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OfflineCrystal G
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Registered: 06/05/07
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: akira_akuma]
    #19303263 - 12/20/13 02:44 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

John Cage? You mean that guy that published 4 minutes of silence and called it "music," THAT John Cage? :lol: I remember telling my piano teacher about that, she laughed so hard she cried.

But she thinks anything after jazz was the downfall of music, and it all started from the Beatles. :lol:


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InvisibleNWlight
Just look


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Posts: 18,686
Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Crystal G]
    #19303282 - 12/20/13 02:49 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

you can still have a reliable day job $$

and play music as a hobby.

seems to me if you're going to be working until you die you should do something to make your time more valuable

i think it's true that some degrees are worthless but only for like 80% of the people who get them.  the world DOES need musicians, but just not that many.


--------------------
:wizard::deemsters:


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Offlineakira_akuma
Φύσις κρύπτεσθαι ὕψιστος φιλεῖ


Registered: 08/28/09
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Crystal G]
    #19303292 - 12/20/13 02:51 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

yeah, that's the one. but for the record, John Cage wasn't the first guy to do it. (for example one notable work is a Czech work on piano comprised entirely of rests)

plus, that's not all he's known for... he's done multitudes of different works from Sonata's on prepared piano, Etudes on piano based off of astrological star charts (some of the most commanding piano work like For Bunita Marcus) he's done ballet and more... he's a seminal figure in indeterminacy in music and electroacoustic music (like Satie and others)


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InvisibleEndure
The Anal Demon
Male User Gallery

Registered: 10/17/13
Posts: 4,906
Loc: New York
Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: akira_akuma]
    #19303376 - 12/20/13 03:08 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

I stopped caring about the money a long time ago
I just want to put out shit I can bump down the road
I want my neighbors to know this asshole coming home


--------------------
Im only aloud to post once an hour. Because 'Sell Your Soul' doesn't like me. so if I am responding to you, that means you are above of the utmost importance


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Offlineakira_akuma
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Endure]
    #19303398 - 12/20/13 03:12 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Endure is a suitable SN.


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OfflineGreySatyr
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Registered: 06/20/13
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: akira_akuma] * 2
    #19303432 - 12/20/13 03:18 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

I notice a lot of classical snobbery these days against folk and all it's subgenres. Personally I think most modern music is shit but that's besides the point, rock was definitely not the falling point of music. It was the wave that crested before its downfall.

It was one of the heights of music in my opinion. The crest of a thousand years of folk music mixing up with modern music such as the blues, american folk and electronics and then it was all over in a brief moment of glory. From its remains spawned a million sub genre piles of crapola.

I love classical music but its so damned snobby that I just can't get into it. I love listening to it but folk music and rock is where I find the best comradery among musicians.

It's also in my opinion more individually free.
Plus ear training beats sight reading any day but that's just my opinion.
I do love music theory so there is a point for classical, folk players will surprise you with how much theory they know that. But this is just a formulative opinion from a complete amateur so take my post with a grain of salt...


--------------------
...also, go to hell, huh?


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Offlineakira_akuma
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: GreySatyr]
    #19303544 - 12/20/13 03:39 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

all music is forward thinking, it's just that not everyone realizes this, and chooses to make music based on regressive "musical" (sometimes entirely non-musical) foreplay...

ie Dubstep

it turned into this thing that is utterly and completely NOT Dubstep, yet people still call it that.

then add into the mix all the other sub genres (psybeat, illbient ect) with a good idea to make something a little different, and of course, you'll see alot of "try-hards" trying to get in on the "new thing"; that at once was great, until people decide that's where they wanna go.

the what was once a brilliant and unique innovation or idea, becomes monotone and that's what MOST people will hear. the monotone trash that has been done in and out before, with no innovation of thought, performance, or concept.

it happens with all music, including Jazz and Rock, and even Classical music.

all of it.

that's why there is constant innovation... the drive to need to bury all that hypnotic trash out of the way for the real good stuff.

it's a harder task, at this point in time, then it ever has been before, and thusly we're all getting alot of good music out of it. just gotta see through the garbage.


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OfflineCrystal G
I'm a teapot


Registered: 06/05/07
Posts: 19,584
Loc: outer space
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: GreySatyr]
    #19303550 - 12/20/13 03:41 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

GreyMorph said:
I notice a lot of classical snobbery these days against folk and all it's subgenres. Personally I think most modern music is shit but that's besides the point, rock was definitely not the falling point of music. It was the wave that crested before its downfall.




You mean.... jazz and blues?!!??!!?!?1? :crankey:




Totally random, but holy shit, I just found an 8 year old girl playing a piece that I played when I was 15. She plays very robotically, but damn I'm still impressed a girl of her age can play it. I think I was just learning Moonlight Sonata at her age.



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Offlineakira_akuma
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Registered: 08/28/09
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Crystal G]
    #19303593 - 12/20/13 03:49 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

i say there is no "bad genre's of music".

all genre's of music have good and bad musicians in them (and by bad i mean, either not worth mentioning, or are just simply not as innovative as what i look for personally in music.)

PS: i wanna see you face while trying to take in For John Cage by Morton Feldman...

you'd be like  :whateveryousayfreak:



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OfflineGreySatyr
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Registered: 06/20/13
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Crystal G]
    #19303632 - 12/20/13 03:58 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Crystal G said:
Quote:

GreyMorph said:
I notice a lot of classical snobbery these days against folk and all it's subgenres. Personally I think most modern music is shit but that's besides the point, rock was definitely not the falling point of music. It was the wave that crested before its downfall.




You mean.... jazz and blues?!!??!!?!?




No, I meant that everything that came after rock. Pop...

Django Reindhart was once playing guitar for his friend, Andres Segovia (faster of classical guitar), after he finished playing Andres asked him where he could get a copy of that piece and Django just laughed and said that he was improvising. That to me speaks wonders about the two different cultures of musicians. I prefer Django but respect the classical approach although typically classical players don't show the same respect for self taught folk or other genre players. At least most don't.


--------------------
...also, go to hell, huh?


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Offlineakira_akuma
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: GreySatyr]
    #19303646 - 12/20/13 04:01 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

pop music was around before rock and roll, man.

light music is a "classical form" of pop music... plus, there was AM Pop and commercial and corporate music, to boot.

all that stuff was formulaic as to pop, or be "simple", just like pop music today.

pop music had just since been "informed" by R&B and Gospel music; after Rock became "a thing".


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OfflineCrystal G
I'm a teapot


Registered: 06/05/07
Posts: 19,584
Loc: outer space
Last seen: 8 months, 30 days
Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: GreySatyr]
    #19303705 - 12/20/13 04:14 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

GreyMorph said:
I wish I had learned music earlier, now I'm stuck trying to learn it at 24 with much less time on my hands and lesser resources. Although I still have the Internet, my time to use it is limited to when people are buggin me or I don't have work to do. Basically, usually when I'm worn out and mentally fatigued. There's always hope that. You don't really appreciate music until you've began playing it.




It's true man, although I personally didn't appreciate music until after I became an adult. Kids are like that, they never appreciate what they are learning while they are young. They just view it as tedious work. I didn't appreciate my music lessons, I didn't appreciate swim team, I didn't appreciate learning Japanese. It wasn't until I was an adult that I realized how great it was that I learned to do these things.

You might not have learned while young, but you have a better sense of appreciation and understanding of music than any child.


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Offlineakira_akuma
Φύσις κρύπτεσθαι ὕψιστος φιλεῖ


Registered: 08/28/09
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Crystal G]
    #19303720 - 12/20/13 04:17 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

all true^

too true. damn



Chopin Etudes

hand punishing.


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OfflineCrystal G
I'm a teapot


Registered: 06/05/07
Posts: 19,584
Loc: outer space
Last seen: 8 months, 30 days
Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Yukon Cornelius]
    #19303739 - 12/20/13 04:21 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Yukon Cornelius said:
I'm not saying it's worthless to study music and art, but it is in-debting yourself to get a piece of paper saying you studied in a prestigious location.




I guess that depends on where you go. I had two piano teachers, both from Julliard, one was a concert pianist who played professionally (her name was Yoshie Akimoto). She makes $200 an hour for lessons now, and people fly her all over the world to take her lessons.

She makes more hourly than a psychiatrist, and medical school is WAYYYYY more expensive than 4 years at Julliard.

I had another piano teacher before either teacher from Julliard, and she was good, but definitely nowhere near their level.


Quote:

Lynnch said:
I had the pleasure of being in arts magnet schools for the entirety of my public education while growing up. Quite a few of my school mates have gone on to make successful livings in music. There are a lot more gigs out there than just being one in a million and becoming a rock star, guys. They play on cruise ships, they get hired to play on touring musicals, get a steady gig as the house band...




OMFG that would be such an effing sweet job... I never even considered playing on a cruise ship. Basically you would get to enjoy all the amenities of being on a cruise FOR FREE when you're not working. It'd be like getting paid to be on vacation. SIIIICKKKKK


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Offlineakira_akuma
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Registered: 08/28/09
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Crystal G]
    #19303815 - 12/20/13 04:40 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

indeed. people often don't realize the many options you have available to musicians and performers.

just gotta eke out what you can, in this day and age; and sometimes it might sound silly, but whatever, a gig is a gig and playing music is playing music... and same goes for writing it.

i'd love to write music for a play, or video game, or film... something like that. it'd be entirely awesome.

or like... have a sound installation where you feed various instruments into reverb and delay effects generators around various blinking lights.

yeah, there... there's alot of shit you CAN do without being a famous "star" or whatever...


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OfflineCrystal G
I'm a teapot


Registered: 06/05/07
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Last seen: 8 months, 30 days
Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: akira_akuma] * 1
    #19303864 - 12/20/13 04:51 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

akira_akuma said:
indeed. people often don't realize the many options you have available to musicians and performers.

just gotta eke out what you can, in this day and age; and sometimes it might sound silly, but whatever, a gig is a gig and playing music is playing music... and same goes for writing it.

i'd love to write music for a play, or video game, or film... something like that. it'd be entirely awesome.

or like... have a sound installation where you feed various instruments into reverb and delay effects generators around various blinking lights.

yeah, there... there's alot of shit you CAN do without being a famous "star" or whatever...




There was a professor of music theory at my school that was hired to write the orchestra music for some sci-fi movie... I am not a huge fan of sci-fi (except for Futurama, which is my favorite show) so I don't remember which movie it was. But I remember he had all the music majors at my school do the orchestra recording. Only the professor got paid though. :bored:


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Offlineakira_akuma
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Crystal G]
    #19303980 - 12/20/13 05:19 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

lol, that's rather unfair.

players should not be abused like that. i bet it wasn't even that good anyways; the jerk. :snub:

but yeah, on that note, and along with what you were saying earlier... making music can be in a strange source of income; definitely not as "polished" so to speak, as other money making devices. definitely not as "bureaucratic"


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Offlineakira_akuma
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: akira_akuma]
    #19304145 - 12/20/13 05:50 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

you know what's really worthless? attributing values to things, when one isn't on the forefront of experiencing said "things".


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OfflineSuperSillyUs
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Registered: 12/14/13
Posts: 326
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: Crystal G]
    #19304333 - 12/20/13 06:18 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Crystal G said:
(except for Futurama, which is my favorite show)





Just earned a +1, from me. Futurama ...way under rated...


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OfflineSuperSillyUs
Proud 'Shitbird'. ®

Registered: 12/14/13
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Re: I Don't Understand People Who Say Studying Art and Music is Worthless [Re: akira_akuma]
    #19304348 - 12/20/13 06:20 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

akira_akuma said:
you know what's really worthless? attributing values to things, when one isn't on the forefront of experiencing said "things".





So basically, no one's opinion is worth anything unless they're 'experts' in said field.  :boxerface:

And why would they become experts?


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