that aren't enforced?

Who is to stop people who pay illegals money that is now LEGAL TO PAY THEM because there are no minimum wage laws, so now it is even easier to hire illegals and pay them nothing, since they already expect to come be paid nothing, even they are citizens since the wage laws changed in the U.S.?


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: imachavel]
    #19336593 - 12/28/13 11:17 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Your failure to make a living is driving you insane.  It is not legal to pay illegal border jumping scum anything at all.


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: imachavel]
    #19336705 - 12/28/13 11:44 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

imachavel said:
If you think that'll stagnate democracy, to be limited on pulling out too much money out of your corporate account for personal use, that is, a quarter of a million, then you must be crazy :lol::facepalm:

I can't imagine anyone having a hard time living on that :stoned:




The thing is, multi-millionaires and billionaires don't just use their money to buy personal items. Most of them invest their money, creating new companies and jobs etc...


Edited by Ran-D (12/28/13 11:44 AM)


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: imachavel]
    #19336927 - 12/28/13 12:40 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

imachavel said:
Quote:

psyconaught said:
Quote:

Lord_McLovin said:
You are right cost of living can differ a lot. But you do agree that the average standard of living most non-Western countries have is not even remotely comparable to ours (even compared to most of what we consider poor), don't you?



of course poor countries have different lifestyles. Whats your point?

Quote:

what's the major accomplishment for reaching the $1.50-$2.00 per day level?



if you're making $0.50 a day then the accomplishment is massive.




Do you think if the minimum wage was removed in our country that it would be hard to pay someone $0.50 a day? I am trying to figure out what people think would happen if there was no minimum wage and someone could be paid whatever someone would offer. Of course perhaps competitively other people work for more and it might be more then $.50 a day, perhaps even $5.00 a day. But for sure there would be no law to stop it, that can for sure be said



I'm sure there would be plenty of jobs offering $0.50 an hour or a day. Would anyone accept that job? Hell no, therefore the employer would have to increase the wages in order to be competitive in the market. I would have been more than happy to take a $5.00 an hour job in high school. But i wasn't able to get a job because of minimum wage, it priced me out of the market. So instead i created my own business in high school. Not everyone has the entrepreneurial spirit however, nor does everyone want that.


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: zappaisgod]
    #19338019 - 12/28/13 05:54 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

zappaisgod said:
Your failure to make a living is driving you insane.  It is not legal to pay illegal border jumping scum anything at all.




I have to fail to make a living to be on the other side of the argument? You think it's legal to pay non US citizens? A work visa is temporary, and is still a work visa. Jumping the fence and being here does not mean you have a work visa or are even granted a temporary stay of a week in the U.S., paying these people who have no proof of citizenship or visa is 100% illegal.

So if I made a good living I'd agree with you? And if I know someone who makes 200k a year who disagrees with you, then what? Just for the theory of arguing


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: imachavel]
    #19338073 - 12/28/13 06:08 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

imachavel said:
Quote:

zappaisgod said:
Your failure to make a living is driving you insane.  It is not legal to pay illegal border jumping scum anything at all.




I have to fail to make a living to be on the other side of the argument? You think it's legal to pay non US citizens? A work visa is temporary, and is still a work visa. Jumping the fence and being here does not mean you have a work visa or are even granted a temporary stay of a week in the U.S., paying these people who have no proof of citizenship or visa is 100% illegal.

So if I made a good living I'd agree with you? And if I know someone who makes 200k a year who disagrees with you, then what? Just for the theory of arguing



That was in reference to your previous ravings but I suggest you reread what I wrote.  I'll repost it for you

"It is not legal to pay illegal border jumping scum anything at all". 


If you have a work visa you are whaaaaat?  Survey says:  "Legal"


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: Ran-D]
    #19338099 - 12/28/13 06:14 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Ran-D said:
Quote:

imachavel said:
If you think that'll stagnate democracy, to be limited on pulling out too much money out of your corporate account for personal use, that is, a quarter of a million, then you must be crazy :lol::facepalm:

I can't imagine anyone having a hard time living on that :stoned:




The thing is, multi-millionaires and billionaires don't just use their money to buy personal items. Most of them invest their money, creating new companies and jobs etc...




Yeah, like Donald Trump, he invested a lot of money, in a lot of other people's projects, which is why he owed hundreds of millions to the banks, because he was so generous. Oh wait no he wasn't he couldn't even use his millions for his projects it was all borrowed. :whatdoyouthink: It's why big companies get huge loans where if the loans aren't paid back they could end up owing tens of millions in interest payments alone, because of positive re investments instead of constantly borrowing money.

By the way, is re investing your earnings into other projects the same as personal cash for personal use? I'd imagine investments to be along the lines of re investing into a business, if even not your own. I'd even imagine it's such a useful endeavour, there might even be some type of tax credit for tons of money returned for people who make investments on large scales. I don't know for sure, but please don't quote me tax deductions and say you've never heard of a tax deduction for such a venture. A tax credit and a tax deduction is not the same thing. A credit is something the government gives you back for doing something useful to all people being a real contributor etc. For example you can get credited tons of money just for using solar panels, or doing research and development on new and improved products, or get r&d credits simply for putting in new windows that retain heat in your office building that if beneficial to the development of society advancing. Many credits don't apply to all situations but a lot of people don't even know about them.


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: psyconaught]
    #19338134 - 12/28/13 06:24 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

psyconaught said:
Quote:

imachavel said:
Quote:

psyconaught said:
Quote:

Lord_McLovin said:
You are right cost of living can differ a lot. But you do agree that the average standard of living most non-Western countries have is not even remotely comparable to ours (even compared to most of what we consider poor), don't you?



of course poor countries have different lifestyles. Whats your point?

Quote:

what's the major accomplishment for reaching the $1.50-$2.00 per day level?



if you're making $0.50 a day then the accomplishment is massive.




Do you think if the minimum wage was removed in our country that it would be hard to pay someone $0.50 a day? I am trying to figure out what people think would happen if there was no minimum wage and someone could be paid whatever someone would offer. Of course perhaps competitively other people work for more and it might be more then $.50 a day, perhaps even $5.00 a day. But for sure there would be no law to stop it, that can for sure be said



I'm sure there would be plenty of jobs offering $0.50 an hour or a day. Would anyone accept that job? Hell no, therefore the employer would have to increase the wages in order to be competitive in the market. I would have been more than happy to take a $5.00 an hour job in high school. But i wasn't able to get a job because of minimum wage, it priced me out of the market. So instead i created my own business in high school. Not everyone has the entrepreneurial spirit however, nor does everyone want that.




Why do you think no one would accept such a low wage? They do in other countries. Are they forced to work in other countries? Or are they just willing to eat a piece of stale bread cut into pieces for a few days because it's better then starving to death?

It DOES suck when a minimum wage stops someone from getting paid a lower amount of money they'd accept to work for. Of course, at $7.00 an hour with taxes 8 hours of work only comes out to about $52 a day. An extremely low amount of money as it is, but I understand you being willing to take less. To me it's an unfortunate situation. It is of course true it benefits more people who are willing to work for less to not have a minimum wage. But this is the price of capitalistic greed. If if wasn't for a minimum wage, losers would accept anything people would pay them, and many people would make $1.50 an hour. Not a lot in this country, considering the price of living in the U.S. Of course as I said it's unfortunate, but these laws are the price of greedy and desperate people who will do anything for money and pay people anything to make tons of money.

I wish there was another way, but I myself am not willing to work for $7 an hour and haven't worked for that much for quite several years now. Perhaps if people were more self reliant then more people would be less willing to work for less and people would automatically get paid more based on the necessity to pay people what they ask to get something done. Another thing that would help remove the need for a minimum wage; is people paying whatever someone asks for something. For example, for most people to pay rent, they need a certain amount of money a month, because people are willing to buy property at high prices, property sells at high prices, and people who rent out rooms etc. pay high property taxes. Now those high property taxes create a need for higher wages just to make a simpler living. As I said, it's an unfortunate but necessary thing to have a minimum wage


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: zappaisgod]
    #19338141 - 12/28/13 06:25 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

zappaisgod said:
Quote:

imachavel said:
Quote:

zappaisgod said:
Your failure to make a living is driving you insane.  It is not legal to pay illegal border jumping scum anything at all.




I have to fail to make a living to be on the other side of the argument? You think it's legal to pay non US citizens? A work visa is temporary, and is still a work visa. Jumping the fence and being here does not mean you have a work visa or are even granted a temporary stay of a week in the U.S., paying these people who have no proof of citizenship or visa is 100% illegal.

So if I made a good living I'd agree with you? And if I know someone who makes 200k a year who disagrees with you, then what? Just for the theory of arguing



That was in reference to your previous ravings but I suggest you reread what I wrote.  I'll repost it for you

"It is not legal to pay illegal border jumping scum anything at all". 


If you have a work visa you are whaaaaat?  Survey says:  "Legal"




So jumping a fence is the same as having a work visa? Not sure where this is going. Say what?


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: imachavel]
    #19338283 - 12/28/13 07:00 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Not sure your reading comprehension is up to snuff.  No, that is not what I'm saying.  My first sentence referenced only illegal border jumping scum and went on to point out that it is illegal to pay them anything at all.  The second sentence was to point out that if you have a work visa you are legal.


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: zappaisgod]
    #19340006 - 12/29/13 02:10 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

You guys are funny.

Why the fuck would any of you care about a maximum wage? it wouldn’t effect you thats for damn sure. Ya maybe if you keep voting against your own interests some day you’ll get lucky and strike the lottery.


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: elax420]
    #19340887 - 12/29/13 10:12 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Because I'm trying to go pro at mushroom hunting and start stacking benjamins :baaaam:


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: elax420]
    #19341299 - 12/29/13 12:25 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

elax420 said:
You guys are funny.

Why the fuck would any of you care about a maximum wage? it wouldn’t effect you thats for damn sure. Ya maybe if you keep voting against your own interests some day you’ll get lucky and strike the lottery.



because a maximum wage creates a system where government dictates who and who cannot gain wealth. The less government the better, I think a maximum wage in a hinderance to freedom and the economy. Do you really only care about laws that affect you directly? I'm not gay but gay marriage should not be illegal.


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: elax420]
    #19342790 - 12/29/13 05:55 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

If I reach the maximum allowable wage by the end of February I will stop working.  Have a good time finding somebody who can take my place.


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: elax420] * 1
    #19344204 - 12/29/13 11:27 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

elax420 said:
You guys are funny.

Why the fuck would any of you care about a maximum wage? it wouldn’t effect you thats for damn sure. Ya maybe if you keep voting against your own interests some day you’ll get lucky and strike the lottery.





WHY the fuck do you care if a company pays its CEO 10 million dollars?  It is NONE OF YOUR BUSINESS. :smirk:


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: starfire_xes] * 1
    #19344225 - 12/29/13 11:35 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

starfire_xes said:
Quote:

elax420 said:
You guys are funny.

Why the fuck would any of you care about a maximum wage? it wouldn’t effect you thats for damn sure. Ya maybe if you keep voting against your own interests some day you’ll get lucky and strike the lottery.





WHY the fuck do you care if a company pays its CEO 10 million dollars?  It is NONE OF YOUR BUSINESS. :smirk:




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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: psyconaught]
    #19344238 - 12/29/13 11:38 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Ya thats what CEOs get in bonuses when their company takes a loss for the year and has to downsize.


What was that severance package they paid all those guys that started the sub prime mortgage shit? like 60 mill to create the biggest recession since the depression :loldongs:


Good job bruhhh, well earned.


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: elax420]
    #19344241 - 12/29/13 11:40 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

thats an interesting point. Please explain how being a CEO means you contributed to the housing bubble?


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: psyconaught]
    #19344253 - 12/29/13 11:45 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Im talking about the guys that ran the banks that gave out the shitty loans.

If the Chief Executive isn’t the fall guy i don’t even know what to say :rofl:
You better never bitch about the president.


I just think its funny how the uber rich get the poor out in numbers voting for issues that will never effect them, or anybody that will even be seen in the same zip code as them


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: elax420] * 1
    #19344258 - 12/29/13 11:47 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

elax420 said:
Ya thats what CEOs get in bonuses when their company takes a loss for the year and has to downsize.


What was that severance package they paid all those guys that started the sub prime mortgage shit? like 60 mill to create the biggest recession since the depression :loldongs:


Good job bruhhh, well earned.



Quote:

elax420 said:
Ya thats what CEOs get in bonuses when their company takes a loss for the year and has to downsize.


What was that severance package they paid all those guys that started the sub prime mortgage shit? like 60 mill to create the biggest recession since the depression :loldongs:


Good job bruhhh, well earned.




"Frank 'no crisis.' The New York Times reported on Sept. 11, 2003:

    ''These two entities -- Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac -- are not facing any kind of financial crisis,'' said Representative Barney Frank of Massachusetts, the ranking Democrat on the Financial Services Committee. ''The more people exaggerate these problems, the more pressure there is on these companies, the less we will see in terms of affordable housing.""

Uh, the housing bubble was caused by GOVERNMENT POLICY and was pushed ahead by the bonehead actions of certain members of the Senate Finance Comittee.


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: starfire_xes]
    #19344273 - 12/29/13 11:51 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Yaaaaaa....


Okay Rush, can i have a little of whatever your smoking.


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: elax420] * 1
    #19344344 - 12/30/13 12:16 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

elax420 said:
Yaaaaaa....


Okay Rush, can i have a little of whatever your smoking.





You saw it, Barney Frank said that there was no problem.  There were warnings from several prominent republicans about the housing crisis.  This is the little bit of information the lefties don't want to admit.

Fucked up government policy caused the problem.  The government more or less forced banks to give up loans to people who didnt qualify for them.

So stick that up your butt, take a deep breath, and blow hard to see if it hits you in the head and gets you out of the brainwashed liberal mode.


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: starfire_xes]
    #19344436 - 12/30/13 01:00 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

I like it how you assume anyone who disagrees with you is a lefty. Just because I’m not a major tool that worships wealth doesn’t make me a leftist.

You actually think the financial institutions are ethical and have no role in the crash, how cute and naive of you.


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: elax420]
    #19344461 - 12/30/13 01:14 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

i think peter schiff puts it fairly accurately.

"Wall Street drank the alcohol that the government poured"


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: elax420]
    #19344462 - 12/30/13 01:15 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

elax420 said:
I like it how you assume anyone who disagrees with you is a lefty. Just because I’m not a major tool that worships wealth doesn’t make me a leftist.





I know right? It's always funny when people get defensive and just call someone else a "liberal" like it automatically wins the argument. If you ask me, identifying as a liberal or conservative is stupid and unrealistic for anyone to do. They want us to get all caught up picking sides like teenage girls fighting over Team Edward vs. Team Jacob, that way nothing ever actually gets accomplished.

Quote:

elax420 said:
You actually think the financial institutions are ethical and have no role in the crash, how cute and naive of you.




:lol:


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: elax420]
    #19344868 - 12/30/13 03:44 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

elax420 said:


You actually think the financial institutions are ethical and have no role in the crash, how cute and naive of you.




Did I say that?  No.

You actually think that the government is ethical and had no role in the crash, how cute and naive of you.

:lolsy:

You go ahead, you can suck the governments dick, call yourself whatever you want.


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: elax420]
    #19344871 - 12/30/13 03:47 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Oh, by the way, i'll bet if you suddenly came into shitloads of money, or someone started paying you really large sums of money for something, that you would turn it down, give it back.  You would refuse it because, well, you are above those rich evil fuckers who make money, right? :lolsy:


Face it.  You dont make shit squat for money and you are envious of those who do.  Class envy.  The brand of the lefty.


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: starfire_xes]
    #19345663 - 12/30/13 10:01 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Yea, because everyone on this site likes the government. :rolleyes:

Get over yourself already.


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Offlineimachavel
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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: zappaisgod]
    #19345749 - 12/30/13 10:34 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

zappaisgod said:
If I reach the maximum allowable wage by the end of February I will stop working.  Have a good time finding somebody who can take my place.




You swear there aren't tons. And I'm not a believer in maximum wage so much as maximum area. Perhaps a cell phone provider shouldn't cover more then 10 states. How then will the other 40 states be covered? By other cell phone providers who step in to fill the gaps. I don't see anything wrong with that personally. How does the government enforce "no monopolizing" anyway? I have no idea how they would even consider enforcing that, if they ever have


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:kingcrankey: I did not say to edit my signature soulidarity! Now forever I will never remember what I said about understanding the secrets of the universe by paying attention to subtleties!

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Offlineimachavel
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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: starfire_xes]
    #19345754 - 12/30/13 10:35 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

starfire_xes said:
Quote:

elax420 said:
You guys are funny.

Why the fuck would any of you care about a maximum wage? it wouldn’t effect you thats for damn sure. Ya maybe if you keep voting against your own interests some day you’ll get lucky and strike the lottery.





WHY the fuck do you care if a company pays its CEO 10 million dollars?  It is NONE OF YOUR BUSINESS. :smirk:




It is when they made more money then anyone else could fathom, then need a bail out. I feel it's completely my business. Every single penny of taxes I don't get back should not go back into the pocket of a guy who is already richer then possibly imaginable


--------------------
:kingcrankey: I did not say to edit my signature soulidarity! Now forever I will never remember what I said about understanding the secrets of the universe by paying attention to subtleties!

:facepalm: I'm never giving you the password again. Jerk


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Offlinepsyconaught
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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: imachavel]
    #19345802 - 12/30/13 10:52 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

imachavel said:
Quote:

starfire_xes said:
Quote:

elax420 said:
You guys are funny.

Why the fuck would any of you care about a maximum wage? it wouldn’t effect you thats for damn sure. Ya maybe if you keep voting against your own interests some day you’ll get lucky and strike the lottery.





WHY the fuck do you care if a company pays its CEO 10 million dollars?  It is NONE OF YOUR BUSINESS. :smirk:




It is when they made more money then anyone else could fathom, then need a bail out. I feel it's completely my business. Every single penny of taxes I don't get back should not go back into the pocket of a guy who is already richer then possibly imaginable



for once a partially agree with you. The bailouts should not have happened. The banks and auto industry should have failed, and the higher ups all should have lost their jobs. However the simple fact of a CEO making millions of dollars a year (outside of the bailouts) should be none of your business whatsoever.


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Offlineimachavel
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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: psyconaught]
    #19345838 - 12/30/13 11:06 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

psyconaught said:
Quote:

imachavel said:
Quote:

starfire_xes said:
Quote:

elax420 said:
You guys are funny.

Why the fuck would any of you care about a maximum wage? it wouldn’t effect you thats for damn sure. Ya maybe if you keep voting against your own interests some day you’ll get lucky and strike the lottery.





WHY the fuck do you care if a company pays its CEO 10 million dollars?  It is NONE OF YOUR BUSINESS. :smirk:




It is when they made more money then anyone else could fathom, then need a bail out. I feel it's completely my business. Every single penny of taxes I don't get back should not go back into the pocket of a guy who is already richer then possibly imaginable



for once a partially agree with you. The bailouts should not have happened. The banks and auto industry should have failed, and the higher ups all should have lost their jobs. However the simple fact of a CEO making millions of dollars a year (outside of the bailouts) should be none of your business whatsoever.




Me making $8 an hour instead of $7 should be none of your business. :facepalm: why do people even come close to calling this Republic a Democracy? There is no "general consensus" voted on in this god damn country. It's really sad :rofl2: I find people that want to own a business and don't want to pay $8 instead of $7 should go start a business in another country with more lenient wage laws and see how easy it is to run a business in Brazil.

:rolleyes: I mean cmon already. Why is it your business how much a millionaire makes but not mine? It's none of your damn business either. It's not your hundred million, let them and the government duke it out, quit being nosey


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:kingcrankey: I did not say to edit my signature soulidarity! Now forever I will never remember what I said about understanding the secrets of the universe by paying attention to subtleties!

:facepalm: I'm never giving you the password again. Jerk


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Offlinepsyconaught
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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: imachavel]
    #19346084 - 12/30/13 12:29 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

its none of my business how much you make per hour. If you can negotiate higher wages with you employer then good for you. However when the government dictates what i can or cannot pay my employees then it becomes my business. Why do you care what i pay my people? You're right its none of my business how much a CEO makes, nor is it your business, nor the governments. You call me nosey yet you are the one calling for a microscope up someones ass simply because they are more successful than you.


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Offlineimachavel
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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: psyconaught]
    #19346335 - 12/30/13 01:35 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

psyconaught said:
its none of my business how much you make per hour. If you can negotiate higher wages with you employer then good for you. However when the government dictates what i can or cannot pay my employees then it becomes my business. Why do you care what i pay my people? You're right its none of my business how much a CEO makes, nor is it your business, nor the governments. You call me nosey yet you are the one calling for a microscope up someones ass simply because they are more successful than you.




They are more successful then me? On what basis? That I have an account on this site? If people could negotiate wages with employers more, things would be easier. The fact is in this country there is something called a corporate mentality. A person who is employed is usually employed by a manager WAAAAYYYY down the line. This manager cannot authorize what he can and can't pay someone because it's not his decision, those decisions have to go waayyy up the ladder, and there is usually a general consensus on what corporations allow managers to give raises to employees.

Most corporations are all about cutting costs anyways, the less people a manager has to hire to get a job done, the larger his bonus. I mean, if labourers had an INCENTIVE to work harder and make more, that'd be nice. But you and me both know how corporations work, buy for $1 and sell for $100 if possible. I'd know, I used to sell time shares. I made a 5% commission which wasn't terrible, but the fact is the time shares themselves could have made the corporations TONS OF cash just each person using the time share paying an $800 a year maintenance fee just for that one unit for one week. The added cost of buying was also RIDICULOUS. The other employees who weren't in sales who weren't making commission like me? Know what they got? $7 an hour, and some had been there practically their whole life and were maybe up to $9 an hour or $10 an hour.

Your plausibilities of how much harder it's MOST likely going to be to run a business paying an increase in wages compared to how much more money consumers will be able to spend to me is ridiculous. Most small businesses don't sell SUPER EXPENSIVE THINGS anyway. Have you heard of a guy with a car dealership that started the car dealership with only a few thousand dollars? Ridiculous. Corporations have already been CASHING IN on what someone is WILLING to buy something for and not what is REASONABLE what so ever.

So capitalism then is more like survival of the fittest. It's not about rational or well thought out it's about "we will sell that shit for millions if someone will buy it for millions." It's survival of the fittest. Well the small business guy is living in a world of survival of the fittest. That's just how it is. You start a business that depends on TONS of employees you better be prepared for wage raise laws. This isn't about "fair." It's about "you don't want politicians raising the wages" then really you should have influenced more people to go vote for someone besides Obama who wouldn't push for wage raise laws.

I personally hate Obama, but I'm finding it fun that every person who is against raising wages is now retorting to me as "a liberal attitude person" as though they have nothing better at all to throw at me. This is a tired argument. I find that Obama is probably pushing for a wage increase based on his popularity and what people want. Even though he can't get another term, I doubt he could care less what people make or not. He is simply fighting a war with congress, and all his fellow liberals are analyzing that wage raises would probably produce more taxes, and he is opposing Republicans. And maybe they got this one right. It's harder for a guy making $10 an hour to go take his cash out of the country and loop hole the crap out of tax laws then it is for a billionaire.

If I was a politician and I depended on taxes? Man.... I'd be doing the same thing. Half those billionaires have dozens of Swiss bank accounts they launder their money into. Or even easier, "offshore investments." Now the money being taxed will be the dinner bucket accounts, no way to loop hole out of that. Good thinking Obama, for once I agree with you. And to be personally honest I think most employers should pay employees $100 a day, MUCH more then your $10.10 x 8 hours equals out to be. So for me to agree that these wage increase will hurt anyone, you'll have to show me some actual facts, hard solid evidence, that many businesses have in fact filed for eventual bankruptcy based on wage increases and that this country would be MUCH better off with lower wages.

And to be honest, it's easier for people to cut hours of employees anyway. You have 3 or 4 people at your business for the first 4 hours of the day, then most of the work is done, you let 1 or 2 or them go, and only keep another one or two for the rest of the day. I've seen to much down sizing based on fabricated reasons to cut employees down to actually sit here and swallow that this proposal which probably won't even be met will have any real serious impact on our economy. It's an inconvenience and hey that's how it is in a survival of the fittest market, you just have to deal with it. If you don't like it create a petition but I know I'm not signing it that's for sure.


--------------------
:kingcrankey: I did not say to edit my signature soulidarity! Now forever I will never remember what I said about understanding the secrets of the universe by paying attention to subtleties!

:facepalm: I'm never giving you the password again. Jerk


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Invisiblelighthouse09
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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: imachavel]
    #19346515 - 12/30/13 02:15 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

IMO it is kind of good idea look at some of the people who are CEO's ,some may not be evil but look at these http://listverse.com/2012/07/23/top-10-evil-businessmen/ robert rubin perhaps could have been a major cause in both sides of the collapse. Some people seem to have some mental problem where it's never enough ,most people want a better life but when is enough enough?and who needs 80million a year??(that has nothing to do with how successfully a business is)
How company's treat employees is complete bullshit like the Deborah shank story. if the law is on the side of stuff like that happening we should definitely cut their rich asses off .I don't believe many companies or CEO's really care about anyone their goal as a company is $$ and saying they are a person is just crazy talk .That would be one psychotic scary person!!!


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Offlinezappaisgod
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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: lighthouse09]
    #19346976 - 12/30/13 04:04 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Imacheval, why don't you work on commission?  Start your own company doing whatever then you can pay yourself whatever you want (LOL) and not worry about negotiating pay.

Day laborers here make $100 a day plus lunch and transportation.  Sounds like an upgrade for you and elax.


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Offlinezappaisgod
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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: lighthouse09]
    #19346989 - 12/30/13 04:06 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

lighthouse09 said:
IMO it is kind of good idea look at some of the people who are CEO's ,some may not be evil but look at these http://listverse.com/2012/07/23/top-10-evil-businessmen/ robert rubin perhaps could have been a major cause in both sides of the collapse. Some people seem to have some mental problem where it's never enough ,most people want a better life but when is enough enough?and who needs 80million a year??(that has nothing to do with how successfully a business is)
How company's treat employees is complete bullshit like the Deborah shank story. if the law is on the side of stuff like that happening we should definitely cut their rich asses off .I don't believe many companies or CEO's really care about anyone their goal as a company is $$ and saying they are a person is just crazy talk .That would be one psychotic scary person!!!




They care about their shareholders which is who they have a legally required allegiance to.  Their employees?  None at all.


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Invisibleelax420
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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: imachavel]
    #19347281 - 12/30/13 04:53 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

zappaisgod said:
Quote:

lighthouse09 said:
IMO it is kind of good idea look at some of the people who are CEO's ,some may not be evil but look at these http://listverse.com/2012/07/23/top-10-evil-businessmen/ robert rubin perhaps could have been a major cause in both sides of the collapse. Some people seem to have some mental problem where it's never enough ,most people want a better life but when is enough enough?and who needs 80million a year??(that has nothing to do with how successfully a business is)
How company's treat employees is complete bullshit like the Deborah shank story. if the law is on the side of stuff like that happening we should definitely cut their rich asses off .I don't believe many companies or CEO's really care about anyone their goal as a company is $$ and saying they are a person is just crazy talk .That would be one psychotic scary person!!!




They care about their shareholders which is who they have a legally required allegiance to.  Their employees?  None at all.





Oh you and your remedial understanding and constant parading of a deeper understand of business is pretty funny.




You know there is this little startup you may have never heard of that really made employee satisfaction a point of emphasis. but they are really small and insignificant
Quote:

imachavel said:
Quote:

starfire_xes said:
Quote:

elax420 said:
You guys are funny.

Why the fuck would any of you care about a maximum wage? it wouldn’t effect you thats for damn sure. Ya maybe if you keep voting against your own interests some day you’ll get lucky and strike the lottery.





WHY the fuck do you care if a company pays its CEO 10 million dollars?  It is NONE OF YOUR BUSINESS. :smirk:




It is when they made more money then anyone else could fathom, then need a bail out. I feel it's completely my business. Every single penny of taxes I don't get back should not go back into the pocket of a guy who is already richer then possibly imaginable





at least one person here can agree that guys getting paid stupid amounts of money, on which they pay no taxes is a little hairy.
The funny thing is yall keep bitching about cronyism and patronage, irony much :lol:


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Offlinepsyconaught
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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: elax420]
    #19347314 - 12/30/13 04:57 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

google has no legal obligation to care about their employees in the same manner that they care about their shareholders.


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Offlinezappaisgod
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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: elax420]
    #19347320 - 12/30/13 04:59 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

elax420 said:
Quote:

zappaisgod said:
Quote:

lighthouse09 said:
IMO it is kind of good idea look at some of the people who are CEO's ,some may not be evil but look at these http://listverse.com/2012/07/23/top-10-evil-businessmen/ robert rubin perhaps could have been a major cause in both sides of the collapse. Some people seem to have some mental problem where it's never enough ,most people want a better life but when is enough enough?and who needs 80million a year??(that has nothing to do with how successfully a business is)
How company's treat employees is complete bullshit like the Deborah shank story. if the law is on the side of stuff like that happening we should definitely cut their rich asses off .I don't believe many companies or CEO's really care about anyone their goal as a company is $$ and saying they are a person is just crazy talk .That would be one psychotic scary person!!!




They care about their shareholders which is who they have a legally required allegiance to.  Their employees?  None at all.





Oh you and your remedial understanding and constant parading of a deeper understand of business is pretty funny.




You know there is this little startup you may have never heard of that really made employee satisfaction a point of emphasis. but they are really small and insignificant





If they want to pay their employees more money that is their business.  I don't give a shit.  How much did their CEO make, anyway?

The only people that CEOs have a fiduciary duty to are the shareholders.  It is their business.  Not yours or mine.
Quote:








Quote:

imachavel said:
Quote:

starfire_xes said:
Quote:

elax420 said:
You guys are funny.

Why the fuck would any of you care about a maximum wage? it wouldn’t effect you thats for damn sure. Ya maybe if you keep voting against your own interests some day you’ll get lucky and strike the lottery.





WHY the fuck do you care if a company pays its CEO 10 million dollars?  It is NONE OF YOUR BUSINESS. :smirk:




It is when they made more money then anyone else could fathom, then need a bail out. I feel it's completely my business. Every single penny of taxes I don't get back should not go back into the pocket of a guy who is already richer then possibly imaginable





at least one person here can agree that guys getting paid stupid amounts of money, on which they pay no taxes is a little hairy.
The funny thing is yall keep bitching about cronyism and patronage, irony much :lol:




So much derangement here.  What bailout is he babbling about and what cronyism and no taxes are you babbling about?


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Invisibleelax420
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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: zappaisgod]
    #19347428 - 12/30/13 05:17 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Not up to date on your business news, obviously :rolleyes:

They are the CEO’s now grandpa. Good employees actually like to be treated good, real shocker there right.... Ya the CEO has an obligation to deliver a profit to the shareholders, how you gonna do that when no one wants to work for you or your shitty company? PR is pretty important as well my man. Most people would rather work for a decent human at a job that respects them and treats them well and make less then at a place they get treated like shit. Just like how people will pay a little more for a smile and personalized service then to go to a place that treats them as an expendable POS.

Its funny how locked in absolutes you are.

The only people who think in absolutes are insane, or stupid. The real world doesn’t work that way, but yes i love being lectured on businesss practice by a fucking carpenter....
If i want to know how to make a shed, ya ill go to you. If i want financial advise pretty much the last person I’m going to talk to is the blue collar guy who is just reciting some maxim he heard rush limbaugh say 20 years ago.


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Offlinepsyconaught
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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: elax420]
    #19347459 - 12/30/13 05:23 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

no one is talking about right or wrong. Its a simple fact that CEO's have a legal responsibly to the shareholders and not the employees. Will employee's treated well work harder? Most likely. But thats a management discussion not a legal one.


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Offlinezappaisgod
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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: elax420]
    #19347516 - 12/30/13 05:32 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

elax420 said:
Not up to date on your business news, obviously :rolleyes:

They are the CEO’s now grandpa. Good employees actually like to be treated good, real shocker there right.... Ya the CEO has an obligation to deliver a profit to the shareholders, how you gonna do that when no one wants to work for you or your shitty company? PR is pretty important as well my man. Most people would rather work for a decent human at a job that respects them and treats them well and make less then at a place they get treated like shit. Just like how people will pay a little more for a smile and personalized service then to go to a place that treats them as an expendable POS.

Its funny how locked in absolutes you are.

The only people who think in absolutes are insane, or stupid. The real world doesn’t work that way, but yes i love being lectured on businesss practice by a fucking carpenter....
If i want to know how to make a shed, ya ill go to you. If i want financial advise pretty much the last person I’m going to talk to is the blue collar guy who is just reciting some maxim he heard rush limbaugh say 20 years ago.




I have no desire to advise you.  I expect you will fail no matter what anybody tells you.  Yes, attracting worthwhile employees might be important to provide a return to the shareholders.  Unless it isn't.  The CEO has no obligation to the employee.  Only to the shareholder.  The only purpose of my employees, and I made this very clear to them, was to make me money.  If they weren't comfortable with that please fuck off right now.  Even construction workers without college degrees understood that.


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Invisibleelax420
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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: psyconaught]
    #19347523 - 12/30/13 05:33 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Did i say it was a legal decision?

Zapp spouts out some shit they teach 8 year olds to try and seem smart. Shareholders and Employees are often one in the same anyway. Too say CEO's give no shits about their employees is just a major :facepalm: especially when that is the way most businesses are moving now days. Google changed the game.


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Offlinezappaisgod
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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: elax420]
    #19347544 - 12/30/13 05:37 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Google changed nothing. 

Let me slow this down for you

The      only      people      that      CEOs      have      a      fiduciary    duty    to      are    the    shareholders.


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Invisibleelax420
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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: zappaisgod]
    #19347570 - 12/30/13 05:41 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

No shit sherlock did you just finish your personal finance class from DeVry? Tell me the one about sole proprietorships again now grandpa zapp.



Quote:

zappaisgod said:
Google changed nothing. 






This is single handedly the stupidest comment i have ever seen on this site.

Carpentry was a good fit, clearly.


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Offlinezappaisgod
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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: elax420]
    #19347588 - 12/30/13 05:44 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Do you really think Google was the first company that overpaid it's employees for some happy workplace nirvana?  That is not a new concept.


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Invisibleelax420
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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: zappaisgod]
    #19347622 - 12/30/13 05:53 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

I don’t even know how I got in this conversation with a fucking carpenter no less, but its over.

You are way too detached from reality


May as well go talk to the crack head down the street about mutual funds...


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Offlinezappaisgod
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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: elax420]
    #19347637 - 12/30/13 05:55 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

elax420 said:
I don’t even know how I got in this conversation with a fucking carpenter no less, but its over.

You are way too detached from reality




So says mom's basement boy who's done nothing but sweep floors and loves it.
Quote:




May as well go talk to the crack head down the street about mutual funds...




Crack is wonderful but I can't imagine why you would talk to anybody about mutual funds.


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Offlineimachavel
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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: zappaisgod]
    #19347907 - 12/30/13 06:51 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

this thread just got :lolwut:

It's nice to see others doing the arguing and insulting besides me for a change. :rofl2: Now I know what I look like arguing........ fucking........ hilarious


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: imachavel]
    #19348905 - 12/30/13 10:19 PM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

imachavel said:
Quote:

starfire_xes said:



WHY the fuck do you care if a company pays its CEO 10 million dollars?  It is NONE OF YOUR BUSINESS. :smirk:




It is when they made more money then anyone else could fathom, then need a bail out.





And here is my point again:  who gave the companies 'bailouts'?  DUH...the government. 

Who can blame the companies if the government is going to give them money?  I don't see anyone bitching about Free Stuff the government gives out.

Again, the government is to blame.  They ENABLE bad behavior by bailing out companies.

If the government was going to give me a bunch of money as a bailout I would take it. 

But I'm sure you wouldn't...your ass is lily white and shines brightly and righteously above the Capitialists Who Make Too Much Money.


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: starfire_xes]
    #19350508 - 12/31/13 10:13 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

starfire_xes said:
Quote:

imachavel said:
Quote:

starfire_xes said:



WHY the fuck do you care if a company pays its CEO 10 million dollars?  It is NONE OF YOUR BUSINESS. :smirk:




It is when they made more money then anyone else could fathom, then need a bail out.





And here is my point again:  who gave the companies 'bailouts'?  DUH...the government. 

Who can blame the companies if the government is going to give them money?  I don't see anyone bitching about Free Stuff the government gives out.

Again, the government is to blame.  They ENABLE bad behavior by bailing out companies.

If the government was going to give me a bunch of money as a bailout I would take it. 

But I'm sure you wouldn't...your ass is lily white and shines brightly and righteously above the Capitialists Who Make Too Much Money.




You don't know a god damn fucking thing about me. I would never take a damn government penny. NOTHING the government gives you is free, if you think a bank is bad well when you don't pay back a bank loan the government enforces the law that they can come take your stuff for not paying them back. What do you think will happen when you don't pay back a government loan? They MAKE the laws that say they can come take your stuff. No I wouldn't take a government grant or anything close, unless 40 lawyers were standing next to me saying "for sure you don't have to pay back .02 of this"

Now anyway what is the relevance of this to the topic? Do I see a straw man coming?


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: starfire_xes]
    #19350529 - 12/31/13 10:21 AM (10 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

starfire_xes said:
 

But I'm sure you wouldn't...your ass is lily white and shines brightly and righteously above the Capitialists Who Make Too Much Money.




Your god damn right it is, and don't ever forget it. I am NOTHING like those people. Honestly I wouldn't know how to spend a billion dollars anyway, that is WAAYYY too much money for me. I would HATE to have that much responsibility like millions of peoples jobs and the entire financial sector are depending on me, even if it's indirectly. Id much rather have a simple $10,000,000, to me I could do whatever I wanted, and still have tons of cash to invest in lots of projects and fly around the world.

I love it when people put me in the same shoes as someone else and try and convince me I wouldn't do the same thing. If I had that much power, I'd sell my company, start a bank, and give $500 loans to people with new business ideas. I'd make it a goal to give out 2 million $500 loans with only 5% interest to people who want to test a business idea go out with $500 and make it into $1000 then I'd up the loans to only loans under $50,000 and I'd only give money to people who qualify with debit not credit. I would NEVER make it a goal to look at how much someone had borrowed and paid back. How do I know where they got the money to pay me back?

I'd look at peoples income and spending history, how much they make and how much they spend what percentage of it is on bills and what percentage on shit they don't need, basically a full income and debit history. I would NEVER give two shits about credit. Back in the day a person was laughed at with credit, it was a "we take cash only sir not that credit shit" situation. Things sure have changed, I don't see how I've contributed to that, I basically have ZERO credit and it's caused quite a few bumps but I can still rely on just about anyone to take cash if you have enough of it


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: imachavel]
    #19351243 - 12/31/13 01:46 PM (10 years, 30 days ago)

So basically you'd start a bank?  5% interest?  You dirty banker :wink:


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: Shins]
    #19351306 - 12/31/13 02:13 PM (10 years, 30 days ago)

I talked to a republican i used to sorta be Friends with and he said they taught him at Columbia in new york that money is more important than people, thats what our society is going towards the king of the hill i have the most attitude.Life comes and goes but money makes change he said?  i am pretty sure people made the change you just had to pay them i would say.
whats more important money or human lives?


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: lighthouse09]
    #19351456 - 12/31/13 02:56 PM (10 years, 30 days ago)

Quote:

lighthouse09 said:
I talked to a republican i used to sorta be Friends with and he said they taught him at Columbia in new york that money is more important than people, thats what our society is going towards the king of the hill i have the most attitude.Life comes and goes but money makes change he said?  i am pretty sure people made the change you just had to pay them i would say.
whats more important money or human lives?




That doesn't sound like Columbia


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: Shins]
    #19351727 - 12/31/13 04:10 PM (10 years, 30 days ago)

Quote:

Shins said:
So basically you'd start a bank?  5% interest?  You dirty banker :wink:




You find that bad? I'd make it FIXED 5% interest. But I couldn't get federally approved to be an actual bank. I know you don't need tens of millions to start a bank you only need $500,000(although realistically tens of millions is much better), but damn do you have to go through some back ground for that or what. I've heard to be federally insured as a legal bank if they find you've gotten a speeding ticket it can be extremely difficult to get approved


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: imachavel]
    #19353270 - 12/31/13 11:56 PM (10 years, 30 days ago)

Quote:

imachavel said:
Quote:

starfire_xes said:
 

But I'm sure you wouldn't...your ass is lily white and shines brightly and righteously above the Capitialists Who Make Too Much Money.




Your god damn right it is, and don't ever forget it. I am NOTHING like those people. Honestly I wouldn't know how to spend a billion dollars anyway, that is WAAYYY too much money for me.





I can say i'd damn sure find a way to spend a billion.  Now please, don't insult our intelligence by saying you are above money.  I mean, the horse poop gets deep here sometimes but Jesus Chirst, you just laid out the Mother Of All Bullshit Proclamations.


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: starfire_xes]
    #19353280 - 12/31/13 11:58 PM (10 years, 30 days ago)

By the way, a billion aint too much for me.  And when someone says 'more money than you can imagine, well, fuck me raw, I can imagine a goddamn shitload of money. 

So Im materialistic and like money.

If I have a lot of money, i can help my family, and give to all the people an causes I like.  :smirk:


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: starfire_xes]
    #19353328 - 01/01/14 12:19 AM (10 years, 30 days ago)



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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: starfire_xes]
    #19355189 - 01/01/14 03:44 PM (10 years, 29 days ago)

Quote:

starfire_xes said:
Quote:

imachavel said:
Quote:

starfire_xes said:
 

But I'm sure you wouldn't...your ass is lily white and shines brightly and righteously above the Capitialists Who Make Too Much Money.




Your god damn right it is, and don't ever forget it. I am NOTHING like those people. Honestly I wouldn't know how to spend a billion dollars anyway, that is WAAYYY too much money for me.





I can say i'd damn sure find a way to spend a billion.  Now please, don't insult our intelligence by saying you are above money.  I mean, the horse poop gets deep here sometimes but Jesus Chirst, you just laid out the Mother Of All Bullshit Proclamations.




Dude just shut the fuck up already. I've seen people sell their mother for a sale, I had a sales job I could've been making 100k a year. I turned it down, I didn't like it, and the money was great but so fucking what.

You swear you know saying shit like "don't insult our intelligence saying you are above money." What the hell would you spend a billion dollars on? Honestly, 500 houses and you only stay in 13 most of the time, 15 planes and you only fly one? Well we know one thing is for sure about you, if you had a billion you wouldn't spend $900,000,000 of it feeding starving children in Somalia. You are a greedy SOB, you might as well just say "I'd love to have a billion, I don't care about anybody"

Well the truth is, I don't care about anybody either, I don't give two fucks. Therefore I'd HATE to have a billion dollars when I could just have 10 mil. I had a billion I'd get nothing but phone calls from people asking me to invest in things, companies constantly calling me to market me sell me stock or get me to invest in some company or try and take my current company public into some IPO. I am starting to think you have NO IDEA what that life would be like. Also, you wouldn't have friends, only people pretending to be friends to use you for shit.

No thank you I'd be happy with just $5 or $6 mil all together. Just enough to do whatever the hell I'd like and yet be left alone whenever the hell I wanted. We sure know a lot more about you though now, if you had all that cash, you'd be spoiled more then the King of Aladdin of Cashmere you'd have all the jets and gold and furniture and roller coaster rides you wanted, and yet you'd STILL be wining and crying about paying people $8 an hour instead of $7 :laugh2:


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: imachavel]
    #19356310 - 01/01/14 09:28 PM (10 years, 29 days ago)



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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: psyconaught]
    #19359577 - 01/02/14 04:51 PM (10 years, 28 days ago)

Quote:

psyconaught said:





:lol: I guess so, maybe I should wish the world was fair and no one would consider a minimum wage. Our minimum wage could be non existent, and our country like like Somalia I mean just fantastic :trollmove:






































































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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: imachavel]
    #19359611 - 01/02/14 04:56 PM (10 years, 28 days ago)

The world is not fair.  It isn't supposed to be fair and I think I'm willing to let the idiocracy raise minimum wage to whatever the fuck they want.  Knock yourself out.  I am old and about this much away from washing my hands of the entire lot of you.


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: imachavel]
    #19359628 - 01/02/14 04:59 PM (10 years, 28 days ago)

hahahaha yep if we got rid of the minimum wage we'd become Somalia. You sure about that? You know what countries don't have minimum wages? The nordic ones, Norway, Sweden, Finland, etc. They rely on bargaining between the workers and the employers. I disagree with most of the socialist policies in those countries but a lack of minimum wage is one i absolutely agree with.


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: psyconaught]
    #19359686 - 01/02/14 05:10 PM (10 years, 28 days ago)

China has a minimum wage, .75 to $1.50 per hour in most areas, why so low?  Excess pool of labor.

Why is the minimum wage when adjusted for inflation at a all-time low (since 1938) today in the US?  Excess pool of labor.

Why were real wages growing so strong after WW 2 in the US? More demand for unskilled/skilled labor relative to supply, but since globalization started in the 1980's, the demand for US labor has continued to drop.


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: qman]
    #19359808 - 01/02/14 05:31 PM (10 years, 28 days ago)

Has the demand for labor dropped or has the distaste among bratty American mediocrities to accept laborious jobs increased?  There's no shortage of border jumping scum willing to take the jobs.  American slackers would rather couch surf than work.


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: zappaisgod]
    #19360448 - 01/02/14 07:50 PM (10 years, 28 days ago)

Quote:

zappaisgod said:..
Has the demand for labor dropped or has the distaste among bratty American mediocrities to accept laborious jobs increased?  There's no shortage of border jumping scum willing to take the jobs.  American slackers would rather couch surf than work.




both, however the latter is insult to injury. Stings bad


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: myc_check1212]
    #19362046 - 01/03/14 03:59 AM (10 years, 28 days ago)

Maybe it's just a concept to me that is beyond what most people think. That to me is the concept that I can never imagine a "poor person" owning a business that so many people seem to have this view of a business owner as being poor or something that he has to pay people an extra $1 an hour and the guy is like



To me the concept is like I go around doing landscaping just me and my van and tools. One day I realize I'm making enough and could use help to expedite the process and hire people. I feel at this point a person is wealthy enough and prepared to pay people whatever it takes. This was normal when I was a little kid a business owner was not a "poor person" even if they struggled they ever went belly up or not. Of course a minimum wage of going from $7 to $17 would destroy someone but I've never heard of such a ridiculous thing. Everyone now has this mentality of like crying for people over their losses considering they own so much more then everyone else. It just blows me away :laugh2:

I feel things have changed so much since I was younger. Hell when I was 17 I could walk in anywhere and get a job I could have probably worked for a week quit and gotten a job somewhere else and kept applying and kept quitting and kept working different places every week. Now I can't imagine coming close to finding work by the day or work by the week or work by the month. And back in the day no one cried over rich peoples losses. I can't believe how much the world has changed, hell in the 80s my mom worked at a jewelry store making $14 an hour and the minimum wage by where we were was $4 something an hour back then and no one thought it was weird she was making that much she just told everyone "the owner really appreciates me."

I also don't think anyone would have said "she couldn't have gotten that job if the entry level was $9." I don't see why not she got paid that much almost right off the bat just because she knew a lot about jewelry and had previous experience. I don't cry for people who can't afford to pay who they hire enough I find that people who operate a business should be extremely competent I'm always complaining that in this country there aren't enough business owners not enough entrepreneurs but maybe I'm wrong maybe there are too many business owners that the world gets together and has a little cry baby fest over the cost of labour as though metals will be traded based on cost of labour now not based on demand. Has anyone ever seen GOLD go down because of minimum wage laws? :rolleyes: I mean come on give me a break


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: zappaisgod]
    #19362060 - 01/03/14 04:09 AM (10 years, 28 days ago)

Quote:

zappaisgod said:
Has the demand for labor dropped or has the distaste among bratty American mediocrities to accept laborious jobs increased?  There's no shortage of border jumping scum willing to take the jobs.  American slackers would rather couch surf than work.




but how is this relevant to minimum wage? Once upon a time the $2.50 or whatever that Americans were making was equivalent to like $9 an hour now considering the cheap cost of everything else a house could easily be bought for under 100k in a crowded city and a good house too. What corroboration is there that minimum wage has effected America's work ethic at all? Perhaps if it has in any way, it's that spoiled American kids go out and work, make basically fucking nothing, and realize it's easier to get free cash from their parents then go out and work all fucking day for $56, and then get taxed 25%, and take home less then $45 for the day.

Of course yes compared to other countries our spoiled rotten children are lucky. But when college kids realize that daddy got a job his first year out of college and bought a house a few years later in his time and they have personally been a graduate for 4 years now and can't find shit besides temp intern positions and are flipping burgers, they realize their successful parents are easier to live with and take advantage of and their work is completely unappreciated so why try? I mean if raising the M W .50 fucking cents creates a stronger spending consumer, then by all means I say fucking do it. But we all know this isn't the problem with the economy, is businesses losing money because of consumer spending. That's 100% bullshit billionaires are richer now then ever in history. This is just a numbers game, and to me complaining about a few peons getting an extra quarter an hour just shows pure ignorance about what side of the game the people are winning on the numbers

:facepalm: what's next a story about how our economy is going to get weaker compared to Russia post communist and countries like China and Cuba still fairly pro communist in mentality because of minimum wage raises?

Also, all those countries in Europe that have no minimum wage that people praise so much? They are all BROKE AS SHIT and EXTREMELY socialist dependent like 40% of the population depends on welfare. How can that be used as a positive example?


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: imachavel] * 1
    #19362364 - 01/03/14 08:02 AM (10 years, 28 days ago)

Quote:

imachavel said:
Quote:

zappaisgod said:
Has the demand for labor dropped or has the distaste among bratty American mediocrities to accept laborious jobs increased?  There's no shortage of border jumping scum willing to take the jobs.  American slackers would rather couch surf than work.




but how is this relevant to minimum wage?




Because it explains the market.  I'm going to say this again.  If you are in your mid twenties and have been in the work force for more than a year and minimum wage is a relevant concern of yours you are a complete fucking loser
Quote:

Once upon a time the $2.50 or whatever that Americans were making was equivalent to like $9 an hour now considering the cheap cost of everything else a house could easily be bought for under 100k in a crowded city and a good house too.




You can still buy a house for 100K.
Quote:

What corroboration is there that minimum wage has effected America's work ethic at all?




I didn't say it did.
Quote:

Perhaps if it has in any way, it's that spoiled American kids go out and work, make basically fucking nothing, and realize it's easier to get free cash from their parents then go out and work all fucking day for $56, and then get taxed 25%, and take home less then $45 for the day.

Of course yes compared to other countries our spoiled rotten children are lucky. But when college kids realize that daddy got a job his first year out of college and bought a house a few years later in his time and they have personally been a graduate for 4 years now and can't find shit besides temp intern positions and are flipping burgers, they realize their successful parents are easier to live with and take advantage of and their work is completely unappreciated so why try?




Why try?  Why not just kill themselves?
Quote:

I mean if raising the M W .50 fucking cents creates a stronger spending consumer, then by all means I say fucking do it.




It doesn't.  Why not just smash windows so you can fix them?
Quote:

But we all know this isn't the problem with the economy, is businesses losing money because of consumer spending. That's 100% bullshit billionaires are richer now then ever in history. This is just a numbers game, and to me complaining about a few peons getting an extra quarter an hour just shows pure ignorance about what side of the game the people are winning on the numbers.




Raising the minimum wage will raise prices for poor peons
Quote:



:facepalm: what's next a story about how our economy is going to get weaker compared to Russia post communist and countries like China and Cuba still fairly pro communist in mentality because of minimum wage raises?




More :flowstone: from you. 
Quote:



Also, all those countries in Europe that have no minimum wage that people praise so much? They are all BROKE AS SHIT and EXTREMELY socialist dependent like 40% of the population depends on welfare. How can that be used as a positive example?




You really need to find a way to make a living.


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: zappaisgod]
    #19362383 - 01/03/14 08:12 AM (10 years, 28 days ago)

Funny how on one forum over there, people are talking about how fungus brings people together, how we are essentially the same, and here we see how they can tear each other apart. Money. Awesome.


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: Blue Shaman]
    #19362390 - 01/03/14 08:14 AM (10 years, 28 days ago)

Perhaps that's because, despite the Kumbayah crap, we are not all the same.


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You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: Blue Shaman]
    #19362422 - 01/03/14 08:28 AM (10 years, 28 days ago)

Quote:

Blue Shaman said:
Funny how on one forum over there, people are talking about how fungus brings people together, how we are essentially the same, and here we see how they can tear each other apart. Money. Awesome.



What forum is that?


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: imachavel]
    #19362495 - 01/03/14 09:02 AM (10 years, 28 days ago)

Socialism is the reason they're broke.


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: myc_check1212]
    #19362694 - 01/03/14 10:13 AM (10 years, 28 days ago)

If the state provides a floor there are too many people who will accept it as a comfortable place to sleep.


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: Blue Shaman]
    #19363135 - 01/03/14 12:11 PM (10 years, 27 days ago)

Quote:

Blue Shaman said:
Funny how on one forum over there, people are talking about how fungus brings people together, how we are essentially the same, and here we see how they can tear each other apart. Money. Awesome.




The market brings people together too.


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: zappaisgod]
    #19363637 - 01/03/14 02:14 PM (10 years, 27 days ago)

Quote:

zappaisgod said:
If the state provides a floor there are too many people who will accept it as a comfortable place to sleep.




fucking truth!


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Offlineimachavel
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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: zappaisgod]
    #19363948 - 01/03/14 03:33 PM (10 years, 27 days ago)

Quote:

zappaisgod said:
Quote:

imachavel said:
Quote:

zappaisgod said:
Has the demand for labor dropped or has the distaste among bratty American mediocrities to accept laborious jobs increased?  There's no shortage of border jumping scum willing to take the jobs.  American slackers would rather couch surf than work.




but how is this relevant to minimum wage?




you are a complete fucking loser.




:lolwut: yeah no kidding read it more often it's good for you to hear :shrug:


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #19371497 - 01/05/14 06:16 AM (10 years, 26 days ago)

Quote:

luvdemshrooms said:
Perhaps that's because, despite the Kumbayah crap, we are not all the same.




Do you not need to eat, shit and breathe? Do you not long for love? Do you not want to be respected and treated justly? Do you not want to be free?

Of course people are not all the same. Not everyone is white, black, rich, poor, greedy, needy, whatever superficial quality you can think of.
But on a fundamental level, we are all humans, all have needs and desires and fears. This is what is meant with "we are all equal".


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: Lord_McLovin]
    #19378149 - 01/06/14 05:10 PM (10 years, 24 days ago)

You know what amazes me when people argue about things such as minimum wage? Let me come up with an example on what I think of capitalism:

let's say I have a business and I create a product and it costs me .90 cents to create this product. Right? And I realize I can make TONS of money if enough people show up and buy my product, so I sell it for $5, since that is what everyone else is selling it for. One day, I've attracted tons and tons of customers, and in theoretical make believe land, the next day 1 million people show up, and buy my product $5 each, not caring because hey what's $5 for a great drink/sandwich/installation whatever. So in my rational mind, if that happened, I would be SOOOO happy these customers showed up, because without them I'd be a completely useless business. They are everything the customers are the life blood of the business, and they just showed up and spent $5 million on my great product, and since making a million products cost me $900,000 then I just made $4.1 million. Now to show these customers how much I appreciate them, in my rationale, I would the next day make the product cost $1.00, and if a million people showed up again, I'd make $100,000 that next day. So what if I'm spending a lot, I get ingredients/materials/supplies etc. from tons of different distributors, so it's like we are all making money, and besides I'm making $100,000 a week.

But this is not the reality of capitalism. In reality a capitalist doesn't give two flying fucks about his customers. They are ants to him in his pawn scheme. So what the capitalist would do to show appreciation towards his customers, is the next day instead of lowering the $5 to $1.00 to bring in more customers, he would CAPITALIZE on the customers he already had. He would raise the price to $10.00 for one product, then $15.00, then $20.00, then before you know it he would charge whatever he could get people to pay.

Now when the minimum wage goes up, these ass holes who couldn't give a shit less about dip shit customer A who is dumb enough to go pay more for what he likes because he loves what he buys so much, are now forced to pay more. They have all the power in the world, and now have to pay more. In fact speaking of people who make a lot of money, a person painting a house these days generally charges $35 an hour. I've seen it most people charge over $200 a day when painting a house they make often on one job $1400 $1700 $2000 $2300 etc. So it's not just like BILLIONAIRES pay out. Now all the sudden these people have to pay a LITTLE bit more, and yet you get these droves of people who come in complaining that the free market and capitalism that drives our country is being destroyed, prices are going to go up :rolleyes:(yeah, all the sudden, because right now things are cheap), and oh my god the free market will be destroyed

:lolwut: what a bunch of bullshit. I mean honestly I can't believe the people who swallow this shit. And to be honest, when only one class has all the money, it hurts other business, namely the small business. If Bill and Melinda Gates are the only people who go out and spend good cash every night, then only the finest steak house in Grenich Connecticut is going to have customers and business. But on the other hand, if EVERYONE in the country has an extra $100 to spend at the end of the week, then little Joe shit shack down the street that sells cheap $2.00 burgers but doesn't attract the wealthy crowd because he doesn't have marble pillars holding up the place and oak desks and a waiting list will suddenly have TONS of people going to spend on great cheap burgers.

WHO IS GOING TO LOSE?????

I mean really :facepalm: in a world of philosophy where the minimum wage goes up to $17 an hour all the sudden no one can afford to pay employees etc. etc. OBVIOUSLY it's going to disturb the free market. But raising it $1 an hour to keep up with a level of inflation and setting a wage that frankly probably would have benefited everyone 20 years ago is NOT GOING TO HURT CAPITALISM. Your precious capitalism won't be damaged. And if it makes you feel any better, I'm sure dish washers will still be the poorest people in existence next week. So if you feel wrongly about un motivated people who refuse to go to school and better themselves with fancier educations and careers and employment living more comfortably, well I doubt they will get much from a minimum wage increase :smirk:

As said a minimum wage raise won't change much but it will make life SLIGHTLY EASIER for the lowest class and balance spending in terms of who spends where what economically a little bit.


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: imachavel] * 1
    #19378164 - 01/06/14 05:16 PM (10 years, 24 days ago)

what do you think happens when the cost of doing business goes up for a company/business? One of three things will happen:

A) They cannot continue to afford to do business and they shut down

B) They fire employees to make up for the higher cost

C) They increase the cost of their goods/services to make up for the cost


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: psyconaught]
    #19378230 - 01/06/14 05:29 PM (10 years, 24 days ago)

Quote:

psyconaught said:
what do you think happens when the cost of doing business goes up for a company/business? One of three things will happen:

A) They cannot continue to afford to do business and they shut down

B) They fire employees to make up for the higher cost

C) They increase the cost of their goods/services to make up for the cost




D) Their profit margins come down and life goes on as usual.


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: qman] * 2
    #19378257 - 01/06/14 05:34 PM (10 years, 24 days ago)

a vast majority of small business's operate at extremely small margins as it is. They cannot afford to lower their margins any more. All you think about when you talk about min. wage increases are large corporations. And i agree they would be able to absorb the costs easily, which is why WalMart suppers a minimum wage hike, they know that they can absorb the cost and go about business as usual, however mom and pop shops cannot, thus putting their competition out of business.


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: psyconaught]
    #19378436 - 01/06/14 06:04 PM (10 years, 24 days ago)

Quote:

psyconaught said:
a vast majority of small business's operate at extremely small margins as it is. They cannot afford to lower their margins any more. All you think about when you talk about min. wage increases are large corporations. And i agree they would be able to absorb the costs easily, which is why WalMart suppers a minimum wage hike, they know that they can absorb the cost and go about business as usual, however mom and pop shops cannot, thus putting their competition out of business.




Even with minimum wage at a all-time low in real terms, it would most likely hurt some small business owners if they hiked it, but what does that tell us?   

It says that the general economy is weak, when there is decent economic prosperity taking place, hiking the minimum wage 10% makes little difference, but if there is no real growth taking place, yes I agree it can make a difference.


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: psyconaught]
    #19378585 - 01/06/14 06:28 PM (10 years, 24 days ago)

Quote:

psyconaught said:
what do you think happens when the cost of doing business goes up for a company/business? One of three things will happen:

A) They cannot continue to afford to do business and they shut down

B) They fire employees to make up for the higher cost

C) They increase the cost of their goods/services to make up for the cost




This is all bullshit in any reality besides the perspective of theory.

Any business that is paying people $7 an hour, let's say two people. Let's say this business pays each of two people $7 an hour and also $1 an hour for lease plus $1 an hour in general cost of production plus $1 an hour miscellaneous. So hiring two employees plus an extra $3 an hour would add up to $10 an hour.

So let's say this business made JUST ENOUGH to break even. That's means each year they would have to make 17x8x5x4x12, which comes out to:

$32,640 a year just to break even. So let's say the business made $35,000 a year and had a $2460 a year profit margin :facepalm: :lol: I'm trying so hard not to laugh at what a joke a business owner who makes about 3k a year is, but for the example if the minimum wage went up to $8 now the business would be running at $19 an hour instead of $17 an hour. Ok so let's add that up same way 19x8x5x4x12 comes out to

$36,480 a year it costs to run the business instead of $32,640. So now instead of the owner making a $2460 a year profit he is now $1480 a year in debt. So upon this theoretical basis, if a business owner has to pay a higher minimum wage, it hurts his business. Now here is another question for you

what type of retard business owner who can't deal with a $4000 a year increase because his profit is less then each employee makes on his own, and is too stupid and incompetent to run a better business, should have the privilege of owning a business

if you were a bank, would you give a loan to an idiot profiting 4k a year? Let me give you a hint, I know this as a fact actually. Most lenders require a business to make 100k a year before giving them a loan, and at least 30k a year I know definitely is the minimum. Why??? Because if a chump makes 50k a year, and takes home 25k a year(because it's not all profit), do you actually think anyone is going to loan to someone that makes a basic living enough for food rent and insurance?

Now on that side of the argument, you are saying if the owner made more but paid less in wages, he would be more likely to be approved for a loan because he would take home more, and could expand his business. Well certainly, IF the minimum wage was going to go up to $17 an hour, I would certainly agree that is hurts everyone economically. But from my side of the fence, I see people who run businesses as incompetent as the employees themselves and not necessarily more skilled or qualified. Why? Because of what you are arguing. You are arguing that a business owner has more skill and is therefore worth more then the base pay of all his employees put together.

Well in that case if the guy is skilled and competent, and I owned a bank, I wouldn't want some jack ass coming to me asking for a loan, that I know would lose just TONS AND TONS of money if he had to pay an extra $1 an hour in wages to his employees. That to me would suck, I would only want to lend to PRIME clients. Not idiots, but prime clients as people who would return a loan with interest. So these wages to me creating harder to run businesses shows the incompetence of business owners.

In theory, a higher wage would make negotiating a higher wage by first getting your foot in the door at base wage harder to do. But this country is run by reality, not bullshit philosophy. If that philosophy was true, then minimum wage wouldn't matter, because as it is it's such a joke that NO HONEST EMPLOYEE would ever have to negotiate such a low honest living at such a low wage. Really, there is a reason minimum wage exists, because if employers negotiated fairly, there would be no such thing


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: qman]
    #19378597 - 01/06/14 06:31 PM (10 years, 24 days ago)

Quote:

qman said:
Quote:

psyconaught said:
a vast majority of small business's operate at extremely small margins as it is. They cannot afford to lower their margins any more. All you think about when you talk about min. wage increases are large corporations. And i agree they would be able to absorb the costs easily, which is why WalMart suppers a minimum wage hike, they know that they can absorb the cost and go about business as usual, however mom and pop shops cannot, thus putting their competition out of business.




Even with minimum wage at a all-time low in real terms, it would most likely hurt some small business owners if they hiked it, but what does that tell us?   

It says that the general economy is weak, when there is decent economic prosperity taking place, hiking the minimum wage 10% makes little difference, but if there is no real growth taking place, yes I agree it can make a difference.




exactly. Mom and pop owners don't profit from wealthy individuals. Wealthy individuals go to more expensive planes. Mom and pop owners profit from the dinner bucket crowd. The dinner bucket crowd spends more when wages are higher. There is nothing about what psychonaut argues to me that makes sense in any other way then theory. In theory that is true at $17 an hour mom and pop go out of business. But I'm not arguing theory I'm arguing reality


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Edited by imachavel (01/06/14 06:31 PM)


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Offlinepsyconaught
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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: imachavel] * 1
    #19378865 - 01/06/14 07:19 PM (10 years, 24 days ago)

Your math at the beginning showed me i don't need to take the rest of your post seriously.

Quote:

Any business that is paying people $7 an hour, let's say two people. Let's say this business pays each of two people $7 an hour and also $1 an hour for lease plus $1 an hour in general cost of production plus $1 an hour miscellaneous. So hiring two employees plus an extra $3 an hour would add up to $10 an hour.

So let's say this business made JUST ENOUGH to break even. That's means each year they would have to make 17x8x5x4x12, which comes out to:

$32,640




Two employees = $26,880 a year in payroll (realistically much higher due to associated costs of having employees)

$1 an hour for lease? Are you fucking kidding me? Using a 40 hour work week that comes out to $160 a month, good luck finding commercial space for that price :lol: even if you run it 24 hours a day it comes out to 760 a month, which is just slightly less asinine.

$1 an hour for production is both a gross overgeneralization AND completely unrealistic (and you attempt to lecture me on what the "real world" is :rolleyes:)

Your obviously lack of any real knowledge on associated costs with running a business is painfully obvious. So before you determine what a business owner should and shouldn't be capable of why don't you gain some more experience.


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: qman]
    #19378876 - 01/06/14 07:20 PM (10 years, 24 days ago)

Quote:

qman said:
Quote:

psyconaught said:
a vast majority of small business's operate at extremely small margins as it is. They cannot afford to lower their margins any more. All you think about when you talk about min. wage increases are large corporations. And i agree they would be able to absorb the costs easily, which is why WalMart suppers a minimum wage hike, they know that they can absorb the cost and go about business as usual, however mom and pop shops cannot, thus putting their competition out of business.




Even with minimum wage at a all-time low in real terms, it would most likely hurt some small business owners if they hiked it, but what does that tell us?   

It says that the general economy is weak, when there is decent economic prosperity taking place, hiking the minimum wage 10% makes little difference, but if there is no real growth taking place, yes I agree it can make a difference.



the economy is improved by more people working and production taking place. Hiking the minimum wage discourages both.


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: psyconaught]
    #19379059 - 01/06/14 07:55 PM (10 years, 24 days ago)

Quote:

psyconaught said:
Quote:

qman said:
Quote:

psyconaught said:
a vast majority of small business's operate at extremely small margins as it is. They cannot afford to lower their margins any more. All you think about when you talk about min. wage increases are large corporations. And i agree they would be able to absorb the costs easily, which is why WalMart suppers a minimum wage hike, they know that they can absorb the cost and go about business as usual, however mom and pop shops cannot, thus putting their competition out of business.




Even with minimum wage at a all-time low in real terms, it would most likely hurt some small business owners if they hiked it, but what does that tell us?   

It says that the general economy is weak, when there is decent economic prosperity taking place, hiking the minimum wage 10% makes little difference, but if there is no real growth taking place, yes I agree it can make a difference.



the economy is improved by more people working and production taking place. Hiking the minimum wage discourages both.




If you are suggesting that eliminating the minimum wage would drastically improve the current economic environment, I would disagree. 

When a economy has been structurally damaged like the US has the last 20 years, things like the minimum wage are pretty meaningless at the end of the day.


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: qman]
    #19379201 - 01/06/14 08:18 PM (10 years, 24 days ago)

At this point i would just see the federal minimum wage disappear completely. If states/cities wanted to create one for their specific region that'd be fine. However to norm the cost of living across the country is ridiculous in my opinion.


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: psyconaught]
    #19380081 - 01/06/14 11:09 PM (10 years, 24 days ago)

Quote:

psyconaught said:
Your math at the beginning showed me i don't need to take the rest of your post seriously.

Quote:

Any business that is paying people $7 an hour, let's say two people. Let's say this business pays each of two people $7 an hour and also $1 an hour for lease plus $1 an hour in general cost of production plus $1 an hour miscellaneous. So hiring two employees plus an extra $3 an hour would add up to $10 an hour.

So let's say this business made JUST ENOUGH to break even. That's means each year they would have to make 17x8x5x4x12, which comes out to:

$32,640






Your obviously lack of any real knowledge on associated costs with running a business is painfully obvious. So before you determine what a business owner should and shouldn't be capable of why don't you gain some more experience.





You completely missed the point. But that's alright this is probably the most informed post you've made out of all the asinine horse shit you've repeated over and over again about how much business experience everyone lacks that apparently you have etc. Basically you made my point even stronger. Lease is much more then $1 an hour so therefore it'd make even less of a difference to the over head raising the minimum wage $1 an hour for each employee. But that's for magnifying my point by correcting me.


Amazing how much your "business experience" has taught you. What did you say you do again? Graphic design html css sitting on apache sql php? And you say you make 60k a year? And are lecturing me on a business with lease and tax and regulations and utilities and are STILL trying to convince me how much raising the minimum wage by $1 an hour will GREATLY EFFECT small business? Wow you are astounding me with your experience. By the way if I had a nickel for every time I met a web designer that claimed they make over 50k a year doing web sites, man I'd have the money to start all the business that could easily start paying people at over $7 an hour. You SWEAR you make that much doing web sites. Web developers at best make 40k a year, unless of course you do other server writing such as java or what not, you are totally full of shit.


Your argument about minimum wage at $9 or whatever you are :crying: about is so full of holes it's not even funny. I'm just going to put it basic, since you know so much about running a business. The fact of the matter is plainly: running a business isn't easy


that is why not everybody does it. If it was easy everyone would do it. When it comes down to it, you need to have money prepared, and invest it, and take your time, deal with people, watch it grow or not grow, and continue to deal with it, and possibly blow a lot of what you have saved before seeing any progress. Not ONLY do you have to pay for a lease, license, llc unless you don't care about liability at the point you have it, probably a lawyer, you probably have to sign a 5 year lease at that for a lot, as most people who want to lease a lot don't give someone an option for just 1 year.


You might also have to deal with advertising, finding some goon to do a web site that claims he makes 60k a year, etc. or newspaper ads, craigslist, or whatever maybe not. EVEN IF it will be just you running the business, you probably need a van, sign on the van, pay for a lot of gas, etc. plus your time and rent etc. is added to all of that in reality, tools if needed, PLUS the most important thing:


a list of clients. Even if you are just mowing lawns, you still need to know 15 people who wants their lawns mowed. Now then you add employees etc. and all the money you had to spend already, just pretty much swimming in debt or at least drowning on the concept of breaking even or profiting at least a few dollars because a business that breaks even doesn't profit for the owner because he has his rent etc. etc. etc.


After all that, you have hired a few people, and are completely competent, pay them things are going well customers keep coming back etc. And suddenly you find out you have to pay each employee an extra $1 an hour. And you start crying like a helpless 6 year old. Doesn't sound like a business owner to me, also doesn't sound like a scenario presented by someone with TONS OF BUSINESS EXPERIENCE THAT CAN IMMEDIATELY BULLSHIT.... ERR... I MEAN RECOGNIZE THAT SOMEONE ELSE HAS NONE





:urinate: yeah................. right





can you make one good compelling argument that you didn't just copy and paste off the internet that someone else thought for you? The last few things you said to me while really absurd at least sounded original. Can you make a good argument without just copy pasting what every other retard incoherent republican has tried to throw at people like a little kid throwing food every time they don't get their way? I mean honestly you want to know why a complete idiot like Obama won? Look at Romney and all the other idiots following him around regurgitating the same old horse shit over and over and over again and see if a TWO YEAR OLD couldn't win. I don't even know why I'm replying to you any more. You have proven nothing to me, aside from repeating the same old boring arguments over and over and over again "blah blah minimum wage hurts competitive business blah blah prices go up blah blah the cost of over head of wages is so ridiculous but blah blah you are wrong about the cost of lease, it's much more expensive then you made it seem in your modest argument, blah blah but still an extra dollar blah blah"


You know what happens if people buy floor and don't like $8 a square foot floor? they buy somewhere else, for $5 a square foot. Oh wait that's right you can't lower a MINIMUM WAGE from $8 to $5 :smirk: oh well it's like multiplying square footage of floor I guess if you have 3000 square feet and can't pay for $5 a sf instead of $8 sf then you are paying $24000 for all the floor instead of $1500.


But you know what? Before you say "you just made my point" I'm going to repeat what I said in principle earlier. "poor people don't have the luxury or owning a property with 3000 square foot interior"


Once again you are throwing regurgitated philosophy into a conversation with the "theory" that higher wages will hurt prices against the REALITY that those are just excuses for rich people to make more money. The truth is no "poor" business man will get hurt from minimum wage raises, "poor" business men don't own businesses with lot locations etc. that get hurt by such a small percentage of annual increase. Small business people who do contracting etc. fix air conditioners, landscaping, repairs remodelling etc. guess what they don't claim a lot of pay checks they get paid in cash and get away with whatever they want if you they offer a guy $25 he takes it and otherwise just doesn't do the job. And funny enough in those situation most people make $100 a day


:lolwut: your business experience is just astounding me brah, can you come up with anything original or just going to repeat the same cliche phrases you read on some Republican dip tards web site hoping the 50th time you say it in a row someone finally just changes their mind? :whocares:


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: qman]
    #19380091 - 01/06/14 11:11 PM (10 years, 24 days ago)

Quote:

qman said:
Quote:

psyconaught said:
Quote:

qman said:
Quote:

psyconaught said:
a vast majority of small business's operate at extremely small margins as it is. They cannot afford to lower their margins any more. All you think about when you talk about min. wage increases are large corporations. And i agree they would be able to absorb the costs easily, which is why WalMart suppers a minimum wage hike, they know that they can absorb the cost and go about business as usual, however mom and pop shops cannot, thus putting their competition out of business.




Even with minimum wage at a all-time low in real terms, it would most likely hurt some small business owners if they hiked it, but what does that tell us?   

It says that the general economy is weak, when there is decent economic prosperity taking place, hiking the minimum wage 10% makes little difference, but if there is no real growth taking place, yes I agree it can make a difference.



the economy is improved by more people working and production taking place. Hiking the minimum wage discourages both.




If you are suggesting that eliminating the minimum wage would drastically improve the current economic environment, I would disagree. 

When a economy has been structurally damaged like the US has the last 20 years, things like the minimum wage are pretty meaningless at the end of the day.




He hasn't shown a single shred of proof to back up that claim that the economy will improve without a minimum wage. Just repeated statements of theory he read from other people. Incidentally my last post was very long :lol: why couldn't I sum that up easier? Can you take it apart and see what I'm confronting him on though?


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: psyconaught]
    #19380100 - 01/06/14 11:14 PM (10 years, 24 days ago)

Quote:

psyconaught said:
At this point i would just see the federal minimum wage disappear completely. If states/cities wanted to create one for their specific region that'd be fine. However to norm the cost of living across the country is ridiculous in my opinion.




yet you still can't prove that has anything to do with minimum wage? No direct relevance to high costs can be made. Considering in the last 30 years the M W has barely gone up a few dollars and yet you claim this has relevance to constant cost rises. There is no relevance. Cost rises are because of supply and demand. So why keep recycling the same nonsense argument you have been making since you started balling over this wage hike that hasn't occurred yet


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: imachavel] * 1
    #19380199 - 01/06/14 11:42 PM (10 years, 24 days ago)

I never said i make 60k a year doing web design. I do a multitude of things, my main source of income is being a partner in a silicon valley software consultancy. With some of my own projects on the side.

Can you show a single sentence of mine that has been copied and pasted? No? Otherwise stop making shit up. Thanks in advance.

Oh and btw i don't identify with the republicans, they are just as bought and paid for as the democrats, identifying with either party is asinine in my opinion.


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: imachavel] * 1
    #19380652 - 01/07/14 02:05 AM (10 years, 24 days ago)

Quote:

imachavel said:
You know what amazes me when people argue about things such as minimum wage? Let me come up with an example on what I think of capitalism:

let's say I have a business and I create a product and it costs me .90 cents to create this product. Right? And I realize I can make TONS of money if enough people show up and buy my product, so I sell it for $5, since that is what everyone else is selling it for. One day, I've attracted tons and tons of customers, and in theoretical make believe land, the next day 1 million people show up, and buy my product $5 each, not caring because hey what's $5 for a great drink/sandwich/installation whatever. So in my rational mind, if that happened, I would be SOOOO happy these customers showed up, because without them I'd be a completely useless business. They are everything the customers are the life blood of the business, and they just showed up and spent $5 million on my great product, and since making a million products cost me $900,000 then I just made $4.1 million. Now to show these customers how much I appreciate them, in my rationale, I would the next day make the product cost $1.00, and if a million people showed up again, I'd make $100,000 that next day. So what if I'm spending a lot, I get ingredients/materials/supplies etc. from tons of different distributors, so it's like we are all making money, and besides I'm making $100,000 a week.

But this is not the reality of capitalism. In reality a capitalist doesn't give two flying fucks about his customers. They are ants to him in his pawn scheme. So what the capitalist would do to show appreciation towards his customers, is the next day instead of lowering the $5 to $1.00 to bring in more customers, he would CAPITALIZE on the customers he already had. He would raise the price to $10.00 for one product, then $15.00, then $20.00, then before you know it he would charge whatever he could get people to pay.

Now when the minimum wage goes up, these ass holes who couldn't give a shit less about dip shit customer A who is dumb enough to go pay more for what he likes because he loves what he buys so much, are now forced to pay more. They have all the power in the world, and now have to pay more. In fact speaking of people who make a lot of money, a person painting a house these days generally charges $35 an hour. I've seen it most people charge over $200 a day when painting a house they make often on one job $1400 $1700 $2000 $2300 etc. So it's not just like BILLIONAIRES pay out. Now all the sudden these people have to pay a LITTLE bit more, and yet you get these droves of people who come in complaining that the free market and capitalism that drives our country is being destroyed, prices are going to go up :rolleyes:(yeah, all the sudden, because right now things are cheap), and oh my god the free market will be destroyed

:lolwut: what a bunch of bullshit. I mean honestly I can't believe the people who swallow this shit. And to be honest, when only one class has all the money, it hurts other business, namely the small business. If Bill and Melinda Gates are the only people who go out and spend good cash every night, then only the finest steak house in Grenich Connecticut is going to have customers and business. But on the other hand, if EVERYONE in the country has an extra $100 to spend at the end of the week, then little Joe shit shack down the street that sells cheap $2.00 burgers but doesn't attract the wealthy crowd because he doesn't have marble pillars holding up the place and oak desks and a waiting list will suddenly have TONS of people going to spend on great cheap burgers.

WHO IS GOING TO LOSE?????

I mean really :facepalm: in a world of philosophy where the minimum wage goes up to $17 an hour all the sudden no one can afford to pay employees etc. etc. OBVIOUSLY it's going to disturb the free market. But raising it $1 an hour to keep up with a level of inflation and setting a wage that frankly probably would have benefited everyone 20 years ago is NOT GOING TO HURT CAPITALISM. Your precious capitalism won't be damaged. And if it makes you feel any better, I'm sure dish washers will still be the poorest people in existence next week. So if you feel wrongly about un motivated people who refuse to go to school and better themselves with fancier educations and careers and employment living more comfortably, well I doubt they will get much from a minimum wage increase :smirk:

As said a minimum wage raise won't change much but it will make life SLIGHTLY EASIER for the lowest class and balance spending in terms of who spends where what economically a little bit.





Your ignorance of economics is without peer on this forum.  Your post shows you know absolutely nothing about supply and demand curves, price elasticity, market value, profit margins, or any of the other plethora of concepts that are the reason a business owner sells a product at a certain price.

you whine about 'dumb people who pay high prices' well why the shit do you care.  They pay what they think the product is worth to them.  They don't have to buy the product but they do.  And people who who work for shit wages do so by their own choice. 

You need to learn something about economics before you go posting this fucking nonsense drivel.

face it--you are butthurt envious about people who make money.  sorry you can't hack it and make more money yourself for whatever reason.  you should either learn to do something that will make you money, but if you don't care about making money just suck it up and live on a minimal income because that's your choice.  But don't badmouth everyone who tries to do better for themselves because you choose not to.

you sound like a little punk who just took it up the ass from a downs syndrome idiot in the county jail because you don't have the balls to stand up for yourself. 

Jesus christ man, grow a pair and quit fucking crying and blaming the world because your situation is shit.  And if you are happy with your situation then don't try to drag everyone else into your little sphere of butthurt.


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: starfire_xes]
    #19381451 - 01/07/14 09:18 AM (10 years, 24 days ago)

Vanity to the max right here ^.


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: starfire_xes]
    #19381895 - 01/07/14 11:14 AM (10 years, 23 days ago)

Quote:

starfire_xes said:
Quote:

imachavel said:
You know what amazes me when people argue about things such as minimum wage? Let me come up with an example on what I think of capitalism:

let's say I have a business and I create a product and it costs me .90 cents to create this product. Right? And I realize I can make TONS of money if enough people show up and buy my product, so I sell it for $5, since that is what everyone else is selling it for. One day, I've attracted tons and tons of customers, and in theoretical make believe land, the next day 1 million people show up, and buy my product $5 each, not caring because hey what's $5 for a great drink/sandwich/installation whatever. So in my rational mind, if that happened, I would be SOOOO happy these customers showed up, because without them I'd be a completely useless business. They are everything the customers are the life blood of the business, and they just showed up and spent $5 million on my great product, and since making a million products cost me $900,000 then I just made $4.1 million. Now to show these customers how much I appreciate them, in my rationale, I would the next day make the product cost $1.00, and if a million people showed up again, I'd make $100,000 that next day. So what if I'm spending a lot, I get ingredients/materials/supplies etc. from tons of different distributors, so it's like we are all making money, and besides I'm making $100,000 a week.

But this is not the reality of capitalism. In reality a capitalist doesn't give two flying fucks about his customers. They are ants to him in his pawn scheme. So what the capitalist would do to show appreciation towards his customers, is the next day instead of lowering the $5 to $1.00 to bring in more customers, he would CAPITALIZE on the customers he already had. He would raise the price to $10.00 for one product, then $15.00, then $20.00, then before you know it he would charge whatever he could get people to pay.

Now when the minimum wage goes up, these ass holes who couldn't give a shit less about dip shit customer A who is dumb enough to go pay more for what he likes because he loves what he buys so much, are now forced to pay more. They have all the power in the world, and now have to pay more. In fact speaking of people who make a lot of money, a person painting a house these days generally charges $35 an hour. I've seen it most people charge over $200 a day when painting a house they make often on one job $1400 $1700 $2000 $2300 etc. So it's not just like BILLIONAIRES pay out. Now all the sudden these people have to pay a LITTLE bit more, and yet you get these droves of people who come in complaining that the free market and capitalism that drives our country is being destroyed, prices are going to go up :rolleyes:(yeah, all the sudden, because right now things are cheap), and oh my god the free market will be destroyed

:lolwut: what a bunch of bullshit. I mean honestly I can't believe the people who swallow this shit. And to be honest, when only one class has all the money, it hurts other business, namely the small business. If Bill and Melinda Gates are the only people who go out and spend good cash every night, then only the finest steak house in Grenich Connecticut is going to have customers and business. But on the other hand, if EVERYONE in the country has an extra $100 to spend at the end of the week, then little Joe shit shack down the street that sells cheap $2.00 burgers but doesn't attract the wealthy crowd because he doesn't have marble pillars holding up the place and oak desks and a waiting list will suddenly have TONS of people going to spend on great cheap burgers.

WHO IS GOING TO LOSE?????

I mean really :facepalm: in a world of philosophy where the minimum wage goes up to $17 an hour all the sudden no one can afford to pay employees etc. etc. OBVIOUSLY it's going to disturb the free market. But raising it $1 an hour to keep up with a level of inflation and setting a wage that frankly probably would have benefited everyone 20 years ago is NOT GOING TO HURT CAPITALISM. Your precious capitalism won't be damaged. And if it makes you feel any better, I'm sure dish washers will still be the poorest people in existence next week. So if you feel wrongly about un motivated people who refuse to go to school and better themselves with fancier educations and careers and employment living more comfortably, well I doubt they will get much from a minimum wage increase :smirk:

As said a minimum wage raise won't change much but it will make life SLIGHTLY EASIER for the lowest class and balance spending in terms of who spends where what economically a little bit.





Your ignorance of economics is without peer on this forum.  Your post shows you know absolutely nothing about supply and demand curves, price elasticity, market value, profit margins, or any of the other plethora of concepts that are the reason a business owner sells a product at a certain price.






Oh wow big college words :stoned: man you really showed me you must be worth tens of millions since those words stand out to you :lol:

hey if I have down syndrome at least I don't put a cock in my mouth like you do talking all this shit about "profit margins" and price elasticity. You don't know two fucks about the difference between .25 times a thousand, but you can keep barking about how raising the minimum wage $1 will HURT prices and the long term economic environment :crying:

You sound like a college boy who never had a minimum wage job. Shit you probably went to college just to argue shit like this and sound smart, "supply and demand" haha you are a spoiled brat but still know nothing about real wealth and the 1% you have never been in a $10 million house. "Demand curves" :laugh2: why don't you tell me what a curve in demand is you probably think stock is the entire reason for a businesses existence go run a lemonade stand put down the book you frat boy suck up



oh please explain to me wise one how the minimum wage effects the basic nickel, show me how it has effected the price of gold and silver and aluminium :zomgwtf: oh my god aluminium is going up so says study boy who took economics classes and thinks he words like "demand curve" makes him equivalent to the experience of running 15 restaurants :lolwut:


--------------------
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:facepalm: I'm never giving you the password again. Jerk


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Offlinepsyconaught
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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: imachavel] * 1
    #19381930 - 01/07/14 11:20 AM (10 years, 23 days ago)

Quote:

"supply and demand" haha you are a spoiled brat but still know nothing about real wealth and the 1% you have never been in a $10 million house. "Demand curves" :laugh2:



shit these are basic economic concepts i learned in high school if you think they are meaningless terms you really are far gone beyond reality.


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: psyconaught]
    #19381946 - 01/07/14 11:25 AM (10 years, 23 days ago)

Quote:

psyconaught said:
Oh and btw i don't identify with the republicans, they are just as bought and paid for as the democrats, identifying with either party is asinine in my opinion.




:thumbup:


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: psyconaught]
    #19381993 - 01/07/14 11:37 AM (10 years, 23 days ago)

Quote:

psyconaught said:
Quote:

"supply and demand" haha you are a spoiled brat but still know nothing about real wealth and the 1% you have never been in a $10 million house. "Demand curves" :laugh2:



shit these are basic economic concepts i learned in high school if you think they are meaningless terms you really are far gone beyond reality.




they are meaningless "terms" I don't care how many times you read what "supply and demand is." It's like if I read about "cars" then go around acting like I drive at Nascar and build and take apart cars.

What does that mean "supply and demand" anyway? Here is a good one:

there is a demand for politicians who will raise higher wages. Therefore people supply votes to those who will raise wages. Then everyone cries Obama is an ass hole, but you only have a bunch of Republicans and study boys to compete with him, which most people laugh at, so he wins and raises the minimum wage.

Problem solved. As for "supply and demand" you don't run a business telling people what they want. The customer is never wrong, that's why a snickers bar sells for $1 at a Shell gas station. Maybe though you and Starfire can go take your college experience knowing how business and demand works and go tell Mars how to run their business.

Minimum wage is a joke, if it was $12 IT WOULD STILL BE A JOKE you and Starfire sound incompetent acting as though a business will have a tough time raising wages $1 an hour. Your ideas of experienced business owners to me represent a bad joke, some idiots who are coke heads. I don't care what classes and series 7 license people study to learn terms like "demand curve." I know stock brokers, most of them don't care what "demand curve" is, they care about selling stock. When you sell stock if a person loses money guess what? You get them to buy more stock. It's called sales.

I don't consider a business owner who has a tough time with a $1 wage increase a "sales" expert I call him a moron. I want to see some valid corroborated evidence that minimum wage has raised gas prices or real estate prices or something substantial. You won't show any, you know why? Because it doesn't exist. There is no correlation. You guys keep barking about "supply and demand" but obviously have no idea what it is outside of a fucking text book. No offence, but in the last 30 years the minimum wage has gone up, what..... $3 an hour? Gas has gone up what? 500%?

You now think you are going to feed me a story and say some words like "demand curve" (no offence you didn't say it Starfire did) and get me to believe that the M W will effect business "experts" who do NOTHING but turn a profit?

You know how a guy who sells $300,000 of floor to a person building a house with 5000 sf interior does it? First he sells them most of the floor for $30k the including pavers for the drive way travertine around the pool etc. Then when the customer trusts him he turns around and sells them the bathroom kitchen stair case floor for $230,000 when a customer knows the guy has the best product and is willing to pay for the finest crema marfil of calacatta marble. This is what sales is right here, it's the art of getting a person to trust you 95% and little do they realize the product is only 5% of the sale just because they feel they get something out of you they get out of nobody.

Now what does $8 an hour versus $5 an hour have to do with IT consulting? "oh my servers have a slow connection, but we get 50mb a second interface, ummm.... yeah the web site is sitting on a really old machine and it was written before html5 existed."

"Oh well dude, as your consultant I need to tell you, I hired this guy today and we are paying him $8 an hour instead of $7 an hour, so instead of the job being done at $180 an hour consulting fee, it's now going to run you $360 an hour."

Now you and me both know this scenario doesn't exist. I'm still waiting for a scenario that does exist that will prove I'm wrong and you are right. IT consultants don't worry about minimum wage. Gardeners don't worry about minimum wage because they are paid cash and don't claim taxes and can hire a guy for whatever a sandwich. Restaurants don't worry about minimum wage because most of the employees live on tips and last I heard cooks already earn $11. Billionaires don't worry about it because they have little to lose. I know you aren't worried about it IT consultants don't charge minimum wage and you can hire interns for free if need be.

I'm just asking who does. An actual real life scenario, not involving stock brokers that are pissed off about share value because companies raised prices and now people buy less product and stocks are going down. I already said I don't care about those people, they are insignificant sales people to me, when you live by the phrase "churn em and burn em" as a sales tactic you deserve losses. I'm saying the little guy, the guy you say owns the hardware store and now he is facing serious debt because of a minimum wage increase. How is he hurt? A real life scenario thank you


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: Ran-D]
    #19382002 - 01/07/14 11:39 AM (10 years, 23 days ago)

Quote:

Ran-D said:
Quote:

psyconaught said:
Oh and btw i don't identify with the republicans, they are just as bought and paid for as the democrats, identifying with either party is asinine in my opinion.




:thumbup:




I'm just tired of arguing with people who are studying to be stock brokers but haven't sold one share is all. They are saying "minimum wage hurts the little guy." But I see no evidence that it does. Most people don't become fund managers because I hear these days fund managers don't even charge a fee anymore. "churn em and burn em" and stock demand is not something that effects the little guy as everyone is arguing it's something that effects big greed and I've already said I don't care how the minimum wage effects that


--------------------
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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: imachavel]
    #19382023 - 01/07/14 11:45 AM (10 years, 23 days ago)

Look, imachavel and Starfire_xes, both of you have to dial your rhetoric back several notches or you'll both be banned. By rights I could have banned each of you by now.

Make your arguments and back off the personal slams.


Phred


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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: Phred] * 2
    #19382088 - 01/07/14 11:58 AM (10 years, 23 days ago)

And by the way, of course increases in minimum wage do more to hurt the economy than help it. These increases make it less likely for the most financially vulnerable in society to get one: the young and the unskilled. This has been conclusively demonstrated by so many economists for so many decades that it's kind of strange to see anyone attempting to argue otherwise.


Phred


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Offlinepsyconaught
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Re: Politicians Who Want A Minimum Wage Want a Maximum Wage Too.... [Re: Phred] * 1
    #19382153 - 01/07/14 12:13 PM (10 years, 23 days ago)

Who is an IT consultant? You have no idea what i do :lol: I'm a partner in a software consultancy. I basically write custom software solutions for a business's specific organizational needs. Its actually a pretty cool job, i get to work with all kinds of business's. Recently i was working with a DNA sequencing lab. Very interesting stuff.

Did someone claim to be a stock broker? I missed that part. It boils down to this, if the costs of doing business go up, business's will shut down, and it will discourage other business's from starting in the first place, even if it is just $1 an hour more. Now in your scenario i'd agree it will have only a small increase in payroll, however why add more burden to business's than already exist? And Obama and then dems are pushing for a $10.10 an hour min. wage. Significantly more than your $1 an hour raise scenario.

Lets say a business hires 5 people at min. wage. This is a very common an not uncommon scenario. With 5 people full time at mw the yearly payroll comes out to $69,600 a year. If the min. wage hikes up to $10.10 an hour yearly payroll will increase to $96,000 a year. That is a $26,400 a year increase in doing business. That would be extremely difficult for any small local business to cope with. You wanted real world scenarios? There you go, current min wage vs the min wage the administration is actually pushing for.


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