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RiderOnTheStorm
Reject thug culture



Registered: 11/26/12
Posts: 1,855
Loc: Hug a hippie today
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Re: Here's a gret TED video about how money changes people's behavior for the worst. [Re: Crystal G]
#19309802 - 12/21/13 10:39 PM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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He made it sound more like $10,000 per year per kid when you figured in food stamps, welfare, tax breaks, housing assistance, and everything else. The dude had 3 kids already and deliberately tried not to make more than like $1600 per month so he could stay on certain parts of the assistance. His girl was claiming disability too. I'm sure the kids all wore hand me down clothes from the first one, they were planned after all, albeit poorly.
I hear what you're saying, when he told me they were gonna have another kid to get more money I laughed, but he had it all worked out somehow. The equations were probably faulty, you can't expect much from these types of people, but I could tell both people who told me they were planning it were serious.
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akira_akuma
Φύσις κρύπτεσθαι ὕψιστος φιλεῖ


Registered: 08/28/09
Posts: 82,455
Loc: Onypeirophóros
Last seen: 4 years, 1 month
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Re: Here's a gret TED video about how money changes people's behavior for the worst. [Re: RiderOnTheStorm]
#19309828 - 12/21/13 10:49 PM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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that might be "abuse of the system" to you (the shameless narcissist materialist, funnily enough, would have that opinion) but really is that situation the same thing as "getting on welfare to make babies and get more money for it"?
i don't think it is. maybe in principle, but not in actuality; in actuality one is just using what's available to him, and using his kids as an insurance policy, of sorts, to keep on the dole.
the other is LITERALLY having kids for money.
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Crystal G



Registered: 06/05/07
Posts: 19,584
Loc: outer space
Last seen: 8 months, 6 days
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Re: Here's a gret TED video about how money changes people's behavior for the worst. [Re: RiderOnTheStorm]
#19309975 - 12/21/13 11:33 PM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
RiderOnTheStorm said: He made it sound more like $10,000 per year per kid when you figured in food stamps, welfare, tax breaks, housing assistance, and everything else.
Tax breaks? What the fuck is he talking about, if he's making $18,000 a year his taxes are going to be like a grand. Not much money to be saved there, even if he were to get it all back.
If you look at the food stamp chart, it increases by about $150 per household per person: http://www.cbpp.org/cms/index.cfm?fa=view&id=2226 (1 person is $189, I am 1 person and I spend about $400 a month on groceries if I'm trying to eat healthy but still cheap.)
And according to this, the average household receives $2,500 a year (AKA $214 a month) in federal housing assistance: http://www.cbpp.org/cms/?fa=view&id=3892 (I simply did the math and took the estimated 2012 budget, subtracted the budget cuts, came up with $5.5 billion, and then divided by the number of families assisted, 2,142,134).
And like I said, the average family household on TANF (temporary asssistance for needy families) gets something like $327 a month for a family of 4.
Essentially he is correct, everything all put together comes out to just around $9,500 per year, however this is DEFINITELY NOT PER KID. Actually, it's more like $10-$12,000 for all 2-3 kids.
Also, why the fuck is he working just for insurance? Are the kids not on MediCal or something, does he not qualify for that?
Quote:
The dude had 3 kids already and deliberately tried not to make more than like $1600 per month so he could stay on certain parts of the assistance.
This part I can understand if your children are receiving free medical, and one girl has a disability.
Edited by Crystal G (12/21/13 11:41 PM)
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akira_akuma
Φύσις κρύπτεσθαι ὕψιστος φιλεῖ


Registered: 08/28/09
Posts: 82,455
Loc: Onypeirophóros
Last seen: 4 years, 1 month
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Re: Here's a gret TED video about how money changes people's behavior for the worst. [Re: Crystal G]
#19310007 - 12/21/13 11:44 PM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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the persons "deliberate" nature of his use of the welfare and disabilities system, is what arses Rider so. not so much the fact of the miscalculations with money.
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Crystal G



Registered: 06/05/07
Posts: 19,584
Loc: outer space
Last seen: 8 months, 6 days
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Re: Here's a gret TED video about how money changes people's behavior for the worst. [Re: akira_akuma]
#19310019 - 12/21/13 11:50 PM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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I think he might be doing it, like what you said akira earlier, is sort of using the kid as insurance, so that he doesn't LOSE his benefits. Because I know that a lot of these benefits are basically temporary, such as housing assistance and TANF. I'm guessing that even if he were to really try at his sales job, the most he would make would be $2500 a month, definitely not enough to support a family of three and a wife?
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akira_akuma
Φύσις κρύπτεσθαι ὕψιστος φιλεῖ


Registered: 08/28/09
Posts: 82,455
Loc: Onypeirophóros
Last seen: 4 years, 1 month
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Re: Here's a gret TED video about how money changes people's behavior for the worst. [Re: Crystal G]
#19310027 - 12/21/13 11:54 PM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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yeah, it's called digging a big fat hole to lay in. 
but yeah, i don't think he's morally "defunt" for wanting to have a child to get benefits; when this is the situations that people get in, which belays having these systems in place, in the first place period. 
definitely not the same "Story" as "the junkie addict woman who has three kids to increase her welfare check balance to slum around and shoot drugs".
not even close to that ludicrous story.
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tripp23
Kratom Freak



Registered: 05/21/08
Posts: 4,030
Loc: Florida, US
Last seen: 1 year, 2 months
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Re: Here's a gret TED video about how money changes people's behavior for the worst. [Re: Patlal]
#19310121 - 12/22/13 12:37 AM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
Patlal said:
Quote:
Gilgamesh18 said:
Quote:
Patlal said: Very interesting. Its 16 minutes long so it for people that have some time and will to learn.
Studying people's behavior is amazing
The we hear rich people say that the poor think they are entitled to stuff...
Its socialist propoganda
Of course, once you include science in something, it becomes propaganda. Good old conservative talk.
its propaganda after the line of "to restore the american dream"
interesting though
-------------------- Experience my nightmarish first time of smoking Ganja!

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Crystal G



Registered: 06/05/07
Posts: 19,584
Loc: outer space
Last seen: 8 months, 6 days
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Re: Here's a gret TED video about how money changes people's behavior for the worst. [Re: akira_akuma]
#19310198 - 12/22/13 01:18 AM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
akira_akuma said: but yeah, i don't think he's morally "defunt" for wanting to have a child to get benefits; when this is the situations that people get in, which belays having these systems in place, in the first place period. 
The problem is that once they're in the system like that, they have almost no way of getting out of it. It creates a vicious circle of repetition, just to stay afloat. How DO you get out of poverty when most of your income relies on government assistance to begin with?
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akira_akuma
Φύσις κρύπτεσθαι ὕψιστος φιλεῖ


Registered: 08/28/09
Posts: 82,455
Loc: Onypeirophóros
Last seen: 4 years, 1 month
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Re: Here's a gret TED video about how money changes people's behavior for the worst. [Re: Crystal G]
#19310230 - 12/22/13 01:28 AM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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the way of avoiding this problem (without removing the notion of government assistance) is by a: not having associations and personal obligations to ideals that are proposed by the status quo (making a family! have kids and support your spouse; then get a house! buy a new car, you need one by now! seriously, you need to have ect ect ect) and b: think about new and fruitful ideas that aren't attached to other people's opinions of you; in general.
then you don't get the poor lost soul who thinks they live in a caring and just universe where people help one another because of something other then altruism and that "making mistakes is human", and other antiquated platitudes.
making mistakes is what the universes does... some of them just happen to work out in people's favor. so one shouldn't push for sentiment to favorably exercise a will which is under the will of another; because then you are falling into chaos.
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Crystal G



Registered: 06/05/07
Posts: 19,584
Loc: outer space
Last seen: 8 months, 6 days
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Re: Here's a gret TED video about how money changes people's behavior for the worst. [Re: akira_akuma]
#19310266 - 12/22/13 01:43 AM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Yes avoidance is great, but what about for people who are stuck in that situation. (i.e. living in a low unemployment area, unplanned pregnancy, didn't or couldn't get an abortion for various reasons) How do they get out?
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zappaisgod
horrid asshole


Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
Loc: Fractallife's gym
Last seen: 7 years, 7 months
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Re: Here's a gret TED video about how money changes people's behavior for the worst. [Re: Patlal]
#19311149 - 12/22/13 09:29 AM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
Patlal said:
Quote:
zappaisgod said:
Quote:
Patlal said:
Sociology is the scientific study of human social behavior and human association and results of social activities. Its not mathematics due to the fact no brain is exactly the same, but you can definitely make accurate predictions of behavior based on the results of sociology.
There is no such thing as human society. Psychology can encompass the study of human social interactions and does. Sociology is complete bullshit
There are times where you make brilliant comments, then there are times like these when you say that there is no such thing as human society...
Do you not live on planet earth??? 192 countries, all dividedd in states and provinces, all linked together by the economy, altruism on a dayly basis, people interacting constantly with each other, constant reproduction for the survival of the race.
How the hell can you say that there is no such thing as a society? Either you're trolling or you are extremely closed-minded/stubborn.
Sociology isn't bullshit. Sociology is the reason why marketing works, it's the reason police interogation works, its the reason there are signs on the road, it's the reason why some similar products succeeds and some don't. The internet is the greatest sociology experiment in the world! We learned so much about human behavior because of it I couldn't even start listing all the social trends and specific human behaviors that were discovered because of it...
LOL. No it isn't. Psychology is. We are individuals, not ethereal imagined groups with attributes studied and assigned to the group. What do I have in common with the Yanomami? I find the entire idea of society lazy and fascist and an imposition of group attributes onto individuals. I don't even have all that much in common with the people who live right near me. We are not the same and sociology attempts to argue that we are and have the same interests. We do not.
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ChinChiller



Registered: 07/03/10
Posts: 3,270
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Re: Here's a gret TED video about how money changes people's behavior for the worst. [Re: zappaisgod]
#19311164 - 12/22/13 09:36 AM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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One of the least credible TED talks i've ever seen. Monopoly LOL 
What about the uber rich like Bill Gates. Who (by the time he dies) will be giving away most of his wealth?
~Now watch this TED talk, by one of the most famous statiticians in the world Hans Rosling. hans_rosling_on_global_population_growth.html
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ChinChiller



Registered: 07/03/10
Posts: 3,270
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Re: Here's a gret TED video about how money changes people's behavior for the worst. [Re: ChinChiller]
#19311168 - 12/22/13 09:38 AM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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I just really think that is an informative TED talk, albeit common sense.
Hope I didnt steal your thread Pat.
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NWlight
Just look


Registered: 01/12/10
Posts: 18,686
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Re: Here's a gret TED video about how money changes people's behavior for the worst. [Re: ChinChiller]
#19311650 - 12/22/13 12:13 PM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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poor people ruin everything
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unknown1123
Experimental

Registered: 05/15/08
Posts: 5,813
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Re: Here's a gret TED video about how money changes people's behavior for the worst. [Re: NWlight] 1
#19313649 - 12/22/13 08:57 PM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
NWlight said: poor people ruin everything
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thelanzii

Registered: 11/13/12
Posts: 5,434
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Re: Here's a gret TED video about how money changes people's behavior for the worst. [Re: zappaisgod]
#19313971 - 12/22/13 10:24 PM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
zappaisgod said:
Quote:
Patlal said:
Quote:
zappaisgod said:
Quote:
Patlal said:
Sociology is the scientific study of human social behavior and human association and results of social activities. Its not mathematics due to the fact no brain is exactly the same, but you can definitely make accurate predictions of behavior based on the results of sociology.
There is no such thing as human society. Psychology can encompass the study of human social interactions and does. Sociology is complete bullshit
There are times where you make brilliant comments, then there are times like these when you say that there is no such thing as human society...
Do you not live on planet earth??? 192 countries, all dividedd in states and provinces, all linked together by the economy, altruism on a dayly basis, people interacting constantly with each other, constant reproduction for the survival of the race.
How the hell can you say that there is no such thing as a society? Either you're trolling or you are extremely closed-minded/stubborn.
Sociology isn't bullshit. Sociology is the reason why marketing works, it's the reason police interogation works, its the reason there are signs on the road, it's the reason why some similar products succeeds and some don't. The internet is the greatest sociology experiment in the world! We learned so much about human behavior because of it I couldn't even start listing all the social trends and specific human behaviors that were discovered because of it...
LOL. No it isn't. Psychology is. We are individuals, not ethereal imagined groups with attributes studied and assigned to the group. What do I have in common with the Yanomami? I find the entire idea of society lazy and fascist and an imposition of group attributes onto individuals. I don't even have all that much in common with the people who live right near me. We are not the same and sociology attempts to argue that we are and have the same interests. We do not.
You speak English. Hugely relevant the society you live in and your overall reality. Your gender role is relevant to the society you live in. Your social class and stratification is relevant to the society you live in. The quality of you education is relevant to the society you live in. Society forms our reality now that we are not hunter and gatherer folk.
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elax420
Anal Destroyer


Registered: 10/16/12
Posts: 15,536
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Re: Here's a gret TED video about how money changes people's behavior for the worst. [Re: thelanzii]
#19314356 - 12/23/13 12:55 AM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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That was one of the worst TED talks I’ve seen, all their numbers and studies were subjective as shit and all had confounding variables out the ass.
“science”

Taking a look at this thread it seems its evolved into the typical Republican/Democrat shit.
All i gotta say is we better stop incentivizing growth. Population is getting out of control as is, what is it going to look like in 30 years?
Nobody will say it because it does sound terrible, but people gotta start dying. Its a dog eat dog world, and the truth hurts sometimes but everything isn’t all roses and sunshine 
If the lowest strata of society keeps reproducing at its current rate we are going to see some terrible famines, wars, you name it.
forced sterilization anyone
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Crystal G



Registered: 06/05/07
Posts: 19,584
Loc: outer space
Last seen: 8 months, 6 days
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Re: Here's a gret TED video about how money changes people's behavior for the worst. [Re: elax420]
#19314420 - 12/23/13 01:31 AM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
elax420 said: Nobody will say it because it does sound terrible, but people gotta start dying. Its a dog eat dog world, and the truth hurts sometimes but everything isn’t all roses and sunshine 
People aren't dying because of advents and breakthroughs in medical science. This means longer social security and Medicare payments, which is the biggest expense in the U.S.
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elax420
Anal Destroyer


Registered: 10/16/12
Posts: 15,536
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Re: Here's a gret TED video about how money changes people's behavior for the worst. [Re: Crystal G]
#19314443 - 12/23/13 01:53 AM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Yup, its not just america though its the emerging markets/developing world whatever the fuck you wanna call it.
Watch the fuck out when india gets its shit together (quite literally)

Fact is we need to do something to control human population before we make the planet unlivable for us as a species. The only sociology class i ever had was Environmental Sociology and we talked all about water accessibility, food, energy. Basically in the long run we’re fucked.... But like the great John Maynard Keynes said "in the long run we are all dead."(Lol i just did that cuz i know you guys hate on biz school so much) Point is, what were doing right now is unsustainable
As india’s population keeps skyrocketing Pakistan is going to lose its water supply, keep in mind both countries hate the shit out of each other already and both nuclear powers. Ah what a lovely world we live in Zappa’s generation had it so easy
Gilgmesh is kinda right, every “soft science” teacher I’ve had is a major pinko, I’m not saying thats a bad thing and its probably just the nature of the work. I love it they are all so eccentric and unemployable, thank god for academics right?
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Crystal G



Registered: 06/05/07
Posts: 19,584
Loc: outer space
Last seen: 8 months, 6 days
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Re: Here's a gret TED video about how money changes people's behavior for the worst. [Re: elax420]
#19314464 - 12/23/13 02:11 AM (10 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
elax420 said: But like the great John Maynard Keynes said "in the long run we are all dead."(Lol i just did that cuz i know you guys hate on biz school so much)
I don't hate on biz school guys. I hate on biz school guys who think their schooling is as useful as science.
BTW, IDK why but I felt compelled to show you this Keynes vs Hayek rap video
Quote:
As india’s population keeps skyrocketing Pakistan is going to lose its water supply, keep in mind both countries hate the shit out of each other already and both nuclear powers. Ah what a lovely world we live in Zappa’s generation had it so easy
Nowadays almost all countries have nukes. Supposedly you would only need like 100 nukes to completely destroy the earth, and Russia and the USA alone have thousands. Like WTF is even the point of having that many? It's all just a competition.
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